Encounters: The UFO Phenomenon, Exposed!/Encounters - The UFO Phenomenon, Exposed (1995).iso/altalien/alt21.txt

Internet Message Format | 1995-10-20 | 1MB

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From: [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Cry of the Phoenix
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 08:31:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve Timpson) writes:
>
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes...
>
>        WHAT A WAIST OF BAND WIDTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>        Steve

I had a waist of bandwidth once...but a healthy diet and regular exercise
managed to get it all under control...<g>

:)

Be seeing you...
--
         David "Maelstrom" Zecchini | "It may be better to be a live jackal
       [e-mail] | than a dead lion, but it is better still
 [e-mail] | to be a live lion.  And usually easier."
           [e-mail] | -Robert A. Heinlein
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From: [e-mail] (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Grey Aliens Sighted .... Again
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Date: 12 Feb 92 16:11:00 GMT
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 > >Is this cooper document  authentic?
 > >Also what has happened to him for the past two years?
 > >Has he any plans to do any seminar's in Europe?
 > >Has anybody purchased the JFK video from bill cooper?
 > >Is there any FTP sites where I can grab more info on this subject?
 >
 > >Any help would be much appreciated.
 >
 > Is this the same Bill Cooper who says that JFK's driver did the killing?
 > That Bill Cooper?
 >
 > Don Allen, Mike Corbin -- any comments?

First, I don't want to get into any protracted discussions about Bill Cooper.
All I can say is that we, ParaNet, had a great deal of experience with Bill
Cooper, up to and including ejecting him from the net for causing a variety of
disruptions, not to mention strong attacks on other members of the net that
were counter-productive to intelligent discussion.  Our organization has
investigated Cooper to the max and can find no truth in anything he says
except that he was in the Navy, but not in the capacity that he claims.
Further, the tape of the JFK driver has obviously been altered.  I have a copy
of that tape and I have no doubt in my mind that someone has edited it to make
it look like the driver.  The bottom line is that Bill Cooper just doesn't
hold water, so anything he says should be taken with a large block of salt and
tongue planted firmly in cheek.

Mike

--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
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From: [e-mail] (Jesse Flint)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: Another sick deluded dupe who believes in Mars faces...
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 08:49:12 GMT
Expires: Wed, 1 Apr 1992 05:00:00 GMT
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Yes, I've read "Monuments of Mars", and Hogaland doesn't exactly strike
me as a "UFO nut" or "kook" or whatever ephithet is going around these
days. He's (after all) a repected scientist (not that means he couldn't
be wrong, _but_...) and the book is a reasonably calm, well-researched
text. His _theories_ about the origin of the Face may be questionable,
but I for one believe there's SOMETHING weird in Cydonia.
By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
"face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.
                    --Tog

P.S. If it _isn't_ natural...
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From: [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring)
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face info why it might be no optical delusion!
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 10:26:05 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Joe Mastroianni) writes:
>[..]  The guide says, "Here's the grand piano...". Sure enough,
>2 seconds later this grand piano comes into view. Naturally, its just
>a big limestone rock. But, once they suggest to you it is a grand piano
>before you see it, it certainly becomes a grand piano when you see it.

>[..] Sometimes they could actually
>convince me I was seeing the things they suggested. Sometimes they
>couldnt.

>   When I looked at the picture of the face on Mars, I saw a face
>right away. But, it was presented to me as "The Famous Face on Mars".
>I think I would have known it as a face even if it werent suggested that
>way.

It is important for survival to recognize faces even if they are
distorted or partly hidden or just vaguely face-like (animals
have very different sorts of faces).  It is normally not important
for survival to recognize pianos or rocking chairs.

--
-Caddy------(thomas kettenring, kaiserslautern, germany)--------
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth---Stolen
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth-----from
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth--Matt G.
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From: [e-mail] (Darrell Haught)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 13:02:15 GMT
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In article <behse.697924019@tubue> [e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:
>Hi,
>
>I had posted  the PYRAMIDS.JPG picture in various news-groups.
>I'm just wondering what You think about the Pyramids on mars ??
>Did You already take a look at it and what do You think about it ?
>Only optical delusion or proof of soemthing unexplainable ?
>Let me know !
>
>Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
>Decentral Energy Research
>email to: [e-mail]
>

  Is this available in Gif format?


Darrell
[e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Eric M Chmiel)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: Another sick deluded dupe who believes in Mars faces...
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 15:27:00 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes...
>Yes, I've read "Monuments of Mars", and Hogaland doesn't exactly strike
>me as a "UFO nut" or "kook" or whatever ephithet is going around these
>days. He's (after all) a repected scientist (not that means he couldn't
>be wrong, _but_...) and the book is a reasonably calm, well-researched
>text. His _theories_ about the origin of the Face may be questionable,
>but I for one believe there's SOMETHING weird in Cydonia.
>By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
>"face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
>accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
>Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.
>                    --Tog
>
>P.S. If it _isn't_ natural...

   Just out of curiosity....I don't have the picture of the Mars face handy,
but I believe almost half the face is obscured in shadow, am I right?  If this
is so, you are on very shaky ground claiming perfect bilateral symmetry for
something that you can only see half of.  The other obscured half may just
look like a big rock.
    On the other hand, there can be no doubt that the Mars face is human in
form.  What are the chances that an extraterrestrial race would evolve the
same facial characteristics as man?  Not good, I would suspect.  My point is
that you are asking us to believe that whoever built the Mars face had human
features (unlikely if they are native to another planet) or that they built
a monument to a human on Mars.  If the face were of extraterrestrial origin
it would probably look completely unhuman, wouldn't it?
    Please explain this to me.  I am very curious.  And please don't say the
face looks human because human-looking extraterrestrials came to earth on
spaceships and bred Homo Sapiens or something wacky like that.  Just explain
this to me.
                                           -Eric
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From: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 16:19:35 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
   Yes, I've read "Monuments of Mars", and Hogaland doesn't exactly strike
   me as a "UFO nut" or "kook" or whatever ephithet is going around these
   days. He's (after all) a repected scientist (not that means he couldn't
   be wrong, _but_...) and the book is a reasonably calm, well-researched
   text.

If he came across as a nut, no one would believe him.  Although he is
quite wrong, his rantings may be enough to get the public interested
in sending another mission to Mars, which is a good thing.

   His _theories_ about the origin of the Face may be questionable,
   but I for one believe there's SOMETHING weird in Cydonia.
   By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
   "face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
   accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
   Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.

If you look at enough randomly generated, natural formations
(especially if you computer enhance the images) you will see
everything you can imagine.

--
Gerry Roston ([e-mail]) | Why has government been instituted at all?
Field Robotics Center,          | Because the passions of man will not con-
Carnegie Mellon University      | form to the dictates of reason and justice
Pittsburgh, PA, 15213           | without constraint.  Alexander Hamilton
[phone]                  |
                                |
The opinions expressed are mine |
and do not reflect the official |
position of CMU, FRC, RedZone,  |
or any other organization.      |
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From: [e-mail] (Ken Eshelby)
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face info why it might be no optical delusion!
Keywords: mars face
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Date: 13 Feb 92 17:51:03 GMT
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[e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring) writes:

>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Joe Mastroianni) writes:

>>   When I looked at the picture of the face on Mars, I saw a face
>>right away. But, it was presented to me as "The Famous Face on Mars".
>>I think I would have known it as a face even if it werent suggested that
>>way.

>It is important for survival to recognize faces even if they are
>distorted or partly hidden or just vaguely face-like (animals
>have very different sorts of faces).  It is normally not important
>for survival to recognize pianos or rocking chairs.

  Right!  Take a human individual and family developement class sometime and
  you will probably learn that infants have a built in mechanism to respond
  more positively to human faces rather than - a ball for example (even if
  it's close to the color of a human's face). This goes along with the
  built-in abilities to drive parents crazy into caring for their child because
  of that high-pitched cry that I'm sure you all have heard before.

  Point is:  we can relate to shapes that are "human-esque" almost instantly
  because of our instincts.  Maybe I'll test this by showing some friends the
  face and recording their reactions.  (I'll use people that I haven't rambled
  endlessly to about the implications and reasonings behind the complex on
  Cydonia)   Get back to ya!

  later...
  -ken
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From: [e-mail] (Pigeon Steven)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Mars face, pyramids, & a giant teddy bear in Australia
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 19:36:18 GMT
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Ok, I must admit that those pictures are most fascinating, but, what
if and alien probe passed above Australia and then cought a picture
of the big red rock shaped like a lazy bear (Ayer's Rock, I think)
would they absolutly think it's man-made? (or "what ever"-made?)
Even if it does look like some lifeform, I'd think twice about it.
It is perfectly natural. Like might be the face on Mars. No one ever
saw the sphinx' face in the desert of ... somewhere in soudan? It
does look like a skull, and again, it was shaped by the wind.

The pyramids as well. I had a copy of the "original" bit map sent by
the probe, and before it is enhanced, there is really nothing to freak
on. Once enhanced, though, it begins to look like something.



    "the best proof of intelligence out there is that they decided
     not to contact us"
                Calvin & Hobbes


--
 _ ___  __       __ _  | Steven Pigeon
(_  |  (__ \  / (__ |\ | alias Garfield (for my temper, I guess)
__) |  (__  \/  (__ | \| [e-mail]
==Computer Science & Operation Research, Universite de Montreal==
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face view from Hoaghland concerning Cydonia
Keywords: mars-face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 19:40:01 GMT
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Gee, a geomorphologist and someone with NASA connections - these would be great
people to examine the Mars face if only they could spell 'SETI' and
tetrahedron, if they hadn't filled their paper with technobabble and
sensationalism, and if they actually gave any details about this huge energy
flux that no one seems to have noticed before.

I'm all for variety of thought and different approaches, but the whole face
issue would be much more credible if it's believers didn't all come across as
writers for tabloids or folks who sense a conspiracy and don't seem to know
much about they background anyway.

                Josh

Disclaimer:  okay, okay 'An idea is not responsible for those who believe it.'
and I'm sorry I'm taking up all this bandwidth.  I'm just getting tired of the
whole deal.
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Whatever Happened to Bill Cooper? (was: Grey Aliens sighted ..again)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 19:20:05 GMT
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In article <1992Feb11.202017.2352@anasaz> billy@anasaz (Bill Moore) writes:

>->>Also what has happened to him for the past two years?
>He was on a radio program about two years ago in Las Vegas and ran into
>a buzz saw.  He was so thoroughly discredited by a knowlegeable UFO
>researcher that he simply faded away.
>->>Has he any plans to do any seminar's in Europe?
>I'm sure if you pay his expenses and anything over $2.00 an hour he'd
>be glad for the attention.

Naah, Cooper is still making the rounds. He was a major honcho at the
"Penomicon" UFOs-and-Conspiracies conference in Atlanta last November.
He gave a couple of "free" talks, but if you wanted to hear more, you
had to pay $20 for some "private" sessions. He also did some TV
interviews, and had scheduled some more expensive all-weekend seminars.
And it looks like he had quite a few "buyers" (one born every minute?).
On one panel, Cooper proclaimed that the "New World Order" would be
a reality in "less than two years". I then pointed out that if all these
nightmare things haven't come to pass by Nov. 2, 1993, then we KNOW
we can safely ignore everything Cooper has to say.

Besides, anyone who's been active in the UFO field for some time
could spot the fallacy in the above: since when has being "discredited"
ever shut anyone up??????? :)
--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Re: Ummo
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 19:48:08 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Joe Martinez) writes:
>
>Not quite so... At first I had the same impression. Jean-Pierre Petit
>appeared in an interview for the French magazine "VSD" (in the September
>15th '91 issue I believe), where according to the information given in a
>diagram, the star (Wolf 424) was supposed to be located in the Virgo
>constellation, pretty much between the tip of the two upper arms represented
>by the figure drawn by the Virgo constellation. Then I started searching
>through my two astronomy programs (Distant Suns 4.0 and Voyager on my Amiga)
>and couldn't locate the star in question. Finally, I picked an option from
>Voyager's menu which brings up a 3D view of nearby stars and found it!
>The star goes by the name of "Wolf 424QA" and has a magnitude of 13.2,
>an absolute magnitude of 15.0, at position RA: 12h 33.0m; Dec: +09 deg 07',
>and at a distance of 4.3 parsecs or 14.2 light years. This position places it
>exactly where shown on the diagram and the distance approximates 15 ly.

I don't have any astro books handy, but if this is accurate, you are
describing a white dwarf. Such a star is UTTERLY incapable of supporting
a planet with life.


>
>                                        EARTH                  UMMO
>
>
>non-covered land (by water)             29.2 %               38.16 %
                                                           > would be ICE!
                                                             if white dwarf

>distance from it's sun              149 504 000 km        99 600 000 km
>
>
>temperature                        5 785 deg Kelvin      4 580.3 deg Kelvin
>
>magnitude                                4.73                  7.4
>
>spectral class                            G2                    K
>
>distance from Sun                         --             14.421 light years
>                                                            on 8-7-1967
>
>Note: Magnitude from this table does not match (not by a long shot) that of
>      program database. Also I had no spectral class data from program
>      to compare with table...

I think that the "UMMO" star described above must be the one that
astronomers "haven't noticed" yet. This fellow Petit tried to "fix"
that problem, and brought in Wolf 424, which *has* been "noticed",
but which doesn't fit the Ummit's "data".
--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 19:36:59 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Why must you and other "sceptics" insist on equating "UFO's" with
>"ETI"?
>
>If you would dispense with this obsession, true skeptical and scientific
>study of the _phenomenon_ may be possible.
>
>Why do skeptics continue to see the UFO phenomenon as "aliens, ET's,
>and flying saucers", even when that is not brought into the discussion by
>the "other side"?
>
OK, Hynek and Vallee used to bring up this same objection twenty years
ago. And we replied, OK, it doesn't HAVE to be that. What else might it
be, that has little men coming out of a flying craft, and scurrying
about?

And they would reply, We dunno what else it could be,
it's just "unidentified".

So OK, even though in the mind of the public (and MOST UFOlogists),
UFOs = ETI, it MIGHT be something else.

UFOs might be time travellers.

UFOs might be from another dimension.

UFOs might be secret Nazi technology, flown from bases at the South Pole.

UFOs might be Jungian "archetypes" projected into existence by the
collective unconsious, etc.

I suppose that any one of these "might" be true. And ANY one of them
would be a mighty important discovery, IF TRUE.

So, all you have to do is to convince astronomers, and other scientists,
that studying UFOs is going to teach us about *anything real*, apart
from human self-deception!!

--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 22:12:14 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>
>>Why must you and other "sceptics" insist on equating "UFO's" with
>>"ETI"?
>>
>>If you would dispense with this obsession, true skeptical and scientific
>>study of the _phenomenon_ may be possible.
>>
>>Why do skeptics continue to see the UFO phenomenon as "aliens, ET's,
>>and flying saucers", even when that is not brought into the discussion by
>>the "other side"?
>>
>OK, Hynek and Vallee used to bring up this same objection twenty years
>ago. And we replied, OK, it doesn't HAVE to be that. What else might it
>be, that has little men coming out of a flying craft, and scurrying
>about?

Are you referring to all UFO events, or only those where witnesses claim
to have seen occupants?

It simply isn't relevant to the debate about studying the _phenomenon_.

What is relevant is that there is an apparent need by many sceptics to
"diminish" the unknown aspects of the phenomenon by constantly alluding
to space aliens and flying saucers.  That Hynek and Vallee both used this
same argument is irrelevant.  In any case, it is true.

Incidentally, are you aware that Vallee became interested in studying this
phenomenon when he found astronomers destroying observation data of UFO
events that they could not explain?

>
>And they would reply, We dunno what else it could be,
>it's just "unidentified".
>
>So OK, even though in the mind of the public (and MOST UFOlogists),
>UFOs = ETI, it MIGHT be something else.
>
>UFOs might be time travellers.
>
>UFOs might be from another dimension.
>
>UFOs might be secret Nazi technology, flown from bases at the South Pole.
>
>UFOs might be Jungian "archetypes" projected into existence by the
>collective unconsious, etc.

And don't forget: UFOs might all be a perception of mundane events.

And of course: UFOs might be secret military test-aircraft.

But we don't know that.

BTW: I don't believe this was what Jung claimed (that these things were
somehow created by the collective unconscious).  It's true that he alluded
to this, but if you read the remainder of his remarks about this, I think
you'll find that he too, thought that UFO's were a real, physical
phenomenon.  I'll double check this to make sure I didn't misrepresent
this.

>
>I suppose that any one of these "might" be true. And ANY one of them
>would be a mighty important discovery, IF TRUE.
>
>So, all you have to do is to convince astronomers, and other scientists,
>that studying UFOs is going to teach us about *anything real*, apart
>from human self-deception!!

No, not necessarily.  The only people that need convincing are those who
might be inquisitive enough to want to know what the phenomenon really,
truly is.  Fortunately, they usually aren't the problem.

Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
about this phenomenon need apply.

BTW: Has it ever occurred to you that you may be limiting the sciences by
allowing the study of only those things that would contribute to _known_
fields (such as astronomy, biology, etc.)?  Is it not possible that a
study of the _phenomena_ may yield an entirely _new_ science?

Don't misunderstand me.  I'm not implying that we should study the
phenomenon for the sake of creating a new science.  But, by limiting
our research to those things we already know about or we are sure will
contribute only to _known_ fields is, well...., limiting.

>
>        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

Jim Graham - Scepticus Realisticus

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
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From: [e-mail] (Juergen Behse)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <behse.698015893@tubue>
Date: 13 Feb 92 21:18:13 GMT
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In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Darrell Haught) writes:

>In article <behse.697924019@tubue> [e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:
>>Hi,
>>
>>I had posted  the PYRAMIDS.JPG picture in various news-groups.
>>I'm just wondering what You think about the Pyramids on mars ??
>>Did You already take a look at it and what do You think about it ?
>>Only optical delusion or proof of soemthing unexplainable ?
>>Let me know !
>>
>>Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
>>Decentral Energy Research
>>email to: [e-mail]
>>

>  Is this available in Gif format?


>Darrell
>[e-mail]


Sorry, Darrell, but the original Scan in GIF-format was about 750 KBytes big,
so I decided to convert this 1021*768*256 big picture to JPEG.
I have also scanned two more pictures from the mentioned book and have put them
on a FTP server. So everybody who wants to have also the other two JPEG pics:
They are called : marsinka.jpg ("inkacity" on mars) and marsface.jpg (close-up
zoom of the face), can mail me their email adress, so I will let You know, where
I did put them. By the way, You can also ask "archie".

But I did ask about what You think about the Pyramids and not about the face !
So do You all still think, these rectangular buildings and shadows are normal
rock formations ? When not let's try to convince the people at NASA and JPL
to have the best pictures from the upcoming MARS OBSERVER probe be taken from
the Cydonia region !!
There was several times mentioned, that no pictures would be taken in this
upcoming flight !? What is the official statement now ?



Here comes an info courtesy of Tom Lane about JPEG-software, where to get it:


If you are looking for "canned" software, viewers, etc:

There is not a lot of pre-built, no-thought-required JPEG software available
yet.  This short list will no doubt grow with time.

For X Windows, John Bradley's XV version 2.00 is an excellent JPEG/GIF viewer.
It's available for FTP from export.lcs.mit.edu or grip.cis.upenn.edu.  The
file is called 'xv-2.00.tar.Z' and is located in the 'contrib' directory on
export or the 'pub' directory on grip.  XV's only real shortcoming is that
it does not fully exploit 24-bit displays (it reduces all images to 8 bits).
If you have a 24-bit display you will get better results from "xloadimage",
which is also available from export, file contrib/xloadimage.3.01.tar.Z.
Version 3.01 does not read JPEG files, but it will read the PPM files put
out by the free JPEG converter described below.  There is also a patched
version called "xli" (see files xli.* in same directory) that does read JPEG
directly.  However, xli is a quick hack rather than an official release;
caveat user.  Another good choice for X Windows is John Cristy's ImageMagick
package, also available from export, file contrib/ImageMagick.tar.Z.  The
viewer included in this package handles 24-bit displays correctly; for
colormapped displays, it does better (though slower) color quantization
than XV.

For MS-DOS, Handmade Software offers two (rather pricy) shareware programs:
Image Alchemy and GIF2JPG/JPG2GIF (contact [e-mail] for details).  The
PC versions of these programs are available for FTP from wuarchive.wustl.edu,
directory mirrors/msdos/graphics, files alchmy15.zip and gif2jpg5.zip; also
from SIMTEL20 and its other mirror sites.  (Image Alchemy is also available
as an executable for Sun Unix machines, but I don't know where to find it.)
GIF2JPG/JPG2GIF only perform JPEG<=>GIF format conversion.  Image Alchemy
converts files between these and many other formats, and can also display
images on some types of hardware.  The display option is pretty limited,
so you'll still want a separate viewer program.  (WARNING: GIF2JPG produces
a proprietary file format unless you specify -j.  Be sure to use -j if you
want to exchange JPEG files with other Usenet users.  For that matter, it's
not real clear that you should be posting JPEG files made from GIFs; see
section 5.)

For the Macintosh, Storm Technology has released a free program that can
decode and view JPEG images (though not create them).  This is called
Picture Decompress.  Make sure you get version 2.0.1 or later; earlier
versions are not compatible with JFIF file format.  This program can be
FTPed from sumex-aim.stanford.edu, directory /info-mac/app, file
picture-decompress-201.hqx.  You'll also need a tool for adjusting file type
codes; set the type of a downloaded image file to 'JPEG' to allow Picture
Decompress to open it.

If none of the above fits your situation, you can obtain and compile the
free JPEG converter program described below.  You'll also need a viewer
program, and if your viewer only handles GIF files, you'll want a separate
color quantization program (we recommend ppmquant from the PBMPLUS package
for Unix machines; on PCs, try Piclab).  This last requirement will go away
with the next release of the free code.

There are numerous commercial JPEG offerings, with more popping up every
day.  I recommend that you not spend money on one of these unless you find
the available free or shareware software vastly too slow.  In that case,
purchase a hardware-assisted product.  Ask pointed questions about whether
the product complies with the final JPEG standard and about whether it can
handle the JFIF file format; many of the earliest commercial releases are
not and never will be compatible with anyone else's files.


If you are looking for source code to work with:

Free, portable C code for JPEG compression is available from the Independent
JPEG Group, which I lead.  A package containing our source code,
documentation, and some small test files is available from several places.
The "official" archive site for this source code is ftp.uu.net (137.39.1.9
or 192.48.96.9).  Look under directory /graphics/jpeg; the current release
is jpegsrc.v2.tar.Z.  (This is a compressed TAR file; don't forget to
retrieve in binary mode.)  You can retrieve this file by FTP or UUCP.  Folks
in Europe may find it easier to FTP from nic.funet.fi (see directory
pub/graphics/programs/jpeg).  The source code is also available on
CompuServe, in the GRAPHSUPPORT forum (GO PICS), library 10, as jpsrc2.zip.

The free JPEG code provides conversion between JPEG "JFIF" format and image
files in PBMPLUS PPM, Utah RLE, Truevision Targa, and GIF file formats.
(However, output to GIF format is not of high quality at present; ditto for
colormapped Targa and RLE formats.)  The core compression and decompression
modules can easily be reused in other programs, such as image viewers.  The
package is highly portable; we have tested it on many machines ranging from
PCs to Crays.

We have released this software for both noncommercial and commercial use.
Companies are welcome to use it as the basis for JPEG-related products.
We do not ask a royalty, although we do ask for an acknowledgement in
product literature (see the README file in the distribution for details).
We hope to make this software industrial-quality --- although, as with
anything that's free, we offer no warranty and accept no liability.

The Independent JPEG Group is a volunteer organization; if you'd like to
contribute to improving our software, you are welcome to join.

If you are not reasonably handy at configuring and installing portable C
programs, you may have some difficulty installing the free source code.
Steve Davis ([e-mail]) has volunteered to maintain an archive of
pre-built executable versions of the free JPEG code for various machines.
His FTP archive is at procyon.cis.ksu.edu (129.130.10.80 -- this number is
due to change soon); look under /pub/JPEG to see what he currently has.
(The administrators of this system ask that FTP traffic be limited to
non-prime hours.)  This archive is not maintained by the Independent JPEG
Group, and files in it may not represent the latest source code.



For more information about JPEG in general or the free JPEG software in
particular, contact the Independent JPEG Group at [e-mail].

--
            tom lane
            organizer, Independent JPEG Group
Internet: [e-mail]    BITNET: tgl%cs.cmu.edu@carnegie


Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
Decentral Energy Research
email to: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (JOSEPH T CHEW)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face view from Hoaghland concerning Cydonia
Summary: sheesh
Keywords: mars-face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 22:05:49 GMT
References: <behse.697949192@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Doesn't ANYBODY realize that the Mars face is just an alien ruse to
discredit alternative xenogeomorphology, thus keeping people from
noticing the REAL face -- on Venus?  C'mon, folks.  Surely you've
seen the Magellan image clearly showing the nose of an almost entirely
buried supine humanoid figure of tremendous size, viewed from the chin?

For horse E.T.s, I recommend the January issue of Car and Driver.

Disclaimer:  I've never been to Sedona (though I have spent plenty
of time in Marin County and Santa Fe) and, in case you are having a
really slow day, am pulling your leg. Or, if you yourself are an
alien, your pseudopod or tentacle or whatever.
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From: [e-mail] (Juergen Behse)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal
Subject: Any scanned UFO-GIF-pics available by FTP ?
Summary: ufo gif pics
Keywords: ufo
Message-ID: <behse.698017158@tubue>
Date: 13 Feb 92 21:39:18 GMT
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Hi,
I just wonder, if there is a FTP server out there, which has already stored
any scanned or digitized UFO-GIF-or JPEG-pictures. I mean pictures from real
photos, which were made by people who have watched any UFO-sighting !
If not, why shouldn't we create one ? Is any sysop of a FTP-server is reading
this and is interested to share some disk-space for this topic ?
With pictures to look at, the discussion about UFO-sightings is much more
clear. By the way, I will get soon a few good pictures from a friend and I would
like to put them up anywhere to share them with the people from the net.
let me know.
Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
Decentral Energy Research
email to: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 00:09:27 GMT
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[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:

>Yes, I've read "Monuments of Mars", and Hogaland doesn't exactly strike
>me as a "UFO nut" or "kook" or whatever ephithet is going around these
>days. He's (after all) a repected scientist (not that means he couldn't
>be wrong, _but_...) and the book is a reasonably calm, well-researched
>text. His _theories_ about the origin of the Face may be questionable,
>but I for one believe there's SOMETHING weird in Cydonia.
>By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
>"face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
>accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
>Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.
>                    --Tog

>P.S. If it _isn't_ natural...
I don't see any bilateral symmetry in the picture I've seen at all.  The
left side of the 'face' is in shadow, and for that matter, the shadow
doesn't look like it's being thrown like a face shaped object.  As I
understand it, the other picture of the face has simliar lighting conditions,
so where did you pull the symmetry from?  Considering the sheer SIZE of Mars,
and the fact that the picture shows only a few features of a 'face' at
something like 50 meter resolution, I'm surprised there aren't _more_ natural
features that remind you of things.

            Josh 'Kumquat' Hopkins
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From: [e-mail] (Siri Hewa)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 23:10:33 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue>
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Thank you for the Mars.jpg picture as quality of the picture is quite good. I
also got other mars face gif picture which was done on very close up zoom shot.
Now looking at the jpg picture I have to say that area of this picture got
quite few rocks(natural?) which seems to be natural formation. But Mars face
stick out like a sore thumb on this picture. I think only way to get proof of
any sort is to go there in person?.

Siri Hewa.
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From: [e-mail] (Norman St. John Polevaulter)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: A thrilling chase scene with lots of character development
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 01:27:12 GMT
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 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says:
>Considering the sheer SIZE of Mars,
>and the fact that the picture shows only a few features of a 'face' at
>something like 50 meter resolution, I'm surprised there aren't _more_ natural
>features that remind you of things.

AHA! That's it!

Forget the Face! Forget the pyramids! Forget the beer can they threw at
Phobos 2, THIS is proof that aliens visited Mars! They must have spent
millenia, scouring the surface, removing every natural feature that might
remind humans of something. Through sheer bad luck they missed the Face,
and... and... and...

Okay, I'll shut up now.

[Your blood pressure just went up.]       Mark Sachs IS: [e-mail]
 DISCLAIMER: Penn State cares about my money, not my opinions.
  "All my father wanted to do was make a toaster you could really set the
    darkness on -- and you perverted his work into those horrible machines!"
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From: [e-mail] (david kehoe)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face view from Hoaghland concerning Cydonia
Keywords: mars-face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 01:41:30 GMT
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The story I read about the Mars face was much more interesting:
in the late 1940's a Japanese-American sculptor wanted to carve
a giant face out a hill, which would be titled "View of the Face
on Mars."  He didn't get to do it, but he made a model, which
supposedly looks just like the photo from Mars, and the full-sized
sculpture would be the same size as the one one Mars.

I think I read this in that book about the Aztecs that predicted
the harmonic convergance in 1988.  Has anyone else heard this
story?  If it were true I expect it would be widely publicized
by now.
--
"Why my thoughts are my own, when they are in, but when they are out
they are another's." - Susanna Martin, executed for witchcraft, 1681.
Thomas David Kehoe  [e-mail]  [phone]
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From: [e-mail] (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 06:16:21 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric M Chmiel) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes...
>>Yes, I've read "Monuments of Mars", and Hogaland doesn't exactly strike
>>me as a "UFO nut" or "kook" or whatever ephithet is going around these
>>days. He's (after all) a repected scientist (not that means he couldn't
>>be wrong, _but_...) and the book is a reasonably calm, well-researched
>>text. His _theories_ about the origin of the Face may be questionable,
>>but I for one believe there's SOMETHING weird in Cydonia.
>>By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
>>"face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
>>accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
>>Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.
>>                    --Tog
>>
>>P.S. If it _isn't_ natural...
>
>   Just out of curiosity....I don't have the picture of the Mars face handy,
>but I believe almost half the face is obscured in shadow, am I right?  If this
>is so, you are on very shaky ground claiming perfect bilateral symmetry for
>something that you can only see half of.  The other obscured half may just
>look like a big rock.

And as to "accurate proportions," unless the feature is VERY recent, the face
has WAY too much forehead.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXes and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
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From: [e-mail] (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 00:18:00 GMT
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 > >What is your definition of astronomy?
 >
 > OK, I would be willing to accept "knowledge gained about
 > extraterrestrial
 > visitors" (assuming such to exist) as falling under "astronomy". And I
 > am reasonably confident that any astronomer would, too.
 >
 > Now all the UFOlogists have to do is convince astronomers that they
 > have *anything at all* to teach us about ETI!
 > --
 >
 >         Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

For the sake of clarity, let us begin by defining what each of us mean by
"UFOlogist" and "ETI."  Although I have used the term "UFOlogist" in postings,
etc., I do not recognize that word nor do I think that it is an accepted
descriptor among astronomers.  I may be wrong, but I have never found that to
be true.  Second, I assume that the "ETI" represents the "Extra-Terrestrial
Hypothesis."  Assuming this to be true, I state that since there has never
been an accepted body of scientific persons convened in any formal manner to
even postulate such a thing, although Hynek postulated such a thing during his
time, as well as others in the scientific community, but again, never
formally.  Thusly, I am not sure that "ETI" could even be intelligently
discussed at this point.  Going back to the term "UFOlogist," we have such
personas as Milton William Cooper, John Lear, Budd Hopkins, and a host of
others, completely without scientific credentials, stating with almost
absolute conviction that we are dealing with aliens.  But, when it comes down
to proving such things, there is none.  These people call themselves
"UFOlogists."  The overall problem here is that we have a group of people who
are attempting to make sense out of a very complex problem without the ability
of education, training or discipline.

The study of this phenomena requires a forensic approach.  Forensics, as you
know, is an accepted science, and is very effective at arriving at the truth
where certain elements might be missing, changed or altered.  It has been
proven time and again, so much so, that it is utilized in criminal justice and
can convict someone of a serious crime.

I also liken the study of UFOs to a person who is ill and in need of medical
attention.  They have certain symptoms, which when combined, can be any host
of diseases.  However, they don't go to the next door neighbor for diagnosis
and treatment of their ailment.  They go to an accredited physician, who,
after performing certain tests, can usually diagnose and treat the ailment.
In the case of UFOs, we have a number of people, most credible, reporting
strange anomalies in the sky, on the ground, some leaving physical traces in
the form of burn marks, indentations, and so forth, but no one with any
critical training to interpret the data.  In the entire modern history of the
reported phenomena, there has never been anything really done to analyze the
data and intelligently interpret it, although some like Hynek made the effort
to do so.  To complicate the issue, we have seen it demonstrated that an
official organ of the United States Government was setting policy to deal with
the sightings of objects, not from a scientific standpoint, but from a defense
or militaristic standpoint.  It is well known that although the Air Force
claimed publicly that UFOs were not real, they contracted for several million
dollars with such noted institutions as the Battelle Memorial Institute,
Northrop, and others to scientifically study the phenomena.  But, these
relationships were defense contract items, not subject to the scrutiny of the
main-stream scientific community or the general public.  To my knowledge,
there has never been a report forthcoming from any of these groups concerning
the findings, or non-findings of their research.  Hynek's chief complaint was
that the main-stream scientific community was being excluded from the research
that was being conducted by the "insiders."

Therefore, in my opinion, we must ditch all the past perceptions of the
phenomena, and approach it with a new outlook.  A formal body of study should
be convened and the establishment of approved standards enacted to govern the
research.  This will surely weed out the charlatans that are so common today.

Mike

--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Tom DeLosh)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Book: Cry of the Phoenix - part 2/18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 18:51:51 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Distribution: local iex dfw tx usa na world
Organization: University of Michigan
Lines: 11

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes:
>
>
>
>
> =====>> Cry Of The Phoenix part 2 <<=============================
>
> <lots 'o stuff deleted>

I suspect that this 'book' was plagiarized from a bottle of Dr. Bronner's
peppermint soap  :)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!asuvax!anasaz!qip!john
From: john@anasaz (John Moore)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <1992Feb13.170623.4481@anasaz>
Date: 13 Feb 92 17:06:23 GMT
Organization: Anasazi, Inc. Phoenix, AZ, USA
Lines: 26

Keywords:

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (David M. Schiff) writes:
]There's an interesting article in the Feb. 1, '92 issue of
]Science News (vol. 141) on crop circles.  In fact they chose
]to grace the cover of the issue with a picture of a big, complicated
]crop circle.
]
]   A retired astronomer, named Gerald S. Hawkins, claims that the
]crop designs imply important mathematical theorems.  As I've indicated
]earlier, this is not the first time somebody noticed this.
]The thing that makes this interesting is that these are (according to him)
]previously unknown theorems which he discovered by looking at pictures of
]the designs and later proved. He searched both ancient and modern mathematics
]textbooks but couldn't find anything even resembling these theorems.

The problem I had with the article is that, although it claimed that
the creators of the crop circles had to know those previously unknown
theorems, I could find no evidence of that in the article itself.
Has anyone been able to decrypt the article enough to understand
that conclusion?
--
John Moore NJ7E, 7525 Clearwater Pkwy, Scottsdale, AZ 85253  (602-951-9326)
ncar!noao!asuvax!anasaz!john [e-mail] anasaz![e-mail]
 - - Tree Hugger's Nightmare: Mt. Graham Red Squirrel Stew ...
 - - Have you ever tried looking at the stars through a squirrel? - - -
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From: [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Alibi Mentality
Keywords: mistake, UFOs, psi, creationism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 12:53:04 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
Lines: 64
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20538 alt.paranormal:4372 alt.alien.visitors:4424 talk.origins:14870

-------------------------------------------------------------
When you followup to this, please edit the newsgroups line if
you want to relate only to some of the subjects!
-------------------------------------------------------------

There is common mistake in thinking I call Alibi Mentality,
which can be described like this:

  "The butler has an alibi, the maid has an alibi, the chauffeur
   has an alibi - Sergeant, arrest the gardener!  I didn't like
   that guy, anyway."

That is, one disposes of all possibilities one can think of,
except one (perhaps one's favourite), and declares that the
solution, because it seems to be the only remaining possibility,
without taking into consideration that there could be other
explanations one didn't think of.

This mistake turns up in discussions about UFOs, psi,
creationism, and  probably a lot of other subjects.

In the UFO debate it is an intrinsic component.  When you hear
UFO, you immediately think "alien spaceship".  That way of
association leads to quotes such as this:

In article <[e-mail]>, Michael Corbin writes:
>[..] although the Air Force
>claimed publicly that UFOs were not real [..]

Note: I don't want to say that Michael made a mistake here, but
that the usage is that way.

Real UFOs, Really Unidentified Flying Objects, contrary to
those flying objects that just *seem* to be unidentified?
No, the meaning is "UFOs that really *are* UFOs, that is, alien
spaceships" (or replace "alien spaceship" with your favourite
explanation).

When you watch psychics reading thoughts, bending knifes, or
telling you things they really shouldn't know, you think a
while for a mundane explanation, and if you don't find any
trick that could have done it (because you are no illusionist)
you think it must have been a paranormal phenomenon.

In December, a long list of pro-creationism arguments was
posted on talk.origins, and some of them ran along the line
"This and that effect you can't explain with evolution".
Even if that had been correct (most of the arguments were just
plain wrong), it would have been no argument in favor of
creationism, but only a disproof of the current model.

This "Alibi Mentality" is clearly a sign of overestimation
of oneself, since it implies that is impossible that there
are explanations one didn't think of.

What do think?
Do you have a better name?
Do you have other examples?

--
-Caddy------(thomas kettenring, kaiserslautern, germany)--------
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth---Stolen
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth-----from
-I will not waste bandwidth--I will not waste bandwidth--Matt G.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au!uqcspe!cs.uq.oz.au!jasonp
From: [e-mail] ( Jason Pouflis)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: I know what's real, don't I?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 10:04:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Lines: 10

Look into something called night terrors.
If I remember correctly,
This is a natural function of the autonomous nervous system,
to wake you so that you can start thinking/breathing/functioning again.

--
Ciao,
    Jason

[e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: TEST POST: Please Respond
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 21:26:26 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 8

We don't get this newsgroup here at Stratus in California.  I have to use
Email just to get anything posted anywhere as we aren't allowed to post either.
If this makes it in, someone PLEASE Email me ASAP!  I have files that I would
like to send to this group.  Also if someone would be kind enough to possibly
send me a list of topics already covered so far I would be grateful.

Thank You,
Len
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!pa.dec.com!shodha.enet.dec.com!timpson
From: [e-mail] (Steve Timpson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face view from Hoaghland concerning Cydonia
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 15:09:13 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 15
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4427 sci.space:26596 sci.skeptic:20546 alt.paranormal:4375


In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (david kehoe) writes...
>The story I read about the Mars face was much more interesting:
>in the late 1940's a Japanese-American sculptor wanted to carve
>a giant face out a hill, which would be titled "View of the Face
>on Mars."  He didn't get to do it, but he made a model, which
>supposedly looks just like the photo from Mars, and the full-sized
>sculpture would be the same size as the one one Mars.


        Well it's a BS story because this supposed face on Mars was only
        photgraphed for  the  first  time by satallite orbiting Mars.  No
        telescope in existance then or now can photograph this "HILL."

        STeve
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!spdcc!rdonahue
From: [e-mail] (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 03:17:07 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: insert anything here
Lines: 83

[e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone]) writes:
>    The following posting is a summary written by my friend and
>    co-worker, Drew LePage, of an article in the January 1992 issue of
>    the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS), Volume 45,
>    Number 1.  Titled "An Estimate of the Prevalence of Biocompatible
>    and Habitable Planets", it is authored by M. J. Fogg.
>   ########################################################################
>

    All well and good except if you're looking for life you have
to eliminate all the stars younger than about 3 Gyr...  That limits
things quite a bit...  Exorcising the stars with low probabilities
(from the other contraints...)...

>  Name            Distance (LY)    Type    Habitable    Biocompatible
>  Alpha Centauri A       4.38        G2V       7.8%            44%
>  Alpha Centauri B       4.38        K6V       4.4%            38%
    These two are old (7Gyr)

>  Epsilon Eridani      10.69        K2V       0.6%            34%
    Too young - only 1 Gyr

>  61 Cygni A          11.17        K5V       0.0%         5.8%
>  61 Cygni B          11.17        K7V       0.0%         0.3%
    These two are weird astrophysically.  Although they are a "real"
double system, they don't act alike age-wise in a couple of different
ways... Of course they're almost M stars, so the rules that you apply
for solar-like stars gets stretched a little thin by the time you get to
this red...  Age-wise, they're intermediate 2-3 Gyr...

>  Tau Ceti          11.95        G8V       1.5%            35%
    Another weird star...  activity-wise its one of the least
chromospherically active stars, and most certainly so for stars later
than G5...  Probably old --- 3-4 Gyr.

>  70 Ophiuchi A          16.73        K1       4.4%            38%
>  70 Ophiuchi B          16.73        K6       0.0%            16%
    Too young... (~1 Gyr)

>  36 Ophiuchi A          17.73        K0V       0.0%            28%
>  36 Ophiuchi B          17.73        K1V       0.0%            27%
>  36 Ophiuchi C          17.73        K5V       0.0%         9.0%
    too young... (~1 Gyr)

>  HR 7703 A          18.43        K3V       0.0%            27%
    don't know

>  Sigma Draconis      18.53        K0V       1.5%            35%
    Not bad, actually - just under 3.0Gyr

>  Delta Pavonis          18.64        G5       5.1%            39%
    don't know

>  Eta Cassiopeiae A      19.19        G0V       3.9%            38%
    Pretty good --- 4.6 Gyr

>  82 Eridani          20.9        G5       4.4%            38%
    don't know

>  Beta Hydri          21.3        G1       7.5%            35%
    This one is old - something like 9Gyr...

>  HR 8832          21.4        K3       0.0%            23%
    don't know

    I don't see Zeta 1,2 Ret (6Gyr?) on this list, nor HD 81809 (5 Gyr?)
both of which are "good" candidates mass/age-wise...  Both are also binaries,
but are well-separated.  I'm sure there are others, HD 141004 (Lambda Ser)
comes to mind...  HD 12235, but that's also weird (some people think it's
a subgiant [old] others think it's very young...)...  HD 103095 (grmb 1830)
is definitely old...

    Ages are estimated from rotation and/or chromospheric emission...
Not perfect, but not bad to 1Gyr or so... younger stars are easier
to pick off than older ones...

    As you can see --- you can whittle down the list fairly quickly
even among G stars...  But there are still some physically "good
candidates" although no star yet has been found that matches the Sun
all that well!  (So much for the Astro 101 textbook addage 'the Sun is
a typical run-of-the-mill G dwarf...).

BD
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From: [e-mail] (CSYSPCN)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 17:08:06 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: MVS NNTP News Reader <[e-mail]>
Lines: 15
Nntp-Posting-Host: mvs.oac.ucla.edu

>
>What do think?
>Do you have a better name?
>Do you have other examples?
>

I like it, it rings true.  I don't have a better name, but I've heard
a more restricted varient called "Our Ancestors - the dummys" which
is applied by those who assume that ancient cultures couldn't have
had engeneering skills sufficient to build the pyramids, etc.

A related varient that I call Barnums Razor goes: Given two equally
likely hypothisis choose the one whith the highest Gee-Wiz factor.
So a UFO becomes an alien spaceship, rather than an unidentified
phenomenon of local origin.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!amdcad!netcomsv!sheaffer
From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:20:49 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: na
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 37

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Are you referring to all UFO events, or only those where witnesses claim
>to have seen occupants?
Any explanation for the supposed phenomenon must be able to accomodate
all aspects of it. Therefore, any explanation for UFOs insufficiently bizarre
to account for "little men coming out of flying craft" simply won't
do. Except, of course, for the 'null hypothesis': "all those wonderful
but unsubstantiated stories are not true."

>What is relevant is that there is an apparent need by many sceptics to
>"diminish" the unknown aspects of the phenomenon by constantly alluding
>to space aliens and flying saucers.

Excuse me, what is the *name* of this newsgroup?

Was it a skeptic that named it?

Is it skeptics that fill it with lurid tales of encounters with man-eating
Grays???

>
>Incidentally, are you aware that Vallee became interested in studying this
>phenomenon when he found astronomers destroying observation data of UFO
>events that they could not explain?

Yes, this *sounds* so abominable, but as I heard him explain this, what
I heard him really say was: 'there was this data on a tape that I
wanted to keep, but they wanted to re-use the tape'. So excuse me if I'm
not convinced it's as sinister as you suggest.
--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!amdcad!netcomsv!sheaffer
From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:30:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 15

Fine. If you can convince the Congress, the President, the National
Academy of Sciences, or whoever, that some "fresh look" at UFOs
is either necessary or desirable, the go for it.

But you'd better have something NEW to offer up, because the same old
Virtual Evidence is getting pretty stale after nearly forty-five years.

--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (L. M. P. McPherson)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality
Keywords: mistake, UFOs, psi, creationism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 03:34:29 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Netnews Administrator)
Organization: McGill University
Lines: 20
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20564 alt.paranormal:4377 alt.alien.visitors:4432 talk.origins:14906

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring) writes:
>
>There is common mistake in thinking I call Alibi Mentality,
>which can be described like this:
>
>That is, one disposes of all possibilities one can think of,
>except one (perhaps one's favourite), and declares that the
>solution, because it seems to be the only remaining possibility,
>without taking into consideration that there could be other
>explanations one didn't think of.

>Do you have a better name?

I believe another name for this is the "fallacy of the false dilemma." It is
an either/or mentality. If creationism is wrong, then evolution is right
(or vice versa). This error pervades all areas of science, and leads to much
fruitless discussion. There are always possibilities other than those we
have considered, and more often than not, the correct path is one upon which
we have never trod. One can never find support for one theory by crushing
others! One has to address the predictions of the theory itself.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!news.cs.indiana.edu!lynx!carina.unm.edu!vjmurphy
From: [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes?  NOT!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 06:43:13 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Lines: 64

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone]) writes:
>
>
>THE CHAIRMAN'S CORNER                                      BY JOHN FORD
>
>
>                          SOMETHING IS COMING OUR WAY!
>
>
>      This is such a story.  As yet no evidence exists to support it, yet I
>have a gut feeling that something might be to it.  Only time will tell if the
>evidence or a coming event will prove its veracity.

     No evidence?  Then what's this below?

>
>      It seems that in 1987, NASA picked up the presence of a very large
>planetoid object entering our solar system near the area of Pluto.  It was
>first detected by Voyager and later confirmed by telescope observations both
>radio and optical.  The object is very large, measuring over a thousand miles
>in diameter or even larger.

    Which Voyager?  I don't think either of them would be able to do
 this.


>
>      The object has been under constant observation since.  It was last
>reported in the area of Jupiter.  That last position was of January of this
>year.  It was observed to be leaving a very long Ionization trail behind it.
>The object has made at least three mid course corrections, by the way.

     Boy, no evidence, but it's made three course changes?  Where is
 this crap coming from?

>
>concealed by public announcements that the missions are being deployed to
>photograph distant stars or the Sun's corona.  The Hubble telescope doesn't
>work and needs to be repaired, yet it is pointed straight out there and can
>return pictures through computer enhancement.

    The Hubble does work.  Has for a while.  It just doesn't work
 to its original specs.


>
>      I have had the story confirmed by George Dickson and Mike Crystal,
>(Christol, my corrected spelling) both reputable U.F.O. Researchers of
                                        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>impeccable reputation, through independent contacts in the

   Sounds like an oxymoron.

>      The object may soon be seen by the average person as time advances.  It
>may not be so easy then to conceal the truth from the public.
>
   With such EVIDENCE, it may not be so easy to keep a straight face.


--
                   Phred Platypus [ [e-mail] ]
"Technology is a way of organizing    \
the universe so that man doesn't       \   The Grammarian of Vengeance
have to experience it."   -- Max Frisch \
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 22:58:57 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 223


Sorry if some of this has been here before. Some of this is new.
Len
===============================================================================


Thu 30 May 91 19:29
By: Mike Christol
Re: Something is Coming
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The following information is taken directly form the April issue of The Long
Island U.F.O. Update, the monthly bulletin for the Long Island UFO Network.

THE CHAIRMAN'S CORNER                                      BY JOHN FORD


                          SOMETHING IS COMING OUR WAY!

      In Ufology, you hear a lot of strange stories.  Some you have to take
at face value, while others are too far fetched to believe even in this
strange study of unusual objects and humanoid beings.  Some stories you mark
off as holding merit, but lack supporting evidence to bolster their
credability until a later date when something might surface which could prove
their validity.

      This is such a story.  As yet no evidence exists to support it, yet I
have a gut feeling that something might be to it.  Only time will tell if the
evidence or a coming event will prove its veracity.

      It seems that in 1987, NASA picked up the presence of a very large
planetoid object entering our solar system near the area of Pluto.  It was
first detected by Voyager and later confirmed by telescope observations both
radio and optical.  The object is very large, measuring over a thousand miles
in diameter or even larger.

      The object has been under constant observation since.  It was last
reported in the area of Jupiter.  That last position was of January of this
year.  It was observed to be leaving a very long Ionization trail behind it.
The object has made at least three mid course corrections, by the way.

      That is peculiar for a planetoid object like an asteroid to do.  It
sounds as if it is not what it appears to be.  It sounds like it is under
intelligent control.  Its orbit will bring it into Earth's orbit by late 1992
or early 1993.  What it is, is anyone's guess.

      Linda Moulton Howe has reported this story to us.  She had it confirmed
by a Pentagon Military Officer.  The story relayed to her indicates that the
Government is keeping it a secret and is tracking it through the auspices of
the Jet Propulsion Laboratories and McDonald Douglas' facilities.  The object
is being tracked by the Hubble telescope and several of the recent infra-red
telescopes recently lofted by various Space Shuttle Missions.  All of this
concealed by public announcements that the missions are being deployed to
photograph distant stars or the Sun's corona.  The Hubble telescope doesn't
work and needs to be repaired, yet it is pointed straight out there and can
return pictures through computer enhancement.

      I have had the story confirmed by George Dickson and Mike Crystal,
(Christol, my corrected spelling) both reputable U.F.O. Researchers of
impeccable reputation, through independent contacts in the
Scientific-Military establishment.

      The object may soon be seen by the average person as time advances.  It
may not be so easy then to conceal the truth from the public.

      Consider this too.  Our Moon's orbit has condensed by three thousand
miles while the Earth's axis has tilted slightly as if pushed ever so gently
by the invisible hand of a tremendous gravitational field.  Have you noticed
the strange weather patterns we have been having lately?

     U.F.O. Abductees recount their experiences with the authority that
something very big will happen in the next several years.  Whatever it is,
they can't recall it, but they know the event will occur.

      Is something coming our way?  Is this one of those stories to mark
away?

                                -END-

Now, the "official" word is that SS433 (Stephenson-Saundeleak) is
a very odd-behaviour type pulsar...but it would appear, that this
is a cover for the above-mentioned article. This article,BTW, appeared
on the MUFONET HQ BBS and Mike Christol is a very credible/reliable
MUFON investigator.

However, this is such a *hot* topic, that even a glancing mention of
this on either the UFO echoes of the BBS world, or the Internet will most
certainly guarantee you a gold class invite to a royal flaming.

Have you figured out how the Govt intends to do this?

Here's a clue...

Project SETI has been chosen to be the point organization that will
announce to the world a "discovery"..it will be that they have
established communication with an "alien race" (the lower Greys). The
Greys will "land" at either Whitesands in NM, or at Area 51 in Nevada.

(e.g. an effect like a low efficiency rocket). This in turn would perturb the
comet orbits, resulting in a "comet shower" of the sort associated with the
extenction of the dinasours. (That is, a large number of comets, whose orbit
now carries them into the inner solar system, and a resulting increase in the
probability of comet inpacts with the Earth).
A local amature astronomer, John Hewitt(sp?), has written a paper on the
subject. He is also of the five amature astronomers to recieve observing time
on the Space Telescope, to look for a similar vaporization (and UV glow) from
hypothetical comets around the next, nearby nova.

                    Frank Crary
                    UC Berkeley


Article 15719 of sci.astro:
Subject: Mystery Object of Thursday, 12/5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 11 Dec 91 18:00:40 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet Administration)
Organization: NSDD, Data General Corp.
Lines: 73
Xref: lassie sci.astro:15719


I've seen nothing on the net regarding this, but I found this in the
Globe:

Without permission from the Boston Globe, 12/7, page 13:

Mystery object eludes astronomers

By David L. Chandler, Globe Staff

    The unidentified object that hurtled past Earth before dawn on
Thursday remains a mystery, astronomers said yesterday, and it
apparently slipped by without them getting a good look.
    A week ago, astronomers had decided that the tiny object,
which passed slightly farther away from Earth than the moon's distance
of 240,000 miles, was probably an asteroid -- a chunk of
interplanetary rock probably less than 30 feet across [BUT, read on!].
    But observations on Monday by European astronomers working in
Chile showed dramatic variations in brightness which suggest an
irregularly shaped, tumbling object with great variations in its
surface reflectivity, much more so than expected for a natural object
like an asteroid, said Brian Marsden, an astronomer.
    Marsden, director of the Cambridge-based International
Astronomical Union's Bureau for Astronomical Telegrams and Minor
Planet Center, said yesterday that the variation in brightness "means
we are dealing with some very peculiar object.  I would say man-made.
I think it wold be hard to explain this kind of variation with a
natural object, even a small one."
    But Marsden and others are still puzzling over what kind of
man-made object it is.
    Marsden said two weeks ago that it was probably the leftover
Centaur rocket used in 1974 to launch a sun-observing satellite called
Helios.  But more precise calculations of the object's orbit, based on
the latest observations, show that, traced backwards, it never quite
meets Earth, as it should if it had been launched from Earth.
    There is a possible explaination for that descrepancy, Marsden
said:  Centaur rockets sometimes contain leftover hydrogen fuel after
they reach orbit, and this fuel could continue to leak out, perhaps
for years.  This could propel the rocket in unpredictable directions,
like air escaping from a balloon that send it careening aound a room.
    During its closest approach to Earth on Thursday, the object
was too far south to be visible from anywhere in the northern
hemisphere.  Astronomers at the European Southern Observatory in Chile
tried to get pictures of it shortly after its closest approach in
order to get more precise data on its exact path and to make further
measurements of its brightness variations.
    But as of yesterday, they were unable to find any sign of the
object in their pictures.
    Because of the difficulty of the observation and the faintness
of the object, astronomers Richard West and Oliver Hainaut at the
observatory in the Chilean Andes continued to examine their images
carefully yesterday.
    These observations are essential to guarantee the success of a
planned radar observation of the object when it returns to visibility
in the northern hemisphere next week.  A successful radar observations
"would clinch it" as to whether the object is natural or artificial,
Marsden said.
    "I was hoping it would be natural," said Marsden, because that
would make it a very unusual type of asteroid and the smallest ever
detected, and therefore interesting to astronomers.  But because of
the brightness changes seen this week, he is now "90 percent sure"
that it is artificial.
    Because of the uncertain movements of a rocket leaking
leftover fuel, however, it may never be possible to identify it as a
specific rocket.
    If it is artificial but not any known rocket, that might
explain the astronomers' inability to locate it in their pictures,
Marsden joked.
    "Maybe that's why they couldn't be found last night," he said.
"Maybe they landed."


Tom

Article 17219 of sci.astro:
Path: lassie!voder!pyramid!gossip.pyramid.com!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!hplabs!hpl-opus!hpnmdla!hpsad!paulc
From: [e-mail] (Paul Christensen X3073)
Newsgroups: sci.astro
Subject: Wheres the Bolide?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 11 Feb 92 06:54:18 GMT
Organization: HP Signal Analysis Division - Rohnert Park, CA
Lines: 16

Hey all!

I heard in Dec that there was a large (3mi diam) object coming toward
earth... Some guy from NASA was saying that it was about
a year away.. He called it something like Tutautus????

Anyone up on this stuff?

If so, How close will it get??? <shiver>
(Where's my ticket to MARS??)


+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Paul Christensen        |     Email( Unix ) [e-mail]    |
| [phone]           |     HPDESK Paul Christensen / HP5300/A0     |
+---------------------- HP MicroElectronics ----------------------------+


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!agate!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Testable Unified Field and Electromagnetics
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:00:20 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 911

Article 22901 of sci.physics:
Path: lassie!voder!apple!netcomsv!noring
From: [e-mail] (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: alt.sci.physics.new-theories,sci.physics
Subject: "On a Testable Unification of EM, GR, and QM" by T.E. Bearden (LONG)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 4 Feb 92 07:48:57 GMT
Followup-To: alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 896
Xref: lassie sci.physics:22901


[This paper appeared in the 26th IECEC Conference, as past posts have
mentioned.  Posted with the permission of T.E. Bearden.  See my prior
post for more information.  J.Noring]



ON A TESTABLE UNIFICATION OF ELECTROMAGNETICS, GENERAL RELATIVITY, AND
QUANTUM MECHANICS

T. E. Bearden
Association of Distinguished American Scientists
2311 Big Cove Road
Huntsville, Alabama 35801

Walter Rosenthal
4876 Bethany Lane
Santa Maria, California 93455


Abstract

Unrecognized for what it was, in 1903-1904 E.T. Whittaker (W) published a
fundamental, engineerable theory of electrogravitation (EG) in two profound
papers.  The first (W-1903) demonstrated a hidden bidirectional EM wave
structure in the scalar potential of vacuum, and showed how to produce a
standing scalar EM potential wave -- the same wave discovered experimentally
four years earlier by Nikola Tesla.  W-1903 is a hidden variable theory that
shows how to deterministically curve the local and/or distant space-time using
EM.  W-1904 shows that all force field EM can be replaced by interferometry
of two scalar potentials, anticipating the Aharonov-Bohm effect by 55 years
and extending it to the engineerable macroscopic world.  W-1903 shows how to
turn EM into G-potential, curve local and/or distant space-time, and directly
engineer the virtual particle flux of vacuum.  W-1904 shows how to turn
G-potential and curvature of space-time back into force-field EM, even at a
distance.  The papers implement Sakharov's 1968 statement that gravitation is
not a fundamental field of nature, but a conglomerate of other fields.
Separately applied to electromagnetics (EM), quantum mechanics (QM), and
general relativity (GR), an extended superset of each results.  The three
supersets are Whittaker-unified, so that a testable, engineerable, unified
field theory is generated.  EM, QM, and GR each contained a fundamental error
that blocked unification, and these three errors are explained.  The
Schroedinger potential can also be structured and altered, indicating the
direct engineering of physical quantum change.  Recently Ignatovich has
pointed out this hidden bidirectional EM wave structure in the Schroedinger
potential, without referencing Whittaker's 1903 discovery of the basic effect.
The potential for applying the new approach to explain the nature of mind and
thought, and providing a laboratory-testable theory for them, is briefly
noted and indicative major references cited.  Some of the possible
implications for physics and biology are pointed out.

Electromagnetics Has Foundations Difficulties

There exists today a small but growing number of scientists who have become
aware that the presently accepted electromagnetic theory is seriously flawed.
Shortcomings in the theory are readily cited.  For example, in railgun
experiments the Lorentz force law has been falsified.  It was always an
approximation, and does not adequately approximate at high energies. [ref. 1]

Also completely contrary to orthodox EM theory, the EM force fields are not
primary agents at all, but are effects produced in and on the physical system
by the potentials.  As an example, we cite the Aharonov-Bohm (AB) effect,
which proves that, even in the total absence of the force fields, the
potentials remain and can interfere at a distance to produce real effects in
charged particle systems. [ref. 2]  The AB effect has been proven to the
satisfaction of all but the most diehard skeptics. [ref. 3]  However, its
fundamental impact on the basic notions underlying classical EM theory
continues to be ignored by all but a handful of scientists.

These EM shortcomings were not present in the original quaternion EM theory
by James Clerk Maxwell. [ref. 4]  Indeed, the original Maxwell theory
contains many things that were mistakenly eliminated from the abbreviated
vector theory formulated primarily by Heaviside and Gibbs, and to a lesser
extent by Hertz. [ref. 5]  Further, these things that do not exist in
conventional EM theory, but that exist in Maxwell's actual quaternion theory,
can be used in specially designed equipment, and the operation of that
equipment will be inexplicable by present-day electromagnetic theory.
AB-effect laboratory apparatuses are in fact rigorous demonstrations of such
a statement.


Scalar Electromagnetics

This can be even further explained and developed experimentally according to
Whittaker's fundamental approach. [ref. 6]  In a modern sense, in 1903/1904
Whittaker theoretically showed how to engineer the scalar potential with a
highly dynamic, hidden, bidirectional EM wave structure, to build hidden EM
vacuum engines that are still unsuspected in modern physics today.  Much of
the content of the fundamental 1959 Aharonov/Bohm paper was anticipated in a
different manner, and dramatically extended in an engineerable, testable
fashion, by Whittaker's two papers.  At the time, however, the vector


  phi(x)  |
          |
          |
          |
          |
          |
Potential |              +   +
          |          +           +
          |       +                 +
          |     +         EM          +
          |   +      Substructure       +
          |  +                           +
          | +                             +
          |+_______________________________+_______________________________+__
                                            +                             +
                                             +            EM             +
                                              +      Substructure       +
                                                +                     +
                                                  +                 +
                                                     +           +
                                                         +   +

Figure 1.  A Standing Scalar EM Potential Whittaker Wave.


interpretation of Maxwell's EM theory was just slowly beginning to spread as
the adopted model.  Also, special and general relativity and quantum
mechanics had not yet been born.  Accordingly, considering the scientific
understanding of the day, it was not possible for any scientist, even
Whittaker himself, to perceive the potential future impact these fundamental
papers could have on sciences and technologies not yet even born.
Unfortunately, in later years Whittaker apparently never realized that his
two earlier papers had such application to the modern unification problem.
Indeed, up to the time of Whittaker's death, very few scientists even
concerned themselves with the notion of unified fields.


Turning EM Energy Into G-Potential Energy

In his 1903 paper Whittaker showed that a standing scalar potential wave can
be decomposed into a special set of bidirectional EM waves that convolute
into a standing scalar potential wave, as shown in Figure 1.  As a corollary,
a set of bidirectional EM waves, stress waves, can be constructed to form a
standing scalar potential wave in space, as shown in Figure 2.  Since all
potentials represent trapped energy density of vacuum, they are gravitational


[Note, Figure 2 is too complicated to reproduce here in ASCII]

Figure 2.  Whittaker's Bidirectional EM Plane Wave Structure.


in nature. [ref. 7]  Because it represents a "standing wave" whose magnitude
represents the variation in the local energy density of the vacuum, the
Whittaker scalar potential wave represents a standing wave of variation in
the local curvature of vacuum, sharply in contradiction to the assumptions of
present electromagnetics and general relativity. [ref. 8]  It also represents
a standing wave of the variation of the local gauge.


Turning G-Potential Back to EM

The very next year, Whittaker's second paper (cited above) showed how to turn
such G-potential wave energy back into EM energy, even at a distance, by
scalar potential interferometry, anticipating and greatly expanding the
Aharonov-Bohm effect.  Indeed, Whittaker's second paper shows that the entire
present force-field electromagnetics can be directly replaced with scalar
potential interferometry.  In other words, scalar EM includes and extends the
present restricted vector subset of Maxwell's original theory.


Engineering the Nucleus Directly

Whittaker's work is even more striking when one realizes that potentials are
actually part of the vacuum itself.  They pervade through the electron shells
of an atom, directly reaching the nucleus and centering on it.  Gross
external changes (gradients; force fields) of the potentials interact
primarily with the electron shells of the atom.  The stabilized (persistent,
gradient-free) potential's primary interaction is with the atomic nucleus.
Specifically, the primary interaction between the infolded, internalized EM
bidirectional wave structure of a Whittaker potential is with the atomic
nuclei, rather than with the atom's electron shells, because in the standing
Whittaker potential wave the local magnitude of the external potential is not
changing.  Whittaker has in fact shown that there exists an unsuspected,
hidden, internal EM energy exchange channel between nuclei, a channel where
EM energy flows bidirectionally, undetected by most modern detectors.
Unlimited types of Whittaker-structures can be produced in the laboratory in
the form of deterministically structured potentials; for the first time, the
direct engineering, structuring, and manipulation of the nuclear potentials
themselves, even with miniscule EM power, is possible.  This is a new
capability of exceptional importance and application.  The Whittaker
structuring in effect allows one to produce a "virtual grid" to place in the
violent virtual particle flux (VPF) exchange of the local vacuum with the
nucleus.  By simply holding the grid signal constant, gradually the nuclear
potential itself will substructure (activate) with the same structure.  When
the activating ("charging") potential is removed, the activation of the
nucleus will gradually "decay" back to the normal structure.  Just as one
example, the binding energy of an atomic nucleus is accessible and,
theoretically, engineerable.


Whittaker Structuring Confirmed

Recently Ignatovich has pointed out the hidden bidirectional EM wave
structure in the Schroedinger potential, without referencing Whittaker's 1903
discovery of the basic effect. [ref. 9]  Also, recently modern researchers,
working on acoustic missiles and with the scalar acoustic wave equation, have
"rediscovered" Whittaker's 1903 infolded bidirectional planar waves inside
the scalar wave. [ref. 10]  They do not appear to have yet recognized its
relevance to their work in electromagnetic missiles. [ref. 11]


STOCHASTIC ELECTRODYNAMICS

Whittaker's paper takes on a significant new meaning, however, in light of
Sakharov's 1968 hypothesis that gravitation is not a primary field, but is
produced as a result of interactions of other fields.  Together with
Whittaker's structured potential, this implies that the gravitational aspects
of the nucleus can also be electromagnetically engineered.  As a result of
Sakharov's hypothesis, explosive activity in stochastic electrodynamics (SED)
has shown that many fundamental parts of physics are "already unified" in
terms of electromagnetics and gravitation.  Evidence continues to accumulate
that the gravitational field may not be a primary field of nature, but a
secondary or residual effect associated with other non-gravitational fields.
[ref. 12]   Actually, general relativity has always focused on energy as the
thing which really has gravitation.  Trapped energy, such as mass, is
particularly important.  But since mass is essentially trapped EM energy,
relativity has essentially assumed Sakharov's hypothesis anyway, without
stating it so explicitly.  Further, GR considers "the" G-potential as a
conglomerate of other things. [ref. 13]  It follows that the gradient of that
conglomerate yields a force field which is also a conglomerate.


G-Potential is Electromagnetic

Starting from Sakharov's postulate, to the first order gravitation should be
due to some aspect of the EM field, since EM is the strongest and most
universal force normally encountered in the macroscopic world experimentally,
and since mass is already "trapped EM energy."  Thus Sakharov focused
attention upon the zero-point EM energy fluctuations (ZPF) of vacuum.
Sakharov conjectured that the Lagrange function of the G-field is generated
by vacuum polarization, due to fermions. [ref. 14]  Akama et al examined the
potential generation of gravity as a collective excitation of fermion-
antifermion pairs. [ref. 15]   Haxlacher and Mottolo proved that space-time
(ST) curvature can arise from the quantum fluctuations of pure gauge fields.
[ref. 16]   Zee showed that gravity is generated as a symmetry-breaking
effect in quantum field theory in which a dynamical scale-invariance breaking
is postulated to take place at energies near the Planck mass. [ref. 17]
Amati, Veneziano and Yoshimoto showed that in pre-geometric models the
Einstein action and metric may be generated from quantum fluctuations of
matter fields. [ref. 18]   A review of the exploding field was given by
Adler, with particular emphasis on the case of renormalizable field theories
with dynamical scale-invariance breaking, in which the induced gravitational
effective action is finite and calculable. [ref. 19]


Puthoff's Important Contribution

Recently Puthoff has applied the Sakharov viewpoint to significantly advance
the stochastic electrodynamics field.  He has successfully explained why the
atom's orbital electrons do not decay into the nucleus, even though by
conventional EM theory each electron must constantly radiate EM energy, since
it is constantly accelerated. [ref. 20]  He has also shown that gravitation
can indeed be regarded as an induced effect associated with zero-point EM
fluctuations of the vacuum. [ref. 21]  He has also shown a feedback-
derivation of the source of the vacuum EM zero-point energy fluctuations
from quantum fluctuation motion of particles driven by the ZPE. [ref. 22]
Quantum fluctuation motion of particles and vacuum ZPE fluctuations are
connected by a causal, self-regenerating cosmological feedback cycle.


Some Conclusions

In light of Whittaker's EM structuring of the potential, there are several
important conclusions to be taken from the important SED work since
Sakharov's seminal suggestion, as follows: (1) In stochastic electrodynamics,
very solid theoretical foundation exists for electrogravitation.  (2) The
vacuum EM ZPF may be regarded as causally connected to quantum mechanical
particle jitter (Zitterbewegung motion) and vice versa, though the feedback
mechanism into the virtual particle flux of vacuum is normally hidden by the
large-scale integration represented by any macroscopic object or process.
(3) The SED theoretical demonstration of this hidden mechanism adds new
emphasis on the rather neglected hidden variable theories.  (4) In some
fashion, statistical quantum change is chaotic rather than random, for it has
already been shown by Puthoff that the vacuum ZPF fluctuations driving
everything are totally deterministic.  It follows that, theoretically, hidden
Whittaker order already exists in quantum change, and quantum change must be
already chaotic and at least partially deterministic.  (5) It follows that
there may well exist engineerable mechanisms that can affect or manipulate
quantum change.


Whittaker Potentials Are Engineerable

What Whittaker has described in his 1903 paper is a standing
electrogravitational wave, a standing wave in the local curvature of
space-time itself, that can readily be constructed experimentally.  This
Whittaker standing potential wave is precisely the new form of standing EM
wave that Nikola Tesla had experimentally discovered being radiated from a
thunderstorm four years earlier, on the night of July 3-4, 1899, and which he
recorded in his Colorado Springs Notebook on the morning of July 4, 1899.
[ref. 23]   Further, Whittaker's paper directly implies that the hidden
variable determinism shown by Puthoff to be driving the zero-point EM
fluctuations can also be engineered, both locally and at a distance.

In short, Whittaker's 1903 paper shows how to turn electromagnetics into
gravitational potential.  Unknowingly, Whittaker had already shown the
correct engineering way to unify EM and G fields, and already falsified one
of Einstein's later primary GR assumptions, that the local space-time is never
curved, in a testable manner, a decade before Einstein published his theory
of general relativity.

In the very next year, 1904, Whittaker's second paper (orally presented in
1903) was published. [ref. 24]  In this little-noticed paper Whittaker shows
that all classical force field electromagnetics can be replaced by scalar EM
potentials and their interferometry.  Specifically, any EM force field can be
replaced by two scalar potential fields and scalar interferometry.  The
combination of this paper and the 1903 Mathematische Annalen paper not only
includes the Aharonov-Bohm effect, but specifies a testable method for
producing a macroscopic and controlled Aharanov-Bohm effect, even at large
distances. [ref. 25]


PRESENT ELECTROMAGNETIC THEORY IS INCOMPLETE

As stated above, Maxwell's original EM theory was written in quaternions,
which are an extension to the complex number theory and an independent
system of mathematics.  In short, since the quaternion is a hypernumber,
Maxwell's theory was a hyperspatial theory, not just the limited three-
dimensional subset that was extracted and expressed by Heaviside and Gibbs
in terms of an abbreviated, incomplete vector mathematics. [ref. 26]


Heaviside and Gibbs Curtailed Maxwell's Theory

Oliver Heaviside was a brilliant, self-taught genius who never formally
attained a university degree, and whose papers were printed in technical
magazines rather than scientific journals.  When Maxwell published his
Treatise in 1873, Heaviside was just teaching himself differential equations.
Heaviside's imagination was completely seized by Maxwell's book, and Maxwell
forever became his hero.  However, he had great difficulty with quaternions
and could not completely tolerate them.


Electrogravitation Was Discarded

A puzzled Heaviside abhorred the quaternion, since it linked together a
scalar component and a vector component, or "apples and oranges," in his
view.  He excised the scalar component of the quaternion and excluded the
hyperspatial characteristics of its directional components, producing his
much more limited vectors.  To unite magnetics and electromagnetics, the
simplest complex aspect of the quaternion had to be restored by resorting to
ordinary imaginary numbers.  These machinations to the quaternion theory,
however, discarded its unified field theory aspects.  In short, Heaviside
produced a very practical, highly restricted subset that was far easier to
engineer, but he threw out electrogravitation in the process.


Hatred of the Potential

Heaviside hated the potential because he did not truly understand it.  He
stated that it was "...mystical and should be murdered from the theory."  He
conditioned generations of physicists and engineers to erroneously believe
that the potential was just a mathematical convenience, and had no actual
physical realization.  Indeed, most electrical physicists and electrical
engineers are still of that erroneous persuasion today, even though the
Aharonov-Bohm work has long-since falsified such a position, both
theoretically and experimentally.


The Quaternion Theory Was Already a Unified EM/G Theory

The present author has previously pointed out that Maxwell's quaternion
theory was in fact a unified theory of electromagnetics and gravitation, and
that the scalar component of the quaternion was the electrogravitational part.
[ref. 27]  That part was discarded by Heaviside and Gibbs, and so
electrogravitation no longer appears in the electromagnetics that resulted
from Heaviside's and Gibbs' surgery on Maxwell's quaternion theory.  Strong
experimental evidence for the EG nature of Whittaker's scalar EM theory is
planned for presentation at this conference. [ref. 28]


ELECTROGRAVITATION ALSO EXCLUDED FROM GENERAL RELATIVITY

The electrogravitational effect was also erroneously excluded from
Einsteinian general relativity (GR).  Einstein unwittingly narrowed his
general relativity to only a subset of an unrestricted general relativity of
curved space-time, by excluding local curvature.  This GR error was an
indirect result of the fundamental Heaviside/Gibbs omission error in
classical electromagnetics.


Einstein's Gedankenexperiment

Unfortunately, Einstein's view of electromagnetics approximated the classical
Heaviside/Gibbs view.  In classical EM theory, the electrical potentials,
which actually were electrogravitational potentials, were already ignored as
having no physical significance, and EM was considered mutually exclusive
to G.  Therefore, Einstein only considered the weak gravitational force due
to the attraction of mass, in developing his general relativity theory of
curved space-time.  The G-force is far weaker than the E-force; for two
electrons, for example, the attractive G-force between them is on the order
of only 10^-42 times as strong as their electrical E-force repulsion.  Thus
the G-force is incredibly smaller than the EM force.  If only the weak
G-force is considered for curving space-time, then there will never be an
observable curvature except in the immediate vicinity of a very large mass,
such as on the surface of the sun or near a star.

Considering the weak G-force as the agent for curvature, Einstein reasoned
that the laboratory and the observer/scientist/instrument would never be on
the surface of the sun or near a star.  Therefore, the local space-time, where
the lab and the scientist/observer and his instruments are, would never be
observably curved.  The local space-time of the observer would always be flat.

Unfortunately Einstein then overgeneralized his thought examination, and he
stated one of his fundamental postulates of general relativity as "The local
space-time is always flat."  This is an erroneous overstatement.  The
postulate should be more correctly stated as follows: "The local space-time is
always flat, whenever only the weak gravitational force is used for the agent
of curvature, and the observer is not near a large collection of mass, such
as a star."


Corollary to the Corrected Postulate

The two statements of the postulate differ fundamentally.  Einstein's
overstatement of the postulate does not allow the far stronger EM force to be
used as an agent for local curvature.  In effect, his own postulate excluded
electromagnetics from curvature unity with gravitation, in his general
relativity theory. [ref. 29]  On the other hand, the corrected statement of
the postulate admits the following corollary: "When a very strong force such
as the electromagnetic force is used for the agent of curvature, the local
space-time may be curved, even though the observer is not near a large
collection of mass, such as a star." [ref. 30]

Regrettably, many of Einstein's modern followers have raised Einstein's
theory to a dogma, and have vigorously enforced his overstatement of the
locally flat space-time. [ref. 31]  In so doing, general relativity has been
erroneously reduced to a theory that is basically not experimental:
A priori, if the local space-time is flat, then there is no local experiment
or local apparatus that involves or yields a curved space-time where the
laboratory, the instruments, and the observer are located.  In this fashion
the universities have continued to perpetuate the exclusion of
electrogravitation and its direct space-time curvature engineering
implications.


THE CURTAILMENT OF QUANTUM MECHANICS

Today, quantum mechanics is our most successful physics theory.  Its
predictions, even the eery prediction of action at a distance, have been
proven time and time again.  However, quantum mechanics theory is known to
have a formidable foundations difficulty:  Try as they will, quantum
physicists cannot find chaos in the theory.  The theory is known to be wrong
unless it possesses chaos (hidden order inside its statistics), yet the best
efforts of quantum physicists have failed to find it. [ref. 32]


Chaos Excluded By Inherent Assumption

Any well-founded mathematical discipline is totally implied by its
foundations postulates, and that is true of quantum mechanics.  If the best
efforts of the ablest physicists of the day cannot find chaos in the present
QM, then one may suspect that the present QM does not contain chaos (hidden
order), but already excludes it in some fashion.  If that is true, then some
present QM postulate, either explicit or implicit, of QM must be the culprit.
If so, the "real" QM needed is a superset that has at least two subsets: one
(the missing) subset includes chaos, while the present subset excludes chaos.
So we may suspect that one or more of the postulates of the present QM theory
is in error or overly restrictive, and must be changed to allow the missing
chaotic subset.


Gibbs Statistics Excludes Hidden Order

Indeed, we may resolve this formidable QM problem quite simply by examining
the statistics utilized by quantum mechanics.  When QM was being formulated,
scientists simply appropriated and included the thermodynamic statistics of
Willard Gibbs (the same Gibbs who, together with Heaviside, was responsible
for the highly restricted vector subset of Maxwell's theory of
electromagnetics.).  Gibbs' thermodynamics statistics was totally based on
the notion of the random variable.  That is, the change (value assumed by the
variable in a specific instance) is not only totally statistical, it is also
totally random.  Quantum physicists assumed a postulate of QM as follows:
"Quantum change is totally statistical."  However, because of the Gibbs
statistics, in application they interpreted that postulate in a much stronger
fashion, as if it had been stated thusly: "Quantum change is totally
statistical and random."  The actual postulate and the presently applied
interpretation of it are in fact two quite different statements, and the
interpretation is far more restrictive than actually implied by the postulate
itself.


The Random Interpretation Is False

Further, the strong interpretation can readily be falsified.  As an example,
the macroscopic universe is simply a large integration (collection) of
quantum changes.  If these component quanta occur totally randomly, then no
integration of them would yield the ordered, macroscopic world we all live
in, because integrated randomness is still random.  Therefore, since the
ordered macroworld exists, the present QM strong interpretation of its own
statistical quantum change postulate is invalid.

In addition, if quantum change were totally random, then there would never be
any possibility, a priori, of engineering it deterministically.  Presently,
almost all quantum physicists believe that quantum change cannot be
engineered, on first principles.  On the other hand, if hidden order is
admitted, there is at least the possibility of directly engineering physical
quantum change itself.


Hidden Variables

Interestingly, the renowned physicist David Bohm has shown that a hidden
variable theory of quantum mechanics can actually be constructed, whereby
one could potentially engineer physical change. [ref. 33]  It is well-known
that experimental physics does not in any manner refute hidden variable
theories.  Because of the historical attachment of physics to the theory of
the random variable, such contrary notions as chaos (hidden order) and
hidden variables have simply been greeted with suspicion and shuffled aside.
The usual objection is Occam's razor; a theory must predict something
different, or it is said to be unwarranted. [ref. 34]  But based on this
same form of Occam's overworked razor, the Whittaker hidden variable
approach certainly predicts many profoundly different engineerable effects
and capabilities that mandate its full examination.


Correction of the Statistical Postulate

A much better, valid interpretation of the quantum change postulate is as
follows:  "Quantum change is statistical, and may contain hidden order."

The two interpretations differ sharply.  In the new and less restrictive
reinterpretation, one has three cases or subsets of QM as follows: (1) the
subset where quantum change contains partial order, hence is already chaotic,
(2) the subset where the internal order has vanished, leaving the statistics
as Gibbs' random variable statistics, and exhibiting the present quantum
mechanics without chaos, and (3) the subset where the statistics is totally
deterministic, but information on the variables is lost.


Remarks On the New Interpretation

The new interpretation is consistent with Bohm's hidden variable theory, and
it is also consistent with the Schroedinger equation, which in the QM model
already propagates the QM states forward in time with absolute determinism.
It is even possible, for example, to deterministically produce a Bohm/
de Broglie quantum potential, according to a self-targeting repetitive phase
conjugation mechanism advanced by this author. [ref. 35]  The new
interpretation is not consistent with the Copenhagen interpretation, which
only applies to the present QM subset.  This can be seen as follows:  If
quantum change is engineerable by Whittaker hidden variables, then the inner
contents of the engineered quantum change are known.  This knowledge applies
to the subset where QM change is engineered (the new subset), but not to the
subset where all variables are random variables and hence not subject to
engineering.  Therefore the Copenhagen interpretation applies to the random
quantum change subset, but not to chaotic (partially ordered) quantum change
subset.


The New Interpretation Is Testable

Happily, the reinterpretation of the postulate now allows a sufficient
collection of already-chaotic quantum changes to produce the well-ordered,
macroscopic universe we all live in.  Also, the new interpretation is
testable, and it can be falsified or verified in the laboratory.


THE END RESULT OF ABBREVIATING MAXWELL'S THEORY


Effect On EM

In discarding the scalar component of the quaternion, Heaviside and Gibbs
unwittingly discarded the unified EM/G portion of Maxwell's theory that
arises when the translational/directional components of two interacting
quaternions reduce to zero, but the scalar resultant remains and infolds a
deterministic, dynamic structure that is a function of oppositive
directional/translational components.  In the infolding of EM energy inside
a scalar potential, a structured scalar potential results, almost precisely
as later shown by Whittaker but unnoticed by the scientific community.  The
simple vector equations produced by Heaviside and Gibbs captured only that
subset of Maxwell's theory where EM and gravitation are mutually exclusive.
In that subset, electromagnetic circuits and equipment will not ever, and
cannot ever, produce gravitational or inertial effects in materials and
equipments.  Not a single one of those Heaviside/Gibbs equations ever
appeared in a paper or book by James Clerk Maxwell, even though the severely
restricted Heaviside/Gibbs interpretation is universally and erroneously
taught in all Western universities as Maxwell's theory.


Effect On GR

As a result of this artificial restriction of Maxwell's theory, Einstein also
inadvertently restricted his theory of general relativity, forever preventing
the unification of electromagnetics and relativity.  He also essentially
prevented the present restricted general relativity from ever becoming an
experimental, engineerable science on the laboratory bench, since a hidden
internalized electromagnetics causing a deterministically structured local
space-time curvature was excluded.


Effect On QM

Quantum mechanics used only the Heaviside/Gibbs externalized electromagnetics
and completely missed Maxwell's internalized and ordered electromagnetics
enfolded inside a structured scalar potential.  Accordingly, QM maintained
its Gibbs statistics of quantum change, which is non-chaotic a priori.
Quantum physicists by and largely excluded Bohm's hidden variable theory,
which conceivably could have offered the potential of engineering quantum
change, engineering physical reality itself.


In Summary

Each of the three major scientific disciplines missed and excluded a subset
of its disciplinary area, because it did not have the scalar component of the
quaternion to incorporate.  Further, all of them completely missed the
significance of the Whittaker approach, which already shows how to apply and
engineer the very subsets they had excluded.

What now exist in these areas are three inconsistent disciplines.  Each of
them unwittingly excluded a vital part of its discipline, which was the
unified field part.  Ironically, then, present physicists continue to exert
great effort to find the missing key to unification of the three disciplines,
but find it hopeless, because these special subsets are already contradictory
to one another, as is quite well-known to foundations physicists.


CONCLUSIONS

Obviously, if one wishes to unify physics, one must add back the
unintentionally excluded, unifying subsets to each discipline.

Interestingly, all three needed subsets turn out to be one and the same, as
shown in Figure 3.  So application of Whittaker's work to each one of the
three disciplines produces the necessary superset of each, and these three
supersets are unified in and on the common added Whittaker subset.


                        _______________________
                        |                     |
                        |       GENERAL       |
                        |   RELATIVITY (GR)   |
   _____________________|_____________________|_____________________
   |                    |                     |                    |
   |         QM         |        APPLY        |     CLASSICAL      |
   |      (MISSING      |      WHITTAKER      |        EM          |
   |       CHAOS)       |       THEORY        |      THEORY        |
   |____________________|_____________________|____________________|
                        |                     |
                        |   MIND AND SUBTLE   |
                        |       ENERGY        |
                        |_____________________|

Figure 3.  Whittaker Unification of EM, GR, and QM.



Also, as shown in the figure, one gets an added and unexpected bonus of great
value: Mind, thought, and life occupy time, and if time is treated as a real
dimension, then these are real also.  Since fundamental units in which
physics is modeled are arbitrary, one can even model physics in terms of one
unit, time.  In that case, everything is a time structure.  Since even
physical reality can be viewed in this fashion, it is not unreasonable to
view mind, thought, and life as real; they do after all occupy time.
However, since they do not emerge in the normal external electromagnetics,
they must lie within the hidden, internal electromagnetics (since the photon
carries both time and energy, being a piece of action).  Without further
development, we state that the Whittaker hidden variable EM approach, in
allowing the complete engineering of the internal electromagnetics, allows
the complete engineering of mind, thought, and life.  Living systems have
utilized the internal EM Whittaker channel (in and through atomic nuclear
potentials and area quantum potentials) since the beginning. [ref. 36]

Finally, the Whittaker unification linkage of the three disciplines is
testable.  It is engineerable.  It works.


NOTES AND REFERENCES

[1]   P. Graneau, Ampere-Neumann Electrodynamics of Metals, Nonantum,
      Massachusetts, Hadronic Press, 1985.  See also P. Graneau and P.N.
      Graneau, "Electrodynamic Explosions in Liquids," Appl. Phys. Lett.,
      Vol. 46, 1985, p. 468; R. Azevedo, P. Graneau, P.N. Graneau, and
      C. Millet, "Powerful Water Plasma Explosions," Phys. Lett. Vol. 117,
      1986, p. 101.

[2]   See Y. Aharonov and D. Bohm, "Significance of Electromagnetic
      Potentials in the Quantum Theory," Phys. Rev. Second Series, 115(3),
      Aug. 1, 1959, p. 458-491.  This paper pointed out the primacy of the
      potentials.  Instead of being causative agents, the force fields are
      actually effects generated in and of charged particle systems from the
      potentials.  This is in complete violation of both classical
      electromagnetics and classical dynamics, but it is absolutely required
      by quantum mechanics.  For an extensive discussion of the Aharonov-Bohm
      effect and an extensive list of references, see S. Olariu and
      I. Iovitzu Popescu, "The Quantum Effects of Electromagnetic Fluxes,"
      Rev. Mod. Phys. 57(2), Apr. 1985.

[3]   See Bertram Schwarzschild, "Currents in normal-metal rings exhibit
      Aharonov-Bohm Effect," Physics Today, 39(1), Jan. 1986, p. 17-20 for
      confirmation.

[4]   James Clerk Maxwell, A Treatise on Electricity and Magnetism, Oxford
      University Press, Oxford, 1873.  The third edition is published by
      Dover, 1954.

[5]   Maxwell's true theory of electromagnetics is contained in some 200-odd
      quaternion equations, and is far more complex than the gross vector
      simplification developed by Heaviside and Gibbs after Maxwell's death.
      For a cogent argument about what might have been discovered much
      earlier in physics if quaternions had not been cast aside, see James
      D. Edmonds, Jr., "Quaternion Quantum Theory: New Physics or Number
      Mysticism?", Am. J. Phys., 42(3), Mar. 1974, p. 220-223.  Just how much
      more powerful was Maxwell's quaternionic expression of EM theory than
      was Heaviside's (i.e., the modern) vector interpretation, was
      succinctly expressed by Josephs as follows: "Hamilton's algebra of
      quaternions, unlike Heaviside's algebra of vectors, is not a mere
      abbreviated mode of expressing Cartesian analysis, but is an independent
      branch of mathematics with its own rules of operation and its own
      special theorems.  A quaternion is, in fact, a generalized or
      hypercomplex number..." (H.J. Josephs, "The Heaviside Papers Found at
      Paignton in 1957," Electromagnetic Theory by Oliver Heaviside,
      Including an account of Heaviside's unpublished notes for a fourth
      volume, and with a foreword by Sir Edmund Whittaker, Vol. III, Third
      Edition, Chelsea Publishing Co., New York, 1971, p. 660.)

[6]   See E.T. Whittaker, "On the Partial Differential Equations of
      Mathematical Physics," Math. Ann., Vol. 57, 1903, p. 333-355; "On an
      Expression of the Electromagnetic Field Due to Electrons by Means of
      Two Scalar Potential Functions," Proc. Lond. Math. Soc., Series 2,
      Vol. 1, 1904, p. 367-372.

[7]   In the modern view, it is trapped energy that is gravitational, mass
      being viewed as simply such trapped energy.  We point out that
      Einstein's formula E = mc^2 actually is an expression for mass in terms
      of its trapped EM energy.  Thus we extend the modern view by stating
      that, to first order, Newtonian gravitational attraction is due to the
      attraction of spatially entrapped electromagnetic energy.  Since the
      electromagnetic scalar potentials represent just such spatially
      entrapped EM energy, then they hold a special significance
      gravitationally.

[8]  This assertion can be tested.  At the nodal points of the standing
     potential wave, the rate of flow of time is normal.  At nonzero points
     along the wave, however, the local rate of flow of local time varies
     from normal.  After a proper-time interval for the observer at the nodal
     point, normal clocks and watches at different non-nodal points along the
     wave will appreciably vary in their time reading.  Initially
     synchronized clocks will thus be found to disagree, if placed in
     different positions in the Whittaker wave and allowed to remain for a
     test period.  In the past, various inventors have anecdotally
     demonstrated this effect.  As an example, see David Jones, Vancouver
     Sun Times, Dec. 17, 1977, p. 17.

[9]   V.K. Ignatovich, "The Remarkable Capabilities of Recursive Relations,"
      Am. J. Phys., 57(10), Oct. 1989, p. 873-878.

[10]  Richard W. Ziolkowski, "Localized transmission of wave energy," Proc.
      SPIE, Vol. 1061, Microwave and Particle Beam Sources and Directed
      Energy Concepts, Jan. 1989, p. 396-397.

[11]  An acoustic missile is essentially a slug of acoustic energy that holds
      together as it travels, striking and damaging or destroying a target.
      An electromagnetic missile is a slug of EM energy that holds together
      as it travels to a target and strikes it.

[12]  A.D. Sakharov, "Vacuum Quantum Fluctuations in Curved Space and the
      Theory of Gravitation," Sov. Phys. Dokl., Vol. 12, 1968, p. 1040.  See
      also the related discussion in Misner, Thorne and Wheeler, Gravitation,
      1973, p. 426.

[13]  Note that this assigns an internal structure to a gravitational
      potential.

[14]  A.D. Sakharov, Theor. Math. Phys., Vol. 23, 1975, p. 435.

[15]  K. Akama et al, Prog. Theor. Phys., Vol. 60, 1978, p. 868.

[16]  B. Hasslacher and E. Mottolo, Phys. Lett., Vol. 95B, 1980, p. 237.

[17]  A. Zee, Phys. Rev. Lett., Vol. 42, 1979, p. 417.

[18]  D. Amati and G. Veneziano, Phys. Lett., Vol. 105B, 1981, p. 358; S.
      Yoshimoto, Prog. Theor. Phys., Vol. 78, 1987, p. 435.

[19]  S. Adler, Rev. Mod. Phys., Vol. 54, 1982, p. 729.

[20]  H.E. Puthoff, "Ground State of Hydrogen as a Zero-Point-Fluctuation-
      Determined State," Phys. Rev. D, 35(10), May 15, 1987, p. 3266-3269.

[21]  H.E. Puthoff, "Gravity as a Zero-Point-Fluctuation Force," Phys. Rev.
      A., 39(5), Mar. 1, 1989, p. 2333-2342.  See also H.E. Puthoff, "Source
      of Vacuum electromagnetic Zero-Point Energy," Phys. Rev. A., 40(9),
      Nov. 1, 1989, p. 4857-4862.  Changing the vacuum potential constitutes
      a fluctuation directly in and of the zero-point energy of vacuum, and
      hence, by Puthoff's mechanism, it does indeed induce a gravitational
      effect.  At the level of the vacuum virtual particle flux exchange with
      the charged nucleus, producing an electromagnetic change also produces
      a gravitational change, and vice-versa.

[22]  Puthoff, Phys. Rev. D., 35(10), May 15, 1987, p. 3266-3269.

[23]  Nikola Tesla, Colorado Springs Notes 1899-1900, Nolit, Belgrade,
      Yugoslavia, 1978, p. 61-62.

[24]  E.T. Whittaker, "On an Expression of the Electromagnetic Field Due to
      Electrons by Means of Two Scalar Potential Functions," Proc. Lond. Math.
      Soc., Series 2, Vol. 1, 1904, p. 367-372.

[25]  The potential for weaponization of the Whittaker work should be
      obvious.

[26]  Toward the end of his life Heaviside lived as a recluse in a small
      garret apartment, and may have returned again to his struggle with
      quaternions.  In the 1950's handwritten notes of a theory of
      gravitation, written in quaternion mathematics, were found beneath the
      floor boards of his tiny study.

[27]  T.E. Bearden, "Maxwell's Original Quaternion Theory Was a Unified Field
      Theory of Electromagnetics and Electrogravitation," Proceedings,
      International Tesla Society Symposium, Colorado Springs, Colorado, July
      1988.  See also T.E. Bearden, "Maxwell's Lost Unified Field Theory of
      Electromagnetics and Gravitation," Proceedings, PACE Third
      International New Energy Technology Symposium, June 25-28, 1988 at
      Maison du Citoyen, Hull (Ottawa), Canada, 1988.

[28]  See Floyd Sweet and T.E. Bearden, "Utilizing Scalar Electromagnetics
      to Tap Vacuum Energy," Proceedings, this conference.

[29]  Ironically, Einstein then spent the remainder of his life, desperately
      trying to unify electromagnetics and gravitation in his theory of
      general relativity, never realizing that his own overstatement of his
      "flat local space-time" postulate precluded his success and foredoomed
      all his efforts to failure.

[30]  To appreciate just what can actually be done with local space-time
      curvature, see E.B. Smetanin, "Electromagnetic Field in a Space With
      Curvature - New Solutions," Sov. Phys. J., 25(2), Feb. 1982, p. 107-111.

[31]  For a detailed exposition of the scientific suppression used to uphold
      the present GR, written by an inside scientist of excellent ability, and
      one with over 100 published papers in the literature, see Rugero Maria
      Santilli, Ethical Probe on Einstein's Followers in the USA:  An
      Insider's View, Alpha Publishing, POB 82, Newtonville, MA 02160, 1984.

[32]  For a discussion of the missing chaos in quantum mechanics, see Robert
      Pool, "Quantum Chaos: Enigma Wrapped in a Mystery," Science, 243(4893),
      Feb. 17, 1989, p. 893-895.  For a more technical discussion see P.V.
      Elyutin, "The Quantum Chaos Problem," Sov. Phys. Usp. 31(7), July 1988,
      p. 597-622.

[33]  For an entry point into the literature of hidden variable theory, see
      Quantum Implications: Essays in Honour of David Bohm, B. J. Hiley and
      F. David Peat, Eds., Routledge & Kegan Paul, London & New York, 1987.

[34]  However, even if it predicts something new and is warranted, it still
      may not be adopted.  An example is the continuing reluctance of
      physicists to reformulate EM theory, stressing the primacy of the
      potential and the fact that not the force field but only the potential
      for the force field exists in the vacuum.  Even more so, it is well-
      known that detection is actually binary, and we throw away precisely
      half of almost every detection our instruments make.  C.f. Richard
      Kidd et al, "Evolution of the Modern Photon," Am. J. Phys., 57(1),
      Jan. 1989, p. 27-35.  Generally in every electromagnetic interaction of
      our instruments, two photons are produced: one a time-forward photon,
      and the other a time-reversed photon.  Our detectors essentially
      measure the time-forward photon half, not the time-reversed photon
      (antiphoton) half.  The antiphoton half produces a slight recoil force
      (Newton's third law reaction force) in the mass (nuclei) of the
      instrument, which we ignore.  Also, we continue to ignore the evidence
      that the photon and antiphoton are not identical.  In a pumped phase
      conjugate mirror, for example, the emission of a normal photon from the
      mirror material results in a recoil of the mirror; the emission of an
      antiphoton by the mirror material, however, does not result in recoil
      of the mirror.  Physics is still not consistent, as is well-known to
      foundations researchers, but this fact is generally not accented to
      university students.

[35]  Bearden, Gravitobiology, Tesla Book Co., 1991, p. 33-36.  The mechanism
      was previously advanced in several miscellaneous papers and in private
      correspondence.

[36]  See Bearden, Gravitobiology, Tesla Book Co., for additional development
      of biological effects and mechanisms of scalar EM.


*******************
End of paper
*******************


--
=============================================================================
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----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:04:04 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 128


        The following posting is a summary written by my friend and
    co-worker, Drew LePage, of an article in the January 1992 issue of
    the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS), Volume 45,
    Number 1.  Titled "An Estimate of the Prevalence of Biocompatible
    and Habitable Planets", it is authored by M. J. Fogg.

   ########################################################################

        There is a very interesting article in the January 1992 edition
    of the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS) on the
    likelihood of various types of stars having habitable or biocompatible
    planets.  A biocompatible planet is one where the long term presence
    of surface liquid water provides environmental conditions suitable for
    for the origin and evolution of life.  There are three subsets of
    biocompatible planets:

  * Juvenile Martian - As the name implies, it is a planet with condition
    similar to those found on Mars early in its life.  The planet would
    receive between 27% and 75% of the light we presently receive from the
    Sun and possess plate tectonics or some other geochemical carbon cycle.
    Mars was this type for its first one billion years.

  * Juvenile Terran - Again as the name implies, this is a planet with
    conditions similar to those found on the early Earth.  The planet
    would receive between 75% and 95% of the light we presently receive
    from the Sun and be geologically active.  Earth was this type of planet
    for its first four billion years (i.e. during the Precambrian period).

  * Habitable - This is a planet with Earthlike conditions.  The planet
    would receive between 95% and 110% of the light we receive and be
    geologically active.

        The author of the study collected the results of various studies
    to determine what conditions produce biocompatible and habitable
    planets, the evolution of stars and the effects on planetary environ-
    ments, the likely distribution of planets in other systems, as well
    as others.  The results of the author's simulations indicate the
    following:

  * Habitable planets can exist around stars with 0.8 to 1.8 times the
    mass of the Sun.

  * Biocompatible planets can exist around stars with 0.5 to 1.8 times the
    mass of the Sun.

  * Habitable planets may occur around >3% of the stars between 0.85 and
    1.45 times the mass of the Sun.

  * Biocompatible planets may occur around >30% of the stars between 0.8
    and 1.25 time the mass of the Sun.

        If only single stars possess planets:

  * There would be one habitable planet for every 413 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with habitable planets would be
    31 light years.

  * There would be one biocompatible planet for every 39 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with biocompatible planets would be
    14 light years.

  * There would be about 362 biocompatible (of which 34 would be habitable)
    planets within 100 light years of us.

        If planets could form in multiple star systems:

  * There would be one habitable planet for every 196 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with habitable planets would be 24
    light years.

  * There would be one biocompatible planet for every 18 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with biocompatible planets would be
    11 light years.

  * There would be about 763 biocompatible (of which 71 would be habitable)
    planets within 100 light years of us.

        The author goes further and calculates the probability of the
    nearer stars having biocompatible or habitable planets.  Assuming that
    planets can form in multiple star systems the following probabilities
    were calculated:

  Name            Distance (LY)    Type    Habitable    Biocompatible

  Alpha Centauri A       4.38        G2V       7.8%            44%
  Alpha Centauri B       4.38        K6V       4.4%            38%
  Epsilon Eridani      10.69        K2V       0.6%            34%
  61 Cygni A          11.17        K5V       0.0%             5.8%
  61 Cygni B          11.17        K7V       0.0%             0.3%
  Epsilon Indi          11.21        K5V       0.0%            18%
  Lacille 9352          11.69        M2       0.0%            <0.3%
  Tau Ceti          11.95        G8V       1.5%            35%
  Lacille 8760          12.54        M1V       0.0%             1.5%
  Groombridge 1618      15.03        K7       0.0%             2.5%
  70 Ophiuchi A          16.73        K1       4.4%            38%
  70 Ophiuchi B          16.73        K6       0.0%            16%
  36 Ophiuchi A          17.73        K0V       0.0%            28%
  36 Ophiuchi B          17.73        K1V       0.0%            27%
  36 Ophiuchi C          17.73        K5V       0.0%             9.0%
  HR 7703 A          18.43        K3V       0.0%            27%
  Sigma Draconis      18.53        K0V       1.5%            35%
  Delta Pavonis          18.64        G5       5.1%            39%
  Eta Cassiopeiae A      19.19        G0V       3.9%            38%
  Eta Cassiopeiae B      19.19        M0       0.0%             0.7%
  HD 36395          19.19        M1V       0.0%             0.5%
  Wolf 294          19.41        M4       0.0%            <0.3%
  +5301320 A          19.65        M0       0.0%             0.6%
  +5301320 B          19.65        M0       0.0%             0.5%
  -45013677          20.6        M0       0.0%            <0.3%
  82 Eridani          20.9        G5       4.4%            38%
  Beta Hydri          21.3        G1       7.5%            35%
  HR 8832          21.4        K3       0.0%            23%

        Assuming that the author's simulations and calculations are
    correct, there could be as many as 5.6 BILLION biocompatible planets
    in our galaxy of which about 500 MILLION are habitable.  And, as the
    above table shows, the nearest biocompatible planet could only be
    4.38 light years away.

        Drew LePage


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!spool.mu.edu!agate!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: New Asteroid Coming Our Way ...
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:06:31 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 53

..or is it really an asteroid?  Reference the file Something Wicked This Way
Comes.....

Len



----- Begin Included Message -----

From: [e-mail] (Jim Scotti x2717)
Newsgroups: sci.astro,sci.space
Subject: Re: NEW UNUSUAL ASTEROID FOUND...
Organization: Lunar & Planetary Laboratory, Tucson AZ.
Lines: 34
Xref: lassie sci.astro:16766 sci.space:32698

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Peter Brown) writes:
>
>NEW OUTER SOLAR SYSTEM ASTEROID/COMET FOUND - DUNCAN STEEL, 1992 January 24th
>
>
>On January 1st an object presently designated SS078 (Spacewatch Survey
>object number 078) was discovered by Dr David Rabinowitz using the
>Spacewatch Camera at Kitt Peak, Arizona.
>
The object was discovered on January 9 and re-observed by Spacewatch
on January 10 and 13.  Images were later found by Carolyn Shoemaker
made from Palomar on January 1.  It has now been given the asteroidal
designation 1992 AD.  We expect that more pre-discovery images from
opposition passages in the last 5-10 years may be forthcoming as the
orbit (and subsequent backwards search ephemerides) is improved.  In
the weeks following the discovery of (2060) Chiron at the end of 1977,
images were found in previous years, for example on the Palomar Sky
Survey in the early 1950's & eventually as early as the 1880's!  Chiron,
however, gets a bit brighter & does not travel as far from the sun
as 1992 AD and we don't expect images going back more than a few
years.  1992 AD is now approximately Visual magnitde 16.8.  At the
time of the Palomar Sky Survey in the early 1950's, 1992 AD was near
aphelion and would have been fainter than V=22, below the plate limit.



---------------------------------------------
Jim Scotti
Spacewatch Project
{[e-mail]}
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA
---------------------------------------------


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cis.ohio-state.edu!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: YOUR OWN PERSONAL OPTICAL SETI
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:02:37 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 7917

Check this out!!!!!
Len

===============================================================================


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6A - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part A - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

                         ASA MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION

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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        ASA Officers and Council -

        President - Don Barry
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        Council - Jim Bitsko, Bill Black, Mike Burkhead, Bill Crane,
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    Astronomical Society of the Atlantic, Inc.











    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        Editor's Note -

        This January issue of EJASA is in six parts, and is devoted to the
    work of Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley on the subject of SETI in the Optical
    Spectrum.  While the concept of Optical SETI is not new, it has yet
    to receive the same attention as the surveys for signals from alien
    intelligences in the microwave spectrum.  It is the desire of
    Dr. Kingsley that this paper will elevate the status of the optical
    approach to the search for extraterrestrial intelligence.

        Parts A, B, and C deal with the general concepts of Optical SETI,
    in particular Professional Optical SETI.  Part D covers Amateur Optical
    SETI.  In that part, the basic design of an Amateur Optical SETI
    Observatory is described, and details given of its approximate cost.
    Part E contains the discussion and conclusions, and an extensive list
    of references.  Finally, Part F contains two Appendices:  The first
    gives the theory and specimen calculations to support the case made for
    both Professional and Amateur Optical SETI; the second gives the
    Post-Detection SETI Protocols.

        This year will see considerable media attention given to Microwave
    (Conventional) SETI.  On Columbus Day, October 12, NASA's Microwave
    Observing Project, which is otherwise known by the acronym MOP, will be
    activated in the Northern Hemisphere at Puerto Rico's three hundred-
    meter diameter Arecibo telescope (Targeted Search) and NASA's thirty
    four-meter antenna at the Deep Space Network (DSN) in Goldstone,
    California (All Sky Survey).  Later, the seventy-meter telescopes at
    Parkes and Tidbinbilla in Australia, and the thirty-meter telescope at
    the Institute Argentino de Radioastronomia Villa Elisa in Argentina,
    will join the program for complementary observations in the Southern
    Hemisphere.

        At this auspicious moment as we approach the five hundredth
    anniversary of Christopher Columbus's discovery of the Americas,
    Dr. Kingsley brings to the public's attention the suggestion that we
    may not actually be tuned to the correct frequencies, so that the
    chances of discovering older, more mature extraterrestrial technical
    civilizations will be substantially impaired.


        CORRECTIONS -

        While every care has been taken to ensure the theoretical correct-
    ness of this paper, inevitable mistakes will be found, particularly
    considering the size and complexity of this material.  The author
    wishes it to be known that he would like to hear about these errors.
    The COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION page provides information as to how he may
    be contacted.

        The COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION (Page iii) contains the version number
    for this issue of the EJASA.  If later, corrected versions are
    released, they will have a version number greater than 1.00.



    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        DOWNLOADING AND PRINTING ADVICE -

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        If you receive a copy of this document on a floppy disk or download
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        If you have trouble receiving all six parts of this document due to
    limitations on the network gateways, the entire document is available
    for downloading from FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS BBS (614-258-1710) in
    individual text files:  EJASAV3.N6A, EJASAV3.N6B, EJASAV3.N6C,
    EJASAV3.N6D, EJASAV3.N6E, and EJASAV3.N6F, and in a single compressed
    file.  Both the individual text files and the compressed file,
    EJASA306.ZIP, will be found in the Optical SETI Conference Area 2.  The
    compressed file may be decompressed with PKWARE's PKUNZIP (this DOS
    utility may be found in the Utility Conference Area 10).  The
    decompressed file will explode into a READ.ME file and the six
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                             IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley


                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States





























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                         IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART A

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                           i

        About the Author -

        Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley, born in 1948, is an alien of the
    terrestrial kind (British), having lived most of his life in South
    Tottenham, London, England, where his mother still resides.  Stuart
    is single and still harbors a long-held desire to move to Hawaii or
    California.  Presently he is an Optoelectronics Consultant, a Senior
    Member of the American Institute of Electrical and Electronics
    Engineers (IEEE), and an Associate Member of the British Institution of
    Electrical Engineers (IEE).  Stuart Kingsley has a Bachelor of Science
    (B.Sc.) Honors degree and a Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.) in Electrical
    and Electronic Engineering from The City University, London, and
    University College London, respectively.  In 1984 he shared the
    prestigious British Rank Prize for Optoelectronics with his former
    University College London thesis advisor, Professor D. E. N. Davies,
    who is now Vice-Chancellor of Loughborough University, England.

        Dr. Kingsley arrived in the United States in 1981 to join Battelle
    Columbus Division and lead their activities in fiber-optic sensing,
    initially as a Principal Research Scientist and later as a Senior
    Research Scientist.  In 1987 he left Battelle and established himself
    as a photonics consultant.  The magnet that drew him to this country
    was the dynamic state of American technology during the APOLLO Program,
    which coincided with his formative teenage years.  Indeed, for most of
    his life, Stuart has been "mad about astronomy and space", and once, in
    the late 1970s, volunteered to be a British Payload Specialist on the
    American Space Shuttle.  In the 1970s, Stuart was a member of his local
    Haringey Astronomical Society (patron Arthur C. Clarke), which was
    formed after a suggestion made by Patrick Moore to Arthur's brother,
    Fred Clarke.

        Soon after arriving in Columbus, Ohio, Stuart joined The Planetary
    Society (TPS) and the Space Studies Institute (SSI).  The only previous
    time that he has ventured professionally into the space and astronomy
    area was in the early 1980s, when he suggested the very speculative
    possibility that huge fiber-optic sensors (Sagnac Interferometers)
    with quantum amplifiers might be used to detect gravitational waves.
    In this present paper, Stuart is suggesting how we might "sense" ETI,
    with or without optical fibers - perhaps the ultimate optoelectronic
    (photonic) sensing and communications project.  Dr. Kingsley is
    presently a volunteer with the SETI Group at the Radio Observatory,
    Ohio State University and a member of the Columbus Astronomical Society
    (CAS).  Stuart's greatest concern today is that the nation has
    forgotten how to "dream" for a better tomorrow.

        As a point of information, the logo for Fiberdyne Optoelectronics
    normally shows a Mach-Zehnder interferometer containing a photon and
    a wave-packet, the latter illustrating the dual nature of light (for
    this text-based document, they have been replaced by "hf >> kT").
    Despite the STAR TREK style caption above the logo, which is more
    applicable to Dr. Kingsley's usual consulting activities, the
    suggestion made here is that extraterrestrial artificial optical
    photons may have been coming in Earth's direction for a long time,
    only that we humans have not been sophisticated enough to notice.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                          ii

                         FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS BBS

        On Sunday, October 27, 1991, Fiberdyne Optoelectronics inaugurated
    a Bulletin Board System (BBS) whose main purpose is to promote
    activities for the Optical (Visible and Infrared) Search For Extra-
    terrestrial Intelligence, otherwise known as Optical SETI*, and
    Microwave (Conventional) SETI**.  It is intended that this BBS will
    advance the science of Optical SETI.  In addition, the aim is to use
    this bulletin board to coordinate future world-wide Amateur Optical
    (Visible and Near-Infrared) SETI endeavors.  This BBS is running
    Wildcat 3.0 and supports color ANSI menus.  It will be an open system,
    and there is no charge at this time for becoming a registered user.  If
    the bulletin board should prove to be very popular, a small charge will
    be instigated to fund the hardware acquisitions to support more modem
    lines.

        This announcement also serves as a request to those professionally
    involved with SETI and with other forums listed below, to upload
    relevant files, messages, and news to the appropriate conference areas
    (forums).  This can be done by becoming a registered user and directly
    uploading files, sending text files via the national/international
    computer network systems to the E-mail addresses below, or by mailing
    us the material on any size of PC-compatible floppy disk.  Prior to
    registration, new users can only access Conference Areas 0 and 1.  The
    following is a list (subject to additions and change) of conference
    areas on this BBS:

     1.  Fiberdyne Optoelectronics       2.  Optical SETI*
     3.  SETI**                          4.  Astronomy
     5.  Space & Astronautics            6.  Electromagnetics & Health
     7.  Lighting & VDT flicker          8.  Electrical Engineering
     9.  Mathematics                    10.  Utilities
    11.  UFOs                           12.  TVRO & Intelsat Reception
    13.  Optoelectronics                14.  Fiber-Optic Communications
    15.  Fiber-Optic Sensing            16.  Distributed Fiber-Optic Sensing
    17.  PC Software Demos              18.  PC Hardware
    19.  Science Fiction                20.  Games
    21.  Reserved                       22.  Political
    23.  United Kingdom News            24.  Private
    25.  Private                        26.  Private
    27.  Private                        28.  Employment
    29.  Advertisements

                  IMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM;
                  :        Bulletin Board System (BBS)       :
                  :           Modem: [phone]          :
                  :  300/1200/2400/4800/9600 Baud, MNP, 8N1  :
                  HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM<


        The voice/fax number is [phone].  Manual fax machines can
    access our fax facility by sending the tone "33" anytime after the
    first telephone ring.  The answering machine gives instructions for
    fax and modem usage.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                         iii

                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
    boards, but only in an unmodified form and in its entirety, with the
    following copyright notice attached.  No license is given to reproduce
    this document in electronic or hardcopy form for profit.  However, the
    media may reproduce short extracts for the purposes of furthering the
    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                     Copyright (c) 1992           *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                      /          \             *
 * 545 Northview Drive                        ---   hf >> kT   ---         *
 * Columbus, Ohio 43209                           \__________/             *
 * United States                                                           *
 * Tel/Fax: [phone]                 ..    ..    ..    ..    ..      *
 * Manual Fax Tone Access Code: 33        .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .     *
 * Bulletin Board System (BBS):               ..    ..    ..    ..         *
 * Modem: [phone],                                                  *
 * 300/1200/2400/4800/9600 Baud, MNP, 8N1.                                 *
 * Email: [e-mail]                               *
 * CompuServe: 72376,3545                                                  *
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

   U.K. inquires may be made to the above U.S. address or:
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                                               *
 * 43 Blenheim Avenue                                                      *
 * Gants Hill, Ilford                                                      *
 * Essex 1G2 6JQ                                                           *
 * England                                                                 *
 * Tel: [phone]                                                     *
 * Fax: [phone]                                                     *
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                          January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6A

                            Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                          iv

                                   CONTENTS

                                                                   PAGE

    Preface                                                           1

    Introduction                                                      9

    The Microwave Observing Project (MOP)                            11

    Assumption of Ineptitude                                         13

    Professional Optical SETI                                        14

    Project Cyclops                                                  18

    SETI Comparisons                                                 18

    Lasers                                                           29

    Fraunhofer Lines                                                 31

    The Optical Search                                               31

    Professional CO2 SETI                                            35

    Incoherent Optical SETI at 10,600 nm                             37

    Adaptive Telescope Technology                                    39

    The Columbus Telescope Project                                   40

    Optical SETI Rationale                                           40

    Amateur Optical SETI                                             42

    How to Build Your Own Amateur Optical SETI Observatory           47

    The Microwave and Optical Observing Project (MOOP)               52

    List of Previous and Present Optical SETI Activities             54

    Discussion                                                       56

    Conclusions                                                      58

    References                                                       64

    Appendix A - Theory and Specimen Calculations                    71

    Appendix B - The SETI Protocols                                  94

    Index                                                            98


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                           v

                                    TABLES

                                                                   PAGE

    Table 1   Project Cyclops comparison scenarios.                  19

    Table 2   Summary of SETI performance for (symmetrical)          22
              professional heterodyne communication systems
              over a range of 10 light years.

    Table 3   Important laser types and wavelengths.                 29

    Table 4   The most intense Fraunhofer lines from the Sun.        30

    Table 5   Nearest stars favored for MOP's 800 star Targeted      53
              Search.



                                 ILLUSTRATIONS

    Figure  1  Signpost SETI or pilot-tone system.                   10

    Figure  2  Coherent optical heterodyne receiver.                 15

    Figure  3  Spectral levels at a range of ten light years,        17
               per diffraction limited pixel.

    Figure  4  Spectral density and interstellar CNR for             28
               1 kW (SETI) signals at ten light years.

    Figure  5  The Microwave and Optical Cosmic Haystack             32
               frequency domains.

    Figure  6  Signal-to-noise ratio versus optical bandwidth        38
               for (perfect) photon-counting CO2 receivers.

    Figure  7  Incoherent (direct) detection optical receiver.       42

    Figure  8  Signal-to-noise ratio versus optical bandwidth        44
               (perfect) photon-counting 656 nm receivers.

    Figure  9  Basic Amateur Optical SETI or Poor Man's              48
               Optical SETI.

    Figure 10  Typical FOVs for a large optical telescope.           81

    Figure 11  Maximal Ratio Precombining.                           84







    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                          vi

                               EXECUTIVE SUMMARY

        This paper shows that the rationale behind modern-day SETI (The
    Search For Extraterrestrial Intelligence) lore is suspect, and that
    our search of electromagnetic signals from extraterrestrial technical
    civilizations may be doomed to failure because we are "tuned to the
    wrong frequencies".  The old idea that optical transmissions would be
    better for interstellar communications is revisited.  That lasers might
    be better for interstellar communications has generally been discounted
    by the SETI community.  Indeed, there is very little in the SETI
    literature about the optical approach, as its efficacy was more or less
    dismissed by SETI researchers some twenty years ago.  This paper serves
    to reopen the debate.

        A powerful case is made that we have inherently assumed that ETIs
    are technical inept, so that they lack the prowess to send very narrow
    laser beams into nearby star systems.  This paper provides convincing
    theoretical proof that infrared or visible lasers would be preferred
    for such communication links.  Indeed, the author suggests that until
    a thorough search for ETI signals is done in the optical spectrum, we
    are unlikely to be able to say anything definitive about the
    probability or lack of probability of intelligent life in other parts
    of the Milky Way galaxy, particularly if the microwave search turns out
    to be negative.

        The author, Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley, also indicates that amateur
    optical astronomers should be able to construct their own Optical SETI
    Observatories.  Details are given of the equipment required and
    approximate costs.  He suggests that a coordinated Amateur Optical
    SETI activity could make a useful contribution to SETI research by
    conducting a low-sensitivity Targeted Search in the visible and near-
    infrared spectrum, in parallel with the Microwave Observing Project's
    Targeted Search of eight hundred selected stars.  Stuart Kingsley
    concludes his paper, by suggesting that while it is impossible to say
    that ETIs would not use interstellar microwave techniques to
    communicate with other technical civilizations, it is a mistake to
    ignore the strong possibility that optical communications are
    preferred.

        An extensive theoretical appendix is included to support the
    calculations for Professional and Amateur Optical SETI, and the
    conclusions drawn from these calculations.  For those interested in the
    procedures to follow after detection of an ETI signal, a copy of the
    Post-Detection SETI Protocols is also included.











    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 1

                                   PREFACE

        This paper is about the Search For Extraterrestrial Intelligence
    (SETI) in the Optical Spectrum.  It is a revisit of suggestions which
    for various reasons have yet to be accepted by the majority of the
    SETI community.  This document does not address the usual controversial
    aspects about SETI, such as Fermi's Paradox, i.e., "Where are they?"
    and the arguments of Frank Tipler. [20,39]  We shall also not discuss
    exotic forms of radiation, such as X-rays, gamma rays, neutrinos, and
    gravitational waves.  This paper deals primarily with the superiority
    of interstellar optical beamed communications over their microwave
    counterparts.

        In general, the concept of SETI is "sold" on the basis that
    electromagnetic waves are the cheapest (in energy cost) and fastest
    way to travel through deep space, and is the next best thing to
    actually being there.  I tend to believe that interstellar travel by
    humans will be quite commonplace in the centuries to come, so that
    for myself there is the paradox (Kingsley's Paradox) of why
    communicate when it is possible to travel?

        It is perhaps useful to state from the start what are my basic
    beliefs, with the caveat that there is presently very little scientific
    evidence to support any of these speculative ideas.

    (a)  The Universe is literally crawling with life, some of this extra-
         terrestrial life being highly intelligent.

    (b)  In general, extraterrestrials do not stay at home, but they do not
         leave the exploration and colonization of the galaxy to self-
         replicating von Neumann probes. [20]

    (c)  Extraterrestrials find it easy to travel across the galaxy in
         near-relativistic or relativistic spaceships.

    (d)  On the basis of (a), (b) and (c), it is likely that at least some
         of the so-called sightings of Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs)
         do in fact relate to visitations from other worlds, and that
         Earth's history and the evolution of life on this planet may have
         been affected by such visits.

    (e)  If (c) is not possible and von Neumann probes are not employed,
         then electromagnetic waves could be used by extraterrestrial
         civilizations to contact their counterparts in other stellar
         systems, particularly more primitive technological civilizations.

    (f)  If (e) is occurring, then it is more likely that the optical
         region of the electromagnetic spectrum would be used, in
         preference to the microwave region.


        Note that there is, of course, the possibility of radio or optical
    communications from von Neumann probes in our vicinity, both with us
    and with their home worlds.  Perhaps the greatest difficulty that I

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 2

    have with electromagnetic SETI is my long-held belief in what has come
    to be known as the "Cosmic Zoo", which is related to idea (c).  If we
    are indeed presently off-limits for "Contact" in any form, i.e.,
    quarantined, searching for electromagnetic signals would be a waste of
    time, never mind the consideration as to whether there are a sufficient
    number of ETIs in the galaxy to make electromagnetic "Contact"
    probable.  However, this study is restrictive in its terms of
    reference, as it only considers the relative efficacies of the
    microwave and optical approaches to electromagnetic SETI (f).  For the
    sake of this discussion, we shall not make much of an attempt to
    resolve these other problems here.

        I would, however, make some observations.  It has been a long and
    somewhat difficult road for SETI researchers to establish electro-
    magnetic SETI as a legitimate science.  To some extent, for political
    reasons, they have had to strongly disassociate themselves from those
    who believe in UFOs.  This somewhat artificial differentiation has been
    done to reduce the incidence of being labelled "crazy" by their more
    conservative colleagues and Members of Congress, and to maintain the
    rationale that electromagnetic interstellar communications is the
    cheapest form of travel.

        In reality, there is more common-ground between scientists who
    believe in UFOs and those that ascribe to SETI, than the latter might
    care to admit.  To maintain otherwise is being intellectually
    dishonest, for both believe in "Aliens" or what are now more affection-
    ately referred to as "Extraterrestrials" (ETs).  In the end, what one
    believes (as against what one knows and is scientifically proven) comes
    down to imagination, or the lack of.  On the other hand, what one
    publicly admits to believing is quite another matter entirely.  This
    involves other more down-to-Earth considerations, like the fear of
    being ridiculed by colleagues and the scientific establishment.

        One only has to remember how the "keepers of the flame" recently
    reacted to the Cold Fusion work of Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons,
    to realize that the scientific establishment does not take too kindly
    to those would dare to "rock the boat" of conventional orthodoxy.
    Fortunately, the theory on Optical SETI given in Appendix A is based
    on long-established scientific principles, so this author should fare
    somewhat better.

        Three types of civilizations have been postulated by Kardashev
    for the development of "super civilizations". [4,13,25]  A "Type I"
    civilization would be in a similar stage of development as Earth,
    having gained control of most of the energy sources on the planet of
    origin (about 4 X 10^12 W).  A "Type II" civilization would have
    reached a level at which it controlled the energy output of its own sun
    (4 X 10^26 W).  A "Type III" civilization would have gained control of
    the energy output of the entire galaxy (about 4 X 10^37 W).

        This paper really addresses the type of technology and energy
    sources available to Type I and Type II civilizations.  Freeman Dyson
    has described how a Type II civilization might dismantle one of the
    larger planets in its solar system and build a shell completely

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 3

    surrounding its sun. [25]  A Type III civilization would hardly need to
    use microwave or optical technology for communications, and might
    consider us little more than we do ants.

        During the past eighteen months, I have been associated with
    Dr. Robert Dixon's SETI Group at Ohio State, and have had extensive
    communications with the SETI Institute at NASA's Ames Research Center
    in Moffett Field, California.  My approach in revisiting this subject
    has not been the conventional one of publishing a paper or papers and
    waiting for the "penny to drop".  Rather, because several noted
    researchers have published papers along similar lines over the past
    thirty years and have largely had their ideas rejected by their
    colleagues, I decided to try a somewhat different strategy:  To take
    the SETI community by storm.  The reader is assured that to the best of
    my knowledge, no laws of physics have been violated in this study.
    What is true, however, is that the human imagination has been stretched.

        This is not the first time, nor will it be the last, that the
    scientific community may have gone in the wrong direction because of
    mistaken assumptions.  What I am doing is to seriously question
    present SETI lore, with due respects to Professors Philip Morrison,
    Frank Drake (President, SETI Institute), Carl Sagan, Dr. Bernard Oliver,
    and the late I. Shklovskii, to name but a few.  At first glance, the
    three decades old idea that ETI signals will be found in the quietest
    region of the electromagnetic spectrum seems reasonable.  Thus, the
    21-centimeter hydrogen (H) line and the region of the microwave
    spectrum between the H and lowest OH resonance lines (1.420 to
    1.662 GHz), which has come to be known as the "waterhole", has become a
    favored "magic frequency".  However, we may have been too clever by
    half in guessing the natural interstellar communication frequencies,
    and in assuming that ETIs will make it very easy for us to locate their
    signals.  Perhaps our commitment to the search for ETI must be
    substantially increased before we are rewarded by success.

        Over the years, many science fiction writers have involved inter-
    stellar laser communications in their story lines.  Indeed, in the 1990
    SETI book, FIRST CONTACT [26], edited by Ben Bova and Byron Preiss, Ben
    Bova wrote a story involving Optical SETI called "Answer, Please,
    Answer".  Interestingly, a recent edition of NEW SCIENTIST [45] which
    had an article about SETI, also contained a review of the new paperback
    issue of FIRST CONTACT and criticized it, suggesting that it was
    inappropriate to include this science fiction material.  However, there
    may have been more truth in that story than in much of the rest of the
    book.  Perhaps it is time again for scientists to take note of what
    science fiction writers have to say!

        FIRST CONTACT also contains a chapter (Chapter 9, "How to
    Participate in SETI", by Kent Cullers and William Alschuler) devoted to
    Amateur Microwave SETI, but it is not clear how many TVRO (TeleVision
    Receive Only) owners would wish to convert their satellite dishes for
    this purpose.  In the microwave regime, amateurs would be competing
    with the "big boys", but in the optical regime they would be essent-
    ially on their own.  The contribution that the amateur optical
    astronomy enthusiast can make in this area is described later.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 4

        What I do find slightly disturbing is that the popular literature
    on SETI usually says either nothing about the optical approach or
    dismisses it in a paragraph or two as being without merit.  As far as
    I can recall, THE PLANETARY REPORT [17,21,37] has never discussed this
    approach.  Even the latest PLANETARY REPORT article by Professor Paul
    Horowitz [37] fails again to mention the optical approach.  Indeed, The
    Planetary Society has just launched an appeal, with the help of film
    producer and director Steven Spielberg, to raise funds for support of
    the Harvard BETA (Billion-channel Extraterrestrial Assay) project.
    This system will eventually have six billion channels and is designed
    to have a channel resolution of 0.05 Hz.  This trend in Microwave SETI
    channel resolution is directly opposite to the thrust of the Optical
    SETI rationale described herein, where minimum channel bandwidths of
    about 100 kHz are specified.

        Also, there appears to be misleading information in SETI books as
    to the visibility of electronically detectable signals and the efficacy
    of using Fraunhofer lines to increase signal contrast.  It is almost as
    if no one had bothered to "crunch" the numbers properly.  The fact that
    Fraunhofer lines have been previously thought to have a significant
    bearing on transmission frequencies in the visible regime, really
    arises from the assumption that ETIs lack the technical prowess to send
    us more than a few photons per second.  Once that assumption is swept
    away, the increased contrast ratio produced by these stellar absorption
    lines become less significant, particularly in relation to the use of
    optical heterodyne receiving systems. [71-73]

        Microwave SETI researchers are looking for very weak narrow-band
    signals buried in noise, and require the use of signal processing
    algorithms like the Karhunen-Loeve Transform (KLT) presently being
    studied by Dr. Robert Dixon's SETI group at Ohio State [73,86].  The
    KLT is more effective than the Fast Fourier Transform (FFT) in
    extracting non-repetitive pulses from noise-like data.  I assume, that
    Optical SETI signals will be much stronger and of substantially
    increased bandwidth, and may not need to be processed in this manner.

        The ten-year duration, 100 million-dollar Microwave Observing
    Project (MOP) now just starting, dramatically extends the search space
    in the Microwave Cosmic Haystack. [40-45]  As far as Visible Optical
    SETI is concerned, it would appear that scientists of the former Soviet
    Union have done most of the work in this area, though it represents but
    a tiny fraction of global modern-day SETI activities.

        If we confine ourselves to Visible Optical SETI for the moment, I
    make the following case that the sort of visible signal intensities
    which would allow modest-size telescopes to produce low-noise signals
    in moderate bandwidths are so weak that they would be easily missed by
    conventional optical astronomers.  One just has to remember, that for
    over thirty years, SETI researchers have been scanning the skies for
    artificial extraterrestrial microwave signals in a systematic manner.
    So far they have failed to detect a confirmed artificial extra-
    terrestrial signal.  What is the probability if such rare signals exist
    in the visible or near-infrared spectrum that optical astronomers
    would have accidently stumbled across them?

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 5

        In early 1991, after "suggesting" that the SETI community should
    revisit the optical approach, I was invited to give a talk at the SETI
    Institute.  This Optical SETI Revisited Colloquium took place in April
    of 1991.  Prior to my NASA visit, I had concentrated my analysis on
    Professional Optical SETI and had given some thought to the optical
    equivalent of the Microwave Observing Project.  Some of the signal
    processing ideas arising out of MOP will be transferable to the optical
    search.  I was well-received by NASA, though there are certain members
    of the group who still hold to the view that the optical approach is
    useless, particularly at the high-frequency visible end of the
    spectrum.  After my talk, Dr. John Billingham, Chief of NASA's SETI
    Office, invited me to present a paper at the Commission 51 Bioastronomy
    Conference of the IAU (International Astronomical Union), which is to
    be held in 1993, and have that paper printed in the journal ACTA
    ASTRONAUTICA.

        In recent years, NASA has supported a limited activity in SETI at
    10,600 nm.  However, its main thrust has always been Microwave SETI.
    For about five years, NASA has been supporting Charles Townes and
    Albert Betz in a low-level activity at the Carbon Dioxide (CO2) laser
    wavelength.  This work has been "piggy-backed" onto a larger program
    for CO2 astrophysical research.  They are using an interferometric
    system consisting of two infrared telescopes mounted on a trailer, with
    two phase-locked heterodyning CO2 local-oscillator lasers, nitrogen-
    cooled photodetectors, and a bandwidth of a few MHz.  The observations
    are being conducted at Mount Wilson Observatory.  The SETI aspect of
    this work is so low-key that I found some difficulty in obtaining
    details about this activity.

        Over the early part of the summer of 1991 while I was back home in
    England, I was able to convince myself that perhaps the concept of
    Amateur (visible and near-infrared) Optical SETI was not such an
    implausible idea.  Over the past eighteen months, I have undertaken a
    substantial self-funded analysis of Professional and Amateur Optical
    SETI, of which this represents a brief summary.  I would be interested
    in hearing from any major space/astronomy publication or organization
    that would like to approach me for an article, book, or talk, or any
    company which might be interested in a business relationship in this
    area.  I have prepared a substantial illustrated viewgraph report on
    this subject, which the few ASCII text diagrams and graphs in this
    document can hardly do justice.  I would be interested in producing an
    Optical SETI book accompanied with compiled versions of many of the
    spreadsheets that I have employed for these analyses.  This would allow
    readers to do their own "what-if" analyses.

        The SETI Institute and NASA have been alerted that I will be going
    public about Professional and Amateur Optical SETI at this time,
    because of my gut feeling that there will be a surge of interest in
    this subject seldom seen during the thirty years of modern-day SETI.
    NASA might like to consider coordinating world-wide Amateur Optical
    SETI activities to avoid excessive duplication of searches on the same
    target stars.  This would also present the opportunity to compare data
    to that obtained for the same stars with the Microwave Observing
    Project.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 6

        After digesting this material, some readers are bound to feel that
    what they have read they always knew, but were intimidated by the
    giants of the scientific community.  Perhaps there is no field of human
    endeavor like SETI which involves so much speculation, where the
    citizen with a scientific background is just as qualified to speculate
    as the professional SETI scientist.  The controversy over this approach
    is bound to rage for some time.  Soon after I embarked on this study in
    June of 1990, I came to the conclusion that if this revisit of Optical
    SETI was to at last be given the attention it deserved, I would have to
    take a very different approach to getting the material published.

        It is fitting that this first publication of these ideas is being
    done via the electronic media, the computer networks which span the
    globe.  It has been advantageous that it has also given me substantial
    space in which to delineate the full scope of my rationale in one go,
    without leaving too many gaps.  Indeed, what started out as a small
    paper has turned into a mini-book.  Who knows; perhaps ETIs in the
    future will intercept signal leakage from Earth's microwave satellite
    uplinks, read this document, or eavesdrop on terrestrial TV and radio
    transmissions, and have a chuckle (I assume that humor is more than a
    human trait):  "Those crazy humans, if only they knew!".

        During the early formative part of my life, I owned a small
    refracting telescope and would spend many hours studying Earth's moon
    and the planets.  It has been a long time since I possessed another
    telescope.  Because I believe in putting my money where my mouth is, I
    am now impatient to put together my own Amateur Optical SETI
    Observatory.  This paper has yet to be peer reviewed and the author is
    solely responsible for its contents.  Readers are encouraged to check
    out the relationships used and the accuracy of the calculations.  The
    rest is then a matter of opinion and imagination.

        Optical SETI investigations will probably take a lot of
    perseverance.  In the grand tradition of American disclaimers, readers
    should note that I cannot accept responsibility for the lack of success
    in detecting ETI - ("Caveat emptor"!).  Since I expect that there will
    be considerable reaction to this material, I therefore beg your
    indulgence if I do not presently reply or reply in detail to every
    personal message received in response, either by conventional mail,
    fax, or network E-mail.  However, a personal response is assured
    through my own bulletin board system (BBS), which has been set up
    specifically to coordinate future world-wide Optical SETI activities.

        Simultaneously with the electronic publication of this document, I
    have established a BBS devoted to SETI in general, and Optical SETI in
    particular.  More modem lines may be added later as interest warrants.
    The telephone number is [phone] and supports all modem speeds
    up to 9600 baud.  The BBS is dedicated to NASA and the late Gene
    Roddenberry, the latter having had a substantial influence on how I view
    the future.  Many of the spreadsheets, diagrams, and graphs - and there
    are many - that have supported the development of my rational, will
    eventually be made available via the bulletin board.  For further
    details about this computer bulletin board, see the BBS information
    (Page ii) at the front.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 7

        The theoretical justification for the results and conclusions
    drawn in this paper has been relegated to Appendix A.  In this way,
    those readers uncomfortable with scientific theory and mathematical
    relationships do not have to have wade through masses of equations.
    It is, of course, very difficult to be everything to all people.  For
    this reason, I have compromised in this approach by keeping the theory
    as simple as possible, and have avoided the use of statistical analysis
    and calculus.  For instance, the way that the signal-to-noise ratio of
    a detected optical signal varies with received photon flux, bandwidth,
    and signal integration time is exceedingly complex when the photon flux
    is weak, particularly if avalanche photodetectors are employed.  There
    will be plenty of time later for this author and others to present a
    more rigorous approach to Optical SETI.  This can be done in a variety
    of learned journals, such as IEEE's LIGHTWAVE TECHNOLOGY and
    TRANSACTIONS ON COMMUNICATIONS, or the IEE's ELECTRONICS LETTERS.

        The purpose of this document is to rekindle the debate between
    those who believe in the microwave approach to SETI and those who
    subscribe to the efficacy of the optical approach.  An additional
    desire is to introduce my colleagues in the fiber-optics field to a
    rather exciting concept - an idea which dwarfs all the puny terrene
    "hero" long-distance demonstrations that large fiber-optics
    communication companies like to brag about from time to time.  As
    actor Al Jolson used to say, "You ain't seen nothing yet!".

        I would like to acknowledge discussions and encouragement from
    various sources:  Dr. Robert Dixon (Director, SETI Program) for a very
    professional reaction to what I had to say, despite having devoted
    decades of his SETI activities to the microwave search with "Big Ear".
    I also acknowledge Dr. Dixon's contribution in being given access to
    the educational and scientific network.  In addition, I would like to
    thank Professor Charles Townes (University of California, Berkeley) for
    his helpful comments when this study was first started, recent E-mail
    discussions with his colleague Dr. Albert Betz, Professor Philip
    Morrison (MIT), and correspondence with Dr. John Rather (NASA-HQ).

        I would also acknowledge correspondence and discussions with
    Dr. Bernard Oliver, who in early November of 1990 sent me a copy of his
    Cyclops report, convinced that it would prove the case for the efficacy
    of the microwave approach.  In my correspondence and discussions with
    Dr. Oliver, who is also known as the "grand old man" of SETI, I have
    not been able to shake his belief in the correctness of the microwave
    approach.  So we have agreed to disagree over the relative merits of
    Microwave and Optical SETI.

        Over much of the past year and a half while the ideas were
    developing, I have interfaced with parts of the SETI community.  There
    is some perception that my "lobbying" for the optical approach to SETI
    may already have had some effect on how those within NASA and the SETI
    Institute now view Optical SETI.  At least, I have received rather
    "mixed signals" over the past eighteen months as to where the consensus
    lies, and there appears to have been some shift towards my position,
    though this may be a presumption on my part.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 8

        I would particularly like to acknowledge the professional courtesy
    and assistance given me by Dr. Jill Tarter (NASA SETI MOP Project, SETI
    Institute, U.C. Berkeley) and her staff at the SETI Institute, despite
    the fact that I may have "come on quite strong" in revisiting Optical
    SETI.  I also thank Dr. Kent Cullers (Signal Detection Scientist, NASA)
    then of the SETI Institute, for his encouragement and for checking some
    of my calculations relating to Professional Optical SETI.  I trust he
    will do the same, if he can draw himself away from MOP for a few
    hours, for my more recent computations relating to Amateur Optical
    SETI.

        Finally, I must acknowledge the considerable assistance of the SETI
    Institute's Robert Arnold (Research Assistant and Public Information)
    in providing me with much background information on SETI.  I hope I do
    not give him too much of a headache when he has to deal with the surge
    in national and international interest in all forms of SETI which will
    probably result from this paper.  It is highly likely that because of
    the Microwave Observing Project and this paper, 1992 is going to be
    the Year of SETI.

    Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley
    Columbus, Ohio
    December 24, 1991
































    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                      Page 9

                                INTRODUCTION

        This paper suggests that the modern Search for Extraterrestrial
    Intelligence (SETI) [1-45,86], which was initiated by Cocconi, Morrison
    [1,13], and Drake (Project Ozma) [2,3,13] is being conducted in the
    wrong part of the electromagnetic spectrum, i.e., that SETI receivers
    are presently "tuned to the wrong frequencies".  This paper revisits a
    subject first discussed by Schwartz and Townes [46-47] thirty years ago
    and subsequently investigated by the late Shvartsman [48,50,54],
    Connes [49], Zuckerman [52], Betz [53,57] and Beskin [58].  Dr. John
    Rather (NASA-HQ) also considers that Optical SETI has much to commend
    it. [56]  According to the modern broader definition of the word
    "optical", the wavelength region embraced covers the region between
    350 nm in the ultra-violet, and far-infrared wavelengths greater than
    300,000 nm (millimeter-waves start at 1 million nanometers).

        Our Milky Way galaxy contains about 400 billion stars.  We assume,
    as does most of the SETI community, that at any time there are perhaps
    thousands or tens of thousands of technical civilizations (the Drake
    Equation, Page 71, Equ. 1) [2-39] within our own galaxy.  There
    should be at least a reasonable chance that at any time, one such
    civilization might be signalling in our direction from within a sphere
    several thousand light years in radius.  The volume of space within a
    sphere of two thousand light years in diameter contains about ten
    million stars, one million of which may be capable of supporting life.

        The sign of a mature technical civilization is not to waste power
    over empty space, but to use refined signalling techniques in
    preference to brute force.  Although some authors have suggested that
    optical ETI signals would appear in the form of bright flashing points
    of light, this author thinks it very unlikely.  The idea that such
    signals will be like heliographs or semaphores, sending out intense
    beams at Morse Code rates, is not one that should be seriously contem-
    plated.  As will be shown, there is no need to modulate the entire
    output of a star in order to be detected across the galaxy. [20,33]

        Just as on this planet, where there are a variety of communication
    techniques employed, depending on distance, bandwidth, and techno-
    logies available, there is no reason to assume that there is only one
    universal communication frequency or spectral regime employed by Extra-
    terrestrial Intelligences (ETIs).  Different applications and environ-
    ments will lead to the optimization of different technologies, so that
    there may be many "magic wavelengths or frequencies".  For example,
    because of the huge distances and lower propagation losses, radio waves
    may be better for communication between galaxies.

        If the reader does not believe that advanced extraterrestrial
    technical civilizations would have the wherewithal to aim tight
    optical beams into neighboring stars, then they need read no further.
    In correspondence with the author, Dr. Bernard Oliver, Deputy Director
    of NASA's SETI Office, has put it very strongly that ETIs would not
    have this capability.  This viewpoint has dominated SETI rationale for
    several decades, and in the author's opinion, is somewhat responsible
    for the "bad press" that the optical approach has received.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 10

        It is the author's view that the capability to target tight
    optical beams is probably much easier to achieve than developing
    relativistic or near-relativistic spacecraft.  The same large optical
    antenna array capability which would allow ETIs to produce narrow
    transmitter beams would also allow them to "view" planets orbiting
    nearby stars.  Over millennia they will have developed catalogs for the
    stars in their vicinity, with full details of each star's planetary
    system.  For them, the ballistic skills (point ahead targeting)
    required to land photons on a designated target, over the equivalent of
    twice the light time distance, will be relatively trivial.  This is not
    to discount the possibility that ETIs may send out space probes to
    nearby planetary systems to gather information directly.

        There is a concept inherent in the conventional SETI rationale
    which might best be termed "Signpost SETI".  This says, that the
    signals we are looking for in the microwave spectrum, may only be
    monochromatic/semi-monochromatic beacons or acquisition carriers, and
    that the main transmission channels for extraterrestrials are
    elsewhere.  If this is the case, we might find a narrow-band modulated
    microwave signal that tells us to tune to some place in the optical
    regime, and perhaps provide the "Rosetta Stone" for decoding the
    wideband optical channel.  However, it is not clear why extra-
    terrestrials would spectrally separate these signals into two different
    wavelength regimes.  Both the semi-monochromatic beacon and the main
    wideband transmission channel could be side-by-side in the optical
    spectrum (see Figure 1 below).  Indeed, there would be good signal
    processing reasons (advantages) for using what we terrenes would call a
    "pilot-tone technique", particularly for reception within an atmosphere
    (see Page 83 for a theoretical description of this technique).


                     Ep(t) *         Signal Modulation
                           *             Bandwidth
                           *          <------------->
                           *           ------------- Es(t)
                           *          |             |
                  Beacon   *          |    Signal   |
                    or     *          |    (Main    |
                Pilot-Tone *          |   Channel)  |
                           *          |             |
         ----------------------------------------------------------->
                          fp                 fs    Optical Frequency

    Figure 1 -

    Signpost SETI or pilot-tone system.  The beacon or pilot-tone carrier
    is at frequency fp and has an electric-field amplitude Ep(t), while the
    information signal with amplitude Es(t) is intensity, polarization, or
    frequency-modulated onto a signal carrier at frequency fs.  The
    frequency separation (fs-fp) may be several MHz to several GHz,
    depending upon the signal modulation bandwidth, and other factors, and
    fp may be above fs.  The ETI beacon or pilot-tone might also contain a
    simple very low bandwidth intensity or polarization modulation
    providing the Rosetta Stone for decoding the main channel.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 11

        Such techniques can reduce the effect of transmitter and local-
    oscillator laser phase-noise and correct for phase-noise and wavefront
    distortion produced by Earth's atmosphere, allowing more efficient
    reception with large heterodyning telescopes, i.e., reduced signal
    fading and improved mean SNR. [81-82,84]  The coherence cell size (ro)
    at visible wavelengths (Wl) is approximately 20 cm (8 inches), and is
    proportional to (Wl)^1.2.  In the infrared at 10,600 nm, ro can be as
    large as eight meters.  At the best astronomical observatories in the
    world, the spectral power in atmospheric turbulence is confined below
    30 to 50 Hz.

        Clearly, this pilot-tone technique could be used for free-space
    optical communications between space and Earth with some advantage.  It
    also reduces the differential Doppler Shift and Chirp (Drift) by the
    ratio (fs-fp)/fs; a ratio which can be of the order of 10^-8.  Note
    that the wideband optical signal might use spread-spectrum techniques,
    so that the signal energy density might be too low to be detectable.
    Without the "key" to unlock the pseudo-random sequence, we might
    mistake the main signal channel for an excess amount of random noise.

        There is something quite philosophically appealing about the pilot-
    tone technique.  It satisfies the conventional SETI rationale for the
    need of a "Signpost", while at the same time provides the means for
    more efficiently detecting the main wideband ETI channel from within a
    planetary atmosphere.


                    THE MICROWAVE OBSERVING PROJECT (MOP)

        From time to time, references will be made to NASA's Microwave
    Observing Project, otherwise known by the acronym MOP.  The objectives
    of this program are summarized as follows:

        Project Goal:  To carry out a search for microwave signals of
                       extraterrestrial intelligent origin.

        Project Objectives:

        1.  To use existing large radio telescopes, e.g. Arecibo, to carry
            out a Targeted Search of about 800 nearby solar-type stars with
            high spectral resolution of 1 Hz, and sensitivity in the region
            of 5 X 10^-27 to 1.4 X 10^-25 W/m^2, over the frequency range
            from 1 to 3 GHz.  (Ames Research Center)

        2.  To use the 34-meter telescopes of NASA's Deep Space Network
            (DSN) to carry out a Sky Survey that will examine the whole sky
            at a moderate spectral resolution of 30 Hz, and sensitivity
            2 X 10^-23 to 2 X 10^-22 W/m^2) over the frequency range from
            1 to 10 GHz.  (Jet Propulsion Laboratory - JPL)

        Duration:  1990 to 1999

        Cost:  $12.1 million for starters, $100 million over ten years.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 12

        As will be indicated later, the author would like to add (and has
        recommended this to the SETI Institute) that a third objective be
        added to this program, to run concurrently with the previous:

        3.  To solicit the help of dedicated groups of amateur astronomers
            and coordinate their activities to conduct with their ground-
            based optical telescopes, a low-sensitivity Targeted Search of
            about 800 nearby solar-type stars with spectral resolution
            < 1 nm, and sensitivity 10^-16 W/m^2.  For selected wavelength
            bands in the visible and near-infrared wavelength range (350 nm
            to 1,200 nm).












































    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6B - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part B - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
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    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                     Copyright (c) 1992           *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                      /          \             *
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 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                                               *
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Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                         January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6B

                            Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                        IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART B

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 13

                           ASSUMPTION OF INEPTITUDE

        Unfortunately, despite declarations to the contrary, many SETI
    activists have been very anthropocentric and have in the main assumed
    that ETIs are technically inept.  The "Assumption of (Technical)
    Ineptitude" (private discussions between the author and Clive Goodall),
    not to be confused with the "Assumption of Mediocrity" [5-39] applied
    to our own emerging technical civilization, has caused a gross under-
    estimate of the technical prowess of ETIs, e.g., their capability to
    aim very high-power tight beams into the life zones of nearby stars.
    The onus will be on them to transmit the strongest signal with their
    stellar or nuclear-pumped orbital lasers.

        It is humbling to remind ourselves that just one century ago, very
    few people on this planet used electricity.  We have come a long way in
    a short time!  Yet, in the space of one hundred years, we have been
    able to send astronauts to the Moon, robot probes to other planets, and
    deploy a large space telescope in Earth orbit.  Despite the very
    unfortunate technical problems that have plagued the 2.4-meter aperture
    Hubble Space Telescope (HST), we should note that being representative
    of state-of-the-art terrene technology, it has a designed angular
    resolution of 0.043" and a designed pointing accuracy of 0.012". [59-62]

        In 1961, just after the invention of the laser and only two years
    following Cocconi and Morrison's [1] classic paper which initiated
    modern SETI, Schwartz and Townes [46-47] (of laser fame) suggested that
    in other societies, laser communications technology may have been
    developed before microwave communications.  From looking at the
    development of technology during the Twentieth Century, it is probable
    that the development of microwave and laser technology must occur
    within a short time of each other.  As Schwartz and Townes implied,
    another society, having developed laser technology first, might
    cultivate a SETI rationale which was based on the superiority of laser
    communications over its radio frequency counterpart.  It may only be a
    historical accident that the science of SETI on this planet became so
    dominated by radio astronomers.

        Even Townes and his colleagues [46-47,51-53] have been somewhat
    constrained in imagination by limiting beam divergences to be greater
    than about one second of arc.  A uniformly illuminated diffraction
    limited ten-meter diameter carbon dioxide (CO2) transmitter has a FWHM
    beamwidth equals 0.22 arc seconds (see Table 1, Page 19, and Table 2,
    Line 5, Page 22), so that even this system has a beam that is slightly
    too narrow by their definition.  Note that more recently, Betz [57] has
    reduced the technical limits on beam divergence to 0.1 arc seconds.
    When we decide what might be technically feasible in one hundred, one
    thousand, or ten thousand years, the only thing which should constrain
    our imagination are the laws of physics as we presently know them.  We
    are reminded that mere decades ago, the idea of geosynchronous
    communication satellites and men walking on the Moon was considered
    science fiction by most people.

        Although SETI is about the passive activity of listening for
    signals, otherwise it would be (and was) called CETI (Communications

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 14

    With Extraterrestrial Intelligence), how close are we to being able to
    transmit strong gigawatt-type optical signals across the galaxy?  The
    answer to this question is that we are now much closer in time to be
    in a position to do this than we are to the Industrial Revolution.
    This is practically no time at all on the Cosmic Time Scale.  Perhaps
    SETI is one way to take those Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)
    "swords" on both sides of the now defunct Iron Curtain and turn them
    into CETI "plowshares"!


                           PROFESSIONAL OPTICAL SETI

        In this paper, the model employed for the Professional Optical SETI
    analysis is based on a very modest continuous wave (C.W.) transmitter
    power of 1 kilowatt (1 kW) over a range of ten light years.  As a
    modelling convenience, it assumes symmetrical systems, i.e., that the
    receiver aperture is identical to that of the transmitter.  This
    symmetrical modelling technique is one often adopted by previous
    comparative analyses.  In reality, because by definition Extra-
    terrestrial Intelligences (ETIs) will be older and more technically
    mature civilizations, if and when we do detect ETI, it will be found
    that the alien transmitters are huge compared to our own puny receivers.

        Figure 2 is a schematic diagram showing the most important features
    of a heterodyning receiving system (Equs. 23, 32, and 34) suitable for
    Professional Optical SETI.  The optical pre-detection filter is not
    really required for SETI activities because of the excellent background
    noise rejection inherent in such systems.  In practice, such a receiver
    would at least be duplicated for the detection of two orthogonally-
    polarized or circularly-polarized signal components.

        This optical heterodyne receiver might well use a dye local-
    oscillator laser that has very narrow linewidth (< 5 kHz), and which
    is tunable across the entire visible and near-infrared regimes.  The
    intermediate frequency (I.F.) bandwidth of such a system might be as
    high as 10 GHz.  The output of each photodetector might be taken to a
    single 10 GHz Multi-Channel Spectrum Analyzer (MCSA) which sequentially
    samples all 16,384 photodetectors in the 128 X 128 pixel array, or
    there might be one MCSA for every row or for every photodetector,
    leading to substantial reductions in search time.

        For several practical reasons, e.g., Doppler de-chirping, it is
    likely that the alternative coherent detection technique called
    "homodyne detection" (Equ. 33), which is essentially equivalent to a
    heterodyne system with a zero I.F., would not be used for the frequency
    search, though it might be employed after acquisition of an ETI signal.

        One major reason why the SETI community generally discounts the
    optical approach is the considerable amount of quantum noise generated
    by optical photons.  As we increase frequency, the number of photons
    for a given flux intensity progressively falls, so that there is a
    noise component associated with the statistics of photon arrival times,
    which exceeds the thermal kT noise.  If Bif is the electrical
    bandwidth, it is assumed that sufficient photons arrive in the observa-

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 15

                                                             I
                                                   ----------<--------
                                                  |
                  --          Beamcombiner        |
     Signal Pr   |  |           -------           |
    -----------> |  | -------> |     . | ---->> -----  PIN Photodetector
    -----------> |  | -------> |   .   | ---->> /   \  (One detector in a
    -----------> |  | -------> | .     | ---->> -----  128 X 128 array)
     Background  |  |           -------           |
         Pb       --            ^ ^ ^ ^           |        -----
               Optional         | | | |           |       |     |
               Optical          | | | |            --->---|     |---->
           Bandpass Filter      | | | | Po                |     |
                                | | | |                    -----
                             -------------         Intermediate Frequency
                            |             |      Electrical Bandpass Filter
                            |    Local    |                 Bif
                  Po >> Pr  | Oscillator  |
                            |    Laser    |
                            |             |
                             -------------
                                   |
                                   |
                                    -----------------<----------------
                                            Frequency Control

    Figure 2 -

    Coherent optical heterodyne receiver.  The diagram shows just a single
    photodetector, but in a large professional heterodyning telescope, a
    focal-plane array of about 128 X 128 photodetectors would be used to
    reduced the search time.  This would also ensure that if a star is
    centered on the array, the signal from an orbiting ETI transmitter
    would fall on the same pixel or on an adjacent one within the array
    area, depending on the distance of the star, the orbital distance and
    position of the transmitter, and its plane of ecliptic.  For each array
    pixel (photodetector), the local-oscillator power Po >> the received
    signal Pr to ensure quantum noise limited detection.  A focussed local-
    oscillator (L.O.) laser may be scanned across the photodetector array
    in synchronism with the electronic sampling of the array.  This would
    avoid the requirement for a high power L.O., and would thus eliminate
    heat dissipation problems in the array.


    tion or measurement time 1/Bif, for Gaussian and Poisson statistics to
    apply.  In practice, this means that about ten photons have to be
    detected during each measurement interval.  For the photon-starved
    situation at small and negative Carrier-To-Noise Ratios (CNRs), the
    (analog) CNR values are somewhat meaningless.

        The effective noise temperature (Equ. 30) of the 656 nm system
    modelled in this paper is 43,900 Kelvin, considerably more than the
    10 K of the microwave system.  However, it is the potential high-gain
    transmitting capability of optical antennas (Equ. 10) which can more

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 16

    than make up for this 36 dB reduction in sensitivity (36 dB increase in
    the noise floor).  As a reference performance criterion, it should be
    noted that a symmetrical microwave system based on the 300-meter
    diameter Arecibo radio telescope on the island of Puerto Rico, a 1 kW
    transmitter and a 10 K system temperature, would produce a CNR of about
    20 dB re 1 Hz (this is illustrated in Figure 4, Page 28).

        For discussions about Professional Optical SETI heterodyne
    receivers, we will often refer to the term Signal-To-Noise Ratio (SNR)
    in a generic manner as a means of denoting signal detectability.  In
    such cases, what we really mean is CNR, as the measurement is taken at
    the intermediate frequency (I.F.) before electrical demodulation
    (detection) of the signal.  In the material on Amateur Optical SETI
    photon-counting receivers, we will be dealing with the post-detection
    signal-to-noise ratio, so it is more accurately denoted by the term SNR.

        Communication engineers know that it is often expedient to
    normalize the CNR or SNR to a 1 Hz electrical bandwidth; a bandwidth
    which is thought to be substantially smaller than the minimum bin
    bandwidth required for actual SETI observations with Professional
    Optical SETI receivers.  This allows us to subtract 10 dB from the CNR
    (SNR) for each decade increase in electrical bandwidth.  For instance,
    a CNR (SNR) of 94 dB re (with respect to) 1 Hz is equivalent to 19 dB
    re 30 MHz, a figure arrived at by subtracting 10.log(30 X 10^6) from
    94 dB.  We shall be referencing these particular numbers again later.

        A bandwidth of "1 Hz" has a special significance to Microwave SETI
    researchers.  It is often the minimum bin bandwidth employed to analyze
    the received signals as dispersion effects and Doppler chirp rates in
    the low microwave region, i.e., around 1.5 GHz, would spread the most
    monochromatic of signals to that order (Table 2, Line 30, Page 22)
    shows the maximum equatorial ground-based chirp due to Earth's rotation
    to be about 0.17 Hz/s).  Thus, it is important to realize that for this
    Optical SETI analysis, the 1 Hz bandwidth is used just for the con-
    venience of normalizing the SNR.  It does not imply anything about the
    ideal electrical (I.F.) or post-detection bandwidth.  Note that in this
    study, it is generally assumed that the optical predetection bandwidth
    is at least twice the electrical or post-detection bandwidth.

        Although in Figure 2 we have indicated an optoelectronic front-end
    array, it is possible that future developments in photonic computer
    technology will allow for the employment of an all-optical receiver and
    signal processing array.

        In terms of mean transmitter power, it is useful to normalize
    the different ETI transmitters to a basic unit of 1 kW.  Again, this
    implies no preconception about the actual powers available to ETIs,
    which inevitably will be far in excess of this.  The noise level
    associated with the signal is assumed to be only that due to quantum
    shot noise.  For power-starved receiving condition, non-Poisson noise
    at optical frequencies may actually raise the noise floor and degrade
    the CNR.  In the quantum (Poisson) limited detection case, for every
    factor of ten that we increase the power, the CNR (SNR) will increase
    by 10 dB.  If the optical receiver is background or internally noise

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 17

      Relative Levels Per Pixel re 1 Hz
        |
      34 dB |___1 kW Signal                ***        1.6 X 10^-15 W______
            |                              *S*
            |                              *I* CNR = 34 dB re 1 Hz
            |                              *G*
       0 dB |___Quantum Shot Noise_________*N*________6.3 X 10^-19 W/Hz___
            |                              .A.
            |                              .L.
            |                              . .
     -32 dB |___Planckian Continuum__      . .      __4.0 X 10^-22 W/Hz___
            |                        \     . .     /
            |                         \    . .    /
     -52 dB |___Fraunhofer Dark Line_  \___._.___/  __4.0 X 10^-24 W/Hz___
            |                         <----------->
            |     H_alpha (656.2808 nm) Bandwidth = 0.402 nm = 280 GHz
     -72 dB |___Day_Sky_______________________________4.0 X 10^-26 W/Hz___
            |
            |
            |
            |
            |
    -154 dB |___Night_Sky_____________________________2.5 X 10^-34 W/Hz___
            |
            |                            H_alpha
             -------------------------------------------------------------
                                 Wavelength or Frequency

    Figure 3 -

    Spectral levels at a range of ten light years, per diffraction limited
    pixel.  The normalized transmitter power is 1 kW at 656 nm, and various
    noise sources for a space-based or adaptive ground-based heterodyne
    observatory are indicated.  Both the transmitter and receiver are of
    10 meters aperture and are assumed perfect.  Receiver quantum
    efficiency equals 0.5.  For convenience, the quantum noise level is
    taken as a reference level from which the signal and other noise
    sources are measured.  Fraunhofer dark lines are typically 10 to 20 dB
    below the Planckian continuum level.


    limited, the CNR (SNR) will increase by 20 dB.  Figure 3 is a graph of
    signal and relative noise spectral levels for an imagined symmetrical
    visible SETI system with heterodyne receiver (Equs. 32 and 34).

        One of the main benefits from the optical approach is its ability
    to sustain wideband communications over vast distances with very high
    Effective Isotropic Radiated Powers (EIRPs), but using relatively small
    apertures (Equ. 10).  The latter attribute is particularly useful for
    spacecraft applications. [63-66]  The EIRP is the apparent power that
    the transmitter would have to emit for a given received signal
    intensity, if it was an isotropic radiator, i.e., if it radiated energy
    uniformly in all directions, instead of confining the energy to a
    narrow beam.  It is given by the product of the antenna gain and

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 18

    transmitter power (Equ. 11).  The 656 nm system has a Full Width Half
    Maximum (FWHM) beamwidth of 0.014 arcseconds (Page 73), so that over
    ten light years, the beam diameter has expanded to about 0.04
    Astronomical Units (A.U.); roughly two percent of the diameter of
    Earth's solar orbit (Page 74)!

        For many years the author had been perplexed by the fact the optical
    approach to SETI had been ignored.  There was very much a feeling of
    "What did the SETI community know that he did not?".  Investigations
    over the past eighteen months indicate that to a large extent, the
    answer to this paradox was that the SETI community had simply refused
    to believe in the possibility that ETIs could aim narrow beams, such as
    the 0.04 A.U. dia. beam just described, and hit their targeted planet.


                                PROJECT CYCLOPS

        In this paper, many references are made to the Project Cyclops [5]
    study and the effect that it has had on SETI thinking over the past
    two decades.  Table 1 is taken from this report, which illustrates this
    author's view that Cyclops has been at least partially responsible for
    the lack of interest in the optical approach to SETI after the early
    1970s.

        The first column A is the most revealing in this comparison table,
    in that it models an ETI transmitter at the Nd:YAG (Neodymium: Yttrium-
    Aluminum-Garnet) laser wavelength of 1,060 nm, that has an aperture of
    22.5 cm!  As can be seen, in the Cyclops analysis, the onus for
    detecting a strong signal has been placed at the receiver end of the
    system, where by definition, the technology available would be far
    inferior to that at the transmitter.  The resulting huge multi-mirror
    receiving telescope system is thus incredibly expensive.

        The performance of the 1.06 um (1.06 microns) and 10.6 um systems
    modelled in the Cyclops study have been severely compromised by
    restricting the transmitters and receivers to ground-based operation
    within terrestrial-type atmosphere, and limiting beamwidths to
    one second of arc.  As previously mentioned, the atmospheric coherence
    cell size (ro) is about 20 cm (8") at Wl = 0.5 um, and is proportional
    to Wl^(6/5).  The A infrared systems are essentially state-of-the-art
    for 1971.  The B infrared systems are futuristic for 1971.  If we
    assume that the 1 ns pulses have a repetition rate of one per second in
    the case of the first 1.06 um Nd:YAG system (Optical System A), the
    average power is only a modest 1 kW.  One does wonder though, what a
    peak power of 1 Terrawatt (1,000 GW) would do to a 22.5 cm diameter
    transmitting mirror, or the air contained within the telescope!


                              SETI COMPARISONS

        This paper describes two basic types of Optical SETI receiver; the
    Professional (coherent) heterodyne system and the Amateur (incoherent)
    photon-counting system.  However, there is no reason why a professional
    receiver could not use photon-counting, and vice versa, why an amateur

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 19

==========================================================================
  Table 1  Project Cyclops comparison scenarios
==========================================================================
                       OPTICAL            INFRARED            MICROWAVE
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
PARAMETER            A         B         A         B         A         B
Wavelength           1.06 um   1.06 um   10.6 um   10.6 um   3 cm      3 cm
==========================================================================
                                 TRANSMITTER
==========================================================================
Antenna Diameter    22.5 cm   22.5 cm    2.25 m    2.25 m    100 m     3 km*
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
No. Of Elements      1         1         1         1         1         900
Element Diameter     22.5 cm   22.5 cm   2.25 m    2.25 m    100 m     100 m
Antenna Gain     4.4x10^11 4.4x10^11 4.4x10^11 4.4x10^11 1.1x10^8 9.8x10^10
Peak or CW Power, W  10^12     10^5      10^5      10^5      10^5      10^5
Modulation           Pulse     Pulse     Pulse     PSK       PSK       PSK
Pulse, s             10^-9     1         1         1         1         1
Energy per Bit, J    10^3      10^5      10^5      10^5      10^5      10^5
EIRP, W          4.4x10^23 4.4x10^16 4.4x10^16 4.4x10^16 1.1x10^13 9.9x10^15
Beamwidth            1"        1"        1"        1"        64"       1"
==========================================================================
                                   RECEIVER
==========================================================================
Antenna Diameter     100 m     100 m     100 m     2.25 m    100 m     3 km*
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
No. Of Elements      400       400       1975      1         1         900
Element Diameter     5 m       5 m       2.25 m    2.25 m    100 m     100 m
Atmosphere Tran.     0.7       0.7       0.5       0.5       1         1
Quantum Effic.       0.4       0.1       0.2       0.2       0.9       0.9
Solar Background 1.2x10^-3     36    1.7x10^-3   6x10^-7     -----     -----
Noise Temp., K       13,600    13,600    1360      1360      20        20
RF Bandwidth         1 GHz     3 MHz     3 kHz     1 Hz      1 Hz      1 Hz
Detection Method     Photon    Photon    Sq. Law   Synch.    Synch.   Synch.
Range Limit (L.Y.)   26        24        22        41        500     450,000
State Of The Art?    ?         No        ?         No        Yes       Yes
All Weather?         No        No        No        No        Yes       Yes
==========================================================================

    * Array spread out to 6.4 km diameter to avoid vignetting.

    Data taken from Table 5-3, page 50, July 1973 revised edition
    (CR 114445) of the Project Cyclops design study of a system for
    detecting extraterrestrial life. [5]  This study was prepared under
    Stanford/NASA/Ames Research Center 1971 summer faculty fellowship
    program in engineering systems design.  Note that at the time the
    Cyclops study was done, the field of "optoelectronics" (photonics) had
    not yet really begun.  Thus, what the Cyclops study called "Optical" is
    really a superset of both "near-infrared", and "infrared".  In this
    Optical SETI paper, "optical" covers the entire spectrum from ultra-
    violet to the far-infrared.  The near-infrared 1.06 um ETI transmitter
    for the Optical System A is only 22.5 cm in diameter, and is modelled
    to be putting out 1 kW pulses of 1 ns duration, with a peak power of
    one trillion watts and corresponding peak EIRP of 4.4 X 10^23 W!

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 20

    receiver could not use heterodyne detection.  The definition adopted
    here is one based purely on performance and cost grounds.

        We now continue with the comparisons between various type of
    professional heterodyning SETI systems as tabulated in Table 2
    (Page 22).  It should be noted that while the microwave system in this
    table is based on a 100-meter diameter dish, the microwave system
    modelled in Figure 4 (Page 28) is based on a 300-meter diameter
    Arecibo-type dish.  The 100-meter diameter dish system of Table 2,
    corresponds to the Microwave System A modelled in the Cyclops study
    (Table 1, Page 19), each dish being one of up to nine hundred similar
    dishes making up the Cyclops array.

        The infrared telescope system is very similar to ones previously
    modelled by Townes, Betz, and Zuckerman. [46-47,51-53,57]  Note that by
    increasing the 10,600 nm infrared transmitting and receiving
    telescopes' diameters to twenty meters, the SNR (CNR) obtained can be
    increased to the same value (34 dB) indicated for the 656 nm visible
    system (Table 2, Line 26).  Since the Carbon Dioxide (CO2) laser is
    very efficient, coherent, and CO2 is likely to be readily available
    where life becomes established, 10,600 nm may be considered a "magic
    optical wavelength". [46-58]  This wavelength is also capable of
    propagating with little attenuation across substantial portions of the
    Milky Way galaxy.  The beam divergence is such as to make the targeting
    of nearby stars easier.  There is also an approximately sixty percent
    atmospheric window at this wavelength.

        All these telescopes, save for the Cyclops Array (Table 1) [5], may
    be considered as "puny" for an Advanced Technical Civilization (ATC),
    but are representative of state-of-the-art terrene technology,
    technology available either now or within the next decade.  The results
    are based on "perfect" space-based systems (save for the daylight
    background factor), so in practice, several dB may have to be taken off
    the calculated SNR to account for imperfections, and atmospheric
    absorption and turbulence, if ground-based.  Because optical heterodyne
    receivers are proposed for the professional optical systems, Planckian
    starlight and daylight have no effect on ground-based system
    performance if the local-oscillator power per pixel (per photodetector)
    is a lot greater than the background power.  Large ground-based optical
    telescopes would likely use adaptive deformable mirror and laser guide-
    star technology for removing the "twinkle" from the star and
    transmitter's image. [68-70]  The performance of such telescopes should
    exceed the theoretical performance of the HST. [59-62]  This technology
    may be available within five years, and will be described in more
    detail later.

        The "pilot-tone" technique briefly described on Page 10, used in
    conjunction with a photodetector array, might allow the implementation
    of a Maximal Ratio Predetection Diversity receiver.  This leads to a
    very simple adaptive receiver which could be operated both during the
    day and night.  As previously indicated, a more detailed description of
    how this operates may be found in Appendix A (Page 83).  It should be
    kept in mind that getting a "perfect" image of a star and/or an ETI
    transmitter is a more rigorous pursuit than just collecting all the

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 21

    photons emitted by the ETI transmitter, wherever they fall within the
    photodiode array area.

        Table 2 (Page 22) summarizes the salient points of the comparison
    between different electromagnetic communications technologies as
    applied to SETI, using heterodyning telescopes. [71-79]  A preferred
    wavelength, not shown in this table, might be 1,060 nm, corresponding
    to the Nd:YAG transitions in the near-infrared.  The corresponding SNR
    for a 10-meter diameter 1,060 nm system is 32.1 dB.

        Given a modest extension to our technology over the next century,
    such wideband terrene interstellar links should become feasible,
    though they would use digital modulation and compression techniques
    to reduce the required bandwidth and enhance the SNR.  The apparent
    visual intensity of the 1 GW transmitter, the power output of a
    typical Twentieth Century terrene power station, would rise from an
    apparent magnitude of +22.7 to +7.7.  This is still below unaided human
    eye visibility (sixth magnitude) even if not obscured by the light of
    its star, and amounts to only 0.62% of the star's visual intensity (not
    corrected for wavelength).  This result demonstrates that references in
    the literature to the fact that such signals have never been seen by
    the unaided eye, or detected in low-resolution spectrographs, proves
    nothing about whether ETIs are transmitting in the visible spectrum.
    Simply put, a powerful communications signal is still weak compared to
    a star's (integrated over wavelength) output radiated in our direction.


        Table 2, Line 11 -

        The reader is left to judge whether ATCs (ETIs) would have the
    wherewithal to aim narrow optical beams over tens and hundreds of
    light years and still be sure that their signal would strike a planet
    orbiting within the targeted star's biosphere (zone of life).  Perhaps
    it is this assumption alone that is the key to the efficacy of the
    optical approach to SETI.  The option is available to defocus
    (decollimate) the transmitted beam when targeting nearby stars.  In
    such a situation, the signal strength would be weakened (reduced EIRP)
    for nearby target systems, but would remain relatively constant when
    operated on more remote targets out to distances of several thousand
    light years.  It does not make sense to cripple, which is the result of
    Dr. Bernard Oliver's approach, [5] the long-range performance of Extra-
    terrestrial Intelligence (ETI) transmitters just because the beams
    happen to be too narrow for nearby stars.

        Clifford Singer [15] has described how superior ETI technical
    prowess for transmitting microwave signals at certain preferred times
    related to the targeted star's proper motion can lead to an enhanced
    transmission efficiency, making it more likely that the recipient
    will be able to detect those signals.  In a similar vein, Filippova and
    others [55] have suggested that ETIs might make use of the moment of
    opposition to ensure that a narrow optical beam aimed at a star would
    be detectable at a target planet approaching opposition.  Dr. John
    Rather, in the August, 1991 issue of the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH
    INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS) [56], describes huge Optical ETI

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 22

  =========================================================================
  Table 2  Summary of SETI performance for (symmetrical) professional
           heterodyne communication systems over a range of 10 light years.
  =========================================================================
                               MICROWAVE SETI       OPTICAL SETI
      PARAMETER                 SINGLE DISH    INFRARED       VISIBLE
  =========================================================================
   1. Wavelength                0.20 m         10,600 nm      656 nm
   2. Frequency, Hz             1.50 X 10^9    2.83 X 10^13   4.57 X 10^14
  =========================================================================
                                  TRANSMITTERS
  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
   3. Diameter, m               100            10             10
   4. Gain, dB                  63.9           129.4          153.6
   5. FWHM Beamwidth, arcsecs.  421            0.223          0.0138
   6. Power, kW                 1              1              1
   7. EIRP, W                   2.47 X 10^9    8.78 X 10^15   2.29 X 10^18
  =========================================================================
                                    RECEIVERS
  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
   8. Diameter, m               100            10             10
   9. Gain, dB                  63.9           129.4          153.6
  10. FWHM Beamwidth, arcsecs.  421            0.223          0.0138
  11. FWHM Diameter, A.U.       1,290          0.684          0.0423
  12. Intensity, W/m^2          2.19 X 10^-26  7.81 X 10^-20  2.04 X 10^-17
  13. Signal, W                 1.72 X 10^-22  6.13 X 10^-18  1.60 X 10^-15
  14. Photon Count, s^-1        NA             163            2,640
  15. Equivalent Magnitude      NA             NA             +22.7
  16. Quantum Efficiency        NA             0.5            0.5
  17. Effec. Noise Temp., K     10             2,719          43,900
  18. Planckian, W/m^2.Hz*      8.80 X 10^-33  1.07 X 10^-25  2.74 X 10^-24
  19. Star Stellar Magnitude    NA             NA             +2.2
  20. Relative Brightness, %    NA             NA             6.2 X 10^-7
  21. Alien Planet Magnitude    NA             NA             +24
  22. SPR, dB*                  64.0           55.7           65.7
  23. Minimum SPR, dB*          64.0           69.5           115.7
  24. Daylight, W/m^2.sr.nm     NA             2 X 10^-3      1 X 10^-1
  25. SDR, dB*                  NA             50.6           106.0
  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
  26. SNR, dB*                  1.0            22.1           34.2
  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
  27. Radial Doppler,  Hz       1.0 X 10^5     1.9 X 10^9     3.1 X 10^10
  28. Orbital Doppler, Hz       1.5 X 10^5     2.8 X 10^9     4.6 X 10^10
  29. Synchronous Chirp, Hz/s   1.1 X 10^0     2.1 X 10^4     3.4 X 10^5
  30. Ground-Based Chirp, Hz/s  1.7 X 10^-1    3.2 X 10^3     5.1 X 10^4
  31. Symbiotic Cost, $M        2              20             20
  32. Ground-Based Cost, $M     200            200            200
  33. Space-Based Cost, $M      100            10,000         10,000
  =========================================================================

      FWHM = Full Width Half Maximum (3 dB beamwidth).
      1 Astronomical Unit (A.U.) = 1.496 X 10^11 m.
      1 Light Year (L.Y.) = 9.461 X 10^15 m = 63,239 A.U.
      1 parsec (psc) = 3.26 L.Y.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 23

        * Signal-To-Noise (SNR) and Signal-To-Planck/Daylight (SPR and SDR)
    Ratios assume polarized starlight and background, with no Fraunhofer
    dark-line suppression (typically 10 to 20 dB).

        Signal-To-Noise Ratios (SNRs) in the galactic plane fall at the
    rate of 20 dB per decade of range (see Equ. 38), out to approximately
    one thousand light years in the visible regime, where attenuation by
    gas and dust begins to become significant.  The attenuation in the
    visible, of 4 dB per three thousand light years (equivalent to a one
    stellar magnitude reduction in brightness), drops significantly away
    from the galactic plane.


        The following numbers refer to the line numbers given in Table 2
    and give a more detailed description of the parameters:

        5.  Full Width Half Maximum (FWHM) far-field beamwidth (Equ. 4).

        8.  The Cyclops Array proposed in 1971 consisted of nine hundred
            100-meter diameter dishes (of the type modelled in the table)
            covering an area 6.4 kilometers in diameter.

       11.  Full Width Half Maximum (FWHM) size of received beam (Equ. 5).

       14.  The rate at which photons are detected (Equ. 36).

       15.  Apparent visual magnitude of transmitter is not corrected for
            visible wavelength (Equ. 2).

       20.  Relative brightness of transmitter in comparison to unpolarized
            Planckian starlight from a G-type star (black-body at 5,800 K).

       21.  Apparent Stellar Magnitude of reflected Planckian starlight
            from a Jupiter-size extrasolar planet.  Note that if we want to
            detect an extrasolar planet directly, it is easier to do so by
            detecting its emitted heat in the infrared than by detecting
            reflected light in the visible.

       22.  Signal-To-Planck Ratio (SPR) for a solar-type star at the
            heterodyned I.F. frequency, assuming star and transmitter are
            not separately resolved.

       23.  Minimum Signal-To-Planck Ratio (SPR) for a solar-type star at
            the heterodyned I.F. frequency, assuming star and transmitter
            are separately resolved (Equ. 9).

       24.  Background daylight sky radiance for ground-based visible and
            infrared telescopes.  For the latter, the 300 K temperature of
            the atmosphere presents a relatively constant 24 hour/day
            background.

       25.  Signal-To-Daylight Ratio (SDR) per pixel for diffraction-limited
            ground-based visible and infrared telescopes.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 24

       26.  For convenience, SNRs (CNRs) are normalized to a 1 Hz
            electrical bandwidth.  The value for the microwave system is
            given by Equ. 29.  The values for the optical systems are given
            by Equs. 32 and 34.

       27.  Typical Doppler Shift (+/-) due to line-of-sight relative
            motions between stars at 20 km/s (Equ. 39).

       28.  Maximum local Doppler Shift (+/-) due to motion of transmitter/
            receiver around solar-type star (1 A.U. orbit).

       29.  Maximum local Doppler Drift (+/-) for transmitter/receiver in
            geosynchronous orbit around Earth-type planet (Equ. 40).

       30.  Maximum local Doppler Drift (+/-) for a ground-based equatorial
            transmitter/receiver on an Earth-type planet.

       31.  Approximate ground-based receiver cost (millions), assuming
            re-use or sharing of existing observatories in each hemisphere.

       32.  Approximate ground-based receiver cost (millions), assuming a
            new dedicated (adaptive) telescope in each hemisphere.

       33.  Approximate receiver cost (millions) for a single space-based
            telescope.  A very conservative estimate has been used.

    transmitting arrays which are of planetary size, sending out powerful
    Free-Electron Laser beams to an enormous number of stars simultan-
    eously.  Huge arrays can provide an extended Rayleigh (near-field)
    range so that the flux densities remain constant (the inverse square
    law does not apply) out to considerable distances (Equ. 7, Page 74).


        Table 2, Line 15 -

        In this table, the apparent visual magnitude and brightness of a
    star, planet, or transmitter, is given for comparison purposes, and
    is defined only for visible wavelengths, since infrared light is
    invisible.  The apparent visual magnitude of the transmitter is
    essentially independent of the optical detection bandwidth as long as
    it is equal to or greater than the signal bandwidth, i.e., it is the
    same for an optical bandwidth of 1 Hz, 1 MHz, or 1 THz; these band-
    widths being much less than that of the human eye.


        Table 2, Line 20 -

        This shows the apparent visual intensity of the transmitter with
    respect to the alien star (Equ. 2).  If the 656 nm 1 kW transmitter
    power is increased by six orders of magnitude to 1 GW, the received
    signal will increase to 1.6 nW (2.6 X 10^9 photons detected per
    second), and the Carrier-To-Noise Ratio (CNR) will increase to 94 dB.
    In a 30 MHz bandwidth this CNR will fall to 19 dB.  This is more than
    adequate to transmit a standard analog NTSC/PAL/SECAM F.M. video

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 25

    signal over 10 light years, though at a range of 100 light years the
    CNR would fall to an unusable -1 dB (the F.M. threshold is typically
    7 to 10 dB).


        Table 2, Line 23 -

        The Signal-To-Planck Ratio (SPR) on this line takes into account
    the ability of large diffraction-limited optical telescopes to
    spatially separate in the focal plane, the image of the transmitted
    signal from the image of the aliens' star (Equs. 8 and 9).  This leads
    to the Signal-To-Planckian Ratio (SPR) being about 10 dB greater than
    the Signal-To-Daylight Ratio (SDR).  Clearly, even when the signal
    source and Planckian noise (Equ. 3) are not optically separable, the
    ratio of the signal to the Planckian background noise is much greater
    than the quantum shot noise SNR, so it is not limiting on performance.

        Contrary to statements in the literature [12], there may be no need
    to select a laser wavelength to coincide with a Fraunhofer line if
    optical heterodyne reception is assumed.  This is really useful only
    when incoherent optical detection techniques are employed (see the
    later material on Amateur Optical SETI) with their relatively wideband
    optical filters.  However, it might be advisable to avoid bright
    emission lines that rise substantially above the continuum level.

        For an advanced technical society, a laser transmitting telescope
    is only "slightly" more difficult to construct than a microwave
    transmitting dish, though Isaac Asimov appeared to think otherwise in
    the late 1970s.  Towards the end of his 1979 book, EXTRATERRESTRIAL
    CIVILIZATIONS [12] (page 263), Asimov says:  "With laser light we come
    closer to a practical signaling device than anything yet mentioned,
    but even a laser signal originating from some planet would, at great
    distances, be drowned out by the general light of the star the planet
    circles."  He goes on to say:  "One possibility that has been suggested
    is this:  The spectra of Sun-type stars have numerous dark lines
    representing missing photons - photons that have been preferentially
    absorbed by specific atoms in the stars' atmospheres.  Suppose a
    planetary civilization sends out a strong laser beam at the precise
    energy level of one of the prominent dark lines of the star's spectrum.
    That would brighten that dark line...."  Asimov went on to imply that a
    laser system was complicated and that no civilization would be expected
    to use the harder method if a simpler (microwave) method is available.

        This erroneous idea that laser transmitters have to outshine stars
    to be detectable has unfortunately been accepted by many in the SETI
    community.  Dr. Jill Tarter [24] (Chapter 14, SETI: THE FARTHEST
    FRONTIER, Page 192) has said that "Any optical communications signal
    coming from a planet circling a distant star would have to outshine the
    star itself in order for us to detect it".  As we have seen, this is
    simply not true.  Indeed, as we shall show later, even small incoherent
    receivers with optical bandwidths as large as 100 GHz can produce
    electronically detectable signals at intensities considerably below
    that of nearby stars.  Note that this statement has nothing to do with
    the assumed technical beaming prowess of ETIs, only that a visible

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 26

     wavelength signal strong enough for good communications, is still weak
     compared to a star's visual brightness (intensity).

        With optical heterodyne receivers, whose performance is essentially
    independent of the optical pre-mixing bandwidth (the effective optical
    bandwidth for background noise calculations is equal to the electrical
    intermediate frequency bandwidth), there does not appear to be any
    necessity to operate within a Fraunhofer dark absorption line in order
    to avail ourselves of 10 to 20 dB of Planckian continuum noise
    suppression.  The "magic-wavelength" would thus be determined only by
    the availability of highly efficient and coherent laser frequencies.


        Table 2, Line 25 -

        The high Signal-To-Daylight (background) ratio indicates that
    Optical SETI is one of the few branches of optical astronomy, save for
    solar astronomy, which can be conducted during daylight hours under a
    clear, blue Earth sky.  Since the background detected per diffraction
    limited pixel is essentially independent of aperture, this ratio
    (shown for 45 degrees to the zenith) is proportional to the receiving
    telescope's aperture area, as is the quantum SNR.  The Signal-To-
    Nightlight ratio for ground-based observatories is some 80 dB greater.

        Thus, it is suggested that Optical SETI observations with the
    great optical telescopes of Earth could be conducted during daylight
    hours while conventional astronomy is conducted at night.  Also,
    telescopes which have been decommissioned due to light pollution
    effects might be brought back into service.  A future symbiotic
    relationship (sharing of facilities) between Optical SETI and
    conventional astronomy, could allow Optical SETI to be conducted for
    one-tenth the cost indicated on Line 32 for dedicated observatories,
    i.e., for about twenty million dollars (United States currency).


        Table 2, Line 26 -

        This is the bottom line, showing the SNR (CNR) normalized to a
    1 Hz bandwidth.  The 34 dB CNR for the 656 nm system corresponds to a
    photon detection rate of 2,640 per second (Equ. 36).  For practical
    Professional Optical SETI searches, we should be looking for signals
    with minimum bandwidths of about 100 kHz.  As long as the Signal-To-
    Planck and Signal-To-Daylight ratios are larger than the quantum SNR,
    the former do not reduce the system performance.  It should be noted
    that at a frequency of 1.5 GHz (wavelength = 20 cm), the full
    6.4-kilometer diameter microwave Cyclops Project [5], which in 1971
    would have cost about ten billion dollars, only achieves an SNR of
    60 dB (see Table 1, Page 19).  This is about 26 dB greater than for a
    10-meter diameter symmetrical visible system.

        Other than the fact that interstellar absorption at microwave
    frequencies for distances in excess of a few thousand light years is
    significantly less than in the visible spectrum, the Microwave Cyclops
    system has little to commend it for communications within the solar

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 27

    neighborhood, particularly as the cost of the receiver is about one
    hundred times that of a single-aperture ground-based optical counter-
    part.  This is good grounds for thinking "small is beautiful".  For
    some strange reason, while free-space laser communications appears to
    be fine for future terrene GEO (Geosynchronous Earth Orbit) to LEO
    (Low Earth Orbit) and deep-space communications (much of this work is
    being coordinated by NASA [63-66]), the SETI community appears to be
    convinced that ETIs would not use such technology for interstellar
    communications!  This is illogical.  A presently favored operating
    wavelength for terrene free-space communications systems is 530 nm
    (green), obtained by frequency-doubling the 1,060 nm wavelength
    produced by a laser-diode pumped Nd:YAG laser.

        As previously mentioned, terrene SETI programs appear to have been
    distorted by poor assumptions in the Cyclops study (see Table 1,
    Page 19). [5]  As we showed earlier, the efficacy of the optical
    approach was severely hampered by constraining the near-infrared
    transmitting telescope size to 22.5 cm.  It boggles the mind to think
    that ETIs would be trying to contact us with their equivalent of a
    Celestron or Meade telescope.  This would put the onus on us to build
    very large and expensive multi-aperture receiving telescopes to pick up
    their weak signals; surely the very opposite would be the case!  The
    Cyclops study was unable even to predict the rise in ascendancy of the
    ubiquitous semiconductor chip over the following five years, and the
    effect it would have on SETI signal processing, even though integrated
    circuits were being developed in the editors' backyard!

        Present-day experimental ground-based free-space communications
    links are already using receiving telescope apertures as large as
    1.5 meters. [66]  Since the overall performance of symmetrical systems
    is proportional to the telescope diameter raised to the sixth to eighth
    power (allowing for power density limitations due to heating effects
    at the transmitter mirror), poor estimations about transmitting and
    receiving telescope apertures can drastically skew a comparative
    systems analysis.  In practice, transmitting and receiving telescopes
    are likely to be extremely asymmetric.  If we do discover an optical
    ETI signal in the next few decades, it will probably be found to have
    been transmitted by a huge optical array, while our receiving antenna
    will be a relatively puny telescope.

        Figure 4 shows a graph of received signal spectral density,
    superimposed on the Planckian spectral density curve for a (solar-type)
    black body radiator at a temperature of 5,778 K.  The microwave system
    performance shown in this graph is based on the 300-meter diameter
    Arecibo telescope; producing a CNR some 19 dB greater than for the
    100-meter radio telescope system modelled in Table 2 (Page 22).

        The reader is encouraged to compare this graph to that given in
    FIRST CONTACT [26] (Chapter 4, Page 151, by Dr. Michael Klein).  The
    first impressions from that graph (Figure 1 of Chapter 4) is again
    that optical communications are useless.  This is far from the truth.
    Indeed, the graph is very misleading.  One might be forgiven for
    thinking that in this model the ETIs are using Compact Disc-type
    laser-diodes and/or hobby model-type telescopes!  The assumed

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 28

    Spectral Density, W/m^2.Hz
      |
    10^-15 |
           |                              EIRP = 2.3 X 10^18 W  23rd Mag.
           |                                                  *
           |                    EIRP = 8.7 X 10^15 W          * CNR = 34 dB
           |                                        *         *         .
    10^-20 |                            CNR = 22 dB *         *.    Quantum
           |                                        *.        *      Noise
           |                              .         *         *
           |                                        *         #656 nm Beacon
           | EIRP = 2.2 X 10^10 W                   *    #   |  #(10 m Dia.)
    10^-25 |       *               10,600 nm Beacon #        | |
           |       * CNR = 20 dB   (10 m Dia.)  #            |V| #
           |    . .*. . . . . . .           #                |I| 2nd Mag.
           |       * Temp. = 10 K      #    ^                |S|  #Starlight
           |       *              #         |                |I|
    10^-30 |       *         #          Planckian            |B|   #
           |       *    #              Black Body            |L|
           |       # 1.5 GHz Beacon       Curve              |E|    #
           |   #     (300 m Dia.)                            | |
           |#                                                |L|     #
    10^-35 |                                                 |I|
           |                                                 |G|      #
           |                                                 |H|
           |       Microwave      Millimeter      Infrared   |T| Ultra #
           |                                                 | | Violet
    10^-40  ----------------------------------------------------------------
         10^8   10^9   10^10   10^11   10^12   10^13   10^14   10^15   10^16

                                    Frequency, Hz

    Figure 4 -

    Spectral density and interstellar CNR for 1 kW (SETI) signals at
    ten light years.  Quantum Efficiency at Visible and Infrared = 0.5.
    Microwave system is based on 300-meter diameter Arecibo-type
    telescopes.  Optical systems are based on perfect 10-meter diameter
    telescopes as modelled in Table 2.  The Carrier-To-Noise Ratios (CNRs)
    are normalized to a 1 Hz bandwidth.  The EIRP of a solar-type star =
    3.9 X 10^26 W, and has an apparent magnitude equal to 2.2.


    optical EIRPs are much too low.  Also, the graph is plotted in terms
    of EIRP, and therefore exaggerates the efficacy of the microwave
    approach for an electronic receiver (instead of an observer), because
    it does not show the typical 10 K noise floor of a high-quality
    microwave receiver, only the radio brightness of a quiet G-type star.
    The latter is about 54 dB beneath the 10 K systems noise floor, as
    shown in Figure 4, and could only be detected after considerable signal
    integration.  At 1.5 GHz, it is generally the Cosmic Background, i.e.,
    the 2.73 K aftermath of the theoretical Big Bang, and the electronic
    noise in the microwave front-end that limits signal detectability, not
    Planckian radio noise from the star.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6C - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part C - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

                         ASA MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION

        The Electronic Journal of the Astronomical Society of the Atlantic
    (EJASA) is published monthly by the Astronomical Society of the
    Atlantic, Incorporated.  The ASA is a non-profit organization dedicated
    to the advancement of amateur and professional astronomy and space
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
    boards, but only in an unmodified form and in its entirety, with the
    following copyright notice attached.  No license is given to reproduce
    this document in electronic or hardcopy form for profit.  However, the
    media may reproduce short extracts for the purposes of furthering the
    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                     Copyright (c) 1992           *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
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Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                          January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6C

                             Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                        IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART C

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 29

                                    LASERS

        Table 3 gives a list of many of the more important laser types
    presently known. [79]  As previously mentioned, the CO2 wavelength of
    10,600 nm has been identified as an "optical magic wavelength".
    [46-47,51-53,57]  However, there are many laser wavelengths in the
    visible and infrared spectrums that might be suitable for ETI trans-
    mitters and local-oscillators.  We should not discount the possibility
    that ETIs may use efficient frequency-doubled lasers, so we might
    consider exploring the visible spectrum for near-infrared lasers at
    half the wavelengths quoted below.  For example, the 532 nm wavelength
    corresponding to the frequency-doubled Nd:YAG 1,064 nm transition may
    be a suitable wavelength; one that is presently favored for terrene
    optical communications.


    =====================================================================
   |  Table 3  Important laser types and wavelengths                     |
   |=====================================================================|
   |               Type               |          Wavelength (nm)         |
   |----------------------------------|----------------------------------|
   | Free-Electron                    | Ultra-violet to far-infrared*    |
   | Krypton-Fluoride Excimer         | 249                              |
   | Xenon-Chloride Excimer           | 308                              |
   | Nitrogen Gas (N2)                | 337                              |
   | Organic Dye (in solution)        | 300-1,000 (tunable)**            |
   | Krypton Ion                      | 335-800                          |
   | Helium-Cadmium                   | 422.0                            |
   | Argon Ion                        | 450-530 (main lines 488 & 514.5) |
   | Helium Neon                      | 543, 632.8, 1,150                |
   | Semiconductor (GaInP)            | 670-680                          |
   | Ruby                             | 694                              |
   | Semiconductor (GaAlAs)           | 750-900                          |
   | Neodymium YAG                    | 1,064                            |
   | Semiconductor (InGaAsP)          | 1,300-1,600                      |
   | Hydrogen-Fluoride Chemical       | 2,600-3,000                      |
   | Semiconductor (Pb-salt)          | 3,300-27,000 (tunable)**         |
   | Deuterium Fluoride               | 3,600-4,000                      |
   | Carbon Monoxide                  | 5,000-6,500                      |
   | Carbon Dioxide (CO2)             | 9,000-11,400 (main line 10,600)  |
    =====================================================================
    *  Extremely high peak powers available within the decade (> 100 GW).
    ** Suitable for wide-tunability receiver local-oscillators.


        Carbon Dioxide and Semiconductor lasers are very efficient.  In
    addition to the types listed above, there are a variety of chemical
    lasers, including:  Iodine, Hydrogen Bromide, Xenon Hexafluoride,
    Uranium Hexafluoride, and Sulphur Hexafluoride.  These chemical lasers
    are efficient and very powerful.

        Lasers like the Helium-Cadmium and Helium-Neon can be discounted
    because of their very poor efficiency and low power, even though their
    temporal coherence is excellent.  Similarly, the original Ruby laser is

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 30

     =====================================================================
    | Table 4  The most intense Fraunhofer lines from the Sun{1}          |
    |=====================================================================|
    | Wavelength, nm      Bandwidth, nm   Bandwidth, GHz    Element       |
    |---------------------------------------------------------------------|
    | 410.1748               0.3133          558.7          H_delta       |
    | 413.2067               0.0400           71.0          Fe I{2}       |
    | 414.3878               0.0466           81.4          Fe I          |
    | 416.7277               0.0200           34.5          Mg I          |
    | 420.2040               0.0326           55.4          Fe I          |
    | 422.6740               0.1476          247.9          Ca I          |
    | 423.5949               0.0385           64.4          Fe I{2}       |
    | 425.0130               0.0342           56.8          Fe I{2}       |
    | 425.0797               0.0400           66.4          Fe I{2}       |
    | 425.4346               0.0393           65.1          Cr I{2}       |
    | 426.0486               0.0595           98.3          Fe I          |
    | 427.1774               0.0756          124.3          Fe I          |
    | 432.5775               0.0793          127.1          Fe I{2}       |
    | 434.0475               0.2855          454.6          H_gamma       |
    | 438.3557               0.1008          157.4          Fe I          |
    | 440.4761               0.0898          138.9          Fe I          |
    | 441.5135               0.0417           64.2          Fe I{2}       |
    | 452.8627               0.0275           40.2          Fe I{2}       |
    | 455.4036               0.0159           23.0          Ba II         |
    | 470.3003               0.0326           44.2          Mg I          |
    | 486.1342               0.3680          467.2          H_beta        |
    | 489.1502               0.0312           39.1          Fe I          |
    | 492.0514               0.0471           58.4          Fe I{2}       |
    | 495.7613               0.0696           85.0          Fe I{2}       |
    | 516.7327               0.0935          105.1          Mg I{2}       |
    | 517.2698               0.1259          141.2          Mg I          |
    | 518.3619               0.1584          176.9          Mg I          |
    | 525.0216               0.0062            6.7          Fe I{3}       |
    | 526.9550               0.0478           51.6          Fe I{2}       |
    | 532.8051               0.0375           39.6          Fe I          |
    | 552.8418               0.0293           28.8          Mg I          |
    | 588.9973               0.0752           65.0          Na I(D2){2}   |
    | 589.5940               0.0564           48.7          Na I(D1)      |
    | 610.2727               0.0135           10.9          Ca I          |
    | 612.2226               0.0222           17.8          Ca I          |
    | 616.2180               0.0222           17.5          Ca I          |
    | 630.2499               0.0083            6.3          Fe I{3}       |
    | 656.2808 _____________ 0.4020 ________ 280.0 ________ H_alpha       |
    | 849.8062               0.1470           61.1          Ca II         |
    | 854.2144               0.3670          150.9          Ca II         |
    | 866.2170               0.2600          104.0          Ca II         |
     =====================================================================

    Table reproduced from "Astrophysical Formulae", edited by K.R. Lang,
    Springer-Verlag, 1978, p. 175. [90]

    {1} After MOORE, MINNAERT, and HOUTGAST.
    {2} Blended line.
    {3} Magnetic sensitive line.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 31

    inefficient and low power.  Probably, one of the more important
    considerations for an ETI transmitting laser is that it should be
    capable of being deployed in space, be able to produce extremely high
    C.W. or pulse powers, and be nuclear or stellar (solar) pumped.

        Organic dye lasers are suitable for local-oscillators, with their
    wide tunability and narrow linewidth (< 5 kHz).  Lead-salt semi-
    conductor lasers are suitable for infrared local-oscillators.


                               FRAUNHOFER LINES

        Table 4 is a list of the most intense Fraunhofer lines from the Sun
    and their effective bandwidths.  The H_alpha Hydrogen line upon which
    the visible Optical SETI model is based, has a wavelength of
    656.2808 nm (frequency = 4.57 X 10^14 Hz), and an effective linewidth
    or bandwidth of 0.402 nm (280 GHz). [88-90]  The actual FWHM linewidth
    is somewhat less that 280 GHz.


                              THE OPTICAL SEARCH

        An "All Sky Survey" of the type planned for the Microwave Observing
    Project (MOP), which pixelizes the entire celestial sphere, does not
    make sense in the optical regime. [40-45]  The 10^16 beams (Equ. 20)
    for a diffraction limited 10-meter diameter visible-wavelength
    telescope are mainly wasted looking out into empty (local) space.  For
    a celestial sphere one thousand light years in radius, containing one
    million solar-type stars, the average angular separation between stars
    is 0.23 degrees (see Figure 10).  A 34-meter diameter radio telescope at
    1.5 GHz has a typical field-of-view (FOV) of 0.41 X 0.41 degrees, and
    thus, on average, its FOV encompasses several stars.  It is efficient
    when conducting a radio "All Sky Survey" to continuously scan the
    celestial sphere in consecutive or adjacent strips or sectors.

        The 10-meter diameter Professional 656 nm Optical SETI Telescope
    would have a typical FOV = 0.33 X 0.33 degrees and a 128 X 128
    photodetector array FOV = 2.1" X 2.1".  Since the average separation
    between stars is 0.23 degrees, the average number of stars in the
    optical array FOV is 6.4 X 10^-6.  Thus, the narrow diffraction-limited
    field-of-view means that for most of the time the optical detector(s)
    would be viewing empty space.  A similar situation prevails for the
    smaller, single detector amateur optical telescopes to be discussed
    later.  The argument has been advanced by Dr. Bernard Oliver, in
    correspondence with the author and at the author's SETI Institute talk,
    that because an "All Sky Survey" would be out of the question at
    optical frequencies, this implies that ETIs would not use these
    frequencies.

        The author's response to this is that there is nothing "holy" about
    the "All Sky Survey" approach.  What we may wish to do is to have a
    Targeted Search of tens of thousands of stars, instead of a mere eight
    hundred as presently planned for MOP (see Page 11).  However, each time
    we wish to scan another star in the frequency domain, we will move the

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 32

    telescope to an adjacent sector of the sky that contains the desired
    object.

        While there is the possibility that ETI transmitters exist in the
    interstellar voids, far from their home stars, the author thinks that
    this scenario is unlikely (except perhaps within our own solar system,
    i.e., von Neumann-type probes), if for no other reason than it would
    place the energy-intensive transmitters far from a "cheap" and
    plentiful energy source.

        One of the many objections made to the optical approach to SETI is
    that there are just too many frequencies to search.  As Figure 5
    illustrates, under the author's rationale, this is more a perception
    than a reality because of the wider signal bandwidths assumed.


      21-cm Water-Hole                               Channel or Bin
         |                                                  |
       ------------------------------------------------------------------
      |  *                                                  #            |
      |  *                      MICROWAVE HAYSTACK          #            |
      |  *                                                  #            |
       ------------------------------------------------------------------
      |                                  |               --> <--         |
    1 GHz                              10 GHz              1 Hz      100 GHz

        Number of 1 Hz frequency channels or bins between
        1 GHz and 10 GHz = 9 Billion.


                10,600 nm                                 656 nm
                   |                                         |
       ------------------------------------------------------------------
      |            *                                   #     *           |
      |            *             OPTICAL HAYSTACK      #     *           |
      |            *                                   #     *           |
       ------------------------------------------------------------------
      |                                  |          --> <--              |
    10 THz                            100 THz       100 kHz        1,000 THz

        Number of 100 kHz frequency channels or bins between
        20 THz and 920 THz = 9 Billion.

    Figure 5 -

    The Microwave and Optical Cosmic Haystack frequency domains.  This
    demonstrates that the number of frequencies to search in the microwave
    and optical haystacks are of similar magnitude.


        Wide bandwidth means that laser linewidths, Doppler shifts, and
    chirps (drifts) are less significant, and the number of frequencies to
    search in the optical spectrum is more manageable.  Just because
    visible frequencies are over five orders of magnitude higher than

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 33

    microwave frequencies does not mean that there are over 10^5 more
    frequencies to search in the optical frequency domain.  The modulation
    bandwidth of proposed optical ETI signals as a percentage of the
    carrier frequency may be as large or larger than the percentage
    modulation bandwidth of proposed microwave ETI signals.  In fact,
    assuming minimum bin bandwidths of 100 kHz, the number of frequencies
    to search in the entire optical spectrum may not be much greater than
    the number of 1 Hz frequencies between 1 and 10 GHz, i.e., nine
    billion!  This is illustrated diagrammatically in Figure 5.  This
    clearly has important ramifications in terms of the search time.

        The reader should note that for a drifting carrier signal, i.e.,
    one subjected to Doppler Chirp, the optimum detection bandwidth is
    equal to the square root of the frequency drift rate. [5,8]  This
    assumes that the local-oscillator laser is not de-chirped.  Thus, the
    optimum bandwidth for a monochromatic 1.5 GHz signal drifting at a
    local Doppler Chirp rate of 0.17 Hz/s (see Table 2, Line 30, Page 22)
    is about 0.4 Hz, while for a monochromatic 656 nm signal drifting at
    51 kHz/s, the optimum bandwidth is 226 Hz.  If the bin bandwidth is
    excessive, too much system noise is detected, and the CNR is degraded.
    On the other hand, if the bin bandwidth is too small, the response time
    of the filter (approximately 1/Bif) is insufficient to respond to all
    the energy in the signal as it sweeps by, again leading to a reduction
    in CNR and detectability.

        It is an interesting exercise to estimate the time that would be
    required at visible wavelengths for both an All Sky Survey and a
    Targeted Search.  We will assume the use of a ten-meter diameter
    receiving telescope, a 128 X 128 photodetector array (16,384 pixels),
    and initially, a single 10 GHz bandwidth Multi-Channel Spectrum
    Analyzer (MCSA) that sequentially samples all 16,384 photodetectors.
    These MCSAs could have final bin bandwidths of about 100 kHz.  At this
    time, 10 GHz MCSAs do not exist, and the state-of-the-art for single-
    chip devices employed in Microwave SETI is about 10 MHz.  However, it
    is only a question of time before these more powerful 10 GHz devices
    are developed.

        For the purposes of this brief analysis we shall not concern
    ourselves with the huge amount of data storage that must be provided,
    or the data reduction time overhead required.  Equ. 20 (Page 81) shows
    that the number of received beams for such a telescope is about 10^16.
    Since the minimum sampling time per pixel for a 10 GHz bandwidth is
    100 ps, the time to sample the entire array of 16,384 instantaneous
    beams is 1.64 microseconds.  The number of array sets of beams in the
    celestial sphere consisting of 10^16 beams is 6.1 X 10^11.  Thus, the
    time just to "look" at one 10 GHz wide band of the visible spectrum,
    assuming that a continuous scan of the sky could be made with no dead
    time or overlap, is 10^6 s, i.e., 11.6 days!  This is a substantial
    amount of time for a single band just 10 GHz wide.

        Since there are 42,857 bands of 10 GHz bandwidth between 350 nm and
    700 nm, the time required to search the entire sky and all visible
    frequencies is, at a minimum, 1,360 years!  Even if we had 128
    parallel MCSAs (don't even consider having 16,384 - 10 GHz MCSAs!), the

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 34

    time to search even a 10 GHz band is long, notwithstanding the "slight"
    data storage problem.  Clearly, we can forget about this form of
    optical All Sky Survey, since it is a grossly inefficient way of
    scanning or pixelizing the sky.  Almost all the data bins will be empty
    bins, having been derived from beams pointing to empty (near) space.
    The situation for an Optical All Sky Survey is actually much worse than
    just implied, due to the additional time that each pixel must be
    sampled to ensure a high probability of detecting the fewer, but more
    energetic optical photons - more about this in a moment.

        On the other hand, if we only consider a Targeted Search, the time
    required is much shorter and allows for the search to be done across
    the entire optical spectrum, not just at selected laser frequencies or
    Fraunhofer lines.  As we have just seen, if the photon arrival rate is
    sufficiently high, the time with a single 10 GHz MCSA for a single scan
    of the entire array is 1.64 microseconds.  To scan for one star over
    the entire 350 nm to 700 nm band would take 0.070 seconds (assuming
    suitable L.O. lasers).  This is a trivial amount of time, and the amount
    of data that has to be collected and stored is relatively insignificant.
    Indeed, it is the time to do the FFTs and move the telescope to a new
    position that will be the most significant overheads here.

        The above times are highly optimistic because the basic flux
    sensitivity of any kind of receiver, be it microwave or optical, depends
    on the sampling or integration time.  Hence, before we can estimate the
    realistic length of time for a given search, we must decide what are the
    minimum detectable flux levels that we wish to detect.  This, in turn,
    will determine the minimum sampling time for each pixel.  Usually, SETI
    minimum detectable flux estimates are based on integrating a very weak
    signal for a period of time, and not for providing sufficient SNR to
    allow actual demodulation.  We must also decide if we want to model a
    system based on short pulses or on continuous wave (C.W.) signals.

        Of course, it is extremely unlikely that the signal flux would be
    sufficiently high to allow for a high probability of detecting the
    photons in a sampling bandwidth of 10 GHz.  In reality, our minimum
    MCSA bin bandwidths would be about 100 kHz, and the sampling
    (integration) time is at least a factor of 10^5 longer.  For the
    purposes of this further analysis, we shall assume a C.W. signal and a
    100 kHz minimum bin bandwidth, so that the pixel sampling time is now
    10 us.  For our ten-meter diameter 656 nm symmetrical heterodyning
    telescope system, we can estimate the minimum detectable signal flux
    density by calculating the flux required to reduce the CNR to 0 dB.

        We have already shown (Table 2, Line 12, Page 22), that a flux
    intensity of 2.04 X 10-^17 W/m^2 will produce a CNR = 34 dB re 1 Hz.
    Therefore, in a 100 kHz bandwidth, the CNR will be -16 dB.  To increase
    the CNR to 0 dB means that the intensity must be increased by 16 dB to
    8.12 X 10^-16 W/m^2.  Thus, the minimum detectable signal flux for
    this bandwidth and sampling rate is 8.1 X 10^-16 W/m^2.  This is
    equivalent to saying that during the 10 microsecond sampling time, if
    an ETI signal is present on one pixel, we would have a reasonable
    probability of detecting one photon (Equ. 36).  This signal flux would
    be produced by a ten meter diameter transmitter at a range of ten light

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 35

    years, with a power of 16 dB re 1 kW, i.e., 40 kW.  This is a trivial
    amount of power for an ETI.

        On the basis that the author thinks that ETI transmitter powers
    will be in excess of 100 MW and perhaps even substantially in excess of
    1 GW, we could decide to lower the detection sensitivity and go for a
    faster sampling rate, thus speeding up the search.  For the purposes of
    this analysis we will stick to the 100 kHz pixel sampling rate.  As
    previously stated, we will assume that we are doing our single star
    signal processing in real time, with 100 kHz minimum bin bandwidths.
    This means that the entire array would take 0.164 s to scan.  If we
    assume no scan dead time, then to scan the entire visible band between
    350 nm and 700 nm at a sensitivity level of about -150 dBW/m^2
    (10^-15 W/m^2), would take about two hours (Equ. 21, Page 82).  An All
    Sky Survey of this type would take at least 136 million years!  If a
    survey of this type could have been started when the dinosaurs roamed
    Earth, we would be just about reaching the end of the first scan!
    (Don't anyone accuse the author of lacking a sense of humor.)

        On the other hand, for a sensitivity of -150 dBW/m^2, a Targeted
    Search scan of a single star over the 280 GHz effective bandwidth of
    the 656 nm Fraunhofer line (Table 4, Page 30) with a 10 GHz MCSA, with
    on-line data storage, and a 10 microsecond pixel sampling time, would
    take 4.6 seconds.  This is a very reasonable time, so that a slower
    scan at selected laser and Fraunhofer lines could be performed to
    reduce the minimum detectable flux levels.


                             PROFESSIONAL CO2 SETI

        Just as this paper was being completed, the author received a copy
    of Albert Betz's (University of California, Space Sciences Laboratory,
    Berkeley, CA 94720) latest paper on Optical CO2 SETI. [57]  For the
    sake of completeness, because there is currently so little Optical SETI
    literature available, and because Betz's paper is a very up-to-date
    account of the only observational Optical SETI work presently being
    done in the United States, a short description is now given.  The work
    of Townes and Betz is supported by a NASA grant NAGW-681.  As mentioned
    on Page 5, this low-profile SETI work is being done on Mount Wilson, and
    is piggy-backed onto a much larger NASA program to investigate astro-
    physical phenomena at the galactic center, e.g., a possible black hole.

        To start with, here now is a complete quote of the abstract from
    Dr. Betz's paper, which was presented in August of 1991 at the Santa
    Cruz, California USA-USSR SETI Meeting:

        "In an effort complementary to NASA's search for microwave signals
    from an extraterrestrial intelligence, we are searching for possible
    laser signals of a similar origin.  We are surveying approximately 300
    nearby stars in a multi-year effort to detect narrowband laser signals
    in the 10 um wavelength region.  For this directed search, we are using
    an available 1.7 m telescope and a heterodyne receiver tuned to
    discrete CO2 laser frequencies between 26-30 THz.  The bandwidth of the
    heterodyne allows us to analyze a Doppler velocity range up to

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 36

    +/-60 km/s around selected laser lines, and thus accommodate the
    velocity dispersions of hypothesized laser sources orbiting nearby
    stars.  The resolution of the spectrometer is currently 2.4 MHz
    (24 m/s), with 10^3 spectral channels available.  Although this
    resolution is somewhat coarse, any indication of a signal could be
    subsequently analyzed at much higher resolution with the type of signal
    processor (MCSA) now being developed for the microwave survey."

        Betz uses a slightly different transmission throughput
    relationship to that employed by this author (Pages 77-78).  For his
    parameters: Pt = 1 kW, D = 10 m, R = 10 L.Y. (9.461 X 10^16 m), and
    Wl = 10.6 um (see Appendix A for parameter definitions):

                              Pr = 9.9 X 10^-18 W

        This figure for received power is about 2.1 dB greater than given
    in Table 2, Line 13 on Page 22 (6.1 X 10^-18 W).  The reason for the
    slight discrepancy is that Betz uses an approximation by omitting a
    PI^2/16 factor (see Equs. 13 and 14 on Pages 77 and 78 for more details).

        Earlier it was stated that the minimum beam divergence thought
    possible by Townes and others was about one second of arc.  However,
    this recent paper by Betz indicates a new, more optimistic limitation
    of about 0.1 second of arc.  This is only a factor of 7.25 greater than
    the 0.0138" diffraction limited beamwidth for the visible system (as
    shown in Table 2, Line 5 on Page 22, and on Page 73).  By assuming that
    the nearest stars to be targeted are around 50 parsecs (163 L.Y.) away,
    a beam divergence of 0.1 arcsecond is compatible with the expected
    zones of life.  Because of this increase in beam directivity, Betz gets
    an infrared SNR improvement over the 300-meter diameter Arecibo system
    of about 3 dB (a factor of 2).  Figure 4 on Page 28 shows that the
    microwave system has a CNR of 20 dB, while the infrared system has a
    CNR of 22 dB; a 2 dB difference in favor of the infrared system.  Thus,
    taking into account the slightly different assumptions made in this
    analysis, i.e., the transmission relationship, the microwave front-end
    temperature and quantum efficiency, the theoretical results for the CO2
    system in this paper are in very close agreement with that of Betz's
    paper.

        The Townes and Betz CO2 telescope is computer driven, with the
    ability to point blind to approximately one arcsecond, both during the
    day and night.  As indicated on Page 23, CO2 SETI is just as effective
    during the day as at night, since, whatever the limitations of the sky
    background, it is essentially constant over the 24 hour day.

        The reader should note that the 128 X 128 pixel array specified for
    the Professional Visible SETI system has a field of view of about
    2.1 X 2.1 arcsec (Figure 10, Page 81), and thus is semi-compatible with
    the pointing accuracy of Betz's system.  Note that a medium size
    visible wavelength telescope with a single incoherent photodetector
    system, may have to be steered and pointed during daylight hours with
    point blind accuracy better than 1 arcsec.  If the pixel size and FOV
    are increased to accommodate steering inaccuracies and atmospheric
    turbulence, the daylight background would increase and degrade the SNR.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 37

                     INCOHERENT OPTICAL SETI AT 10,600 nm

        In a later section, we will describe an incoherent Optical SETI
    receiver for visible and near-infrared wavelengths, with Amateur
    Optical SETI application.  For the sake of completeness, Figure 6 has
    been included here to demonstrate the relatively poor response of a
    small incoherent (photon-counting) CO2 receiving system.  This should
    be compared to Figure 8 (Page 44), given for the case of incoherent
    Optical SETI at visible wavelengths.  Identical signal flux levels and
    telescope apertures have been employed in both graphs.  These graphs
    have been located at the top of their respective pages to allow the
    pages to be flicked back and forth for easier comparison.

        In the incoherent CO2 system, where the signal-to-noise ratio (SNR)
    is quantum noise limited, the SNR it is greater than in the visible
    spectrum because "hf" is smaller.  However, where the SNR is background
    noise limited, the SNR is severely degraded.  For a high signal
    intensity of 10^-14 W/m^2, as produced by a transmitter at a distance
    of ten light years with an EIRP of about 10^21 W, the SNR for a 30 cm-
    diameter CO2 receiving telescope begins to degrade for optical band-
    widths greater than about 1 MHz.

        The infrared telescope's photodetector must be subject to
    considerable cooling, e.g., using liquid nitrogen, to avoid high dark-
    current, and it must be provided with a cold-shield to restrict its
    field-of-view (FOV) to background thermal radiation.  Note that the
    performance of an amateur CO2 system could well be much worse than
    shown in Figure 6, because CO2 transmitter gains and EIRPs are likely
    to be much less than available at visible wavelengths.  Unfortunately,
    high-Q optical filters centered on the CO2 wavelength are not available
    with wide tuning characteristics, although a small degree of tuning may
    be obtainable by tilting the filters.  Fixed optical filters with
    100 GHz bandwidths at 10,600 nm are available for several hundred
    dollars.  The cost of a extremely high-Q 10 GHz (0.035 percent
    bandwidth) interference filter may run into several thousand dollars.
    Even then, the thermal background detected is excessive, and the filter
    itself must be cooled.

        As has been pointed out repeatedly and demonstrated by Equ. 32
    (Page 88), the optical heterodyne receiver has the great advantage over
    its direct detection counterpart (Equ. 31), in that the effective
    optical bandwidth through which background radiation is received is
    determined by the small electrical I.F. bandwidth.  Also, because of
    the excessive dark-current characteristics of 10,600 nm photodetectors,
    there is considerable merit in using a local-oscillator laser to swamp
    out these noise sources, though coherent detection would not
    necessarily obviate the necessity to employ some cryogenic cooling.
    Thus, there is much truth in the observation that as far as ground-
    based CO2 SETI receivers are concerned, only coherent receivers are
    practical, such as the interferometer system presently being employed
    by Townes and Betz on Mount Wilson, and described on the previous two
    pages. [57]



    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 38

    Postdetection Normalized SNR, dB re 1 Hz
       |
       |
      80 | Ir = 10^-10 W/m^2             EIRP = 1.1 X 10^25 W
         |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
         |                                                       *
      60 | Ir = 10^-12 W/m^2             EIRP = 1.1 X 10^23 W         *
         |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
         |                                           *
      40 | Ir = 10^-14 W/m^2             EIRP = 1.1 X 10^21 W
         |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *                     *
         |                                *                     *
      20 | Ir = 10^-16 W/m^2                  *                     *
         |* * * * * * * * * * *                  *
         |                        *                  *
       0 |.Ir = 10^-18 W/m^2.........*...................*..............
         |* * * * * *                   *                   *
         |               *                  *                   *
     -20 | Ir = 10^-20 W/m^2 *                 *                    *
         |*                     *                 *
         |     *                   *                 *
     -40 |         *                  *                 *
         |            *                  *                 *
         |               *                  *                 *
     -60 |                  *                  *                 *
         |                     *                  *                 *
         |                        *                  *
     -80 |        Day & Night        *                  *
         |                              *                  *
         |                                 *                  *
    -100  --------------------------------------------------------------
       10^0      10^2      10^4      10^6      10^8      10^10  ^  10^12
                                                                |
                             Optical Bandwidth, Hz              |
                                                       100 GHz (37.5 nm)

    Figure 6 -

    Signal-to-noise ratio versus optical bandwidth for (perfect) photon-
    counting CO2 receivers.  Range = 10 light years, wavelength = 10,600 nm,
    diameter = 30 cm, antenna efficiency = 0.7, spectrometer efficiency =
    0.5, quantum efficiency = 0.5.  Dark current is assumed to be
    negligible, though in practice it will impact the above sensitivity
    curves at lower flux levels, even more than the sky background.


        Needless to say, the construction cost of a heterodyning CO2 SETI
    telescope/receiver is likely to be excessive for the amateur
    enthusiast.  For this reason, CO2 SETI is not being proposed for the
    amateur.  This activity is best left to NASA and the professional
    observer.




    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 39

                        ADAPTIVE TELESCOPE TECHNOLOGY

        Perhaps one of the most exciting developments in modern optical
    astronomy is the subject of adaptive telescope technology.  The author
    believes that this not only has profound implications for conventional
    optical astronomy but also for Optical SETI.  In particular, for what
    we call Symbiotic Optical SETI.  What follows is a description of the
    technique obtained from the tutorial introduction to reference 69.

        "Earth-based telescopic adaptive-optics systems need a reference
    (guide) star which is near objects of interest and bright enough to
    provide information on the wavefront distortion.  But natural guide
    stars for a usable portion of the visible spectrum are few and far
    between, allowing glimpses of just 0.003 percent of the night sky.
    Rather than cursing the darkness, astronomers and engineers are
    lighting some celestial candles of their own.

        To create the artificial guide stars, a laser is beamed into the
    sky, which answers back inflamed.  The laser energy creates Rayleigh
    backscattering in the stratosphere (10 - 40 km up) and resonance-
    fluorescence backscattering in the mesospheric sodium layer
    (80 - 100 km).  No radically new technology is required for the lasers,
    although the breadth of capabilities is large for a single laser.  For
    zenith viewing of a 20-cm atmospheric patch using the Rayleigh
    approach, the laser must put out 82 watts; for the sodium-
    backscattering approach the required exciting power is 14 watts.  At
    the sodium layer, which results from meteor ablation, the beam must be
    0.5 meter in diameter, with a pulse rate of 100-200 pps and 100
    millijoules per pulse.

        The laser guide-star concept was first put into practice by Chester
    Gardner and Laird Thompson, who in 1987 created, photographed, and
    measured their own glowing beacon, shot like some giant flare above the
    Mauna Kea Observatory in Hawaii. [69]

        The basic system requirement is that the distortion of the guide
    star must be measured and the adaptive mirror adjusted in the time it
    takes for a star to twinkle, or, depending on how you look at it, the
    time between twinkles.  This window of visibility known as twinkle time
    (also called scintillation coherence time) is open for a scant
    10 milliseconds."

        The requirements to produce a diffraction limited image over the
    entire focal image plane are rigorous.  It could be that the criteria
    for Optical SETI are rather less demanding.  The requirement here is
    for imaging the ETI signal onto a two-dimensional photodetector array,
    where the primary purpose (neglecting Planckian suppression needs) of
    the array is to detect ETI photons, not to produce a super high-quality
    extended image.  As described on Pages 10 and 83, it is shown how
    efficient detection of an ETI signal might be obtained with a simple
    passive technique, if ETIs cooperate by transmitting a signal
    accompanied by a pilot-tone beacon.  Such a technique automatically
    makes any telescope adaptive, without the need for deformable mirrors
    and laser guide stars.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 40

                        THE COLUMBUS TELESCOPE PROJECT

        As this paper was nearing completion, the author learned that a
    decision had been made to terminate Ohio State University's
    participation in The Columbus Project, the construction of a twin
    8-meter diameter interferometric telescope to be built on Mount Graham
    in southeastern Arizona.  The instrument, which is supposed to see
    "first light" in 1994, will have the light gathering power of a single
    11.3-meter (448-inch) mirror and the resolving power of a 22-meter
    (866-inch) telescope.

        The project was a joint venture between OSU, the University of
    Arizona, and Italy's Arcetri Astrophysical Observatory.  The reason
    given for OSU's pulling out of the project was a lack of privately
    donated funds.  Within these pages, this author has suggested the
    possibility of a future symbiotic relationship between Professional
    Optical Astronomy and Professional Optical SETI.  During the early part
    of this study, an idea was formulated that plans for The Columbus
    Telescope might be changed, so that both scientific activities could be
    undertaken at that site; Professional Optical Astronomy being done at
    night, and Professional Coherent Optical SETI mainly during the day.

        On Columbus Day, October 12, the Microwave Observing Project will
    commence its search of the sky.  As we in Columbus, Ohio, approach the
    quincentennial of Columbus' discovery of the Americas, what more
    fitting way could there be to celebrate the first encounter with the
    New World than if OSU's participation in The Columbus Project was
    resumed and the telescope's purpose modified to include the search for
    extraterrestrial intelligence.  The New World would be looking for
    other, perhaps older worlds, with more mature technical civilizations.

        OSU is already home to the "Big Ear" Radio Observatory, which under
    the guidance of Professor John D. Kraus (Director) and Dr. Robert Dixon
    (Assistant Director), has been undertaking conventional microwave
    SETI for many years.  On the same site in Delaware (a little north of
    Columbus), and close to "Big Ear", is the Perkins Optical Observatory.
    At the moment, the author is working on ideas to upgrade the Perkins
    Observatory for Semi-Professional Incoherent Optical SETI.  This
    observatory presently contains a 81-cm (32-inch) Cassegrain.


                            OPTICAL SETI RATIONALE

        SETI would not seem so mysterious to the average person if it was
    recognized that this is yet another communications problem, albeit
    complicated by the fact that we do not know where or when to look, the
    transmission frequency, the bandwidth, or the modulation format.  In
    many ways it is just another aspect to our manned and unmanned space
    program, but one that has received relatively little funding.  It took
    many years before SETI was recognized as a legitimate science and not
    pseudoscience.  The technology described here for Optical SETI is more
    than just a means of contacting emerging technical civilizations.  If
    intelligent life is not uncommon in the galaxy, and if electromagnetic
    waves are still the primary means of interstellar communications, the

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 41

    ability of optical relays to form a galactic network might obviate the
    necessity to use low-loss microwaves or the far-infrared in order to
    propagate across the entire galaxy in one go.  After all, it is very
    difficult to have a snappy conversation when communicating over one
    hundred thousand light years!

        Earlier, we showed that our "perfect" 10-meter diameter symmetrical
    656 nm heterodyning system was capable of yielding over a range of
    10 light years, a CNR of about 34 dB re 1 kW re 1 Hz, for a diffraction
    limited EIRP of 2.3 X 10^18 W (see Table 2 and Figure 4).  Since a
    solar-type star has an EIRP of 3.9 X 10^26 W, we pose the question:
    What is the communication capability of such a communications link when
    the mean EIRP of a large transmitter array is 2.5 times that of the
    star, i.e., when the mean EIRP is about 10^27 W?  This condition
    corresponds to the transmitter appearing as a 1st magnitude object; a
    situation which would produce a noticeable (2.5 times) brightening of
    the ETI's star.  Since the ratio of EIRPs {10^27/(2.3 X 10^18)} is
    4.4 X 10^8, the CNR will be improved by 86 dB, resulting in a CNR of
    about 120 dB re 1 Hz, and a photon detection rate of about 10^12 s^-1
    (Equ. 36).  If the bandwidth is increased to 10 GHz, the CNR falls to
    about 20 dB.  Thus, this just naked-eye noticeable transmitter would be
    just about capable of sending a 10 Gbit/s data stream across 10 light
    years with low bit-error-rate {BER} (Equ. 37).  This would allow a
    hypothetical Encyclopedia Galactica to be uploaded or downloaded rather
    efficiently!

        This might give new meaning to Arthur C. Clarke's "Extra-
    Terrestrial Relays", which in the October, 1945 issue of WIRELESS WORLD
    described the basic idea for the present terrene geostationary (the
    Clarke Belt) satellite system. [67]  Clarke had originally given his
    article the title "The Future of World Communications".  Perhaps this
    paper should be titled "The Future of Interstellar Communications"?

        In many ways, Arthur C. Clarke and "Extra-Terrestrial Relays" has
    done more to shape what we now call the "Global Village" than any
    other single factor on our planet.  Indeed, the spreading of the ideas
    of democracy, and freedom, and the breakup of the Soviet Empire have
    more to do with former Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev, Russian
    President Boris Yeltsin, and author Clarke than any other factor.  The
    latter is perhaps the unsung hero here.  The failure of the August, 1991
    Soviet Coup was facilitated by the ease with which it is now possible
    to communicate.  Those readers who own TVROs (TeleVision Receive Only)
    satellite receivers will especially appreciate the power of this
    technology.  We can be sure that the reception, demodulation, and
    decoding of the first ETI signal - be it microwave, millimeter-wave, or
    optical - will have an immense effect upon our civilization.  Just the
    act of detecting a carrier signal will forever change our view of the
    Universe and humanity.

        The following section deals with the amateur approach to Optical
    SETI, showing how an amateur observatory can be constructed.  This is
    based on the more controversial assumption that optical ETI signals may
    be present in the visible spectrum, and of sufficient intensity, to
    yield detectable signals with relatively small receiving telescopes.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6D - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part D - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

                         ASA MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION

        The Electronic Journal of the Astronomical Society of the Atlantic
    (EJASA) is published monthly by the Astronomical Society of the
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        ASA Officers and Council -

        President - Don Barry
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        Board of Advisors - Bill Bagnuolo, Jim Bitsko, Eric Greene
        Council - Jim Bitsko, Bill Black, Mike Burkhead, Bill Crane,
                  Toni Douglas, Ruth Greene, Larry Klaes, Tano Scigliano,
                  John Stauter, Gary Thompson, Bob Vickers


        ARTICLE SUBMISSIONS -

        Article submissions to the EJASA on astronomy and space exploration
    are most welcome.  Please send your on-line articles in ASCII format to
    Larry Klaes, EJASA Editor, at the following net addresses or the above
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        When sending your article submissions, please be certain to include
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        DISCLAIMER -

        Submissions are welcome for consideration.  Articles submitted,
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    Copying or reprinting of the EJASA, in part or in whole, is encouraged,
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
    boards, but only in an unmodified form and in its entirety, with the
    following copyright notice attached.  No license is given to reproduce
    this document in electronic or hardcopy form for profit.  However, the
    media may reproduce short extracts for the purposes of furthering the
    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                    Copyright (c) 1992            *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                      /          \             *
 * 545 Northview Drive                        ---   hf >> kT   ---         *
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 * United States                                                           *
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 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

   U.K. inquires may be made to the above U.S. address or:
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
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Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                         January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6D

                            Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                        IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART D

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 42

                            AMATEUR OPTICAL SETI

        Working on the assumption that highly advanced ETI technology could
    appear to late Twentieth Century humanity like "magic", it is imagined
    that ETIs will be using much larger transmitting telescopes or arrays
    and transmitter powers far greater than 1 kW. [56]  In practice, the
    signal is likely to be pulsed, and, depending on the duty cycle, even
    less detectable by normal integrating detectors, i.e., the unaided
    eye, photographic plates, or standard CCDs.  Optical SETI is a branch
    of science to which the enthusiastic amateur astronomer may be able to
    make a useful contribution.  In so doing, this may increase public
    and scientific interest in all forms of SETI so that this field of
    scientific endeavor will at last get the financial support and effort
    it richly deserves.


                             Optional                     I
                            Intensifier         ----------<---------
                  --          ------           |
     Signal Pr   |  |        |      |          |
    -----------> |  | -----> |      | -----> -----   PIN Photodetector,
    -----------> |  | -----> |      | -----> /   \ APD or Photomultiplier
    -----------> |  | -----> |      | -----> -----
     Background  |  |        |      |          |        -----
         Pb       --          ------           |       |     |
             Narrow-Band                        --->---|     |----->
       Optical Bandpass Filter                         |     |
        (or Monochromator) Bo                           -----
                                             Low-Pass Electrical Filter
                                                          Be

    Figure 7 -

    Incoherent (direct) detection optical receiver.  The image or photon
    intensifier is only required if a zero-gain PIN photodetector is
    employed.  The narrow-band optical filter (Bo < 0.1 nm) is ideally
    a tunable device like a scanning grating monochromator.  The photo-
    detector current I is proportional to the received signal Pr.


        Figure 7 is a basic schematic of an incoherent photon-counting
    receiver for an Amateur Optical SETI Observatory.  The high cost and
    technical difficulties of optical heterodyne detection in the visible
    and near-infrared spectrum means that the amateur's receiver will most
    likely have to use photon-counting, a little cooling, and a mono-
    chromator.  Unlike coherent receivers, incoherent receivers do not
    have the ability to reject Planckian starlight and daylight background
    noise if the signal is weak.

        Figure 8 results use slightly more conservative assumptions than
    employed to derive Table 2 (Equ. 15, Page 78).  It is assumed that the
    amateur telescope has a diameter of thirty centimeters (twelve inches),
    uses a low-resolution scanning grating monochromator bandwidth of
    100 GHz (0.143 nm) at 656 nm, and employs a receiver consisting of a

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 43

    single perfect photon-counter.  For a received flux density of
    10^-12 W/m^2, the SNR is about 39 dB re 1 Hz (Equ. 31, Page 87).  In
    the region of the graph where the SNR is reduced due to Planckian
    starlight, daylight background further reduces the SNR by a few dB.

        In the Microwave Cosmic Haystack, the flux densities of interest
    lie in the range of 10^-27 to 10^-20 W/m^2.  It is suggested that the
    corresponding flux levels in the Optical Cosmic Haystack would be in
    the range of 10^-20 to 10^-10 W/m^2.  As indicated in Figure 8, an
    EIRP = 10^23 W at a range of ten light years produces a received signal
    intensity Ir = 10^-12 W/m^2, with an apparent visual magnitude of
    eleven.  This would not be visible to the unaided eye even if it was
    not completely outshone by the second magnitude star.

        This 39 dB Signal-To-Noise Ratio represents an SNR penalty
    compared to the performance of a 10-meter heterodyning array receiving
    telescope of about 34 dB.  This 34 dB SNR penalty figure should not be
    confused with the 34 dB CNR that was established in Table 2 (Page 22)
    for a 1 kW transmitter.  Starlight and daylight sky backgrounds only
    slightly affect the SNR for this range, intensity, and optical
    bandwidth.  The effect of the 10 to 20 dB Fraunhofer Planckian
    suppression factor has not been included in the graph of Figure 8;
    allowance for which would improve the night sky performance for weaker
    signals and/or larger optical bandwidths.

        If a powerful ETI signal is detected, given an adequate SNR, it
    might even be possible for an amateur observer to demodulate a signal
    of moderate bandwidth, not just detect the presence of an excess
    number of photons arriving in a given time!  A photodetector bandwidth
    of about 1 MHz would probably be desirable, and well as a spectrum
    analyzer covering a similar frequency range.

        As can be seen from Figure 8, the SNR is degraded by Planckian
    starlight at low signal intensities and larger optical bandwidths.  In
    this regime, if the signal flux drops by 20 dB, the SNR falls by 40 dB
    because the receiver is no longer signal quantum noise limited.
    Clearly, if ETIs want their signals to be detected by relatively small
    incoherent receivers, it pays to use pulses with low duty-cycle in
    preference to C.W. signals.  High peak EIRPs can override all external
    and internal noise sources and thus make their signals as detectable
    as possible for a given mean EIRP.

        In Table 2 we showed that the 1 kW signal at a range of ten light
    years produces a received intensity of 2.04 X 10^-17 W/m^2.  If this
    was received by a one-meter diameter incoherent adaptive ground-based
    telescope, the normalized SNR in a 100 GHz (0.143 nm) optical bandwidth
    (not allowing for Planckian dark line continuum suppression) would be
    about -42 dB re 1 Hz.  In this situation it would indeed help to
    operate the transmitter within a Fraunhofer line.  The SNR would be
    increased to -32 dB re 1 Hz for a 10 dB Fraunhofer line contrast
    factor.  Either way, the presence of the signal would not be detectable
    without considerable integration.  However, if the ETI transmitter mean
    power was increased to 1 GW, leading to a received intensity of
    2.04 X 10^-11 W/m^2, the SNR would increase dramatically to about

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 44

    Postdetection Normalized SNR, dB re 1 Hz
       |
       |
      80 |
         |
         | Ir = 10^-10 W/m^2       EIRP = 1.1 X 10^25 W (6th Magnitude)
      60 |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
         |
         | Ir = 10^-12 W/m^2       EIRP = 1.1 X 10^23 W (11th Magnitude)
      40 |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
         |                                                           *
         | Ir = 10^-14 W/m^2       EIRP = 1.1 X 10^21 W (16th Magnitude)
      20 |* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
         |                                               *
         | Ir = 10^-16 W/m^2                                  *
       0 |.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*.*....................*.....
         |                                       *                    *
         | Ir = 10^-18 W/m^2                         *
     -20 |* * * * * * * * * * * * *                      *
         |                            *                      *
         | Ir = 10^-20 W/m^2              *                      *
     -40 |* * * * * * *                       *                      *
         |                *                       *
         |                    *                       *
     -60 |                        *                       *
         |                            *                       *
         |                                *                       *
     -80 |         Night Sky                  *                       *
         |                                        *
         |                                            *
    -100  --------------------------------------------------------------
       10^0      10^2      10^4      10^6      10^8      10^10  ^  10^12
                                                                |
                             Optical Bandwidth, Hz              |
                                                      100 GHz (0.143 nm)

    Figure 8 -

    Signal-to-noise ratio versus optical bandwidth for (perfect) Photon-
    counting 656 nm receivers.  Range = 10 light years, diameter = 30 cm,
    antenna efficiency = 0.7, spectrometer efficiency = 0.5, quantum
    efficiency = 0.5, excess avalanche gain noise factor = 0, dark
    current = 0.  EIRP of a solar-type star = 3.9 X 10^26 W.  A
    diffraction limited 10-meter diameter 1 GW transmitter produces an
    EIRP = 2.3 X 10^24 W, and appears to be 0.6 percent of the brightness
    of a second magnitude solar-type star.


    63 dB re 1 Hz; essentially independent of Planckian background.  This
    signal would stick out like a proverbial sore thumb.  In the case of
    Professional Heterodyning Optical SETI, we were dealing with stronger
    detected signals and a local-oscillator produced shot noise floor.
    Because we are dealing here with smaller, incoherent receivers that use
    an avalanche photodetector, the precise analysis for the CNR or BER is

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 45

    extremely complex when the received signal power is very small and/or
    larger post-detection bandwidths are employed.  The reader is
    cautioned, that the above results may be somewhat optimistic.

        Figure 8 forces us to consider whether such easily detectable
    signals could have been missed by professional optical astronomers?
    Perhaps, because there are so many stars and frequencies to search,
    and with the limitations of conventional spectrographic equipment, we
    can hope that these signals have been missed or overlooked.  Again, if
    the signals have low duty-cycle, the mean signal powers detected by
    integrating detectors would be considerably less.

        Scanning grating monochromators/spectrometers are available with
    ten times the resolution previously quoted, i.e., 10 GHz (0.0143 nm)
    optical bandwidths.  High-Q Fabry-Perot spectrometers with bandwidths
    as small as 1 MHz are perhaps less useful here because of their free-
    spectral range and multiple response characteristics, requiring
    additional broadband filtering.  However, the tandem combination of a
    scanning grating monochromator and a Fabry-Perot would form a very
    powerful optical filtering and spectral analysis system, comparable in
    many respects to what could be achieved with a heterodyne system.

        For the thirty-centimeter diameter telescope system, ETI signal
    detectability will not be substantially degraded for peak signal
    strengths higher than about 10^-14 W/m^2 (sixteenth magnitude) if the
    spectral resolution < 0.01 nm.  If the EIRP was about 10^25 W, the
    received signal flux would be at the threshold of unaided eye
    visibility of about 10^-10 W/m^2, and yield an SNR of 60 dB re 1 Hz.
    This would give an SNR = 30 dB in a 1 kHz post-detection bandwidth, or
    a just detectable 0 dB in a 1 MHz bandwidth.

        It would appear that as long as we can construct efficient photon-
    counting receivers, that the sensitivity of small incoherent receiving
    telescopes will not be unduly affected by the relatively large optical
    bandwidths of such receivers, though their sensitivity will be degraded
    if operated in daylight.

        There was no particular reason in choosing the 656.2808 nm
    (457.1214 THz) H_alpha line for the purposes of modelling the visible
    system.  While it could be considered a "magic wavelength", it does
    not coincide with a known laser transition.  It has an effective band-
    width of about 280 GHz, though its half-power bandwidth is somewhat
    smaller (Table 4, Page 30).  A less expensive way of undertaking
    Amateur Optical SETI observations at this single wavelength, instead of
    using the more flexible scanning grating monochromator, would be to
    employ a standard narrow-band H_alpha solar filter.  To further reduce
    costs, a photomultiplier could be used in place of the state-of-the-art
    cooled avalanche (geiger-mode) photodetector.

        It may be possible for amateur astronomy groups to "steal a march"
    on NASA as far as the low-sensitivity search for ETI in the visible
    and near-infrared spectrum is concerned.  For Amateur Optical SETI
    to be a sensible pursuit for the astronomical and space enthusiast
    requires the belief that ETI technology would appear to emerging

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 46

    technical civilizations comparable to ourselves to be like "magic".
    The demands placed on assumed ETI technical prowess are even greater
    than when considering the practicality of Professional Optical SETI.
    The onus would be on ETIs to make their signals easily detectable.

        Since peak EIRPs > 10^23 W are thought possible, which lead to peak
    intensities at a range of ten light years greater than 10^-12 W/m^2
    (eleventh magnitude), the detectability of such signals with amateur
    equipment is imaginable.  Telescopes with apertures greater than about
    one meter diameter are only slightly affected by daylight when observing
    nearby stars, indicating that Daylight Professional/Semi-Professional
    Optical SETI may be feasible for larger telescopes with incoherent
    receivers.  It should be realized that even during the day, the sky is
    essentially black when viewed with artificial narrow bandwidth eyes!

        It is not yet clear whether the 81-cm (32-inch) Perkins Telescope
    in Delaware, could be upgraded with a precision-drive system that would
    allow for satisfactory image-tracking during the night and day.  Image-
    tracking difficulties at night might be mitigated by using a photon-
    counting array or image intensifier (or microchannel plate) instead of
    a single photodetector.  There are also some concerns, regarding the
    effects on conventional astronomical nighttime observations, of thermal
    currents caused by the observatory dome being open during the day.

        Because optical bandwidths of these incoherent Amateur Optical SETI
    receivers will be much wider than the effective optical bandwidths in
    coherent Professional Optical SETI receivers, there is no concern for
    anticipating or removing local line-of-sight Doppler chirps (drifts).
    These chirps can be as high as 50 kHz/s (Table 2 and Equ. 40).  Such
    drifts are insignificant for optical bandwidths of the order of 100 GHz
    in any reasonable amount of observation (dwell) time.  Allowance should
    be made for Doppler shifts of the ETI transmitter and Fraunhofer lines
    when making a detailed search of specific frequencies, since these
    shifts can be comparable to the width of a Fraunhofer line (Table 2
    and Equ. 39).  For specific laser frequencies not coinciding with
    Fraunhofer lines, this requires knowledge of our line-of-sight velocity
    relative to the star being observed.  However, for transmissions and
    observations within Fraunhofer lines, the receiver could simply be
    tuned for minimum Planckian starlight noise.  As before, it is assumed
    that ETIs will remove their local line-of-sight transmitter Doppler
    shift (and chirp) with respect to their star.

        It should be noted for the record that thermoelectrically-cooled
    CCD (Charged Coupled Device) cameras are now available to the amateur
    which allow the sixteenth magnitude to be reached in under one minute
    of integration, with negligible threshold effects.  Even the fastest
    photographic film has such low quantum efficiency that only a few
    percent of the photons are converted to exposed film grains.  The dark
    current count for the photon-counter should ideally be kept below about
    five hundred counts per second if the SNR of a potential ETI signal is
    not to be excessively degraded.  It may be reasonable to suggest that
    eliciting the help of thousands of enthusiastic amateur optical
    astronomers might considerably aid the low-sensitivity Targeted Search
    of the entire Northern and Southern Hemisphere skies.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 47

            HOW TO BUILD YOUR OWN AMATEUR OPTICAL SETI OBSERVATORY

        How easy and cheap will it be for amateur astronomy organizations
    to combine the efforts and resources of their members to participate in
    this activity?  The answer to this is that there is no hard figure.  It
    depends very much on how sophisticated and sensitive one is prepared to
    be.  There will always be tradeoffs between sensitivity and cost.
    Figure 9 shows a basic Amateur Optical SETI system based on the use of
    twenty-centimeter (eight-inch) or larger telescopes.  While smaller
    telescopes (reflectors or refractors) may be used, the potential
    detectability of ETI signals will be degraded.

        However much the reader may be excited by the statements made
    herein, the reality of the situation is that SETI, be it conducted in
    the microwave or optical spectrums, can become a rather monotonous
    endeavor.  It is an activity well-suited for automation.  Hence, the
    system to be described makes extensive use of computer-driven hardware.
    The same computer can be used to analyze the spectral (optical and
    electrical) data obtained with various signal processing algorithms to
    see if there is a weak ETI signal hidden within the noise.

        Particularly for an optical receiver with a wide tuning range,
    i.e., one that uses a grating monochromator, the mass of the
    additional equipment required to be attached would be excessive for a
    small telescope.  Hence, the preferred way to couple the SETI receiver
    to the telescope would be via several meters of a single strand of
    low-loss multimode optical fiber.  The output face of the fiber-optic
    umbilical replaces the slit normally found in a monochromator/
    spectrograph.  This approach is additionally useful if cryogenic
    cooling techniques have to be employed at the optical front-end.

        The optical fiber is positioned to be centrally placed in the focal
    plane and the fiber input arranged by suitable imaging, i.e., SELFOC
    lens (GRIN rod), to match to the telescope's diffraction limited spot
    size (Airy disk).  In practice, if daylight SETI is not attempted, the
    optical fiber's aperture and FOV may be increased to accommodate image
    wander caused by typical atmospheric turbulence conditions.  The
    diagram shows a beamsplitter sharing the image with the CCD, though the
    CCD might make use of off-axis guiding to avoid light loss, i.e., for
    locking onto a guide star.  The graded-index lens also serves to
    convert the focal ratio of the telescope to one that matches the fiber
    for maximum throughput, this operation being equivalent to matching
    numerical apertures.  Some mode scrambling may be required to ensure
    that the output numerical aperture (N.A.) of the fiber is fully
    illuminated at all times, whatever the light launching conditions.
    This ensures that amplitude fluctuations do not occur in the slitless
    monochromator or spectrometer as the image of the star and transmitter
    dances around the entrance (input end) of the fiber.

        Multimode optical fiber essentially depolarizes light, so that any
    polarization analysis equipment must be situated at the input, focal
    plane end of the fiber.  There will be an inherent throughput loss of
    about fifty percent in the monochromator because high resolution
    diffraction gratings have a tendency to polarize light.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 48

     --------------------   Beamsplitter/Off-Axis Guiding CCD Imaging/
    |      8" - 14"      |-- _  Tracking Camera------------->--------------
    |                    |  |_|->-                                         |
    | Schmidt-Cassegrain |--      | Optional Polarizing Optics & Multimode |
     --------------------         | Fiber-Optic Umbilical in Focal Plane   |
                  |  |            |                                        |
                  |  |            |    -----------------     -----         |
               ---------          |   |     Scanning    |   | APD |        |
              |  Drive  |<>-       ->>|     Grating     |->-| or  |->-     |
               ---------    |         |  Monochromator  |   | PM  |   |    |
                            |          -----------------     -----    |    |
                            |                 ^                       |    |
                            |                 |                     -----  |
                            |                 |                    | Amp | |
                            |                 |                    |     | |
                            |                 |                     -----  |
                            |                 |                       |    |
       -----------          |                 |    -------------      |    |
      |           |         |                 |   |   Optional  |     |    |
      |    VDT    |         |                 |   |   Spectrum  |<----|    |
      |           |         |                 |   |   Analyzer  |     |    |
       -----------          |                 |    -------------      |    |
          |   |             | RS-232/IEEE-488 |                       |    |
      ------------- <>------------<>----------    Baseband Signal     |    |
     |     PC      |<-------------<----------------------<------------|    |
      ------------- <-----                            -------         |    |
        Optional          | CCD Video                |  Low  |        |    |
      FFT Spectrum        |                Audio <---|  Pass |<-------|    |
      Analyzer Card       |                          | Filter|        |    |
                          |                           -------         |    |
                          |          -----------                      |    |
                          |         |   Video   |<--------------------     |
                          |         |  Monitor  |<-------------------------|
                          |         |   Or TV   | CCD Video                |
                          |          -----------                           |
                          |                                                |
                           ------------------------------------------------

    Figure 9 -

    Basic Amateur Optical SETI or Poor Man's Optical SETI.  Only a single
    photodetector is used, which can be either an avalanche photodiode
    (APD) or a photomultiplier (PM).  The optical filter can be a computer-
    controlled scanning monochromator or a relatively inexpensive fixed
    interference filter.  Additional focal-plane optical fibers and photo-
    detectors may be employed for maintaining star-lock.  An electronic
    mixer and filter may be included between the photon-counting receiver
    and the display/audio devices to beat down the detected spectrum to
    lower frequencies.  This electrical local-oscillator would likely be
    driven by the PC.  The TV (video) monitor can be used both to display
    the star field via the CCD imaging/tracking camera and the detected
    signal, or these could be displayed on the PC.  Later, several
    telescopes could be slaved together to increase light gathering power,
    sensitivity, and SNR of a would-be ETI signal.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 49

        The output of the fiber is expanded and collimated in the usual way.
    However, if a single photodetector is employed, as indicated in
    Figure 9, some form of cylindrical output lens will be required to
    match the aspect ratio of the beam from the diffraction grating(s) to
    the photodetector.  For this reason, some investigators may prefer to
    use a photomultiplier with a large cathode to collect all the photons.

        As this document was nearing completion, the author's attention was
    drawn to a recent report by Douglas et al [93] on an astronomical
    heterodyned spectrometer.  The title of the report is somewhat
    misleading as this author feels that the word "homodyned" would have
    been more applicable.  Unless fringes actually move across a photo-
    detector at an interference beat rate, a system cannot be said to
    really employ heterodyne techniques.  However, the report does describe
    a high resolution spectrometer using a fiber-optic umbilical, and in
    that respect is relevant to the discussion here.

        In Figure 9, the purpose of the conventional CCD is just to display
    the star field on a television (TV) or personal computer (PC) monitor
    and for precision star tracking.  In this preferred design, it does
    not detect the ETI signal; that job is performed by a relatively fast
    single solid-state Avalanche photodetector (APD) or photomultiplier
    (PM).  APDs have the advantage of high quantum efficiency but the
    disadvantage of higher dark current; the converse being the case for
    photomultipliers.  With state-of-the-art solid-state photodetectors
    like the RCA SPCM-100-PQ Single Photon-Counting Module, the cooling to
    reduce dark current noise is applied via Peltier (thermoelectric)
    coolers, and their mass is relatively insignificant.  Though the
    imaging CCD can itself be used as the ETI detector, this approach might
    compromise detection sensitivity and bandwidth.  It would also require
    a very high-quality and expensive CCD array.  This would be incompa-
    tible with the use of the device for star field imaging and fine
    guidance because of the narrow-band optical filtering requirements of
    the SETI receiver.  The input end of the fiber-optic umbilical might
    be dithered in the focal plane to aid guidance, and to ensure fine
    dynamic-tracking on a star's image.  Indeed, four additional optical
    fibers with unfiltered photodetectors might surround the ETI-detecting
    fiber and be used for this purpose.

        Note that the audio monitor in the schematic is for listening to
    the hiss of stellar noise and perhaps audibly detecting the presence of
    a strong artificial signal.  The Planckian background in a 100 GHz
    optical bandwidth for a 2nd Magnitude star, produces a photon-count
    rate of about 18,000 s^-1, which should be compared to the dark-current
    count rate for a high-quality cooled photodetector or photomultiplier
    of less than several hundred counts per second.  An essential component
    will be a variable threshold detector connected to an alarm system.
    The TV or PC monitor could also serve to display a noisy raster and the
    presence of any coherent signals.  It is unlikely though, that an ETI TV
    picture will pop up (in any TV standard), considering the deficiencies
    in SNR and bandwidth with amateur receivers!  However, if high SNR and
    bandwidth can be supported by ETI transmitters and terrene professional
    receivers over interstellar distances, a sequentially scanned TV [36]
    picture would be the most effective bridge between our two cultures.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 50

        Even as this is being written, substantial developments are being
    made in terrestrial video compression techniques for High Definition
    TeleVision (HDTV).  Compression ratios as high as 100:1 have been
    achieved with only a small reported impairment in perceived video
    quality. [87]  A 100:1 compression ratio would reduced bandwidth
    required by the digitized video signal by a factor of 100.  If it was
    applied to an ETI interstellar communication system, the effective CNR
    could be increased by 20 dB.  Of course, we cannot yet comment on
    whether ETIs would use such techniques, or what their level of
    sophistication is.  What we can say, however, is that optical communi-
    cations technology, along with video compression techniques, would make
    it much easier to transmit high-quality "real-time" video signals over
    thousands of light years.  What was previously thought possible with
    old-fashioned analog TV signals and a 1 GW transmitter over ten light
    years now becomes possible over one hundred light years.

        ETI signals may be linearly or circularly polarization-modulated,
    so that as previously mentioned, some means of analyzing the light would
    be required to detect the modulation.  This polarization analyzing
    system could include a polarizer and a Soleil-Babinet compensator or
    quarter/half-wave retardation plates.  The latter might be spun to
    cause sampling of all polarization states.  If the signals are
    frequency (or phase) modulated with relatively small deviations, then
    only the professional heterodyne receiver will be able to recover the
    modulation envelop, whatever the signal strength.


        Shopping List -

     1.  20-36 cm (8"-14") or larger Schmidt-Cassegrain with periodic error
         correction drive and RS-232 or IEEE-488 interface.

                 Low $2,000                          High $12,000

     2.  CCD imaging and tracking system with RS-232 or IEEE-488 interface.

                 Low $1,100                          High $3,200

     3.  Polarizaton analyzer.

                 Low $100                            High $2,000

     4.  Fiber-optic umbilical and connectors (ten meters).

                 Low $150                            High $150

     5.  Triple grating monochromator (resolution 0.1 to 0.01 nm) with
         RS-232 or IEEE-488 interface.

                 Low $1,000                          High $6,500

     6.  APD photon-counter or photomultiplier front-end.

                 Low $200                            High $3,000

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 51

     7.  Front-end cooling system.

                 Low $200                            High $1,000

     8.  PC with fixed (hard) disk and RS-232/IEEE-488 interfaces.

                 Low $1,000                          High $3,000

     9.  Spectrum analyzer PC card or stand-alone 0-10 MHz spectrum
         analyzer.

                 Low $1,000                          High $4,400

    10.  Video and audio monitors (PC may double-up for this purpose).

                 Low $200                            High $200

    11.  Miscellaneous

                 Low $1,000                          High $2,000

    12.  Labor - Free

           Total cost: Low $8,000; High $38,000


        Thus, the low-end cost is approximately $8,000; less if telescope
    and computer system are already available.  This is an affordable
    activity for many clubs and societies.  Some of the equipment above is
    optional and may be replaced by less sophisticated devices, e.g., the
    automatic scanning monochromator could be replaced by a manual
    monochromator or a series of discrete high-Q bandpass filters, such as
    a 656 nm H_alpha filter.  By omitting the electrical spectrum analyzer
    and using a fixed optical bandpass filter, instead of a scanning
    monochromator, the cost of a rudimentary system adaptation to an
    existing telescope would fall to about $3,000.  This figure will be
    affordable for some individual enthusiasts.

        Instead of a scanning grating monochromator, a scanning grating
    spectrometer might be used, where a linear CCD array is employed to
    produce an essentially instantaneous display of optical spectra (over a
    limited band) on a video display terminal (VDT).  However, this does
    not allow for the flexibility of employing a single photodetector
    optimized for bandwidth and photon-counting sensitivity, and thus this
    approach will be more expensive and/or less sensitive.  Often, mono-
    chromators use triple gratings in order to obtain spectral resolutions
    of 0.01 nm or better.  As previously mentioned, a set of four optical
    fibers surrounding the signal fiber and corresponding low-bandwidth
    photodetectors might be used in the system for fine guidance purposes.

        Within this account of Amateur Optical SETI is the ambitious
    desire to detect the modulation envelop.  Hopefully, the ETI signals
    will be intensity or polarization-modulated so that the modulation can
    be detected by an incoherent receiver.  For weak signals, we may only

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 52

    be able to detect the presence of an optical carrier or beacon (perhaps
    Signpost SETI) and then only after some signal integration.  However,
    this would be a significant achievement by itself, allowing for more
    powerful professional receivers to be built later for detecting the
    modulation envelope.

        As a spin-off from the MOP, electronic Multi-Channel Spectrum
    Analyzers (MCSAs) could be developed for the Amateur Optical SETI
    market, eventually making Amateur Optical SETI an even more affordable
    activity for optical astronomy clubs and societies.  Perhaps ETIs do
    not expect their signals to be detected until the targeted civili-
    zations make a collective, cooperative, and systematic search of their
    home skies!


              THE MICROWAVE AND OPTICAL OBSERVING PROJECT (MOOP)

        The following is the author's tentative list of objectives for the
    optical extension to MOP.  It is called the Microwave and Optical
    Observing Project, otherwise known by the acronym MOOP.

        Project Goal:  To continue the search for microwave (and millimeter
                       wave) signals of extraterrestrial intelligent origin
                       and to extend the search into the infrared and
                       visible spectrums.

        Project Objectives:

        1.  To use existing large ground-based optical telescopes to carry
            out a Targeted Search of about 800 nearby solar-type stars with
            spectral resolution of 1 kHz and sensitivity 10^-16 W/m^2.
            For selected laser wavelength bands corresponding to
            atmospheric windows in the visible and infrared wavelength
            range (350 nm to 12,000 nm).

        2.  To use existing large ground-based optical telescopes to carry
            out a Targeted Search of about one million nearby solar-type
            stars with spectral resolution of 100 kHz and sensitivity
            10^-10 W/m^2.  For selected laser wavelength bands corres-
            ponding to atmospheric windows in the visible and infrared
            wavelength range (350 nm to 12,000 nm).

        3.  To use dedicated groups of amateur astronomers and coordinate
            their activities to conduct with their ground-based optical
            telescopes a low-sensitivity Targeted Search of about 800
            nearby solar-type stars with spectral resolution < 1 nm, and
            sensitivity 10^-16 W/m^2.  For selected wavelength bands in the
            visible and near-infrared wavelength range (350 nm to 1,200 nm).

        Duration:  2001 - 2010

        Cost:  $20M for starters.  Assumes use of existing large ground-
               based professional telescopes and the cost of modifying the
               telescopes for adaptive reception and Optical SETI.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 53

 ==========================================================================
     Table 5  Nearest stars favored for MOP's 800 star Targeted Search

 ==========================================================================
  RGO        RH         DEC    Relative  Distance  Apparent   Spectral
 Number    H  M  S     D  M    Vel. km/s   L.Y.    Magnitude    Type
 --------------------------------------------------------------------------
 559A     14 36 11   -60 37.8    -22.2     4.39    -0.01     G2  eye, SB
 559B     14 36 11   -60 37.8     -0.0     4.39     1.33     K0  eye
 144       3 30 34    -9 37.6    +15.4    10.79     3.73     K2  eye
 820A     21  4 40    38 30.0    -64.3    11.01     5.22     K5  eye, AB
 820B     21  4 40    38 30.0    -63.5    11.01     6.03     K7  eye
 845      21 59 33   -56 59.6    -40.4    11.20     4.69     K4  eye
  71       1 41 45   -16 12.0    -16.2    11.77     3.50     G8  eye
 380      10  8 19    49 42.5    -26.0    14.68     6.59     K7
 166A      4 12 58    -7 43.8    -42.4    15.90     4.43     K1  eye
 702A     18  2 56     2 30.6     -7.2    16.72     4.03     K0  eye, UD
 702B     18  2 56     2 30.6    -10.0    16.72     6.00     K5  eye, SB
 663A     17 12 16   -26 31.8     -0.7    17.25     4.32     K0  eye
 663B     17 12 16   -26 31.9     -0.2    17.25     5.10     K1  eye
 570A     14 54 32   -21 11.5    +19.5    18.11     5.78     K5  eye
 664      17 13  9   -26 28.6     -1.3    18.31     6.34     K5
 783A     20  7 55   -36 13.7   -130.3    18.42     5.31     K3  eye
 764      19 32 28    69 34.6    +26.7    18.52     4.69     K0  eye
  34A      0 46  3    57 33.1     +9.4    18.94     3.44     G0  eye
 139       3 17 56   -43 15.6    +86.8    20.25     4.26     G5  eye
  66A      1 37 54   -56 26.9    +22.5    21.32     5.07     K0  eye
  66B      1 37 54   -56 26.9    +19.4    21.32     5.90     K0  eye
 566A     14 49  5    19 18.4     +3.9    22.03     4.54     G8  eye
 566B     14 49  5    19 18.4     +5.4    22.03     6.91     K5
 892      23 10 52    56 53.5    -17.8    22.18     5.57     K3  eye
  33       0 45 45     5  1.4    -12.6    22.62     5.75     K2  eye
 105A      2 33 20     6 39.0    +23.4    22.64     5.82     K3  eye, UD
 667A     17 15 33   -34 56.2     +1.2    23.29     5.91     K3  eye
 667B     17 15 33   -34 56.2     -0.0    23.29     7.20     K5
  17       0 17 29   -65 10.1     +8.8    23.44     4.23     G0  eye
  68       1 39 47    20  1.6    -33.7    24.32     5.24     K1  eye
 178       4 47  7     6 52.5    +24.3    24.70     3.19     F6  eye
 673      17 23 16     2 10.2    -28.3    24.70     7.53     K7
 666A     17 15 15   -46 35.1    +23.6    24.89     5.48     G8  eye
 713      18 21 58    72 42.7    +32.5    25.27     3.58     F7  eye, SB AB
 879      22 53 37   -31 49.8     +9.0    25.47     6.49     K5
 117       2 50  7   -12 58.3    +18.8    25.67     6.05     K0
  23A     11 15 31    31 48.6    -15.5    25.67     3.79     G0  eye, SB AB
 423B     11 15 31    31 48.6    -15.9    25.67     4.80     G0  eye, SB
 216B      5 42 21   -22 26.2    -10.1    26.50     6.15     K2
 216A      5 42 23   -22 27.8     -9.7    26.50     3.60     F6  eye
 502      13  9 32    28  7.9     +6.1    27.17     4.26     G0  eye
 785      20 12 10   -27 11.0    -54.2    27.17     5.73     K0  eye, SB
 506      13 15 47   -18  2.0     -8.5    27.39     4.74     G6  eye
 827      21 22 20   -65 35.6    -29.5    28.10     4.22     F6  eye
 231       6 11 44   -74 44.2    +34.9    28.35     5.08     G5  eye
  75       1 44  6    63 36.4     +1.8    28.59     5.63     K0  eye
 ==========================================================================

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 54

        Table 5 is an extract from the list (provided by the SETI
    Institute) of the closest stars that form the group of 800 stars which
    are subject to MOP's "Targeted Search". [40-45]  Presently, the list
    covers stars in the range of 4.39 to 81.5 light years from Earth, but
    is subject to review.

        UD  = White Dwarf                     559A = Alpha Centauri A
        EB  = Eclipsing Binary                144  = Epsilon Eridani
        AB  = Astrometric Binary               71  = Tau Ceti
        SB  = Spectral Binary
        eye = Visible to the unaided eye under good conditions (apparent
              visual magnitude less than 6.0 - about 224 stars).


        The Amateur Optical SETI system just described is quite capable of
    being upgraded in sensitivity by slaving "n" similar telescopes
    together, and combining the photons from the "n" optical fibers through
    a single monochromator and photon-counter.  In this way, ten telescopes
    of 25 cm (10") aperture would have approximately the same sensitivity
    as a single 81 cm (32") telescope, but in a more cost-effective manner.
    Of course, ten small telescopes would not have the same ability as a
    81 cm (32") telescope to reject the effects of daylight, should
    daylight Optical SETI be desired.  The approach could be adopted, as
    with the original Cyclops Study, to gradually increase the number of
    telescopes as the need arises and availability of funding, assuming
    that ETI signals are not detected soon after system activation.

        A large, single barrel, telescope could be constructed using
    several smaller mirrors, each with its own focus and optical fiber.  In
    this way, only one drive system would be required.  A much simpler
    construction is possible because we do not need to image a star field,
    just collect as many photons as possible from the region around a
    single star (light-bucket mode of operation).  This could be somewhat
    like the Multi-Telescope Telescope (MTT) that has been designed by
    Georgia State University's (GSU) Center for High Angular Resolution
    Astronomy (CHARA). [92]


              LIST OF PREVIOUS AND PRESENT OPTICAL SETI ACTIVITIES

        The following material has been extracted from a comprehensive list
    on all modern-day SETI activities so far, and was prepared in October
    of 1991 by Dr. Jill Tarter of the SETI Institute.

        Dr. Tarter lists sixty-three different SETI observing programs,
    starting with Project Ozma in 1960 at the Green Bank National Radio
    Observatory in West Virginia, to Harvard University's microwave search
    of Messier M31 and M33 from the Oak Ridge Observatory.  This list also
    includes the 1983-1984 Amateur Microwave SETI program organized by
    Dr. Kent Cullers, which used Silicon Valley Hams with their satellite
    TV dishes (TVROs).

        Of this list of sixty-three observing programs, only three were or
    are concerned with Optical SETI, and these optical programs are listed

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 55

    below.  Optical SETI observing programs currently amount to less than
    5 percent of all SETI programs to date.  In actuality, the ratio is
    nearer 3 percent because Shvartsman's two programs can be considered as
    one.  This supports the author's contention that Optical SETI has
    suffered benign neglect.


    Date:                         1973 - 1974
    Observer(s):                  Shvartsman et al. "MANIA"
    Site:                         Special Astrophysical Observatory
                                  (former Soviet Union)
    Instrument Size (m):          0.6
    Search Wavelength (nm):       550
    Frequency Resolution (Hz):    df = 100 kHz (dWl = 10^-7 nm)
    Objects:                      21 Peculiar Objects
    Reference:                    48
    Comments:                     Optical search for short pulses of length
                                  3 X 10^-7 to 300 seconds, and narrow
                                  laser lines.  Prototype for later system
                                  on 6 m telescope.

    Date:                         1978 to Present
    Observer(s):                  Shvartsman et al. "MANIA"
    Site:                         Special Astrophysical Observatory
                                  (former Soviet Union)
    Instrument Size (m):          6
    Search Wavelength (nm):       550
    Frequency Resolution (Hz):    df = 100 kHz (dWl = 10^-7 nm)
    Objects:                      93 Objects
    Flux Limits:                  < 3 X 10^-4 of the optical flux is
                                  variable in any object observed.
    Total Hours:                  250
    Reference:                    54 and 58
    Comments:                     Have searched 30 Radio Objects with
                                  Continuous Optical Spectra to date,
                                  looking for optical pulses from
                                  potential Kardashev type II or III
                                  civilizations.

    Date:                         1990 to Present
    Observer(s):                  Betz
    Site:                         Mt. Wilson
    Instrument Size (m):          1.65 m element of Townes IR
                                  Interferometer
    Search Wavelength (um):       10.6
    Frequency Resolution (Hz):    3.5 MHz (35 m/s)
    Objects:                      100 nearby solar-type stars
    Flux Limits:                  1 MW transmitter out to 20 psc
    Total Hours:                  Continuing
    Reference:                    57
    Comments:                     Search for IR beacons at CO2 laser
                                  frequency using narrowband acousto-
                                  optical spectrometer.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6E - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part E - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

                         ASA MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION

        The Electronic Journal of the Astronomical Society of the Atlantic
    (EJASA) is published monthly by the Astronomical Society of the
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        or telephone the Society Recording at [phone] to leave your
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        ASA Officers and Council -

        President - Don Barry
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        Council - Jim Bitsko, Bill Black, Mike Burkhead, Bill Crane,
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        ARTICLE SUBMISSIONS -

        Article submissions to the EJASA on astronomy and space exploration
    are most welcome.  Please send your on-line articles in ASCII format to
    Larry Klaes, EJASA Editor, at the following net addresses or the above
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        You may also use the above addresses for EJASA back issue requests,
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        When sending your article submissions, please be certain to include
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        DISCLAIMER -

        Submissions are welcome for consideration.  Articles submitted,
    unless otherwise stated, become the property of the Astronomical
    Society of the Atlantic, Inc.  Though the articles will not be used for
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    Copying or reprinting of the EJASA, in part or in whole, is encouraged,
    provided clear attribution is made to the Astronomical Society of the
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    expressed in the EJASA are those of the authors' and not necessarily
    those of the ASA.  This Journal is Copyright (c) 1992 by the
    Astronomical Society of the Atlantic, Inc.










    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
    boards, but only in an unmodified form and in its entirety, with the
    following copyright notice attached.  No license is given to reproduce
    this document in electronic or hardcopy form for profit.  However, the
    media may reproduce short extracts for the purposes of furthering the
    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                    Copyright (c) 1992            *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                      /          \             *
 * 545 Northview Drive                        ---   hf >> kT   ---         *
 * Columbus, Ohio 43209                           \__________/             *
 * United States                                                           *
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 * CompuServe: 72376,3545                                                  *
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

   U.K. inquires may be made to the above U.S. address or:
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                                               *
 * 43 Blenheim Avenue                                                      *
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Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                         January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6E

                            Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                        IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART E

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 56

                                  DISCUSSION

        The thirty-year-old rationale which would have us believe that the
    low frequency end of the microwave regime is the place to search for
    ETI signals is seriously suspect.  If the underlying assumption of
    present-day SETI lore that the best ETIs could do would be to send us
    very weak low bandwidth signals is swept away, then almost all the
    so-called problems that are usually advanced to dismiss the optical
    approach become insignificant.  This is even more so if the use of
    optical heterodyne reception is assumed.  The increased immunity of
    such systems to background noise means that the signal detectability
    constraints set by Planckian starlight are essentially removed.  In
    addition, with dechirping of the local-oscillator to remove local
    Doppler drift along the line-of-sight, problems from local Doppler
    drift are eliminated.

        Because of the very narrow field-of-view of a photodetector array,
    Doppler drift compensation can be made simultaneously to all pixels in
    the array to a very high degree.  The larger bandwidths mean that the
    effects of finite laser linewidths, Doppler shift, and residual drift
    are minimized, and the number of frequencies to search in the entire
    optical spectrum is in reality no more than in the microwave spectrum.

        Up to now, the SETI community has taken some comfort in the fact
    that the obvious explanation as to why we have not detected ETI signals
    is simply that they are too weak and that we need sophisticated
    hardware and signal processing algorithms to extract this information.
    An even simpler explanation for the lack of success so far is that
    there are strong signals but they are elsewhere in the electromagnetic
    spectrum.  Of course, Tipler [39] has an even more simpler explanation.

        It is the author's prediction that in years to come, it will be
    hard to understand how anyone in the late Twentieth Century, e.g.,
    people like Frank Tipler, could think it possible that humanity was all
    alone - that Earth is atypical in that we are the "first civilization".
    If anything, it is far more likely that the answer to "Where are they?"
    is that we live in a "Cosmic Zoo".  Tipler believes that ETI tech-
    nologies only slightly superior to our own, if they exist, would have
    produced self-replicating von Neumann machines (probes) that would have
    rapidly populated the galaxy.  Therefore, since we have not detected
    these machines or they have not contacted us, ETIs do not exist.

        The "Cosmic Zoo" rationale is probably the only viable alternative
    explanation as to why ETIs do not appear to have colonized the entire
    galaxy.  We could just as easily be a typical or atypical civilization,
    developing in a sector of the galaxy that is off limits for physical
    contact, i.e, the Prime Directive so much loved by STAR TREK fans.  As
    was stated in the Preface, if the author has any doubts about the
    efficacy of the Optical SETI, it surely has to do with the Kingsley
    Paradox of "why communicate when one can just as easily travel?".
    Nevertheless, the author is sufficiently convinced about the
    plausibility of this Optical SETI rationale to believe it worthwhile to
    construct his own Optical SETI Observatory and mount his own search.
    He intends to start this project as soon as possible.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 57

        The author has taken some pains to try and understand why he
    believes Tipler is wrong.  The author finds it very difficult to accept
    that only once in the ten billion year history of our galaxy has
    intelligent life arisen.  Secondly, since the dawn of the Space Age,
    i.e., since about 1957, he has thought that life was common throughout
    the galaxy, and as a STAR TREK and science fiction fan, he has believed
    that the future for humanity was in space.  Thus, the idea that there
    would be no one to meet out there is an anathema.

        It is the author's intuitive feeling, that soon we will learn
    that life appears relatively rapidly, given the right environmental
    conditions.  Life, rather than being the exception to the rule, is
    the inevitable consequence of the mixture of certain elements,
    temperatures, cosmic catastrophes, and time.  In the roughly fifteen
    billion year existence of the Universe, there will have been no
    shortage of the latter.  At the moment, we still have a very sketchy
    picture of how life arose on this planet - that possibly, lines of
    evolution were erased and new lines initiated several times during
    Earth's history, due to bombardment by meteors, planetoids, and comets.

        If ETIs are operating in the visible spectrum we should not expect
    to see flashing lights in the sky, for the power required to do this
    and outshine their stars is much greater than required to establish a
    decent communications channel.  Free space optical communications will
    be a mature technology for any spacefaring civilization.  It seems
    reasonable to assume that they will spinoff this technology for SETI
    transmitters should they wish to contact emerging technical
    civilizations.  The fact that optical magic frequencies are hard to
    identify at this time, save for 10,600 nm, is not an argument that such
    frequencies do not exist.

        Perhaps the only reasons for ETIs to build very large microwave
    arrays would be to eavesdrop on radio frequency leakage from primitive
    technical civilizations (like us), to beam microwave power, for astro-
    physical research, or to communicate with other galaxies.  Even this
    author has some problems in believing that the civilizations of
    extraterrestrials would be so altruistic and long-lived to attempt
    electromagnetic communications across the intergalactic voids.  The
    interstellar eavesdropping scenario is also problematic, as it is
    likely that a developing technical civilization only produces
    substantial radio frequency leakage for a short period in its history.
    In time, other technologies like fiber optics will replace high-power
    radio and TV transmitters, and military radar systems will be
    decommissioned.  For this reason, if we attempt eavesdropping with large
    radio frequency antennas ourselves, failure to detect such signals may
    not imply very much about the existence or lack thereof of ETIs.  Thus,
    if the MOP does not detect ETI in the next decade, we should not jump
    to the conclusion that we are alone in the Milky Way galaxy.

        On the other hand, some civilizations may be continually threatened
    by cosmic catastrophes in the form of bombardment by planetoids.  These
    races may have instigated powerful radar early warning systems for
    planetary defense purposes.  These comments are good examples of how
    difficult it is to predict the future.  Even Arthur C. Clarke and

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 58

    Stanley Kubrick appear to have been caught out by Pan Am going bankrupt
    before it had a chance to ply the heavens between Earth and the Moon
    (2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, to the strains of "The Blue Danube"), or that
    there would be no Soviet Union in 1992, let alone in 2001 or 2010!  We
    can only hope (and pray) that there will be a dynamic American Space
    Program in 2001.  We should not be too hard on Arthur Clarke, for
    without his idea concerning "Extra-Terrestrial Relays" (Page 41), when
    the word "Extraterrestrial" meant something completely different, the
    Soviet Union might still be in existence.  One notes in passing that
    the spaceship DISCOVERY, which was central to Arthur Clarke's 2001 and
    its sequel 2010, used microwave dishes for its communications link with
    Earth. [94-96]  Surely, the main (high-gain) link should have been a
    laser-based system, notwithstanding the bright Earth background, and the
    high solar background that might on occasion be viewed by the DISCOVERY
    looking back towards Earth!  A heterodyning telescope of several meters
    diameter on the DISCOVERY, and a similar system on or near Earth, could
    easily sustain a 1-10 Gbit/s data rate out to Jupiter and beyond.

        We cannot even be sure that ETIs would want their signals to be
    detected within an atmosphere or otherwise too easily.  These are
    prevalent assumptions among most SETI proponents.  There might be
    logical reasons for ETIs to think that only when a technical
    civilization begins to "emerge" from its planet would it be truly
    mature enough, and in a culturally receptive frame of mind, to receive
    signals from ETIs.  Thus, the recipients' atmosphere itself might be
    used as an automatic protective blanket to avoid cultural shock.  In a
    way, the electromagnetic search for ETI is one of the greatest hunts
    and detective stories ever.  Unfortunately, there are still so few
    clues.


                                  CONCLUSIONS

        The author feels that it is still an open question as to what are
    the optimum electromagnetic frequencies for interstellar communi-
    cations.  As he concluded in his talk last year to the SETI Institute:
    "The jury is still out as to whether ETIs are signalling with low-
    energy microwave photons, or with high-energy optical photons".  What
    the author will say is that he feels a strong case has been made in
    this paper for the SETI community and NASA to review their present
    attitude towards the optical approach.  This does not mean that the
    Microwave Observing Project (MOP) should be abandoned or severely
    modified, since clearly we need to do a exhaustive search in the
    microwave spectrum.  Some of the signal processing techniques developed
    for MOP will also be applicable to the optical search.

        In many ways the Cyclops Report may have become the cornerstone
    upon which much of present-day SETI lore rests.  While the report
    itself was a very comprehensive study of Microwave SETI, and of high
    technical quality, certain very conservative assumptions in that study
    lead this author to consider the report flawed.  Just like for NASA's
    studies of the efficacy and cost of Microwave PowerSat technology back
    in the 1970s, if we ask the wrong questions we are likely to get
    incorrect answers.  Attempting to lift all the material for PowerSats

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 59

    from the deep gravitational well of Earth is sure to make the
    technology uneconomic and damaging to the environment.  Sweep away the
    inherent anthropocentric Assumption of Ineptitude of present SETI lore
    and the problems associated with the optical approach disappear.

        There appear to be some indications of group-think within the SETI
    community, where it is easier to agree with the consensus than disagree.
    The U.S. Space Shuttle CHALLENGER tragedy of 1986 is a classic example
    of how group-think and the desire to conform can have immense ramifi-
    cations.  The issues may not be so acute here:  Nevertheless, they
    represent an impediment to the acceptance of new (or revisited) ideas.

        Planning for an extensive optical search should be started now, so
    that if by the year 2000 the results of the MOP are negative, we can
    immediately initiate Professional Optical SETI activities.  This would
    be a natural extension to MOP so that the program could eventually be
    renamed MOOP, the Microwave and Optical Observing Project.  In the
    meantime, amateur astronomers could be conducting a low-level
    (low-sensitivity) optical search, helping to establish some ground
    rules for a later high-sensitivity professional optical search.

        It is believed that Professional Optical SETI with large hetero-
    dyning telescopes is compatible with Professional Optical Astronomy
    in that they can share most of the hardware, yet be undertaken at
    different times so as not to interfere with each other's observations.
    There is theoretical and experimental evidence to suggest that the new
    adaptive telescope technology using Rayleigh or Sodium Resonance
    Fluorescence laser guide stars [69] can be made to work during daylight
    hours.  This clearly has important ramifications for the concept of
    Symbiotic (Serendip) Optical SETI.  The idea of modifying Earth's Great
    Optical Telescopes for Symbiotic (Serendip) Professional Optical SETI
    has many attractions; where the scientific endeavors of conventional
    and SETI astronomy could be of mutual benefit to each other.

        There is probably a case here for an automated retrospective
    historical study of stellar spectrographic plates to see if ETI signals
    actually exist and are on record.  It is quite possible that anomalous
    spectral lines will be found in the record, signifying laser trans-
    missions, but which had previously been overlooked, fogged the film,
    saturated the recording media, been mistaken for natural bright
    emission lines, or put down to "technical problems with the spectro-
    graphic equipment".  It would not be the first time that a major
    scientific discovery had been missed for lack of attention and
    curiosity.  There does appear to be some doubt as to whether C.W.
    ETI signals, if present, would have been accidently detected during
    conventional optical astronomy and recognized for what they were.  This
    is the crux of the matter as far as the efficacy of Amateur Optical
    SETI is concerned.

        It is left as an exercise for others to determine the probability
    of missing an ETI signal at any particular flux level.  It is the very
    concept that ETIs are supposed to be rare which makes it plausible to
    suggest that the historic accidental discovery of ETI by optical
    astronomers would be unlikely.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
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        Initially, to reduce the optical search time, we would concentrate
    on efficient laser transition frequencies presently known to humanity,
    and Fraunhofer dark lines.  It is suggested that we must keep an open
    mind here.  For thirty years we have been digging relatively deep
    trenches in a very small corner of our electromagnetic backyard.  Was
    it prudent to do this without at least turning over the topsoil in the
    rest of the electromagnetic garden, particularly in that part of the
    spectrum where solar output peaks, and which tells us and ETIs most
    about our Universe?

        The study also seems to indicate that the amateur SETI enthusiast
    could make a useful contribution to the search using medium-size
    amateur optical telescopes with photon-counting receivers.  It is
    certainly more debatable whether Optical ETI signals are present at
    sufficient flux intensities to be detectable by small incoherent
    telescopes.  However, although the theoretical SNRs described for small
    photon-counting (direct-detection) receiving telescopes are not
    particularly impressive, even if very high mean EIRPs are assumed, it
    must be remembered that ETI signals are likely to be pulsed and far
    more detectable than the C.W. signals assumed here for the simplified
    analyses.  This would be particularly true for detection systems with
    optical bandwidths greater than 100 GHz.

        Today, the technology is available to construct efficient,
    highly-sensitive photon-counting receivers for the visible and near-
    infrared regimes.  For several thousand dollars, top-of-the-line
    amateur optical telescopes could be equipped with the instrumentation
    to make unattended frequency searches of selected targeted stars.  If
    this new scientific endeavor really takes off, market growth will lead
    to considerable reductions in hardware and software costs, making this
    activity more affordable.

        Not only would it be possible to slave many amateur telescopes
    together at one site, to produce the equivalent of a larger telescope,
    but it may also be possible to slave telescopes at different sites and
    average the data.  This would, of course, require accurate time
    synchronization between the telescopes, though this should not be much
    of a problem.  However, the requirement to match the wavelength
    accuracy of the optical filter or monochromator to within 100 GHz is
    probably a more severe obstacle.  In the case of co-site slaving, where
    pre-detection combining of photons would occur, the SNR would increase
    at a rate proportional to the number of identical telescopes.  For
    remote site slaving, where only post-detection electrical signal
    combining could be employed, the SNR would increase at a rate
    proportional to the square root of the number of identical telescopes.

        While it is the author's view that Professional Optical SETI ought
    not to require the use of more sophisticated signal processing
    algorithms like KLTs [73,86] for extracting very weak pulsed signals
    from noise, Amateur Optical SETI may well benefit from its use.

        Perhaps one of the interesting aspects of the Amateur Optical SETI
    concept using incoherent detection is that not only may there be a
    useful contribution made by the enthusiast, but that such activities

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 61

    may occur before Professional (Visible) Optical SETI and its coherent
    detection systems get established.  A low-level search by amateurs
    might help set some of the criteria for later professional searches,
    even if the results are negative.  Amateur optical SETI has the
    potential to bring SETI to the masses, something that has not really
    been possible at microwave frequencies, except in a limited way for a
    few enthusiastic radio hams with modified satellite receivers
    (AMSETI). [26]  It also has the power to cause a renaissance in public
    interest for astronomy and the night sky.  It is an activity in which
    amateur optical astronomers who live in big cities can participate
    unincumbered by light pollution, the bane of conventional amateur
    astronomers.  This could be the opportunity to dust off those old
    telescopes and put them to use again.

        It is clear [27-29] that today there is an enormous interest in
    SETI amongst the population.  Professional SETI scientists could tap
    into that interest to receive increased SETI funding and the cooperation
    of enthusiastic amateurs.

        It does not appear that Amateur Optical SETI at the infrared Carbon
    Dioxide (CO2) wavelength of 10,600 nm would be very sensible because of
    the limitations set by the essentially 24-hour day, 300 K temperature
    background of the atmosphere, particularly for small apertures.  As we
    have seen, Professional Optical SETI in the visible and near-infrared
    can use coherent or incoherent optical receivers.  The coherent
    approach is generally more sensitive but far more complex and
    expensive.  However, based on performance considerations, both ground-
    based Professional and Amateur Optical SETI in the infrared would have
    to be restricted to coherent receivers.  This represents a complexity
    and cost problem for the amateur.  Of course, there could be very
    powerful CO2 ETI transmitters present, as powerful as conjectured for
    Visible SETI that have so far escaped detection, for we may not been
    looking in the right direction at the right moment, with suitable
    detection equipment.  The CO2 observational work now being undertaken by
    Dr. Albert Betz and Professor Charles Townes [57] is addressing this
    issue.

        Presently, Dr. Jill Tarter and Deborah Schwartz-Koyler of the SETI
    Institute are involved with a NASA project (NASA NCC 2-407) titled:
    "Supporting Research and Technology Activities in the Preparation of a
    Three-Dimensional Map of the Infrared Sky".  The goal of this project
    is to construct a detailed three-dimensional model of the infrared sky,
    which will enable us to reconsider the question of the "best" frequency
    at which to conduct a search for electromagnetic radiation, which is
    indicative of the existence of an extraterrestrial technological
    civilization.  Thus, despite the general consensus that Microwave SETI
    has the greatest likelihood for success, others are even now beginning
    to probe deeper into the infrared part of the optical spectrum.

        Since the start of modern-day SETI thirty-two years ago, a strong
    Microwave SETI constituency has developed.  It will be understandable
    if this author's views are attacked by that community, for many SETI
    researchers have much at stake - decades of work invested in the
    microwave regime and professional reputations.  I would council the

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 62

    following thought:  The public, and by that I mean the taxpayer, and
    Members of Congress, should clearly be informed that it is quite
    possible that the search for ETI in the microwave spectrum will be
    unsuccessful - not because such signals are not present, but because we
    are presently tuned to the wrong frequencies.  It may well be necessary
    to extend the search into the optical regime before we can be sure
    whether electromagnetic ETI signals do or do not exist.  It will not
    look good for the SETI community if, in ten years time, they have to go
    back to Congress, cap in hand, and ask for more funding to extend the
    search into the optical regime after decades of maintaining that the
    optical approach was useless.  Note that these sentiments have
    previously been expressed privately to both the SETI Institute and
    NASA.  It is the author's contention that SETI has been "hijacked" by
    radio astronomers.  It should now be clear to the reader that for
    humanity to have devoted less than 5 percent of its SETI observation
    programs to the optical regime, and an even smaller percentage to basic
    Optical SETI research, was probably unwise.  The author hopes that
    readers will urge the SETI Institute, NASA, and Congress to rectify
    this omission.

        NASA should be able to put an end to recent problems in deploying
    large high-gain microwave antennas in space, e.g., on the GALILEO
    probe, by moving to fixed high-gain optical antennas as soon as
    possible.  During the next few decades, other lights (visible and near-
    infrared) will appear in the sky of terrene origin:  They will be the
    advanced laser communication systems of GEO and LEO satellites, along
    with signals coming back to Earth from NASA's next generation of deep
    space probes. [63-66]  Sometime next century, humans will be seen
    walking on the planet Mars.  These HDTV television signals are likely
    to traverse most of the distance between Mars and Earth via laser, be
    relayed around the globe via laser-based geosynchronous satellites, and
    arrive in people's home via optical fiber.  When humanity sends out
    (non-relativistic) interstellar probes to investigate nearby star
    systems, the data and pictures of those encounters (hopefully with
    other planetary systems) will come back to Earth via laser.  The
    computer technology of the day will also be substantially dependent on
    photonics.  See the January 13, 1992 issue of NEWSWEEK (pp. 56-57) for
    the article on "The Highway to the Future", describing a fiber-optic
    multi-gigabit data highway system being proposed for the United States.
    Also see the January 9, 1992 issue of ELECTRONIC DESIGN (pp. 73-80) for
    the article on "The World of Communications is Moving to Fiber Optics".
    The author has seen the future, and it is photonic.

        Truly, the superior communications and computing technology of the
    future will be photonic, a technology that is likely to be around for
    a while.  Indeed, in the future, one of the main uses for low-gain
    microwave space communications might well be the "acquisition" of the
    party at the other end of the link, so that the high-gain laser
    communications system can be locked on!  The amateur SETI enthusiast,
    with the right photonic receiving equipment, will be able to tune in on
    these Earth-bound optical transmissions.  How ironic that next century
    the complaint will surely arise that terrene optical transmissions are
    interfering with our ability to carry out Optical SETI free of false
    alarms!  Now where have we heard that before?

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 63

        We end as we began.  If we look at the basic beliefs that
    differentiate the proponents of the Microwave and Optical SETI
    rationales, or the belief in Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs), an
    area that has been even more controversial than SETI, we find that the
    respective convictions hinge on our assumptions about the technical
    abilities of ETIs.  In the case of Microwave SETI, the proponents
    believe that while intelligent life within in galaxy is not rare, that
    ETIs do not have the technical wherewithal to get the full benefits of
    the superior optical technology for interstellar communications.  If
    the reader subscribes to the Optical SETI rationale, they will
    additionally believe that ETIs have the technical prowess to use the
    superior laser technology in an effective manner.  Advocates of UFOs
    essentially accept that ETI technology is so superior to our own that
    rapid interstellar travel is easy for them, and if these ETIs actually
    wanted to make contact, they would make physical contact.  In the end,
    the reader's belief will be limited only by their own vision.

        The theoretical results quoted in this paper are based on standard
    text book relationships, familiar to students of electrical
    engineering, physics, and astronomy.  Please refer to Appendix A for a
    list of most of these formulas and specimen calculations.  Perhaps the
    main reason for the difference between the conclusions of this analysis
    and many previous comparative SETI analyses is that the author has
    shown a bit more imagination.

        A few additional closing statements.  It may appear from the
    author's comments throughout this document that he does not hold high
    regards for the efforts over the past thirty-two years of many noted
    (microwave) SETI scientists.  This would be far from the truth.  It is
    the nature of science that for every two steps forward, it may often
    take a step back in the light of new discoveries or new ideas.  It is
    very easy with hindsight to criticize those who have gone before, but
    without their predecessors' work and developments in other scientific
    fields and technologies, it is unlikely that the new discovery or idea
    would ever have seen the light of day.  Each generation of scientists
    and engineers builds on the foundations laid by earlier generations.

        Readers are reminded that there is little which is innovative about
    the contents of this document which have not previously been described
    by Charles Townes [46-47,80] and others - the author has just been a
    bit more forceful.  Innovative ideas, like good wines, take time to
    mature.  The author hopes that the effort he has expended in this
    revisiting of the optical approach to the search for extraterrestrial
    intelligence will at last cause Optical SETI to be seriously considered
    by the scientific community as warranting closer study.

        This paper could be the start of an exciting new chapter in both
    SETI and professional/amateur optical astronomy.  One thing which can
    be said for certain is that should a professional or amateur
    astronomer discover electromagnetic (radio or optical) signals from
    ETIs, neither they nor humanity will ever be the same.  There is no
    doubt that a Nobel Prize will await the discoverer.  Perhaps now is the
    time to get familiar with those Post-Detection SETI Protocols! [25]
    See Appendix B for a description of these protocols.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 64


                                  REFERENCES

    General SETI Literature -

     1.  Cocconi, Giuseppe, and Philip Morrison, "Searching For Inter-
         stellar Communications", NATURE, Vol. 184, No. 4690, September 19,
         1959, pp. 844-845.  Also ref. 13.

     2.  Drake, Frank D., "How Can We Detect Radio Transmissions from
         Distant Planetary Systems?", SKY & TELESCOPE, Vol. 19, No. 3,
         January 1960, pp. 140-143.  Also ref. 13.

     3.  Drake, Frank D., "Project Ozma", PHYSICS TODAY, Vol. 14,
         April 1961, pp. 40-42, 44, and 46.  Also ref. 13.

     4.  Kardashev, N. S., "Transmission of Information by Extraterrestrial
         Civilizations", SOVIET ASTRONOMY-AJ, Vol. 8, 1964, p. 217.  Also
         ref. 13.

     5.  Oliver, Bernard (Editor), PROJECT CYCLOPS: A DESIGN STUDY OF A
         SYSTEM FOR DETECTING EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENT LIFE, NASA
         Publication CR 114445, Revised Edition, 1973.

     6.  Lunan, Duncan, "Man and the Stars - Contact and Communication with
         other Intelligence", SOUVENIR PRESS, 1974.

     7.  Christian, James L. (Editor), EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE -
         THE FIRST ENCOUNTER, Prometheus Books, 1976.

     8.  Morrison, Philip, John Billingham, and J. Wolfe, THE SEARCH FOR
         EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE, NASA SP-419, 1977.

     9.  Mallove, Eugene F., M. M. Connors, Robert L. Forward, and
         Z. Paprotny, A BIBLIOGRAPHY ON THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL
         INTELLIGENCE, NASA Reference Publication 1021, March 1978.

    10.  Nicolson, Iain, THE ROAD TO THE STARS, Westbridge Books, 1978.

    11.  Edelson, E., WHO GOES THERE?, Doubleday & Co., 1979.

    12.  Asimov, Isaac, EXTRATERRESTRIAL CIVILIZATIONS, Crown Publishers,
         1979.

    13.  Goldsmith, Donald (Editor), THE QUEST FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL LIFE,
         University Science Books, 1980.

    14.  Billingham, John. (Editor), LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE, The MIT Press
         and NASA Conference Publication 2156, 1981.

    15.  Singer, Clifford E., "When to Look Where", COSMIC SEARCH, Vol. 4,
         No. 1, January-June 1982, pp. 22-23.



    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
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    16.  Drake, Frank D., J. H. Wolfe, and C. L. Seeger (Editors), SETI
         SCIENCE WORKING GROUP REPORT, NASA Technical Paper 2244, 1983.

    17.  THE PLANETARY REPORT, Vol. 3, No. 2, 4-5, March/April 1983.

    18.  Baugher, J. F., ON CIVILIZED STARS - THE SEARCH FOR INTELLIGENT
         LIFE IN OUTER SPACE, Prentice-Hall, 1985.

    19.  Sagan, Carl, CONTACT, Simon & Schuster Inc., 1986.

    20.  McDonough, Thomas, THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE:
         LISTENING FOR LIFE IN THE COSMOS, John Wiley & Sons, 1987.

    21.  Horowitz, Paul, "A Status Report on The Planetary Society's SETI
         Project", THE PLANETARY REPORT, Vol. 7, No. 4, July/August 1987,
         pp. 8-10.

    22.  Feazel, Angie, "Does Extraterrestrial Life Exist?", EJASA, Vol. 1,
         No. 4, November 1989.

    23.  Holm, Lars W., "Suggestions for an Intragalactic Information
         Exchange System", EJASA, Vol. 1, No. 4, November 1989.

    24.  Scott, A. (Editor), FRONTIERS OF SCIENCE, Basil Blackwell, 1990,
         Chapter 14, pp. 185-199.

    25.  White, Frank, THE SETI FACTOR, Walker & Company, 1990.

    26.  Bova, Ben, and Byron Preiss (Editors), FIRST CONTACT: THE SEARCH
         FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE, NAL/Penguin Books, 1990.

    27.  Sagan, Carl and Frank Drake, "The Search for Extraterrestrial
         Intelligence", Scientific American Special Issue, EXPLORING SPACE,
         1990, pp. 150-159.

    28.  Harrison, Albert A., and Alan C. Elms, "Psychology and the Search
         for Extraterrestrial Intelligence", BEHAVIORAL SCIENCE, Vol. 35,
         1990, pp. 207-218.

    29.  Blum, Howard, "SETI, Phone Home", THE NEW YORK TIMES MAGAZINE,
         October 21, 1990.

    30.  Gray, Robert H., "Isotropically Detectable Interstellar Beacons",
         JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY, Vol. 43, No. 12,
         December, 1990, pp. 531-536.

    31.  Lawton, A. T., P. Wright, "The Search for Companions to Epsilon
         Eridani", JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY, Vol. 43,
         No. 12, December, 1990, pp. 556-560.

    32.  Jones, Barrie W., "SETI: The Search for Extraterrestrial
         Intelligence", PHYSICS EDUCATION, Vol. 26, No. 1, January 1991,
         pp. 52-57.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 66

    33.  McDonough, Thomas R., "Searching for Extraterrestrial
         Intelligence", SKEPTICAL INQUIRER, Vol. 15, No. 3, Spring 1991,
         pp. 255-262.

    34.  Faulkes, Zen, "Getting Smart About Getting Smarts", SKEPTICAL
         INQUIRER, Vol. 15, No. 3, Spring, 1991, pp. 263-268.

    35.  Letters To The Editor, SKEPTICAL INQUIRER, Vol. 16, No. 1,
         Fall 1991, pp. 94-102.

    36.  Devito, Carl L., "Languages, Science and the Search for Extra-
         terrestrial Intelligence", INTERDISCIPLINARY SCIENCE REVIEWS,
         Vol. 16, No. 2, 1991, pp. 156-160.

    37.  Horowitz, Paul, "A Morning With Philip Morrison - Exploring the
         Extraterrestrial Mind", THE PLANETARY REPORT, Vol. 11, No. 5,
         September/October 1991, pp. 4-7.

    38.  Williams, John M., "The Star Hunters", FINAL FRONTIER, November/
         December 1991, pp. 38-40, 50-53.

    39.  Tipler, Frank J., "Alien Life", A review of the book "The Cosmic
         Water Hole" by Emmanuel Davoust, MIT Press, NATURE, Vol. 354,
         No. 6351, November 28, 1991, pp. 334-335.


    The Microwave Observing Project (MOP) -

    40.  Gulkis, Sam and Edward T. Olsen, "The NASA SETI Program At JPL",
         PROCEEDINGS OF THE SETI WORKSHOP, Green Bank Workshop Series,
         May 1985.

    41.  Cullers, D. Kent, Ivan R. Linscott, and Bernard M. Oliver, "Signal
         Processing In SETI", COMMUNICATIONS OF THE ACM, Vol. 28, No. 11,
         November 1985, pp. 1151-1163.

    42.  Oliver, Bernard M., and Michael J. Klein, PROGRAM PLAN FOR THE
         SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI), Ames Research
         Center and Jet Propulsion Laboratory, NASA, March 30, 1987.

    43.  Olsen, E. T., R. B. Brady, D. J. Burns, G. T. Cooper, W. T. S.
         Deich, S. Gulkis, M. F. Garyantes, and M. J. Klein, "A Development
         Signal Processing System For The NASA All Sky Survey", JPL SETI
         REPRINT SERIES, No. 003, October 1988.

    44.  Klein, Michael J., E. T. Olsen, and N. A. Renzetti, "The NASA SETI
         Sky Survey: Recent Developments", TDA PROGRESS REPORT, April 15,
         1989, pp. 218-226.

    45.  Gribbin, John, "Is Anyone Out There?", NEW SCIENTIST, May 25,
         1991, pp. 29-32.




    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 67

    Optical SETI -

    46.  Schwartz, R. N., and Charles H. Townes, "Interstellar and Inter-
         planetary Communication by Optical Masers", NATURE, Vol. 190,
         No. 4772, April 15, 1961, pp. 205-208.  Also ref. 47.

    47.  Cameron, A. G. W. (Editor), INTERSTELLAR COMMUNICATION,
         W. A. Benjamin, 1963, p. 223.

    48.  Shvartsman, V. F., COMMUNICATIONS OF THE SPECIAL ASTROPHYSICAL
         OBSERVATORY, No. 19, 1977, pp. 5-39.

    49.  Connes, Pierre, "Olbers Paradox Revisited and the Future of
         Intelligence", CONFERENCE ON LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE, Paris, France,
         November 19-21, 1979.

    50.  Beskin, G. M., S. I. Neizvestnyi, A. A. Pimonov, V. L.
         Plakhotnichenko, and V. F. Shvartsman, "A Photometry System to
         Search for Optical Variability on Time-Scales of 3 X 10^-7 to
         300 s: Main Results", C. M. Humphries (editor), INSTRUMENTATION
         FOR ASTRONOMY WITH LARGE OPTICAL TELESCOPES, D. Reidel Publishing
         Company, 1982, pp. 181-184.

    51.  Townes, Charles H., "At What Wavelength Should We Search for
         Signals from Extraterrestrial Intelligence?", PROC. NATIONAL
         ACADEMY OF SCIENCES, U.S.A., Vol. 80, 1983, pp. 1147-1151.

    52.  Zuckerman, Ben, "Preferred Frequencies for SETI Observations",
         ACTA ASTRONAUTICA, Vol. 12, No. 2, 1985, pp. 127-129.

    53.  Betz, Albert, "A Directed Search for Extraterrestrial Laser
         Signals", ACTA ASTRONAUTICA, Vol. 13, No. 10, 1986, pp. 623-629.

    54.  Shvartsman, V. F., "SETI in Optical Range with the 6 m Telescope"
         (MANIA), BIOASTRONOMY - THE NEXT STEPS, G. Marx (Editor), Kluwer
         Academic Publishers, 1988, pp. 389-390.

    55.  Filippova, L. N., N. S. Kardashev, S. F. Likhachev, and V. S.
         Strelnitskij, "On the Strategy of SETI", VAL CENIS THIRD BIO-
         ASTRONOMY PROCEEDINGS,  To be published by Springer-Verlag, 1991.

    56.  Rather, John D. G., "Lasers Revisited: Their Superior Utility for
         Interstellar Beacons", JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY
         SOCIETY, Vol. 44, No. 8, August, 1991, pp. 385-392.

    57.  Betz, Albert, "A Search for IR Laser Signals", USA-USSR JOINT
         CONFERENCE ON THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENT LIFE,
         University of California, Santa Cruz, August 5-9, 1991.

    58.  Beskin, Gregory, M., "Results of Searches for Optical Signals of
         Extraterrestrial Intelligence", USA-USSR JOINT CONFERENCE ON THE
         SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENT LIFE, University of
         California, Santa Cruz, August 5-9, 1991.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 68

    Hubble Space Telescope (HST) -

    59.  McRoberts, Joseph J., SPACE TELESCOPE, NASA Publication EP-166,
         1982.

    60.  Hubble Space Telescope Media Reference Guide, Published by NASA
         and Lockheed Missiles & Space Company, Inc.

    61.  Field, George, and Donald Goldsmith, THE SPACE TELESCOPE,
         Contemporary Books, Inc., 1989.

    62.  Brown, Robert A., "Systematic Aspects of Direct Extrasolar Planet
         Detection", BIOASTRONOMY - THE NEXT STEPS, Edited by G. Marx,
         Kluwer Academic Publishers, 1988, pp. 117-123.


    Free-Space Communications -

    63.  Lesh, James R., and Marc D. Rayman, "Deep-Space Missions Look to
         Laser Communications", LASER FOCUS/ELECTRO-OPTICS, Vol. 24,
         No. 10, October, 1988, pp. 81-86.

    64.  Begley, David, "Lasers for Spaceborne Communications", PHOTONICS
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    65.  Begley, David, and Bhogi Boscha, "Laser Diodes Conquer the
         Challenge of Space Communications", PHOTONICS SPECTRA, Vol. 23,
         No. 4, April, 1989, pp. 147-155.

    66.  Begley, David L., and Bernard D. Seery (Editors), FREE-SPACE LASER
         COMMUNICATION TECHNOLOGIES II, SPIE Proceedings, Vol. 1218,
         January, 1990.

    67.  Clarke, Arthur C., ASCENT TO ORBIT, Chapters 4 and 8, John Wiley
         and Sons, 1984.


    Adaptive Optics -

    68.  Mercer, L.B., "Adaptive Coherent Optical Receiver Array",
         ELECTRONICS LETTERS, Vol. 26, No. 18, 30th August 1990,
         pp. 1518-1520.

    69.  Gardner, Chester S., Byron M. Welsh, Laird A. Thompson, "Design
         and Performance Analysis of Adaptive Optical Telescopes Using
         Laser Guide Stars, PROC. IEEE, Vol. 78, No. 11, November, 1990,
         pp. 1721-1743.

    70.  Carts, Y. A., "Adaptive Optics Goes Public", LASER FOCUS WORLD,
         August, 1991, pp. 45-48.





    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 69

    Optoelectronics -

    71.  Pratt, William K., LASER COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS, John Wiley, 1969.

    72.  Yariv, Amnon, INTRODUCTION TO OPTICAL ELECTRONICS, Second Edition,
         Holt, Rinehart, & Winston, 1976.

    73.  Gagliardi, Robert M., and Sherman Karp, OPTICAL COMMUNICATIONS,
         John Wiley & Sons, 1976.

    74.  Osinski, M. and J. Buss, "Linewidth Broadening Factor in Semi-
         conductor Lasers - An Overview", IEEE J. QUANTUM ELECTRONICS,
         Vol. QE-23, No. 1, January 1987, pp. 9-29.

    75.  Barry, J. R., and E. A. Lee, "Performance of Coherent Optical
         Receivers", PROC. IEEE, Vol. 78, No. 8, August 1990,
         pp. 1369-1394.

    76.  Wagner, Richard E., and Richard A. Linke, "Heterodyne Lightwave
         Systems: Moving Towards Commercial Use", IEEE LIGHTWAVE COMMUNI-
         CATION SYSTEMS (LCS), Vol. 1, No. 4, November 1990, pp. 28-35.

    77.  Green, Paul E., and Rajiv Ramaswami, "Direct Detection Lightwave
         Systems: Why Pay More?", IEEE LIGHTWAVE COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS
         (LCS), Vol. 1, No. 4, November 1990, pp. 36-49.

    78.  Mcintyre, Robert J., Comments on "Performance of Coherent Optical
         Receivers", PROC. IEEE, Vol. 79, No. 7, July 1991, pp. 1080-1082.

    79.  Hecht, Jeff, UNDERSTANDING LASERS, Howard W. Sams & Company, 1988.

    80.  Perry, Tekla, S., "The Innovative Mind at Work - Charles H. Townes:
         Masers, Lasers, and More", Special Report, IEEE SPECTRUM, Vol. 28,
         No. 12, December 1991, pp. 32-33.

    81.  Kingsley, Stuart A., D. E. N. Davies, B. Culshaw, and D. Howard,
         "Fiberdyne Systems", Proceedings of FOC '78, Information
         Gatekeepers, Chicago, September 6-8, 1978, pp. 152-158.

    82.  Kingsley, Stuart A., and S. Lange, "Interferometric optical fibre
         sensors and multimode heterodyning", FOC '80, Information
         Gatekeepers, San Francisco, September 16-18, 1980.


    Communications -

    83.  Schwartz, M., INFORMATION TRANSMISSION, MODULATION AND NOISE,
         McGraw-Hill, 1970.

    84.  Jakes, W. C. J. (Editor), MICROWAVE MOBILE COMMUNICATIONS, John
         Wiley & Sons, 1974.

    85.  Johnson, Richard C., and Henry Jasik, (Editors), ANTENNA
         ENGINEERING HANDBOOK, McGraw-Hill Book Company, 1984.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 70

    86.  Dixon, Robert S., and Charles A. Klein, "On the Detection of
         Unknown Signals", USA-USSR JOINT CONFERENCE ON THE SEARCH FOR
         EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENT LIFE, University of California,
         Santa Cruz, August 5-9, 1991.

    87.  Ang, Peng H., and Peter A. Ruetz, "Video Compression Makes Big
         Gains", IEEE SPECTRUM, Vol. 28, No. 10, October 1991, pp. 16-19.


    Astronomy -

    88.  Motz, Lloyd and Anneta Duveen, ESSENTIALS OF ASTRONOMY,
         2nd Edition, Columbia University Press, 1977.

    89.  Pasachoff, Jay M. and Marc L. Kutner, UNIVERSITY ASTRONOMY,
         W.B. Saunders Co., 1978.

    90.  Lang, Kenneth R., ASTROPHYSICAL FORMULAE, Springer-Verlag, 1978.

    91.  Bracewell, Ronald N., and Robert H. MacPhie, "Searching for
         Nonsolar Planets", ICARUS, Vol 38, p. 136, 1979.  Also ref. 13.

    92.  McAlister, H., "The CHARA Multi-Telescope Telescope", EJASA,
         Vol. 1, No. 1, August 1989.

    93.  Douglas, N., F. Maaswinkel, H. Butcher, and S. Frandsen, "A Study
         of the Potential of Heterodyned Holographic Spectrometry for
         Application in Astronomy", ESO Technical Report No. 15, EUROPEAN
         SOUTHERN OBSERVATORY, June 1991.


    General Science Fiction -

    94.  Clarke, Arthur C., 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, NAL Books, 1968.

    95.  Clarke, Arthur C., 2010: ODYSSEY TWO, Ballantine Books, 1982.

    96.  Clarke, Arthur C., 2061: ODYSSEY THREE, Ballantine Books, 1987.

















    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                          THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF
                  THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                     Volume 3, Number 6F - January 1992

                         ###########################

                              TABLE OF CONTENTS

                         ###########################

           * ASA Membership and Article Submission Information

           * The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI) in
             the Optical Spectrum, Part F - Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                         ###########################

                         ASA MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION

        The Electronic Journal of the Astronomical Society of the Atlantic
    (EJASA) is published monthly by the Astronomical Society of the
    Atlantic, Incorporated.  The ASA is a non-profit organization dedicated
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    exploration, as well as the social and educational needs of its members.

        ASA membership application is open to all with an interest in
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        or telephone the Society Recording at [phone] to leave your
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


        ASA Officers and Council -

        President - Don Barry
        Vice President - Nils Turner
        Secretary - Ken Poshedly
        Treasurer - Karla Poshedly
        Board of Advisors - Bill Bagnuolo, Jim Bitsko, Eric Greene
        Council - Jim Bitsko, Bill Black, Mike Burkhead, Bill Crane,
                  Toni Douglas, Ruth Greene, Larry Klaes, Tano Scigliano,
                  John Stauter, Gary Thompson, Bob Vickers


        ARTICLE SUBMISSIONS -

        Article submissions to the EJASA on astronomy and space exploration
    are most welcome.  Please send your on-line articles in ASCII format to
    Larry Klaes, EJASA Editor, at the following net addresses or the above
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        or - [e-mail]
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        You may also use the above addresses for EJASA back issue requests,
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        When sending your article submissions, please be certain to include
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        Submissions are welcome for consideration.  Articles submitted,
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    Society of the Atlantic, Inc.  Though the articles will not be used for
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    Copying or reprinting of the EJASA, in part or in whole, is encouraged,
    provided clear attribution is made to the Astronomical Society of the
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    expressed in the EJASA are those of the authors' and not necessarily
    those of the ASA.  This Journal is Copyright (c) 1992 by the
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    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992


                            COPYRIGHT NOTIFICATION

        This document may be freely copied to other electronic bulletin
    boards, but only in an unmodified form and in its entirety, with the
    following copyright notice attached.  No license is given to reproduce
    this document in electronic or hardcopy form for profit.  However, the
    media may reproduce short extracts for the purposes of furthering the
    Optical SETI debate.

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                     Copyright (c) 1992           *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
 *                                    "Where No Photon Has Gone Before &   *
 *                                   The Impossible Takes A Little Longer" *
 *                                                 __________              *
 * FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS                      /          \             *
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Version: 1.00
File: EJASAV3.N06


      THE ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF THE ASTRONOMICAL SOCIETY OF THE ATLANTIC

                         January 1992 - Vol. 3, No. 6F

                            Copyright (c) 1992 - ASA

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992










              THE SEARCH FOR EXTRATERRESTRIAL INTELLIGENCE (SETI)
                        IN THE OPTICAL SPECTRUM - PART F

                Optical SETI Revisited and the Amateur Approach



                                       by



                             Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley

                            FIBERDYNE OPTOELECTRONICS
                               545 Northview Drive
                               Columbus, Ohio 43209
                                  United States






























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 71

                                  APPENDIX A

                       THEORY AND SPECIMEN CALCULATIONS


    The Drake Equation:

    Fundamental to all SETI approaches is the belief that there are a
    reasonable number of technological civilizations out there who might be
    trying to communicate with us.

    The following formula for the number of technological civilizations in
    the galaxy is a modified form of the one devised in 1961 by Frank Drake
    [2-3] of Cornell (also President of the SETI Institute) and is known
    as the famous "Drake Equation": [13,25]

    N = R*.fp.ne.fl.fi.fc.L                                              (1)

    where  R* = number of stars in the Milky Way galaxy (400 X 10^9),
           fp = fraction of stars that have planetary systems (0.1),
           ne = average number of planets in such star systems that can
                support life (1),
           fl = fraction of planets on which life actually occurs (0.1),
           fi = fraction of such planets which intelligent life arises
                (0.01),
           fc = fraction of intelligent beings knowing how to communicate
                with other civilizations (0.1),
           L  = average lifetime (fraction of the age of its star) of such
                technical civilizations (0.001).


    Substituting what some might say are conservative values given in
    parentheses for the entire Milky Way galaxy:

                                   N = 4,000

    Thus, there could be a minimum 4,000 worlds for us to detect in our
    galaxy.  If there were only 4,000 technical civilizations within a
    galaxy that is 100,000 light years in diameter, then the probability
    of detecting ETI signals is likely to be small.  However, many SETI
    scientists and exobiologists give more optimistic values for these
    parameters, and thus yield higher values for N.  If fp, fl, fi, fc,
    and L are significantly higher, our galaxy would be teeming with
    intelligent technical civilizations.  If we assume that the average
    lifetime of a star is 10 billion years, then a value of L = 0.001
    implies that civilizations can last 10 million years.  Clearly, there
    is a substantial degree of uncertainty in the value of L.

    Within 1,000 light years of Sol there are 10 million stars, of which
    1 million are solar-type.  Thus, taking a more optimistic value for
    "N", the SETI community reasons that there is a significant chance of
    detecting an ETI signal if we "look" out to 1,000 light years, assuming
    of course, that we are tuned to the correct frequencies.  The issue of
    the correct frequencies to search is at the heart of this paper.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 72

    Apparent Stellar and Signal Magnitudes:

    The relationship between Apparent Stellar Magnitude (m) [88-90] and the
    brightness or intensity of a solar-type star (or a laser operating at or
    near the peak of the photopic response) may be expressed in the form:

    m = -[19 + (2.5).log(Ir)]                                            (2)

    where Ir = received intensity (W/m^2).


    The threshold for unaided eye visibility (dark sky) is m = +6.  As
    mentioned above, this expression may also be used to estimate the
    approximate visibility of a laser, i.e., the apparent signal magnitude,
    if its wavelength is not too far removed from the peak of the low-
    intensity visual response at 500 nm.  Here are several intensities and
    corresponding magnitudes as a function of range R.  We note that the
    Sun's total output (EIRP) = 3.90 X 10^26 watts:

    At R = 1 A.U. (1.496 X 10^11 m):

                               Ir =  1.39 kW/m^2
                               m  = -26.8

    Thus the solar flux density at normal incidence just outside Earth's
    atmosphere is 1.39 kW/m^2.


    At R = 10 L.Y. (9.461 X 10^16 m):

                               Ir =  3.48 X 10^-9 W/m^2
                               m  = +2.2


    At R = 100 L.Y. (9.461 X 10^17 m):

                               Ir =  3.48 X 10^-11 W/m^2
                               m  = +7.2*


    At R = 1,000 L.Y. (9.461 X 10^18 m):

                               Ir =  3.48 X 10^-13 W/m^2
                               m  = +12.2*

    * Not visible to the unaided eye.


    In Table 2 (Page 22), Apparent Magnitudes are quoted for stars,
    extrasolar planets, and ETI transmitters on the basis of the visual
    brightness or intensity of each object acting alone.  Because the
    reason for quoting the Apparent Magnitudes is to demonstrate that
    relatively strong laser transmitters are still "visually" weak, the
    Apparent Magnitudes are only given for the visible wavelength.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 73

    Planckian Starlight Background:

    For observations at night, the background Nb may be taken as the
    Planckian (black body) starlight continuum level (Npl). [88-90]  With
    no allowance for the Fraunhofer dark line absorption or bright line
    emission, the non-polarized spectral energy density is given by:

               2.PI.h.f^3r^2
    Npl = -----------------------  W/m^2.Hz                              (3)
          c^2[e^(h.f/k.T) - 1]R^2

    where  h  = Planck's constant (6.63 X 10^-34 J.s),
           c  = velocity of light (3 X 10^8 m/s),
           Wl = wavelength (656 nm),
           f  = frequency (c/Wl = 4.57 X 10^14 Hz),
           k  = Boltzmann's constant (1.38 X 10^-23 J/K),
           T  = temperature (5778 K),
           r  = radius of star (6.96 X 10^8 m),
           R  = distance of receiver (10 L.Y. = 9.461 X 10^16 m).


    At R= 1 A.U.:

                         Npl = 2.19 X 10^-12 W/m^2.Hz

    At R = 10 L.Y.:

                         Npl = 5.47 X 10^-24 W/m^2.Hz


    Full Width Half Maximum (FWHM) Angular Beamwidth:

    For the purposes of this part of the analysis, we have assumed a fully
    (uniformly) illuminated circular aperture and not a beam with a
    Gaussian intensity profile, as might be obtained from a laser with a
    single transverse TEMoo mode.  The diffraction limited half-power
    (-3dB) beamwidth is given by: [66,85]

                     (58.5).Wl
    FWHM Beamwidth = ---------  degrees                                  (4)
                         d

    where  Wl = wavelength,
           d  = diameter (aperture) of telescope.


    For d = 10 m (professional telescope) and Wl = 656 nm:

                      FWHM Beamwidth = 0.0138 arc seconds


    For d = 0.30 m (amateur telescope) and Wl = 656 nm:

                      FWHM Beamwidth = 0.461 arc seconds

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 74

    Full Width Half Maximum (FWHM) Diameter:

    The diffraction limited far-field half-power (-3 dB) beam diameter is
    given by:

                    (1.02).Wl.R
    FWHM Diameter = -----------  meters                                  (5)
                         d


    At R = 10 L.Y.:

                  FWHM Diameter = 6.33 X 10^9 m = 0.0423 A.U.


    Gaussian Beamwidth:

    If a laser is used to illuminate a transmitting telescope, and if the
    aperture is greater than 4wo, theory gives the far-field 1/e^2 beam
    diffraction angle as:

                         (115).Wl
    Gaussian Beamwidth = --------  degrees                               (6)
                          PI.wo

    where wo = the TEMoo mode waist radius of the Gaussian beam.


    For a compromise aperture diameter d = 2wo, where a little diffraction
    will occur and produce some sidelobe energy, the (1/e^2) diffraction
    angle of the main lobe of a 10-meter telescope is given by:

                    Gaussian Beamwidth = 0.0172 arc seconds


    The corresponding (1/e^2) Gaussian beam diameter at the target is:

                        Gaussian Diameter = 0.0527 A.U.


    This is not that different to the previous case for a fully-illuminated
    aperture (no amplitude taper apodization).


    Rayleigh Range:

    For a Gaussian beam, the Rayleigh or near-field range of a diffraction
    limited single or multi-aperture (array) telescope is given by:

          PI.wo^2
    Ray = -------                                                        (7)
            Wl



    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 75

    At the Rayleigh range Ray, the beam diameter has expanded by a factor of
    1.414.  As the distance increases beyond the Rayleigh range, the beam
    diameter becomes proportional to distance, and the inverse square law
    applies to the beam intensity.


    Considering our 10-meter diameter transmitting telescope with a
    Gaussian beam, and a compromise aperture diameter d = 2wo.

    For wo = 5 m and Wl = 656 nm:

                              Ray = 1.2 X 10^8 m

                                  = 0.0008 A.U.


    Now consider an array that has a width of 10 km.

    For wo = 5 km and Wl = 656 nm:

                              Ray = 1.2 X 10^14 m

                                  = 800 A.U.


    Finally, consider a Mercury-size planetary phased-array as conjectured
    by Dr. John Rather. [56]

    For a wo = 2,439 km and Wl = 656 nm:

                              Ray = 2.8 X 10^19 m

                                  = 3,000 L.Y.


    With such a huge array, the inverse square law does not apply over
    considerable distances.  The Rayleigh range can stretch out over 3,000
    light years, so that the flux density is essentially undiminished by
    distance, accept for any interstellar absorption effects.  Of course,
    the implication that a pencil beam (celestial searchlight) some
    3,500 km in diameter, i.e, of planetary diameter, could be landed on
    a desired planet 10 lights years away, let alone 3,000 light years,
    somewhat stretches even this author's imagination!


    Polar Response:

    The Polar Response (PR) or Directivity of a transmitting or receiving
    telescope with a single fully illuminated circular aperture, with no
    amplitude taper (apodization), is given by: [85]

         [2.J1{(PI.d/Wl).sin(PHI)}]^2
    PR = ----------------------------                                    (8)
            [(PI.d/Wl).sin(PHI)]^2

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 76

    where  J1  = Bessel Function of the first kind,
           d   = diameter (aperture) of telescope,
           Wl  = wavelength,
           PHI = angular separation.


    For the 10-meter diameter telescope at 656 nm, the first sidelobe is
    located at 0.022 arc seconds from the main lobe, and the response is
    17.6 dB down.  The second sidelobe occurs at 0.036 arc seconds from the
    main lobe, and response is 23.8 dB down.


    In a diffraction limited space-based telescope system, where the angle
    PHI between the image of the transmitter and star is >= FWHM/2 (-3 dB
    half width half maximum), the Planckian suppression, ignoring
    scattering within the telescope, is given by:

                                             8
    Suppression Factor >= 10.Log[-------------------------]  dB          (9)
                                 PI.{(PI.d/Wl).sin(PHI)}^3


    Equ. 9 essentially shows that the suppression factor is inversely
    proportional to the telescope's aperture raised to the third power.
    For a transmitter at 10 light years, located 1 A.U. from its star, and
    centered on the main lobe of the receiver, the maximum angular
    separation of the star is 0.275 arcseconds.  Using the parameters for
    the 10-meter diameter 656 nm telescope which has a FWHM beamwidth of
    0.0138 arc seconds, we find that the condition PHI >= FWHM/2 is more
    than satisfied, and the minimum suppression factor for the Planckian
    starlight continuum is:

                              Suppression = 50 dB


    This value is added to the Signal-To-Planckian Ratio (SPR) to arrive at
    the effective SPR when a large telescope is diffraction limited, and
    viewing a nearby star system at right angles to the star's plane of
    ecliptic (Table 2, Line 23, Page 22).  The suppression factor can be
    larger than predicted by Equ. 9 (up to a limit set by scattering and
    secondary mirror diffraction) if the star's image happens to be situated
    in a response null.  However, scattering effects and non-ideal optics
    will set a limit to this suppression factor to between 40 and 50 dB.


    Antenna Gain:

    The gain of a uniformly illuminated antenna is given by: [5,71,85]

        4.PI.At
    G = -------                                                         (10)
         Wl^2

    where At = area of transmitting telescope mirror (78.5 m^2).

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 77

    For a 10-meter diameter telescope at 656 nm:

                               G = 2.3 X 10^15

                                 = 153.6 dB


    Effective Isotropic Radiated Power (EIRP):

    The Effective Isotropic Radiated Power [5,8,85] is given by:

    EIRP = G.Pt  Watts                                                  (11)

    where Pt = transmitter power (W).


    For Pt = 1 GW:

                            EIRP = 2.29 X 10^24 W


    Received Signal Intensity:

    The received signal intensity just outside Earth's atmosphere is:

           EIRP
    Ir = --------                                                       (12)
         4.PI.R^2

    where  EIRP = effective isotropic radiated power (W),
           R    = range (10 L.Y. = 9.461 X 10^16 m).


    At a range of ten light years, a 1 GW transmitter EIRP = 2.29 X 10^24 W
    produces an intensity (Ir) just outside our atmosphere of
    2.04 X 10^-11 W/m^2.  For a perfect space-based 10-meter diameter
    telescope, the received signal power (Pr) is 1.6 nW.


    Received Signal Power:

    From Equs. 10, 11, and 12, and because the receiving aperture area
    At = PI.D^2/4, we may write the "perfect" received signal for the
    symmetrical telescope system in the simple form:

             PI^2.D^4
    Pr = Pt.-----------                                                 (13)
            16.R^2.Wl^2


    It can be clearly seen from the above, that the received power is
    proportional to D^4 and inversely proportional to Wl^2.  Thus, beamed
    optical links, particularly those operating in the visible spectrum,
    have the potential for tremendous throughputs.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 78

    A slightly simpler form of this expression has been used by Albert Betz
    in his recent CO2 paper. [57]  To a close approximation, Equ. 13 may be
    further simplified to:

               D^4
    Pr = Pt.--------                                                    (14)
            R^2.Wl^2


    A more conservative analysis for ground-based observatories, would take
    into account atmospheric transmission losses, aperture blocking, and
    spectrometer efficiency in the case of an incoherent receiver.  For a
    a ground-based telescope, the optical power reaching the photodetector
    is given by:

    Pr = Ir.Tr.Ae.Ar.SE                                                 (15)

    where  Ir = intensity just outside atmosphere (2.04 X 10^-11 W/m^2),
           Tr = atmospheric transmission (0.4 for visible, 0.6 for CO2),
           Ae = antenna efficiency (0.7),
           Ar = antenna aperture area (0.0707 m^2),
           SE = spectrometer efficiency (0.5).


    For a 30-cm diameter (12-inch) visible telescope, and the above
    parameter values (1 GW, 10 m transmitter, EIRP = 2.29 X 10^24 W,
    Ir = 2.04 X 10^-11 W/m^2), the received visible signal:

                        Prv = 2 X 10^-13 W (-127 dBW)

    For a 30-cm diameter (12-inch) CO2 telescope, and the above parameter
    values (1 GW, 10 m transmitter, EIRP = 8.78 X 10^21 W,
    Ir = 7.81 X 10^-14 W/m^2), the received infrared signal:

                        Pri = 1.2 X 10^-15 W (-149 dBW)


    Daylight Background:

    The sky background radiation power detected per pixel, is given by:

    Pb = (PI.THETA^2.Ae.Ar.SE/4).Bo.N(Wl)  W                            (16)

    where  THETA = diffraction limited beamwidth (5.34 X 10^-6 radians),
           Bo    = optical bandpass (0.143 nm),
           N(Wl) = spectral radiance (W/m^2.sr.nm).


    For the incoherent optical systems, the pixel has a diffraction limited
    field-of-view (FOV) corresponding to the Airy disk, i.e., (2.44)Wl/d
    radians, where Wl = wavelength, and d is the aperture diameter.  For
    coherent systems, a smaller FOV is employed; that corresponding to the
    FWHM response, i.e., (1.02)Wl/d radians.  The latter pixel size is
    smaller because of the requirement to reduce the amount of local-

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 79

    oscillator power that does not beat with the signal but only induces
    excess quantum shot-noise.


    At visible wavelengths:

    N(Wl) = 0.01 W/cm^2.sr.micron [71]
          = 0.1 W/m^2.sr.nm
    N(f)  = 1.43 X 10^-13 W/m^2.sr.Hz

    The daytime sky background for a 30 cm (12") telescope at 656 nm (not
    allowing for atmospheric distortion effects) with an optical bandpass
    filter bandwidth Bo = 100 GHz (0.143 nm):

                        Pbv = 7.9 X 10^-15 W (-141 dBW)


    The background is about 14 dB (Prv - Pbv) below the signal from the
    1 GW transmitter which produces an EIRP = 2.29 X 10^24 W, and a flux of
    2.04 X 10^-11 W/m^2 at a range of 10 light years.  Thus, in this small
    photon-counting receiver, the fluctuation noise from the daylight
    background is 14 dB below that of the quantum shot-noise generated by
    the signal.  This has little effect on signal detectability.  If a
    polarizer is employed, Pb can be reduced by a further 3 dB.  For a
    perfect space-based 10 meter diameter visible telescope, the daylight
    spectral density is about 4 X 10^-26 W/Hz (Figure 3, Page 17).


    For infrared systems, the 300 K temperature of the atmosphere produces
    a black body peak at approximately 10,600 nm, with a spectral radiance
    given by:

    N(Wl) = 0.0002 W/cm^2.sr.micron [71]
          = 0.002 W/m^2.sr.nm
    N(f)  = 7.5 X 10^-13 W/m^2.sr.Hz

    The sky background for a cooled 30 cm (12") telescope at 10,600 nm (not
    allowing for atmospheric distortion effects) with a cooled 0.35 percent
    optical bandpass filter bandwidth Bo = 100 GHz (37.5 nm):

                        Pbi = 1.1 X 10^-11 W (-110 dBW)


    For an EIRP = 8.78 X 10^21 W and Ir = 7.81 X 10^-14 W/m^2, the
    potential CO2 SNR is degraded by about 39 dB (Figure 6, Page 38)
    because the background noise is 39 dB -(Pri - Pbi) above the quantum
    shot noise.  The infrared graph of Figure 6 is plotted to the same
    scales as that of the Figure 8 (Page 44) visible graph, to make
    comparisons easier, and the pages may be flicked back and forth to show
    the differences more dramatically.  We can clearly see that the
    effective optical bandwidth must be substantially reduced if ETI signal
    detectability at 10.6 microns is not to be impaired.  Thus, only
    heterodyning receivers, with effective optical bandwidths measured in
    MHz and not GHz, are suitable for CO2 SETI within the atmosphere.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 80

    Field Of View (FOV):

    The relationship between the solid angle occupied by each star and the
    area of the celestial sphere "occupied" by a typical star is:

              A
    OMEGAs = ---  sr                                                    (17)
             R^2

    where A = area of the celestial sphere, i.e., 4.PI.R^2/N; N being the
              number of stars being considered (10^6).


             4.PI
    OMEGAs = ----  sr                                                   (18)
              N


    Let us assume that sky survey is done out to a distance of 1,000 light
    years.  This means that we are searching the entire celestial sphere
    around the Sun with a radius of 1,000 light years.  This sphere of
    4.PI steradians (sr), contains about 10 million stars of which
    approximately 1 million are solar-type.  Assuming that for a sphere of
    this size, these 1 million stars are distributed fairly uniformly:

                        OMEGAs = 1.26 X 10^-5 steradian

    For small angles, the solid angle FOV OMEGAs and the linear angle FOV
    THETAs, are related by:

             PI.THETAs^2
    OMEGAs = -----------  sr                                            (19)
                  4

                             THETAs = 0.23 degrees


     Array Field Of View:

     Figure 10 shows the typical field-of-view (FOV) for a 10-meter
     diameter telescope.  It has a usable Telescope Field-Of-View of about
     0.33 X 0.33 degrees.  At 656 nm, the diffraction limited FOV for each
     pixel, and based on the Rayleigh criterion (1.22)Wl/d radians, is
     8 X 10^-8 radians (0.0165").  For a 128 X 128 diffraction limited
     two-dimensional array, the array has a linear field-of-view =
     1.02 X 10^-5 radians (2.1").  The corresponding array FOV is:

                               FOV = 2.1" X 2.1"


     Thus, at any instant of time, the average number of stars in the
     2.1" X 2.1" array field-of-view is approximately:

                                  6.4 X 10^-6

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 81

                        ------------------------------
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |     *                        |
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |        2.1 arc seconds       |
                       |            -->o<--           |
                       |           Array FOV          |
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |                              |
                       |     *   0.23 degrees   *     |
                       |     <------------------>     |
                        ------------------------------

                         Telescope FOV = 0.33 degrees
                       <------------------------------>

    Figure 10 -

    Typical FOVs for a large optical telescope.  The diagram (not to scale)
    illustrates the fact that the optical telescope's array field-of-view
    generally observes empty space; the array itself occupying just a small
    fraction of the telescope's usable (focal plane) field-of-view.


    Number Of Received Beams:

    The number of directions resolved by a telescope (with a maximum off-
    axis loss of 1 dB) is stated in the Cyclops report [5] as being given
    approximately by:

    Nd = 4.G                                                            (20)

    where G = gain.


    For a 10 meter diameter telescope at 656 nm, G = 2.3 X 10^15.  Thus:

                             Nd = 9.2 X 10^15 beams


    An alternative expression has been given [8] where Nd = G.  In this
    paper, for the purposes of roughly estimating the search time for an
    All Sky Survey, Equ. 20 has been used.  Nd has been taken as being
    10^16 beams or directions.






    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 82

    The Search Time

    For the Targeted Search, the time to scan a single star with the
    heterodyning array, is given by:

          Inor.Npix.(fu-fl).Td
    Ts = ----------------------  s                                      (21)
         Imin.Nmsca.Bmsca.Bbin

    where  Inor  = normalized flux (8.12 X 10^-16 W/m^2),
           Imin  = minimum detectable flux (8.12 X 10^-16 W/m^2),
           Npix  = number of pixels (16,384 photodetectors),
           Nmsca = number of parallel multi-channel spectrum analyzers
                   (MCSAs), {<= Npix} (1),
           Bmsca = total bandwidth of MCSA (10 GHz),
           Bbin  = minimum MCSA bin bandwidth (100 kHz),
           fu    = upper optical frequency (8.57 X 10^14 Hz),
           fl    = lower optical frequency (4.29 X 10^14 Hz),
           Td    = dead time overhead factor per array scan (1.0).


    The dead time overhead factor is >= 1, and for this estimate, has been
    taken to be unity, i.e., implying zero overhead.  The normalized flux
    is defined as that flux level that causes the normalized CNR (SNR)
    (dB re 1 Hz) to fall to 0 dB.  Note that if the pilot-tone maximal
    ratio predetection combining system described later is employed, the
    number of pixels (Npix) is effectively reduced to unity.  Also, the
    number of receiver beams Nd is assumed relatively constant over the
    band fu-fl.  If we substitute the values given in parentheses into
    Equ. (21), for the visible optical bandwidth between 350 nm and 700 nm,
    and a minimum detectable flux level of about -150 dBW/m^2, we find
    that:

                                 Ts = 2 hours

    The time to do an All Sky Survey of this type is increased by a factor
    (10^16/16,384), so that Ts = 136 million years!  If we wanted to store
    all the data collected, the number of bits would be, to say the least,
    astronomical.  Clearly, we would need to be very selective in the wave-
    lengths scanned. i.e., fu-fl would have to be very small, so that a
    guess of the magic optical frequencies would be mandatory.

    This rough optimistic search time estimate, shows that it would be
    ridiculous to consider a Visible SETI All Sky Survey modelled on the
    one being employed for the Microwave Observing Project (MOP). [40-45]


    Optical Heterodyne Detection:

    In an optical heterodyne receiver (Figure 2, Page 15), the signal
    current I is proportional to the product of the signal electric field
    and the local-oscillator electric field, and a difference or Inter-
    mediate Frequency (I.F.) is produced because the photodetector is a
    square-law device. [71-78,81-82]  Let us see how this heterodyne beat

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 83

    signal is created.  Consider two optical beams mixing on a photodiode
    (square-law detector).  Let the beams be given by:

    Received signal beam electric-field component = Er.cos(wrt+phi),
    Local-oscillator beam electric-field component = Eo.coswot.


    The photodetector current is given by:

    I = k(Er+Eo)^2                                                      (22)

    where k = a constant of proportionality relating the current respon-
              sivity of the photodetector (Ri) to the electric-field.

    I = k[Er.cos(wrt+phi)+Eo.coswot]^2

    I = kEr^2.cos2(wrt+phi)+2kEr.Eo.cos(wrt+phi).coswot+kEo^2.cos2wot

    I =   0.5kEr^2[1+cos2(wrt+phi)]
        + kEr.Eo[cos{(wr-wo)t+phi}]+kEr.Eo[cos{(wr+wo)t+phi)}]
        + 0.5kEo^2[1+cos2wot]


    Rejecting all but the difference frequency term,

    I = kEr.Eo[cos{(wr-wo)t+phi}]                                       (23)

    where (wr-wo)/(2.PI) = fr-fo = Bif, is the difference, beat or
    intermediate frequency.


    Thus, the signal detected is proportional to the product of the
    received signal and local-oscillator electric-fields.  In an optical
    homodyne receiver, wo = wr, and the intermediate frequency is zero.
    The optical mixing efficiency factor H, which is not indicated here
    (Equ. 32 and 33) and accounts for wavefront distortion and beam
    misalignment, is typically somewhat less than 50 percent.


    Pilot-Tone Maximal Ratio Predetection Combining:

    The pilot-tone technique has been previously applied to radio frequency
    diversity receivers to overcome deep fades. [84]  It has also been
    employed by the author on multimode fiber homodyne and heterodyne
    systems with a 4-quadrant photodetector acting as an optical space
    diversity receiver. [81,82]  The spatial incoherence of the radiation
    pattern from a multimode optical fiber is very similar to that of a
    free-space optical beam received by a large telescope within an
    atmosphere.

    The theory behind the terrene pilot-tone method is as follows, and
    makes no specific assumption about modulation techniques employed by
    ETIs, i.e., whether intensity, polarization, frequency or phase
    modulation, analog or digital.  With reference to Figure 1 (Page 10):

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 84

    Let the pilot-tone carrier at fp be given by:

    Ep(t).sin[wpt+dphi]                                                 (24)


    and the modulated information signal at fs be given by:

    Es(t).sin[wst+phi(t)+dphi]                                          (25)

    where  dphi   = phase disturbance caused by the transmitter laser
                    (jitter) or Earth's atmosphere,
           phi(t) = represents possible phase or frequency modulation.


    The phase disturbances dphi, are essentially common to both the signal
    and the pilot-tone, as they are almost identical optical frequencies
    and travel the same optical path.  However, dphi generally differs at
    each photodetector.


                              -------
    sin[(ws-wo)t+phi(t)+dphi]|       |    -----    cos[(ws-wp)t+phi(t)]
    ------------------------>| Mixer |-->| LPF |-------------------------->
        1st I.F (1.1 GHz)    |       |    -----      2nd I.F (100 MHz)
                              -------
                                 ^                        To Summer ------>
                                 |
        sin[(wp-wo)t+dphi]       |
    -----------------------------
         2nd L.O. (1 GHz)

    Figure 11 -

    Maximal Ratio Precombining.  The bandpass-filtered signal from each
    photodetector provides two separately-filtered 1st I.F and 2nd L.O.
    signals to an electronic mixer.  The 2nd I.F. produced after the low-
    pass filter (LPF), has all the laser local-oscillator and atmospheric-
    induced phase noise dphi eliminated.


    The frequencies given in brackets in Figure 11 are arbitrary, and used
    to help clarify the technique.  Each pixel of the 128 X 128 array has
    one of these circuits, whose in-phase outputs are simply added (in a
    summer) and taken to a single MCSA.

    If we heterodyne a local-oscillator laser operating at frequency wo
    with both these signals, we obtain the difference frequency signals or
    1st I.F. from the photodetector proportional to:

    Ep(t).Eo.sin[(wp-wo)t+dphi]                                         (26)

    Es(t).Eo.sin[(ws-wo)t+phi(t)+dphi]                                  (27)

    where dphi now also includes the effects of local-oscillator jitter.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 85

    The pilot-tone signal as stated by Equ. (26), may be passed through a
    narrow-band filter and amplifier, to produce what is effectively a
    strong electrical second local oscillator (2nd L.O.) signal for an
    electrical mixer.  It may also be used to lock a narrow-band Phase
    Locked Loop (PLL) whose Voltage Controlled Oscillator (VCO) is used as
    the strong, amplitude-stable and clean 2nd local oscillator.  The
    information signal as stated by Equ. (27), may be passed through a
    wideband filter and applied to the other port of this electrical mixer.
    The 2nd I.F. output of the electrical mixer is proportional to:

    Ep(t).Es(t).Eo(t)^2.cos[(ws-wp)t+phi(t)]                            (28)


    The phase disturbances dphi introduced by the atmospheric turbulence
    and laser jitters have been eliminated by the process of electrical
    mixing.  Thus, if the image of the transmitter is instantaneously or
    sequentially smeared out over many pixels, all the second I.F. contri-
    butions are in phase, and may be simply summed to provide predetection
    diversity combining and a substantial reduction in amplitude
    instability (scintillation).

    It also provides the best type of predetection summation in the form of
    Maximal-Ratio Combining.  Although the system appears to implement
    Equal-Gain Combining, the effect of the electronic mixer is to cause
    the weakest signals to be automatically weighted downwards, and hence
    cause Maximal Ratio Combining of the photodetector signals.  Those
    pixels producing the weakest signal also produce the lowest quantum,
    Planckian or background noise contributions to the input of the
    electrical mixer, so that the summed electrical signal power is not
    degraded by noise from pixels with little or no optical signal.  This
    occurs because when no optical signal is present, the noise output of
    each electronic mixer is essentially that due to a noise^2 term, and
    hence is very small.  Only a single MCSA would be required, which would
    be effectively continuously "looking" at the combined outputs of all
    16,384 pixels.  We would have only one MCSA, but 16,384 electronic
    front-end systems for predetection combining of the photodetector
    outputs, based on the mixing technique illustrated in Figure 11.

    A predetection combining system with a single MCSA would not detect
    directly any Planckian starlight noise from a star in the array field-
    of-view alone, only that which overlapped and mixed (downconverted)
    with an ETI signal on one or more pixels.  However, for nearby stars
    where the transmitter and star are separately resolved, we would lose
    any Planckian suppression effect of a (single pixel) diffraction
    limited telescope.  Also, if there are significant interstellar or
    atmospheric group-delay dispersion effects between the signal and
    pilot-tone, the technique would not work.  This consideration may
    affect the choice for the value of (fs-fp) and may itself limit
    modulation bandwidth to be less than a few GHz, notwithstanding SNR
    considerations.  Of course, to use this technique will require the
    cooperation of the ETI.

    Would they be so obliging?  It would be difficult to justify building
    such a receiving signal processing system without foreknowledge that

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 86

    ETIs employ this technique - this could be said to be putting the cart
    before the horse!  Anyway, before implementing such a system, assuming
    ETIs would use such a modulation format, we would have had to
    previously detect this modulation format to know what electrical
    filters to use!


    Radio Frequency Signal-To-Noise Ratio:

    The Carrier-To-Noise Ratio (CNR) in the Microwave Heterodyne [5,8,85]
    100-meter diameter, 1 kW dish system operating at 1.5 GHz over a range
    of 10 light years:

           Pr
    CNR = ----                                                          (29)
          kTBe

    where  Pr  = received power (1.72 X 10^-22 W),
           T   = effective system temperature (10 K),
           Be  = electrical intermediate frequency bandwidth (1 Hz).

                                  CNR = 1 dB

    A symmetrical Cyclops array system [5] with 900 such dishes at both the
    transmitter and receiver would have a CNR = 60 dB.


    Optical Signal-To-Noise Ratio:

    The dimensions of all signal and noise components the following optical
    expressions are in units of amperes^2, and by multiplying by the
    photodetector load impedance, may be turned into units of power.  The
    numerators are representative of the electrical signal power in the
    photodetector load, while the denominators represents the electrical
    noise power in the photodetector load. [71-78]

    For coherent receivers, dual-balanced photodetection is assumed so that
    all the received signal power is utilized, and the noise floor is not
    raised by excess intensity noise on the local-oscillator laser.  It is
    further assumed that the linewidths of the received signal and local-
    oscillator laser are sufficiently small compared to the modulation
    bandwidths, as to not raise the noise floor.

    The effective system noise temperature of an optical receiver may be
    expressed in the form:

            h.f
    Teff = -----  K                                                     (30)
           eta.k

    where  h = Planck's constant (6.63 X 10^-34 J.s),
           f = frequency (4.57 X 10^14 Hz).

                                Teff = 43,900 K

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 87

    Incoherent Signal-To-Noise Ratio:

    Direct Detection and Photon-Counting

                                   Pr^2(MRi)^2
  SNR = --------------------------------------------------------------  (31)
        [2e{Ri(Pr+NbBo)+Ib}M^(2+x)+2eIs+2Nb{Pr+NbBo}(MRi)^2+4kTF/RL]Be

    where  Pr  = received optical power (W),
           Po  = local oscillator power (W),
           M   = avalanche gain,
           eta = photodetector quantum efficiency (0.5),
           Ri  = unity gain responsivity (W/A),
           e   = electronic charge (1.6 X 10^-19 C),
           Nb  = background radiation spectral density (W/Hz),
           Ib  = bulk dark current at unity gain (A),
           Is  = surface dark current (A),
           x   = excess noise factor,
           k   = Boltzmann's constant (1.38 X 10^-23 J/K),
           T   = front-end amplifier temperature (K),
           F   = front-end amplifier noise figure,
           RL  = front-end load (Ohms),
           Bo  = optical pre-detection bandwidth (Hz),
           Be  = noise equivalent electrical bandwidth, which for a single-
                 pole filter = PI/2 x maximum modulation frequency (Hz).


    The electrical signal power is proportional to Pr^2, and the noise
    components proportional:

    1.  To the quantum noise produced by the signal photons.

    2.  To the fluctuation noise produced by the background radiation Pb
        (NbBo).  Notice that this noise is proportional to the optical
        bandwidth, and the ratio of this noise to the quantum noise
        component is inversely proportional to the received optical power.

    3.  To the shot noise produced by the bulk dark current in the photo-
        detector.

    4.  To the shot noise produced by the surface leakage dark current.

    5.  To the background radiation beating with the signal, which is
        independent of optical bandwidth.  The noise spectral density is
        the important factor here.

    6.  To the noise beating with noise, which is proportional to both the
        noise spectral density squared and the optical bandwidth.  The
        latter two noise components are insignificant and may be safely
        omitted for this application where the background is very small.

    7.  To the thermal kT noise in the photodetector load and front-end
        amplifier, and may be neglected for shot noise limited direct
        detection receivers, and ideal photon-counting receivers.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 88

    The total noise produced is proportional to the electrical post-
    detection bandwidth Be.  To an approximation at high avalanche gain,
    the surface dark current component Is, which is not subject to gain,
    is sometimes ignored, and Ib is called Id.


    Coherent Signal-To-Noise Ratio:

    Heterodyne Detection (Reception)

                                  HPrPo(MRi)^2
 CNR = ---------------------------------------------------------------- (32)
       [e{Ri(Pr+Po+NbBo)+Ib}M^(2+x)+eIs+2Nb{HPo+NbBo}(MRi)^2+2kTF/RL]Be


    Homodyne Detection

                                  2HPrPo(MRi)^2
 CNR = ---------------------------------------------------------------- (33)
       [e{Ri(Pr+Po+NbBo)+Ib}M^(2+x)+eIs+2Nb{HPo+NbBo}(MRi)^2+2kTF/RL]Be


    The electrical signal power is proportional to Pr and the optical
    mixing efficiency H, and the noise components proportional:

    1.  To the quantum noise produced by the signal photons.

    2.  To the shot noise produced by the local oscillator.

    3.  To the fluctuation noise produced by the background radiation Pb
        (NbBo).  This noise is also proportional to the optical bandwidth
        and its ratio to the quantum shot noise is effectively inversely
        proportional to the local oscillator power Po.

    4.  To the shot noise produced by the bulk dark current in the photo-
        detector.

    5.  To the shot noise produced by the surface leakage dark current.

    6.  To the background radiation beating with the local oscillator,
        which is very small, the noise being proportional to the noise
        spectral density and independent of optical bandwidth.

    7.  To the background noise spectral density squared, which is again
        very small, the noise being proportional to the optical bandwidth.

    8.  To the thermal kT noise of the optical front-end, which like the
        case for all other noise components except that due to the local-
        oscillator quantum shot-noise, is negligible for sufficient local-
        oscillator power.

    The local-oscillator (L.O.) is assumed to have negligible excess
    intensity noise or it is balanced out, so that the Relative Intensity
    Noise (RIN) is at the theoretical quantum noise level.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 89

    Note, the excess noise due to a non-Poisson distribution of arriving
    photons in a power-starved situation, is not included in this expres-
    sion.  Poisson statistics imply that sufficient photons arrive during
    the observation time to take the probability of the arrival of a photon
    as being given by a binomial distribution. [83]  In situations where
    the optical receiver is power-starved, i.e., when there are relatively
    few photons arriving during the signal integration time so that Bose-
    Einstein [73] statistics apply, the non-white noise associated with
    statistics of the photon arrival times will lower the effective CNR.

    The total noise produced is again proportional to the electrical post-
    optical detection bandwidth Be.  Usually Po >> Pr and Pb, and thus
    other multiplicative noise components relating to Pr and Pb are not
    included in these expressions, since they are negligible.  For this
    application the nearest star is several light years away, Po is much
    larger the background Pb, and the latter component is also negligible
    for all optical bandwidths, unlike the case for incoherent detection.
    This is also generally true for large diffraction limited telescopes
    operating in daylight.  For SETI to be practical, the EIRP needs to be
    extremely high, but since the star is distant, the background Nb is
    very small.  However, for communications within the solar system, these
    background noise components (from the Sun or reflected light from Earth
    or another planet) can be significant. [94-95]

    For the Amateur Optical SETI analysis, a more conservative approach for
    assessing the performance of various receiving systems has been
    employed.  Account has been made for the efficiencies of atmospheric
    transmission, telescope aperture, monochromator (incoherent systems
    only) and in the case of coherent receivers, an allowance for the
    optical (heterodyne or homodyne) mixing efficiency.

    Expression (31) relates to incoherent detection, while (32) and (33)
    relate to coherent detection.  The ideal shot-noise limited direct
    detection receiver approaches the performance of the photon-counting
    receiver at higher received powers.  For substantially cooled photon-
    counting receivers, the dark currents Is and Ib may be taken as zero,
    and thermal noise is insignificant.  In the quantum noise limit, the
    CNR of the homodyne system is 3 dB more than the heterodyne, which is
    itself 3 dB more than the direct detection or photon-counting receiver.


    Quantum-Noise Limited Signal-To-Noise Ratio:

    The Carrier-To-Noise Ratio in a perfect quantum noise limited (656 nm)
    optical heterodyne system where the L.O. has negligible intensity and
    phase noise, and where the shot noise from the L.O. swamps all other
    sources of noise, is given by:

          eta.Pr
    CNR = ------                                                        (34)
          hfBif

    where  Pr  = received optical power (1.6 nW),
           Bif = Intermediate Frequency bandwidth (30 MHz).

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 90

    One of the major advantages of using the normalized CNR approach is
    that we can express the CNR for the perfect diffraction-limited
    ten meter diameter symmetrical heterodyne system, for any transmitter
    power, range and electrical bandwidth, in the form:

     ------------------------------------------------------
    |                                                      |
    |  CNR = 54 + 10.log(Pt) - 20.log(R) - 10.log(Be)  dB  |            (35)
    |                                                      |
     ------------------------------------------------------

    where  Pt = transmitter power (kW),
           R  = range (L.Y.),
           Be = I.F. bandwidth (Hz).


    For Pt = 1 GW, R = 10 L.Y., and Be = Bif = 30 MHz:

                                  CNR = 19 dB


    Again, it should be remembered that this relationship (Equ. 35) only
    holds out to distances where interstellar attenuation is insignificant,
    and will over-estimate the CNR at very low received optical powers (Pr)
    and/or higher bandwidths (Be).  For a huge transmitting array, the
    Rayleigh near-field range may be so large (Equ. 7), that the 20.log(R)
    term disappears from the above expression, and the 54 dB constant has
    a higher value.

    We see that one advantage of coherent detection for this application is
    that the effective bandwidth determining the relative level of detected
    background noise is the electrical bandwidth Be, not the optical
    bandwidth Bo.  Since Be can be much less than Bo, coherent receivers
    have a considerable sensitivity advantage over incoherent receivers in
    the presence of weak signals and/or significant background radiation,
    besides being able to allow for the demodulation of phase or frequency-
    modulated signals.  In the case of the heterodyne receiver, Be
    corresponds to the I.F. bandwidth, and the signal has still to be
    demodulated.  A further stage of "detection", either square-law or
    synchronous, must be applied to demodulate the intelligence on the
    signal.  For this reason, the signal-to-noise ratio for the radio
    frequency heterodyne and optical heterodyne systems is denoted as CNR
    and not SNR.


    Signal Integration:

    In practically all SETI systems, what is being looked for is an ETI
    beacon.  In such systems, the sensitivity of the receiver is enhanced
    by post-detection signal integration, perhaps over many seconds.  This
    increases the detected signal level, and reduces the noise level; both
    at the expense of increasing the search time.  This can only be done
    for detecting the presence of a signal beacon, not for the demodulation
    of a continuously and rapidly changing non-repetitive signal.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 91

    In the case of a microwave or optical receiver with square law
    detection and an input SNR less than unity, the Signal-To-Noise Ratio
    can be increased by (post-detection) integration of a number of
    detected pulses over a period of time.  In such a situation, the SNR is
    proportional to the square-root of (Nc), where Nc is the total pulse
    count during the observation integration time. [83,88]  The same
    relationship applies to the post-detection counting of individual
    photons, but not to pre-detection.  That is why the quantum limited
    CNRs (SNRs) for both incoherent and coherent optical detection systems
    are proportional to the photon count rate.  See Equ. 36 below.


    Photon-Count Rate:

    The equivalent photon-count rate for the heterodyne receiver is given
    by:

          eta.Pr
    Nph = ------  s^-1                                                  (36)
            hf


    Alternatively, this can be expressed as CNR.(Bif).  For the 1 GW
    transmitter that results in a CNR = 19 dB re 30 MHz:

                            Nph = 2.64 X 10^9 s^-1


    This count rate is more than adequate for the photon arrival (and
    detection) statistics to be taken as Gaussian (Poisson), and hence the
    CNR expressions should give an accurate figure for the Carrier-To-Noise
    Ratio.  This is reasonably true even for the 1 kW transmitter, where
    on average, only 5,280 photons arrive per second, of which on average,
    2,640 photons are detected every second.  However, the method of
    expressing CNRs in this analysis, even in the power-starved case,
    allows for a simple linear extrapolation for CNR at any received
    optical power (Equ. 35).


    Bit Error Rate (BER):

    This analysis has concentrated on optical signal detectability in terms
    of SNR not Bit Error Rate (BER), as would be applicable for a digital
    system.  For the sake of completeness, the following expression may be
    used to predict the photon-count rate for a required BER: [78]

        -ln(2.BER)
    m = ----------                                                      (37)
          log N
             2

    where m = average number of photons per bit required by an ideal N-PPM
              (pulse position modulation) system to achieve a given BER.


    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 92

    The photon-count rate is simply the product of m and the bit rate.  For
    an ideal coherent system with on-off keying (OOK) or 1-PPM,
    BER = 10^-9, and very small extinction (light off/light on) ratio,
    m = 10 photons/bit.  However, a more realistic value is nearer to
    20 photons/bit.  Thus, for a 1 GHz (approx. 1 GBit/s) channel:

                  Minimum Photon-Count Rate = 2 X 10^10 s^-1


    The modelled 1 GW system is a little deficient in being able to achieve
    this goal, since this required count rate is an order of magnitude
    greater than the calculated value of Nph.  With digital compression
    techniques, the 1 GW transmitter is capable of supporting a late
    Twentieth Century digital HDTV signal, compressed into a 10 MHz
    bandwidth. [87]


    Range Equation:

    Instead of expressing the CNR as a function of transmitter power,
    range and bandwidth, we can express the quality of the optical
    communications link in terms of its maximum range.  As before, if we
    ignore interstellar absorption, the range (in light years) required to
    reduce the quantum limited CNR to 0 dB for the "perfect" 10-meter
    diameter 656 nm symmetrical Professional Optical SETI system defined by
    Equ. 35, can be express in the form:

    Rmax = 10^[{54 + 10.log(Pt) - 10.log(Be)}/20]                       (38)

    where  Pt = transmitter power (kW),
           Be = I.F. bandwidth (Hz).


    For Pt = 1 GW (EIRP = 2.29 X 10^24 W) and Be = 1 MHz:

                                Rmax = 500 L.Y.


    Doppler Shift:

    The maximum Doppler Shift is given by:

         v
    df = -.f  Hz                                                        (39)
         c

    where  v = maximum line-of-sight velocity (29.8 km/s),
           c = velocity of light (3 X 10^8 m/s),
           f = frequency (4.57 X 10^14 Hz).






    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 93

    For a ground-based receiving telescope, the maximum local Doppler Shift
    at 656 nm due to the orbit of Earth around the Sun:

                               df = +/- 45.5 GHz


    Doppler Drift:

    The maximum Doppler Drift (Chirp) is given by:

          w^2.r
    df' = -----.f  Hz/s                                                 (40)
            c

    where  w = angular velocity (7.27 X 10^-5 rad/s),
           r = radius of planet or orbit (6,378 km).


    For a receiving telescope on the equator, the maximum local Doppler
    Drift at 656 nm due to Earth's rotation is:

                              df' = +/- 51 kHz/s


    Fortunately, for Amateur Optical SETI observations, the Doppler Drift
    during reasonable observations times is insignificant with respect to
    the bandpass of the incoherent optical filter (approximately 100 GHz).




























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 94

                                  APPENDIX B

                              THE SETI PROTOCOLS

    The following information was provided by Robert Arnold of the SETI
    Institute.


                                          November 20, 1991

    Dear Colleague,

    It is my pleasure to send you a copy of a document entitled
    "Declaration of Principles Concerning Activities Following the
    Detection of Extraterrestrial Intelligence."

    The Declaration was developed over a period of several years by the
    SETI Committee of the International Academy of Astronautics, with the
    assistance of many experts interested in this question.  In April of
    1989 it was approved by the Board of Trustees of the Academy, and also
    by the Board of Directors of the International Institute of Space Law.
    Over the last two years it has been endorsed by the Committee on Space
    Research, by Commission 51 of the International Astronomical Union, by
    the members of Commission J of the Union Radio Scientifique
    Internationale, and by the International Astronautical Federation.

    The document is intended as a series of guidelines for individuals or
    organizations, national or international, engaged in carrying out radio
    searches for extraterrestrial intelligence.  In the near future it will
    be sent by the Academy to all such individuals and organizations with a
    request that they give consideration to endorsing it.

    In the meantime, the SETI Committee of the International Academy of
    Astronautics will continue to review the principles and procedures of
    the Declaration, and will assemble a special post-detection committee,
    as indicated in Principle 9 of the document.  The Committee is also
    working on a second declaration, designed to expand the wording of
    Principle 8 into a process for obtaining international agreement on
    questions about a reply from Earth after the detection of a signal.

    Sincerely,



    John Billingham
    Chief, SETI Office

    Enclosure:







    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 95

    Declaration of Principles Concerning Activities Following the Detection
    of Extraterrestrial Intelligence -


    We, the institutions and individuals participating in the search for
    extraterrestrial intelligence,

    Recognizing that the search for extraterrestrial intelligence is an
    integral part of space exploration and is being undertaken for peaceful
    purposes and for the common interest of all mankind,

    Inspired by the profound significance for mankind of detecting evidence
    of extraterrestrial intelligence, even though the probability of
    detection may be low,

    Recalling the Treaty on Principles Governing the Activities of States
    in the Exploration and Use of Outer Space, Including the Moon and Other
    Celestial Bodies, which commits States Parties to that Treaty "to
    inform the Secretary General of the United Nations as well as the
    public and the international scientific community, to the greatest
    extent feasible and practicable, of the, nature, conduct, locations and
    results" of their space exploration activities (Article XI),

    Recognizing that any initial detection may be incomplete or ambiguous
    and thus require careful examination as well as confirmation, and that
    it is essential to maintain the highest standards of scientific
    responsibility and credibility,

    Agree to observe the following principles for disseminating information
    about the detection of extraterrestrial intelligence:

    1.  Any individual, public or private research institution, or
        governmental agency that believes it has detected a signal from or
        other evidence of extraterrestrial intelligence (the discoverer)
        should seek to verify that the most plausible explanation for the
        evidence is the existence of extraterrestrial intelligence rather
        than some other natural phenomenon or anthropogenic phenomenon
        before making any public announcement.  If the evidence cannot be
        confirmed as indicating the existence of extraterrestrial
        intelligence, the discoverer may disseminate the information as
        appropriate to the discovery of any unknown phenomenon.

    2.  Prior to making a public announcement that evidence of extra-
        terrestrial intelligence has been detected, the discoverer should
        promptly inform all other observers or research organizations that
        are parties to this declaration, so that those other parties may
        seek to confirm the discovery by independent observations at other
        sites and so that a network can be established to enable continuous
        monitoring of the signal or phenomenon.  Parties to this
        declaration should not make any public announcement of this
        information until it is determined whether this information is or
        is not credible evidence of the existence of extraterrestrial
        intelligence.  The discoverer should inform his/her or its relevant
        national authorities.

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 96

    3.  After concluding that the discovery appears to be credible evidence
        of extraterrestrial intelligence, and after informing other parties
        to this declaration, the discoverer should inform observers
        throughout the world through the Central Bureau for Astronomical
        Telegrams of the International Astronomical Union, and should
        inform the Secretary General of the United Nations in accordance
        with Article XI of the Treaty on Principles Governing the
        Activities of States in the Exploration and Use of Outer Space,
        Including the Moon and Other Bodies.  Because of their demonstrated
        interest in and expertise concerning the question of the existence
        of extraterrestrial intelligence, the discoverer should
        simultaneously inform the following international institutions of
        the discovery and should provide them with all pertinent data and
        recorded information concerning the evidence:  the International
        Telecommunication Union, the Committee on Space Research, of the
        International Council of Scientific Unions, the International
        Astronautical Federation, the International Academy of
        Astronautics, the International Institute of Space Law, Commission
        51 of the International Astronomical Union and Commission J of the
        International Radio Science Union.

    4.  A confirmed detection of extraterrestrial intelligence should be
        disseminated promptly, openly, and widely through scientific
        channels and public media, observing the procedures in this
        declaration.  The discoverer should have the privilege of making
        the first public announcement.

    5.  All data necessary for confirmation of detection should be made
        available to the international scientific community through
        publications, meetings, conferences, and other appropriate means.

    6.  The discovery should be confirmed and monitored and any data
        bearing on the evidence of extraterrestrial intelligence should be
        recorded and stored permanently to the greatest extent feasible and
        practicable, in a form that will make it available for further
        analysis and interpretation.  These recordings should be made
        available to the international institutions listed above and to
        members of the scientific community for further objective analysis
        and interpretation.

    7.  If the evidence of detection is in the form of electromagnetic
        signals, the parties to this declaration should seek international
        agreement to protect the appropriate frequencies by exercising
        procedures available through the International Telecommunication
        Union.  Immediate notice should be sent to the Secretary General of
        the ITU in Geneva, who may include a request to minimize trans-
        missions on the relevant frequencies in the Weekly Circular.  The
        Secretariat, in conjunction with advice of the Union's Admini-
        strative Council, should explore the feasibility and utility of
        convening an Extraordinary Administrative Radio Conference to deal
        with the matter, subject to the opinions of the member Admini-
        strations of the ITU.



    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 97

    8.  No response to a signal or other evidence of extraterrestrial
        intelligence should be sent until appropriate international
        consultations have taken place.  The procedures for such
        consultations will be the subject of a separate agreement,
        declaration or arrangement.

    9.  The SETI Committee of the International Academy of Astronautics, in
        coordination with Commission 51 of the International Astronomical
        Union, will conduct a continuing review of procedures for the
        detection of extraterrestrial intelligence and the subsequent
        handling of the data.  Should credible evidence of extraterrestrial
        intelligence be discovered, an international committee of
        scientists and other experts should be established to serve as a
        focal point for continuing analysis of all observational evidence
        collected in the aftermath of the discovery, and also to provide
        advice on the release of information to the public.  This committee
        should be constituted from representatives of each of the
        international institutions listed above and such other members as
        the committee may deem necessary.  To facilitate the convocation of
        such a committee at some unknown time in the future, the SETI
        Committee of the International Academy of Astronautics should
        initiate and maintain a current list of willing representatives
        from each of the international institutions listed above, as well
        as other individuals with relevant skills, and should make that
        list continuously available through the Secretariat of the
        International Academy of Astronautics.  The International Academy
        of Astronautics will act as the Depository for this declaration and
        will annually provide a current list of parties to all the parties
        to this declaration.


























    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 98

                                    INDEX


A  Adaptive                               17,20,24,39,43,52,58
   Airy Disk                              47,78
   All Sky Survey                         4,31,33-34,82-83
   Alpha Centauri                         54
   Amateur Optical SETI                   5-6,8,16,25,37,42,45-48,51-52,54,
                                          60-61,90,92
   Ames Research Center (ARC)             3,11,19
   Arecibo                                11,16,20,27-28,36
   Asimov, Isaac                          25
   Assumption of Ineptitude               13,58
   Assumption of Mediocrity               13
   Avalanche Photodetector (APD)          7,42,44,48-50

B  Beacon                                 10,28,39,52,55,90
   BETA                                   4
   Betz, Albert                           5,7,9,13,20,35-37,55,61,78
   Big Ear Radio Observatory              7,40
   Billingham, John                       5,94
   Bit Error Rate (BER)                   41,91
   Bose-Einstein                          89
   Bova, Ben                              3
   Bulletin Board System (BBS)            6

C  Carbon Dioxide Laser (CO2)             5,13,20,29,35-38,55,61,78-79
   Carrier-To-Noise Ratio (CNR)           15-17,24,26-28,33-34,36,41,43,50,
                                          82,86,88-91
   Challenger                             59
   Charge Coupled Device (CCD)            42,46-51
   Clarke, Arthur C.                      8,41,57-58
   Cold Fusion                            2
   Columbus Telescope                     40
   Coherence Cell                         11,18
   Coherent                               14-15,18,20,26,37,40,42,46,49,
                                          60-61,78,86,88-91
   Contact                                1-3,27,40,56-57,63
   Cosmic Catastrophes                    57
   Cosmic Haystack                        4,32,43
   Cosmic Zoo                             2,62
   Cullers, Kent                          3,8,54
   Cyclops                                7,18,19-20,23,26-27,54,58,81,86

D  Dark Current                           38,46,49,87-89
   Daylight (Optical SETI)                20,26,36,42-43,45-47,54,58,79,89
   Deep Space Network (DSN)               11
   Directivity                            36,75
   Direct Detection                       18,25,36-37,40,42-46,51,60-61,78,
                                          87,89-90
   Discovery                              58
   Dixon, Robert                          4,7,40
   Doppler Drift (Chirp)                  11,14,16,22,24,32-33,46,56,93
   Doppler Shift                          11,22,24,32,35,46,56,92-93

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                     Page 99

   Drake Equation                         71
   Drake, Frank                           3,9,71

E  Effective Noise Temperature            15,86
   EIRP                                   17,19,21-22,28,37-38,41,43-46,60,
                                          72,77-79
   Epsilon Eradani                        54

F  Fabry-Perot                            45
   Fast Fourier Transform (FFT)           4,34,48
   Fermi's Paradox                        1
   Field-Of-View (FOV)                    31,36-37,47,56,78,80-81,85
   Fraunhofer                             4,17,23,25-26,30-31,34-35,43,46,
                                          59,73
   Free Electron Laser                    21,29

G  Gaussian Beams                         73-75

H  Heliographs                            9
   Heterodyne                             4,14-18,20,22-23,25,35,37,42,45,
                                          49-50,56,82-84,86,88-91
   Homodyne                               14,49,83,88-89
   Horowitz, Paul                         4
   Hubble Space Telescope (HST)           13,20

I  Image Intensifier                      42,46
   Incoherent Detection                   18,25,36-37,40,42-46,51,60-61,78,
                                          87,89-90
   Interferometer                         5,8,37,40,55

J  Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL)        11

K  Karhunen-Loeve Transform (KLT)         4,60
   Kraus, John                            40

L  Light Pollution                        26,60
   Local-Oscillator (L.O.)                5,11,14-15,20,29,31,33-34,37,44,
                                          48,56,79,82-88

M  Magic Wavelength (or Frequency)        3,9,20,26,29,45,57,82
   Magnitude (Intensity)                  21-24,28,41,43-46,53-54,72
   Microchannel Plate                     46
   Microwave Observing Project (MOP)      4-5,8,13,31,40,52-54,57-59,82
   Monochromator                          42,45,47-48,50-51,54,60,89
   Morrison, Philip                       3,7,9,13
   MultiChannel Spect. Analy. (MCSA)      14,33-36,52,82,84-85

N  NASA                                   3-5,7,9,11,19,27,35,38,45,58,
                                          61-62
   Neodymium YAG Laser (Nd:YAG)           18,21,27,29
   Noise Equivalent Bandwidth             87

O  Oliver, Bernard                        3,7,9,21,31
   Optoelectronics                        19

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992
                                                                    Page 100

P  Perkins Telescope                      40,46
   Photomultiplier (PM)                   42,48-50
   Photon-Counting                        16,18,37,42,44-46,49,51,60,79,
                                          87,89
   Photon Count Rate                      91
   Photonics                              19,62
   Pilot-Tone                             10-11,20,39,82-85
   Planckian                              17,20,22-23,25-28,39,42-44,46,49,
                                          56,73,76,85
   Planetary Report                       4
   Poisson Counting                       15-16,89,91
   Polar Response                         75-76
   Prime Directive                        56
   Professional Optical SETI              4,8,14,16,40,46,59-61
   Project Ozma                           9,54

Q  Quantum (Shot) Noise                   14-17,25-26,28,37,43,79,85,87-89

R  Range Equation                         92
   Rather, John                           7,9,21,75
   Rayleigh Range                         24,74-75,90
   Rayleigh Resolution                    80
   Rayleigh Scattering                    39,59
   Rosetta Stone                          10

S  Sagan, Carl                            3
   Semaphores                             9
   Serendip                               22,26,39-40,59
   SETI Institute                         3,5,7,12,31,54,58,62,71
   SETI Protocols                         63,94
   Signal-To-Noise Ratio (SNR)            6,11,16,20-26,34,36-38,43-46,48,
                                          49,59,79,85,86-91
   Space Odyssey (2001 and 2010)          58
   Spectrometer                           36,38,44-45,47,49,51,55,78
   Spielberg, Steven                      4
   Star Trek                              62
   Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)     14
   Symbiotic                              22,26,39-40,59

T  Targeted Search                        11-12,31,33-34,46,52-54,82
   Tarter, Jill                           8,25,54,61
   Tau Ceti                               54
   Thermal Noise                          14,87-89
   Tipler, Frank                          1,56-57
   Townes, Charles                        5,7,9,13,20,35-37,55,61,63
   Type I, II, and III Civilizations      2-3

U  Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs)     1-2,63

V  Von Neumann                            1-2,32,56

W  Waterhole                              3,32

Z  Zuckerman, Ben                         9,20

    EJASA, Vol. 3, No. 6, January 1992



                                  ADDENDUM 1


>From Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley, the author of the six-part EJASA article
(Volume 3, Number 6, January 1992) on Optical SETI.

The Optical SETI article was placed on the network on Monday, January 27,
1992, and posted to the newsgroups; sci.space, sci.astro, sci.space.news,
sci.misc and rec.arts.sf.science.  For those who use a keyword search of the
subject headers and may not have realized that the EJASA article was devoted
to Optical SETI, the list below gives the message numbers for the posting on
sci.space and sci.astro.

FILE NAME                                                 MESSAGE NUMBERS
                                                        SCI.SPACE  SCI.ASTRO
READ.ME        Details about printing out the article   30085      16040
EJASAV3.N6A    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part A        30088      16041
EJASAV3.N6B    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part B        30090      16042
EJASAV3.N6C    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part C        30099      16045
EJASAV3.N6D    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part D        30101      16046
EJASAV3.N6E    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part E        30105      16049
EJASAV3.N6F    EJASA, Volume 3, Number 6, Part F        30110      16051


Readers should note that a couple of years ago, a technique was described in
the scientific literature of how to improved on the diffraction-limited
performance of (relatively small) optical telescopes, so that for
transmitters, the far-field inverse square law doesn't apply.  The very idea
of transmitting beams smaller than the life zones of nearby star systems is
a major hurdle in itself to the general acceptance of the efficacy of
Optical SETI.  Thus, the discussion of this Bessel technique was purposely
avoided in the EJASA paper, but will likely be described at a later date.

By a strange coincidence, on the day following this posting (Tuesday,
January 28, 1992), what should come through my mailbox but the Newsletter of
SPIE's (Society of Photo-Optical Instrumentation Engineers) International
Technical Working Group on Laser Communications (ILCS).  The January 1992
issue was devoted to a profile and interview with a Dr. Monte Ross, with
some discussion given to Optical SETI.  He used to work for McDonnell
Douglas and is now President of Laser Data Technology, Inc., which is
located in St. Louis, Missouri.

I have since had a phone conversation with Dr. Ross, who is the author of
one of the first optoelectronics books published in the 1960's.  Unlike
Dr. Bernard Oliver of NASA's SETI Office, who also wrote some of the first
papers on optoelectronics back in the early 1960's on his own and in
conjunction with Professor Charles Townes, and did not agree with the
Optical SETI ideas of the latter, Dr. Ross is a strong believer in the
efficacy of lasers for interstellar communications.  I often consulted
Dr. Ross's book (from the library at University College London) while doing
my Ph.D. research in the early 1970's.  In those days, the information I
needed for my work on the first single-mode fiber-optic Mach-Zehnder
heterodyning interferometer (fiber-optic data highway) was based on prior
work done with free-space optical heterodyning communication systems.  The
Mach-Zehnder work paved the way for pioneering work by University College
London on fiber-optic sensing.  It is perhaps slightly ironic that the wheel
may be turning full circle for me in that my professional activities are
returning to free-space optical communications.

Dr. Ross conjectures the use of pulsed transmissions by ETIs, perhaps of
about 1 ns duration, to get the high peak EIRP's required to allow
incoherent light-bucket photon-counters to be employed.  The SPIE article
ends by remarking that Dr. Ross would like to see some engineering society
or foundation put together a study to define a specific plan and program.  I
concur with that thought, though I believe that the EJASA article already
accomplishes some of this.  I would like to see an Optical SETI Foundation
set up, and am working to achieve this end.  The EJASA article was just one
of many actions on my part required to establish a sufficiently large
constituency to make this goal achievable.  The setting up of a computer
bulletin board system (BBS) devoted to Optical SETI was another.  I intend
to make a major contribution to forming The Optical SETI Institute (TOSI),
or whatever it is eventually called, which would operate either as part of
the SETI Institute or as a separate entity.  I would like to hear from
anyone who could offer expertise in areas related to Optical SETI, either
from a technical viewpoint or for getting such a foundation up and running.

Dr. Ross is sending me copies of his papers on Optical SETI that were
published in the 1980's, some of which I gather were published in the
British Journal of Interplanetary Science (?).  After I have received copies
of Dr. Ross's papers, I will issue ADDENDUM.2 containing the citations for
these references, and some brief comments.  I did not conduct an extensive
independent literature review for all papers relating to Optical SETI,
because it was thought that between my contacts with the few people actively
involved in this field and particularly with the SETI Institute, I would
have picked up all relevant material.

This just goes to demonstrate how compartmentalized are the fields of
science.  During out phone conversation, Monte Ross informed me that he had
no contact with the SETI Institute and NASA, and preferred to work outside
established SETI channels.  I have chosen to work within existing SETI
organizations to try and establish a constituency for Optical SETI.  Indeed,
since the network postings of the EJASA article last week, I have been
mailing floppy disks with the article to selected scientists, engineers and
politicians in the United States and the United Kingdom.

So often, we find that radio astronomers don't talk to optical astronomers
who don't talk to communication engineers.  Scientists and engineers have a
tendency to search and read only the literature in the main-stream of their
own professional activities (these days a difficult and time-consuming task
by itself).  It is when engineers and scientist step outside their normal
areas of specialty and consider the application of their technology to other
branches of science, that the "connection" is made that often leads to the
development of an exciting new endeavor.  If professional optical
astronomers have been negligent in not seeing the potential for Optical SETI
and have allowed microwave communication scientists/engineers to dominate
SETI, it probably is because the former are more concerned with wide optical
bandwidths and integrating detected photons, while Optical SETI communi-
cation scientists/engineers would be more concerned with very narrow optical
bandwidths (compared to that of the visible and infrared spectrum) and
wideband modulation (compared to normal radio frequency modulation
bandwidths).

This has taught me the dangers of assuming that the "experts" know all about
what is going on in the world in their particular field.  The moral of the
story is "Don't leave literature searches to others"!  It is less likely
that I have missed any extensive Optical SETI observations that were not
reported in the EJASA.  Somehow I don't think that the SETI Institute would
have missed out on that one!  But on the other hand . . .  If you know of
anyone conducting professional/semi-professional or amateur Optical SETI
observations not mentioned in the EJASA article or people who have written
theoretical papers on the subject, please let me know.

Presently, I have 127 registered users on my BBS, though only a fraction of
them have registered because of their specific interest in Optical SETI.
Saturday (yesterday) was a quiet day.  Since the early hours of this Sunday
morning (it is now 9.45 am), I have obtained four new users, the majority
from out of state.  Clearly, the message has gotten out over the network,
and some people have been busy printing out and digesting the EJASA article
over this weekend.

>From time to time I will issue further Optical SETI addendums to keep
readers up to date on progress in this field.  Keep an eye on newsgroups
sci.space and sci.astro for these postings.


February 2, 1992
File: ADDENDUM.001


 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 * Dr. Stuart A. Kingsley                                                  *
 * Consultant                                                              *
 * AMIEE, SMIEEE,                                                          *
 * The Planetary Society,                                                  *
 * Space Studies Institute,                                                *
 * Columbus Astronomical Society,                                          *
 * Volunteer, SETI Group, Ohio State.                                      *
 *                                                                         *
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----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Catalog of Humanoid Reports
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:09:15 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 329

My apologies if this has been here before.  I wouldn't know as I can not
receive this newsgrope (no sp error here ;^})!

Len




--- Begin included text ------------------------------------------------




Message #7291 - MUFONET
   Date : 02-Sep-91 23:35
   From : Jacques Poulet
     To : All
Subject : Just a theory! 1 of 4

                        Aliens are gods?

          Many people seems to beleive our visitors are Gods! By
definition, to be god-like entities, they'd need to be flawless,
omniscient, perfect. But if we base our belief in those visitors
solely on reports from other witnesses, maybe we should also take
a look at their superior qualities as shown in those same
reports.

          Here are 7 cases which I selected to demonstrate my
point (all emphasis are mine):

CASE 1
Source:   A CATALOG OF HUMANOID REPORTS FOR 1974 by Ted Bloecher,
          MUFON 1975 UFO Symposium Proceedings.

          Observer, a nurse's aid, was walking from one hospital
     building to another when she saw a disc descending; four
     legs emerged and the object landed atop the roof. A ramp, or
     ladder, emerged ...  ... One being turned and saw the
     witness watching; the three then re-entered the object,
     which took off ...

CASE 2
Source:   A CATALOG OF HUMANOID REPORTS FOR 1974 by Ted Bloecher,
          MUFON 1975 UFO Symposium Proceedings.

          Truckdriver observed blinding white light on the road;
     at 200 m. his lights and Diesel motor went out. ... Two 6 ft
     beings appeared ... They looked at the witness, gestured to
     each other, and one pointed at him; the two then disappeared
     around the right side of the UFO, which rose...

The next day:

          Truck lights and motor killed, as before. ...four men
     now appeared and approached, at which the driver got out of
     truck and fled. They followed, gaining.  After running some
     distance, he jumped into drainage ditch and hid; the four
     searched area but did not find him. ... he returned on foot
     and saw, from distance of 8-9 m., the men digging at
     roadside ...

---
 * Origin: Scotian Gold {Mufonet) Mutual Unidentified Flying Ojects Net
(1:167/




Message #7292 - MUFONET
   Date : 02-Sep-91 23:36
   From : Jacques Poulet
     To : All
Subject : Just a theory! 2 of 4


CASE 3
Source:   Contact 158 by Frangois Bourbeau, 200 pages, Louise
          Courteau Editor, ISBN 2-89239-013-3

     This is a transcript of an hypnosis session with M. X. This
men had been abducted with his car. At this point, he's about to
leave the craft:

Yvon      Now, tell me how you got out?

X         I've been told to sit in the car and to touch nothing.
     There will be a count down from ten to one and at that time,
     I must start the engine! A door will open and I should find
     myself on the same road where they pick me up.

Yvon      Where are you now?

X         I just got in the car...

Yvon      Where are you going?

X         Outside... home...

Yvon      What's happening?

X         The count down has started... get ready... (silence for
     three seconds)... THERE... What the hell is happening?
          (M. X shout that sentence, he seems excited). Oh!...
     Boy a boy a boy!...

Yvon      What happened?

X         I hitted a road pannel, on the side of the road...

Yvon      Where are you, precisely?

X         On the road, I am ...

Yvon      What's happening?

X         I've been informed that there has been a technical
     error. They say they'll come back...

---
 * Origin: Scotian Gold {Mufonet) Mutual Unidentified Flying Ojects Net
(1:167/




Message #7293 - MUFONET
   Date : 02-Sep-91 23:37
   From : Jacques Poulet
     To : All
Subject : Just a theory! 3 of 4


CASE 4
Source:   TOUT SUR LES SOUCOUPES VOLANTES by Jean Ferguson, 258
          pages, Lemiac.

          -How long did you observed together?

          -I'm not sure, a little more than 30 minutes.

          -What happenned next?

          -We got back in the car completely frozen. My friend
     told me: "Why don't you flashes your lights?". The car beeing
     in the general direction with the UFO, I thought I could try
     it. I did just that. And sudenly, a very strong light was
     shining on us, ... it lasted a few seconds, then the UFO
     resumed its ...

CASE 5
Source:   INTRUDERS by Budd Hopkins, 318 pages, Ballantine, ISBN
          0-345-34633-5.

     After an hypnosis session with Kathie where she described
how they removed the foetus from her womb:

          ... I asked if she ever said anything to them, ever
     told them that it was cruel, that they had no right to take
     her baby. She spoke to me almost in a wisper, calmly
     furious: "I screamed it at them." Then, in a sad, ironic mix
     of incomprehension and profound personal loss, she added
     this: "And the fucker looked surprised."

CASE 6
Source:   INTRUDERS by Budd Hopkins, 318 pages, Ballantine, ISBN
          0-345-34633-5.

     During the abduction, Ed was raped:

          "... I was laying on my back on this bench and I didn't
     have any clothes on, and somehow they made me erect and she
     mounted me. ... and then she got off and left the room and
     the two guys, they took little spoons and scraped the
     leftover semen off my penis ..."
          "You know, Budd, I'm sterile. ... I'd had a vasectomy a
     couple of years before this." The previous night, just after
     he came out of the hypnotic trance, he mentioned that his
     abductors had seemed angry at him, and now I understood why.

---
 * Origin: Scotian Gold {Mufonet) Mutual Unidentified Flying Ojects Net
(1:167/




Message #7294 - MUFONET
   Date : 02-Sep-91 23:39
   From : Jacques Poulet
     To : All
Subject : Just a theory! 4 of 4


CASE 7
Source:   NIGHT SIEGE by Dr. J. Allen Hynek and Philip J.
          Imbrogno with Bob Pratt, 207 pages, Ballantine, ISBN
          0-345-37086-4.

          Slowing even more, he peered through the windshield,
     straining to make out some type of shape behind the lights.
          "I thought to myself, 'I wish it would come closer so I
     can get a better look at it,' and as soon as that thought
     went through my mind, the object began to descend and head
     straight for my car."
          It had switched off its "searchlight" and was now about
     one hundred yards above the road.



          Let's try to show them the way they really are:

          One of God's (any god) feature is to be omniscient.
Cases 1 and 2, where they didn't know, at first, that there was a
human witness. In case 5, they didn't understand our psychology,
while in case 6, they didn't know that the man they were
abducting for semen sample was sterile. Those example show a less
than know-it-all entity!

          Another of God's feature should be omnipotent. In case
2, the four men can't locate the hidden truck driver. In case 3,
they tell the abductee that "there has been a technical error".
In general, they try their best to hide from us and erase traces
of memory from contactee/abductee, but we still document (even if
only partially) their presence and activities. Not so powerfull
after all!

          They are very curious! They travel long distances to
monitor, record and collect information. They seems to like to
communicate! Maybe they are not suppose to contact any earthling,
but they often do anyway. In case 4 and 7, they answer to a
witness and in case 7, they even give him the opportunity to get
a good look at their craft (as if they were proud of it!).

          They can even become angry! In case 6, Ed had a
definite impression that they were angry at him. Also in case 3,
which it isn't mentioned here, but there were two entities
performing the abduction. The witness beleived that one of them
was mad at him for an unknown reason and that it could be the
cause of the "technical error".


          So, I think we can safely assume that those visitors
are not god-like creatures. They are certainly members of
advanced societies, but it doesn't means that they are flaw-less.


                                        Jacques Poulet

---
 * Origin: Scotian Gold {Mufonet) Mutual Unidentified Flying Ojects Net
(1:167/



Message #7278 - MUFONET  (RECEIVED)
   Date : 01-Sep-91  0:22
   From : John Powell
     To : Jim Greenen
Subject : Abductions/Implants
Replies : #7277 <--> #7279

In a message to John Powell <30 Aug 91  8:40> Jim Greenen wrote:

 JG> John; there have been several implants been found and removed
 JG> from the abductees. These are being analyze at this time but no
 JG> conclusions have been announce as of yet. I think one of these
 JG> implants is at MIT but don't quote me on this.   ---Jim---

Can you back this up with documentation and sources?

Dr. Cro Magnon could figure out in about 20 seconds, with a K-Mart microscope,
that such an object was not from 'here'...

Thanks, take care.
John.

--- XRS! 4.50+
 * Origin: Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence (Quick 1:19/19.19)




Message #7947 - MUFONET
   Date : 04-Sep-91 08:08
   From : Jim Greenen
     To : John Powell
Subject : Abductions/Implants
Replies : #7279 <-

 JP> In a message to John Powell <30 Aug 91  8:40> Jim Greenen
 JP> wrote:
 JP>
 JP>  JG> John; there have been several implants been found and removed
 JP>  JG> from the abductees. These are being analyze at this time but no
 JP>  JG> conclusions have been announce as of yet. I think one of these
 JP>  JG> implants is at MIT but don't quote me on this.   ---Jim---
 JP>
 JP> Can you back this up with documentation and sources?
 JP>
 JP> Dr. Cro Magnon could figure out in about 20 seconds, with a
 JP> K-Mart microscope, that such an object was not from
 JP> 'here'...
 JP>
 JP> Thanks, take care.
 JP> John.
 JP>
 JP> --- XRS! 4.50+
 JP>  * Origin: Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence
 JP> (Quick 1:19/19.19)
By Golly, I'm glad you ask. I just went to a lecture last night that was done
by Bill Knell and he mention this in his lecture. Yes, the implant was sent to
MIT for analyzes and is now at some other university. I think he said that the
results from MIT was that it was made out of earth material but the structure
was of a way that it couldn't be made on this planet with are present
technology.
   The person that this was taken out is named Richard Price and he is having
a book published at this moment and should be out on the shelves soon. If you
want to obtain more information on this Write to: Island Skywatch---164-22
77th Road, Flushing, NY 11365.
   I hope this helps     73's    ---Jim---
--- RemoteAccess 0.03+
 * Origin: Gourmet Delight! Orlando FL  [phone] (1:363/29)


-- EOF -----------------------------------------------------------------


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Livermore Tests 2KW Laser Beam
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:13:11 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 60

Even tho this is being used for research, none the less ALL air traffic has
been warned.  Why? Hmmmm....sure blindness but what if you upped the power,
sounds like a good weapon to me.....the question is against whom or more
specifically.....what?

Len



----- Begin Included Message -----

From [e-mail] Wed Feb 12 13:36:01 1992
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Date: Wed, 12 Feb 92 13:35:16 PST
From: Jordan Kare <[e-mail]>
Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail], [e-mail]
Subject: artificial star
Status: RO


(Replying to your note to Kirk Bertsche -- he relayed the message to me,
and I know a bit more about what's going on).

    Yes, there is a project at the Lab called "Guidestar" which
will use a large laser (the AVLIS laser, built for laser isotope
separation, about 2 kW output in the visible) to excite sodium ions
in the upper atmosphere.  It should be visible from the ground with a
modest telescope (I don't recall the exact brightness) as a yellow
star; it will be directly overhead in Livermore, and visible for
several miles around.  There is, I believe, an active effort to
get Livermore-area amateur astronomers to report on the appearance
(brightness and shape) of the "star".  Actual generation of a guide star
is still several months away, minimum, but some of the hardware is
in place, and they've just about got the environmental and safety approvals
needed.

    I fear it won't be all that impressive, just a yellow blob
hanging high over Livermore; large satellites seen at dusk are more
impressive and naked-eye visible.  However, you might try to
contact the Institute for Geophysics and Planetary Physics, L-419,
(OOPS, make that L-413; my terminal is screwed up and I can't edit
properly right now) LLNL, P.O. Box 808, Livermore CA 94550,
510-423-0621 and ask about the Guidestar project and possible
amateur observing opportunities.

    Jordin Kare


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!agate!dog.ee.lbl.gov!ucbvax!STRATUS.SWDC.STRATUS.COM!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Who Lives in Dublin,Pleasonton,Livermore CA Area?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 23:27:45 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 11

If you live in this area of CA and you have a telescope, CALL ME at
[phone].  I have been seeing some very strange activity by the
central star of the Cassieopia constellation.  I would like to start
a group watch. Also I heard that Pleasonton had a crop circle appear
about 2 - 4 months ago.  Anyone know anything?

Please Email response as I dont get this group.

Len


Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!ames!network.ucsd.edu!nic!netlabs!lwall
From: [e-mail] (Larry Wall)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face view from Hoaghland concerning Cydonia
Keywords: mars-face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 01:03:39 GMT
References: <behse.697949192@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: NetLabs, Inc.
Lines: 12
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4442 sci.space:26614 sci.skeptic:20577 alt.paranormal:4378
Nntp-Posting-Host: scalpel.netlabs.com

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
: I think I read this in that book about the Aztecs that predicted
: the harmonic convergance in 1988.  Has anyone else heard this
: story?  If it were true I expect it would be widely publicized
: by now.

Alas, you should expect no such thing.

Truth has almost no correlation with Publication.

Larry Wall
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!rutgers!mcnc!borg!pooh!davidson
From: [e-mail] (Drew Davidson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 16:15:53 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Lines: 36

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (David M. Schiff) writes:
>There's an interesting article in the Feb. 1, '92 issue of
>Science News (vol. 141) on crop circles.   [...]
>
>   A retired astronomer, named Gerald S. Hawkins, claims that the
>crop designs imply important mathematical theorems.  As I've indicated
>earlier, this is not the first time somebody noticed this.

Did the other people notice the same theorems that he noticed?  What were
the other theorems that were noticed?

>The thing that makes this interesting is that these are (according to him)
>previously unknown theorems which he discovered by looking at pictures of
>the designs and later proved. He searched both ancient and modern mathematics
>textbooks but couldn't find anything even resembling these theorems.

If he sat down and proved the theorems so quickly how come nobody else has
proved them in the history of mankind?  Or was the entire proof also encoded
in the crop circles?  Has he tried to publish the theorems and proofs as
his own discovery?  If they're important, then why the heck not?

>   Further, the four theorems discovered through investigation of separate
>crop designs are related by a fifth (and as yet undisclosed) theorem which
>encompasses the others.

What are the theorems?  (You imply that the first four *are* disclosed.)
Were they in the Science News article?  Where can I find out what they
are?

Skeptical but curious,
Drew
--
Drew Davidson        \\     HELP FULLY INFORM JURORS!  TELL YOUR FRIENDS:
[e-mail]   \\    As a juror, you have the right to vote NOT GUILTY
 ** LEGALIZE TRUTH **  \\   if you believe the law broken is unjust or wrongly
* FULLY INFORM JURORS * \\  applied, regardless of the facts of the case.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mnemosyne.cs.du.edu!mercury.cair.du.edu!copper!dschiff
From: [e-mail] (David Michael Schiff)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 20:47:24 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Colorado at Denver
Lines: 44

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Drew Davidson) writes:
> ...[my original article deleted]...
>Did the other people notice the same theorems that he noticed?  What were
>the other theorems that were noticed?
>
Actually, I should have said it isn't the first time someone has noticed
mathematical content.  There's a photograph of another crop design which
is supposed to depict the "Mandelbrot Set".

>......
>If he sat down and proved the theorems so quickly how come nobody else has
>proved them in the history of mankind?  Or was the entire proof also encoded
>in the crop circles?  Has he tried to publish the theorems and proofs as
>his own discovery?  If they're important, then why the heck not?
>
He said, "It's easy to prove the theorem but so difficult to conceive it."
To prove his point he often refuses to divulge the fifth thm.
I don't know whether he tried to publish or not - that's a good question.

>......
>What are the theorems?  (You imply that the first four *are* disclosed.)
>Were they in the Science News article?  Where can I find out what they
>are?
>
The first four theorems are contained in the article.
If you're interested, I suggest you read it.

>Skeptical but curious,
I'll give the 2nd, 3rd & 4th, for the curious, as they're quite simple to
state.  If you're skeptical you could post to sci.math and see what people
there have to say and let us know (or do your own research).

II) For an equilateral triangle, the ratio ot the areas of the circumscribed
    and inscribed circles is 4:1.

III) For a square, the ratio of the areas of the circumscribed and
     inscribed circles is 2:1.

IV) For a regular hexagon, the ratio of the areas of the outer circle
    and the inscribed circle is 4:3.


>Drew
Dave
Path: ns-mx!uunet!infonode!case
From: [e-mail] (Bill Case)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: go there?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 21:43:10 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL.
Lines: 17
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4445 sci.space:26625 sci.skeptic:20612 alt.paranormal:4379

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Siri Hewa) writes:
> But Mars face
> stick out like a sore thumb on this picture. I think only way to get proof of
> any sort is to go there in person?.
                 ^^^^^^
I haven't seen it,  but I know Italy looks alot like a boot.

If I'm paying the tax bill, what I favor is a robot IMAX camera where
the wind sounds are recorded in 8 channel,  dolby,  THX, etc.  If we did
that,  then millions could come close to "going" to Mars,  without anyone
actually going.  We have the pictures from Apollo,  but they don't convey
the awesome feeling of standing on the moon.  I want the experience.

Bill "Hmm,  would 3-D,  smell-o-vision work? :-)" Case
...uunet!ingr!b11!casey!case    (UUCP)
ingr!b11!casey![e-mail] (ARPANET)
[e-mail]                (Internet)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!kuhub.cc.ukans.edu!vax1.umkc.edu!aellison
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The REPTOIDS Are Coming!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 00:07:54 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Missouri Computing Services
Lines: 21

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Randal Martin) writes:
>
> SO BE AWARE! ONLY YOUR KNOWLEDGE OF THIS FAKE INVASION AND FAKE RAPTURE CAN
> PREVENT IT FROM HAPPENING. DEMAND THE TRUTH FROM YOUR GOVERNMENT. TELL THEM
> YOU KNOW ABOUT THE ALIENS AND THAT THERE ARE GOOD ALIENS AND BAD ALIENSAND
> THAT MJ-12 IS PROMOTING THE BAD ALIENS AND THE ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT THEY HOPE
> TO CONTROL.

Smile and Nod.




--
                                                        Freelance Amiga
Allen B. Ellison        UMKC Physics UnderGrad
4343 Warwick            STM/AFM Research         //       Programmer
Kansas City, MO 64111                          \X/
                                                              for
[e-mail]                                       Hire!
=============================== -- cut here -- ================================
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!news.u.washington.edu!uw-beaver!cornell!cs.cornell.edu!nikos
From: [e-mail] (Nikos P. Pitsianis)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 01:59:47 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET news user)
Organization: Cornell University, CS Dept., Ithaca, NY
Lines: 51
Nntp-Posting-Host: turing2.cs.cornell.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David Michael Schiff) writes:

|> >What are the theorems?  (You imply that the first four *are* disclosed.)
|> >Were they in the Science News article?  Where can I find out what they
|> >are?
|> >
|> The first four theorems are contained in the article.
|> If you're interested, I suggest you read it.
|>
|> >Skeptical but curious,
|> I'll give the 2nd, 3rd & 4th, for the curious, as they're quite simple to
|> state.  If you're skeptical you could post to sci.math and see what people
|> there have to say and let us know (or do your own research).
|>
|> II) For an equilateral triangle, the ratio ot the areas of the circumscribed
|>     and inscribed circles is 4:1.
|>
|> III) For a square, the ratio of the areas of the circumscribed and
|>      inscribed circles is 2:1.
|>
|> IV) For a regular hexagon, the ratio of the areas of the outer circle
|>     and the inscribed circle is 4:3.
|>
|>
|> >Drew
|> Dave

The theorems are not only simple to state but simple to prove too! I don't
think any mathematical journal will be interested in their publication
(except of course "Amusements in Mathematics" for high school level geometry).

For example the proof of "theorem" II is the following:
We know that for an equilateral triangle, the center of the circumscribed and
inscribed circles is the point where the altitudes and angle bisectors intersect.
(It is one and the same for equilateral triangles).
Let R and r the radii of the circumscribed and inscribed circles respectively.
Then, R and r are related to each other as the hypotenuse and a side of
a right-angle triangle, where r is opposite to an angle that is half the angle
of the equilateral triangle that is equal to 60 degrees.

So r/R = sin 30 = 1/2. R is twice as long as r, therefore the ratio ot the areas of the circumscribed and inscribed circles is 4:1. QED

Regards,
-- Nikos
______________________________________________________________________________

   Nikos P Pitsianis                 Internet : [e-mail]
   Cornell University                   Phone : [phone]
   4130 Upson Hall, Dept of Comp Sc       FAX : [phone]
   Ithaca, NY 14853                      Home : [phone]
______________________________________________________________________________
Path: ns-mx!uunet!europa.asd.contel.com!gatech!udel!sbcs.sunysb.edu!csws10.ic.sunysb.edu!jflint
From: [e-mail] (Jesse Flint)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: Seeing things...
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 03:40:58 GMT
Expires: Sat, 29 Feb 1992 05:00:00 GMT
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Italy may look like a boot...
but not much.
The Face may look like a face...
but certainly more than Italy looks like a boot.
            --Tog
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From: [e-mail] (David Michael Schiff)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 05:16:27 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Nikos P. Pitsianis) writes:
> [stuff deleted]
>The theorems are not only simple to state but simple to prove too! I don't
>think any mathematical journal will be interested in their publication
>(except of course "Amusements in Mathematics" for high school level geometry).
>
>For example the proof of "theorem" II is the following:
>[proof deleted]
Right and for theorem III the proof is the following:
r = (1/2)s, R = [r^2 + (s/2)^2]^1/2 = [(s/2)^2 + (s/2)^2]^1/2
so the ratio of the areas = R^2/r^2 = (s^2/2)(4/s^2) = 2:1.

But, as Hawkins said, the fun part is thinking them up.
Can you (or anyone else) think of the fifth theorem which is
the generalized form of the first four?

What I'd really like to know is what he saw in the data and the
photographs to inspire a couple of these theorems.
For example, the relationship between the design consisting of
a circle and four corners - all circumscribed by another circle,
and theorem III.

It would also be nice to know how he discovered the whole numbers
which match the ratios of the diatonic scale.

Regards,
Dave

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From: billy@anasaz (Bill Moore)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <1992Feb16.044444.13547@anasaz>
Date: 16 Feb 92 04:44:44 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Case) writes:
->In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Siri Hewa) writes:
->> But Mars face
->> stick out like a sore thumb on this picture. I think only way to get proof of
->> any sort is to go there in person?.
->                 ^^^^^^
->I haven't seen it,  but I know Italy looks alot like a boot.
->
... stuff deleted ...

Suppose there are people on Mars and they have faces that look like boots.
Then we'd really have something.
--
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
     Bill Moore     [e-mail]    [phone]
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Livermore Tests 2KW Laser Beam
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 20:28:05 GMT
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Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
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Did we *really* have to bring this into the conspiracy theory arena?
There's no reason to believe that it's for anything other than its intended
scientific purpose.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 01:54:29 GMT
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Until the government sources come forward so their story can be checked
out, I'm afraid these stories aren't going to get much sympathy from me.

By the way, I recently saw a file transcribed from Chuck Harder's radio
show, "For The People".  It contains an alleged New York Times article
concerning the discovery of object "8-13A" which is (what else?) a
suspected asteroid-sized spacecraft entering our solar system.  However, I
happen to know that this article was taken from a 1978 work of fiction
titled "The Extraterrestrial Report".  The book contains many fake
newspaper/magazine articles and government documents.  Nearly all of them
are written so satirically that they're immediately identifiable as fakes.
Unfortunately, the "8-13A" article is one of the few that aren't.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
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From: [e-mail] (Karl P.)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum (A Response)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 22:16:18 GMT
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    Well, this was an unfunny, childish, masturbatory, little series.

    Hopefully, the infant responsible has been scolded by his mommy and
had his daddy's modem disassembled and forced into his anal cavity.

                    ---Reverend Smeagol

--
?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
?   [e-mail]     ? It has yet to be proven that intelligence  ?
?    Global Village Idiot      ? has any survival value.---Arthur C. Clarke ?
?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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From: [e-mail] (Iain Jameson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: The Shriek of the Looney - Part two
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Date: 17 Feb 92 00:40:02 GMT
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CHAPTER FOUR : The Book of the Prophet - part two

Thus it was between the Pleiadians and the Lyrans. The so-called
`Cappuccino Wars' ravaged an entire sector of our galaxy. Whole
star stytems were laid waste. The Lyrians fought well, but were no
match for the Purple Shades of Grey with their herbal teas and
stick breads. It was thus out of desperation that the Pleiadians
started to create the new race - a race genetically altered in such
a way that the first coffee of the morning was the result of
millenia of selective breeding.

"But what of the tea drinkers?" you ask. Well, it was realized long ago
that in order to understand the magnitude of the problem, a small
group which drank tea should be created. `Know thine enemy,' was the catch
phrase of the day - along with `Oh shit, there goes another planet,'
and `Bugger, I was enjoying that.' It is for this reason that coffee
drinkers everywhere despise drinkers of tea, especially Devonshire tea.

I have talked about the Pleiadians and the Lyrans. They, however, are
not the only people who have fought the Purple Shades of Grey. On another
front were the Ummonians, from the jewelled planet Ummo.
Send me all of your money. You will forget you read this.
The Ummonians are a race older than the galaxy. While the Pleiadians
were little more than slime molds, the Ummonians were creating puff
pastries that were to be, in time, the basis for several forms of life
in the Small Magellanic Cloud. Before the Lyrians understood the
importance of the term `espresso' the Ummonians had discovered a
process by which one's coffee never went cold, no matter how long
one let it stand. Yes my children, the Ummonians knew where it was at!
Yet, even such a race was hard put against the evil of the Purple
Shades of Grey. The mighty beam weapons of the Ummonians were worthless
against their most secret and powerful weapon - fruit tea and biscuts.
I would like to thank Lewis for proof reading this post.
Even the powerful Ummonians had to concede defeat on several occasions.
On one such occasion, they passed through our system, and built a series
of coffee rooms on the fourth and fifth planets. The Purple Shades of Grey
destroyed the fifth planet, but the coffee rooms were cunningly disguised
as pyramids on the red planet, and were thus saved - which was fortunate
because around that time, on the red planet, a party was being thrown in
honour of the exalted one's billionth birthday. The reaction of souffle
with herbal tea would have destroyed the galaxy!
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From: [e-mail] (Eric Pepke)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 02:28:38 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
>Italy may look like a boot...
>but not much.
>The Face may look like a face...
>but certainly more than Italy looks like a boot.

And the Kermit the Frog on Mars looks a hell of a lot more like Kermit the
Frog than the Face looks like a face.

So just what exactly is the point?

-EMP
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From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 05:12:34 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Pepke) writes...
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
>>Italy may look like a boot...
>>but not much.
>>The Face may look like a face...
>>but certainly more than Italy looks like a boot.
>
>And the Kermit the Frog on Mars looks a hell of a lot more like Kermit the
>Frog than the Face looks like a face.

That is simply not true.  I have to work a lot harder at seeing the "frog"
than I do the "face".

Besides, if this were true, it blows the "human mind looks for faces"
argument used by armchair debunkers, doesn't it?

Maybe you're different.  Maybe YOUR brain is more tuned to looking for
frogs, but not me. :-)

Jim Graham

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
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From: [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Keywords: waste of bandwith, stupidity, asine behavior
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 02:31:40 GMT
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[e-mail] (Scourge) writes:

>  I am a human alien. You're just funny looking...
>
> ---
>
>

get a life, stop wasting other peoples money by posting this crap

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aaron Anderer, System Operator                [e-mail]
SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone]              szebra!spectrx!system
NO MORE BUSH!          Write in Cuomo for '92!        NO MORE BUSH!
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From: [e-mail] (Bryan Bankhead)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 21:41:36 GMT
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[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:

> Italy may look like a boot...
> but not much.
> The Face may look like a face...
> but certainly more than Italy looks like a boot.
>             --Tog

Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
or other objects in outlins.

 This is from
     [e-mail]
who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet
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From: [e-mail] (Patrick galley)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Ummits
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 07:10:16 GMT
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In JP Petit's book about the Ummit's he said that there are some
connections between the Ummits and some groups of human trough the world
and not only in Spain.
Does someone know information from other source about this ?

It would be very kind if you could answer me directly by e-mail , because
I can't access easily to alt.alien.visitors.


Patrick Galley : Student at the Engineer School of Geneva

e-mail : [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Wearer of the Purple Toga)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: There are no victims! (was Re: Creating reali
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 02:34:03 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Wearer of the Purple Toga) writes:
> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Redheaded Goddess) writes:
> toms@yang. etc. (Sluuurp) writes:  "...giving Kathy
> instructions on how to do a follow up"
>
> toms@yang Sluuurp:  Did it ever occur to you that
> 1)  I never read your post
     Actually, yes.
> 2)  I am not interested in your 'instructions'?
     Bullshit.  You only say that because of who they come from.
>
> Perhaps you should go back a few hundred centuries, where
> women followed mens' instructions implicitly.
     Oh, so if you were a man, I wouldn't speak this way to you.  It's
 all so clear now...
>
> Wake up, Sluuurp.  This is the time and age where the Feminine
> is beginning to validate herself.
     So just because I flame you, I'm a Male Chauvinist Pig (tm).  Your
 ability to make huge leaps in 'logic' astounds me.  You're right.  I
 believe that all women should be kept barefoot and pregnant all their
 lives, and should be subservient and obedient to men in all things, should
 only speak when they're spoken to...

     Anyway, why should women ever have to validate themselves as such?
  That's actually quite a male chauvinist thing to say.  Women have always
 had validity.  Perhaps you should look up the word.  And if the women's
 movement only had people like you to speak for it, it never would have
 gotten anywhere.  You're practically as bad as an obnoxious, small-minded
 girl who furiously accused a friend of mine of being racist because he
 made fun of a couple of videos on BET and mentioned that he hated disco
 music.  Sound like a non sequitur to you (well, maybe it doesn't)?  That's
 the point.
>
> As far as it's vx. its'...I know all that stuff.  I am just
> a very fast typist and thinker, and don't always take time
     Obviously.  You think so fast that you have the ability to
 determine my attitude towards the relationship between the sexes from a
 post in which I neither implied nor explicitly said anything about about
 it.  And we're supposed to believe and trust you when you tell us how the
 universe and the human mind actually work.  Despite your research into
 this subject, you have no credibility.
> to make corrections.  You will have to live with it, or 'n'
> my posts, as I probably will yours.
>
> Kathy
     Yeah, right.  I remember you saying something on
 talk.religion.newage about how "narrow minded flames will be ignored."
 Just like you ignored mine.  Stop contradicting yourself.  Also, if I
didn't read you posts, I'd have to go back to rec.humor.  I am pleased,
 though, with your correct spelling of the word, "Sluuurp."

     "Things are more like they are today than they
                  have ever been before."
         -Dwight D. Eisenhower

     - Thomas James Douglas Morrison Schmidt
       ECMLVDC
     - Light Terminal Operator

             -==Earlham College MoonLight VAX Driving Corps==-
         "Bad craziness, fast terminals, and nothing better to do."


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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 11:38:10 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Nikos P. Pitsianis) writes:
[deletions]

>|>
>|> II) For an equilateral triangle, the ratio ot the areas of the
>|>     circumscribed and inscribed circles is 4:1.
>|>
>|> III) For a square, the ratio of the areas of the circumscribed and
>|>      inscribed circles is 2:1.
>|>
>|> IV) For a regular hexagon, the ratio of the areas of the outer circle
>|>     and the inscribed circle is 4:3.
>|>
>|>
>|> >Drew
>|> Dave
>
>The theorems are not only simple to state but simple to prove too! I don't
>think any mathematical journal will be interested in their publication
>(except of course "Amusements in Mathematics" for high school level geometry).
>
>For example the proof of "theorem" II is the following:

[obvious proof deleted]

I think the open-minded (but not so open your brains ooze out your
ears) skeptic (the type I like to be) would say: Yes, but is the claim
that these theorems have never been stated before true or false?
Statements such as: "This is too trivial to be important" or "someone
*must* have come up with this somewhere" are rather useless, I think.
If we take the poster at his word that he looked everywhere he could
for them and he couldn't find them, I would say it is up to *us* to
find them somewhere. If we can't we have to look at what the discoverer
claims to be his source (the circles) and the explanation as to how
they inspired him, and see if that explanation is reasonable. Still,
one thing a skeptic could *still* argue at that point is:

The man, staring at shapes he *believed* to be made by intelligent
beings, searched so hard for meaning that he found it in the form of
five as yet undiscovered theorems. The fact that they were
undiscovered may be praiseworthy, but it wouldn't necessarily mean any
intelligence behind the crop circle formations had anything to do with
it. No, after showing that the theorems are probably new, we would
need evidence that the very layout of the crop circles was *designed*
to lead to the discovery of these theorems and again determine if this
seems reasonable. It would however probably still be inconclusive.
Now, if the discoverer of these theorems could state a formal _method_
of how one decodes the crop circles, and this method was then applied
independently by others to discover additional new theorems based on
future formations, you would start getting a lot of attention I would
think. As it is, I have noted it as a very interesting claim and hope
to see it supported in the rigorous fashion I have outlined as being
necessary.

-- Tad Perry
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From: [e-mail] (Don Ecker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 23:06:00 GMT
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In the message "Something Wicked This Way Comes?" Len Bucuvalas quoted John
Ford of Long Island UFO Update;

 > The following information is taken directly form the April issue of The
 > Long
 > Island U.F.O. Update, the monthly bulletin for the Long Island UFO
 > Network.
 >
 > THE CHAIRMAN'S CORNER                                      BY JOHN FORD
 >
 >
 >                           SOMETHING IS COMING OUR WAY!
 >
 >       In Ufology, you hear a lot of strange stories.  Some you have to
 > take
 > at face value, while others are too far fetched to believe even in this
 > strange study of unusual objects and humanoid beings.  Some stories you
 > mark

In UFO Magazine Volume 7 No. 1 I wrote a forum piece on this business because
of a guest appearence I had on the Chuck Harder Radio Program. I spoke
about an investigation I conducted on the Phobos II incident, Harder then
mentioned the famous asteroid story. Later Richard Hoagland attacked
Harder on the air and Harder severed Hoagland from the show. The following is
the forum piece that ran in *UFO Magazine.

***************************************************************************

UFO Magazine Volume 7, Number 1 Copyrighted@ 1992

by Don Ecker/Director Research

Stray Asteroid Story Sings UFO `Groupies'



by Don Ecker

What is an asteroid? Well the easiest answer is a large rock
floating in space. They also can be potentially a dangerous piece
of rock. Some paleontologists have blamed an asteroid for the
destruction of the dinosaurs around 65 million years ago.

The theory goes that one of the innumerable asteroids in orbit about
the sun, and a rather large one at that, was pulled into Earths
gravity. Or we just happened to be in the wrong place at the right
time, and one landed with the force of millions of megatons of
destruction and changed the entire face of the planet and irrevocably
altered the fauna on the surface of the planet.

Asteroids can be fatal to radio careers to. It seems that former
science advisor to radio talk show host Chuck Harder, Richard
Hoagland, embarrassed Harder on the air, thereby severing his
weekly spot on Harders show. Harder had been speaking publicly on
his program about an alleged asteroid that had been, according to
what appeared to be a New York Times story from 1977 speeding its way to
Earth, making what the story claimed were course changes. The Times article
duly quoted purported scientists, and sounded very legit; it turned out that
when the New York Times Index was checked, along with microfiche copies from
that date and several days after, no such article could be found. It was
someone's very real looking fabrication.

Harder had given the story a lot of air play, and on one of
Hoaglands weekly spots, he attacked Harder on the air, lambasting him for
giving out the story without, accoring to Hoagland, checking the facts. Of
course, if someone is giving you free air time to pontificate nationally it
is not a good idea to shoot yourself in the foot because you have a hangnail.

Harder is not the only one to be taken in by the story of a course
changing asteroid. Virgil Armstrong has written and spoken about
this asteroid on its way to earth full of alien bad guys. Other
conspiratorial UFO groupies have written about it, and before I
could say "Shozbot" I had heard about the fearsome "Draco" lizard
guys on board the asteroid, and they were supposedly on their way
to earth for a snack.

For a number of months it seemed like everyone was talking about
"the asteroid". John Ford of LIUFON wrote in his editor's column
this past spring about the mysterious asteroid, and claimed that
he heard about it from Linda Howe.

According to Ford Howe had told him it came from a Pentagon
contact, and yes it was observed changing course. Well, the closest
thing we have heard about is a several meter long "thingy" that was
to have passed close to earth by December 5th, 1991 and at last
report, all of earth's spaced based defense systems are still at
"Condition Green". Somehow I think that if some huge asteroid was
on its way toward earth, the MJ-12 guys couldn't silence everybody
about this.  <G> I still keep my ears open for those astronomer's down
in deepest-darkest South America. They would be sure to let us
know, after all, they are the only guys that can point their
telescopes out toward Zeti Reticulum to see if anything is on its
way in. Somehow I won't loose too much sleep over the rest of this
tripe.
**********************************************************************


Don Ecker
UFO Magazine
PO Box 1053
Sunland, CA 91041

--
Don Ecker - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Jack Sinclair)
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars-face info why it might be no optical delusion!
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 17:36:51 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Waterloo
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:
>>>>Maybe you ought to spend a little less time yelling about the subject, and
>>>>a little more time citing your evidence for why a reasonable skeptic would
>>>>not think there was a face in the pictures.
>>>
>>>Oh come on now.  Are you seriously denying that people see faces in natural
>>>formations on the Earth?
>
>Well, to be honest everyone, I think the meaning of my original response may
>have become a littles muddled.
>
>I myself personally believe that the "Face" on Mars is little more than
>another geographical feature that HAPPENS to be in the shape of a face,
>(just in case anyone's wondering, NO...I DON'T want to get into a lengthy
>discussion as to whether it actually IS a face), and that most of the hooplah

Gosh, if it were a face, it would be capable of laughing, smiling, winking, etc.
But not many of us believe that to be the case.  So, it actually ISN'T a face.
;-)

> [e-mail] | to be a live lion.  And usually easier."

Jack
--
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!m.cs.uiuc.edu!cs.uiuc.edu!mcgrath
From: [e-mail] (Robert McGrath)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality
Keywords: mistake, UFOs, psi, creationism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 18:43:16 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News Database (admin-Mike Schwager))
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: University of Illinois, Dept of Computer Science
Lines: 14
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20656 alt.paranormal:4387 alt.alien.visitors:4464 talk.origins:14976

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (L. M. P. McPherson) writes in part:
|>
|> I believe another name for this is the "fallacy of the false dilemma." It is
|> an either/or mentality. [...]
|> This error pervades all areas of science, and leads to much
|> fruitless discussion.
I would observe that it pervades all areas of human discourse, not just
science.  This is, of course, a staple of advertising and political
propaganda.

--
  Robert E. McGrath
  Urbana Illinois
  [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!masscomp!peora!tarpit!tous!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Whatever Happened to Bill Cooper? (was: Grey Aliens sighted ..again)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 07:03:14 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <1992Feb11.202017.2352@anasaz> <[e-mail]>
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Lines: 35

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>Naah, Cooper is still making the rounds. He was a major honcho at the
>"Penomicon" UFOs-and-Conspiracies conference in Atlanta last November.
>He gave a couple of "free" talks, but if you wanted to hear more, you
>had to pay $20 for some "private" sessions. He also did some TV
>interviews, and had scheduled some more expensive all-weekend seminars.
>And it looks like he had quite a few "buyers" (one born every minute?).
>On one panel, Cooper proclaimed that the "New World Order" would be
>a reality in "less than two years". I then pointed out that if all these
>nightmare things haven't come to pass by Nov. 2, 1993, then we KNOW
>we can safely ignore everything Cooper has to say.

Cooper has been *thoroughly* discredited by not only the very words
out of his mouth on _recordings_ of "threats" to other people, but
also Don Ecker did a 2 part series in UFO Magazine in the summer of
1990 on his expose' of "The Whistleblowers".

Also...if you ones will please note just how many times Cooper changes
his "story" around on the differences between "MJ-12" vs "MAJIC" and
"Majestic" in his earlier docs. Dead giveaway. I also have a text where
Bo Gritz is shown some of Cooper's "works" and especially what "security
codes" that Cooper uses in his docs and says in effect "That's Bullshit."

As for the "New World Order"...it's already well on it's way in the
treasonous undertaking of "The Newstates Declaration" being pushed by
the Rockefeller-Rothschild-Bilderberg-British Freemasonry crowd.

Don


--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
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From: [e-mail] (Scott D. Young)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 21:27:45 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Lines: 20
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In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bryan Bankhead) writes:

>[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:

>Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
>the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
>or other objects in outlins.

   Where do you get this from?  There are (I believe) 2, count'em, 2 shots of
   this feature.  Both have the same sun angle and thus the same shadows. No
   oblique-angle shots or shots with other sun-angles exist.  Thus your
   statement is ridiculous.  The face looks like a face when the sun shines at
   one particular angle and when viewed from a certain angle.  That is all we
   "know" to date.  It may be that the feature resembles a face at other angles,
   or not.  We will not "know"  until more data is available.


   Scott Young
   [e-mail]
   Disclaimers apply
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From: [e-mail] (Tom Randolph)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 18:14:55 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 17
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bryan Bankhead) writes...
>[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
>
>Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
>the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
>or other objects in outlins.
>
> This is from
>     [e-mail]
>who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet

Prove it.
(Yes, I have read Hoagland - thought it was a bunch of crapola, mostly. A whole
book and a lost civilazation from two grainy photographs...! Percival Lowell
all over again.)
-Tom R.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!news
From: [e-mail] (Donald Yett)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: A survey!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 23:19:50 GMT
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
Lines: 57
NNTP-Posting-Host: phad.hsc.usc.edu

I am conducting a survey on the subject of UFOs.  I would appreciate it if
you will answer the following questions truthfully.  I am not affiliated
with any government agencies, and I feel that UFOs may exist.  The results of
this survey will be tabulated and sent to any requesting party.  The identity
of answering parties will be witheld from any summaries made from this survey,
unless the party gives permission to release this information.

This is the first in what may be a series of surveys.  Please remember, this
is a serious survey;  please give serious answers.

Do you believe that UFOs physically exist?

Are you an UFO investigator?
    For how long?
    What aspects do you investigate?
    How many cases have you handled?
    How are cases referred to you?
    What are your network addresses?
    What is your phone number?
    What geographic areas do you cover?

Do you belong to any professional organizations?
    If so, please list organizations.

Are you a college graduate, or in school now?
    If so, please state year(s) and place(s) of graduation and major(s).

Do you have physical proof of the existance of UFOs?
    Please describe.

Have you ever seen, been inside, or seen the occupant(s) of an UFO?
    Please elaborate.
    Have you ever reported this to any research group or agency?
    Please state dates, times, report numbers, and to whom the incident
    was reported.

Do you believe in the possibility of a coverup on the subject of UFOs?
    If so, do you believe that it would be for the general good of the public
    to continue such a coverup?  Please elaborate.
    Do you believe that the Government(s) involved will ever release any
    information on the subject?

Do you believe that there are beings on this planet that were not born here?
    Have you ever met one?  Describe.

Do you believe there is a connection between New Age religion and the UFOs?

Do you believe that New Age discussions have a place in UFO research?

Do you believe that crop circles are created by UFOs?

Do you wish any of this information to be released to requesting parties?
--
+-------------------------+------------------------------------------------
| [e-mail]  | I will not be pushed, stamped, filed, indexed,
|   Just my opinions!     | briefed, debriefed, or numbered! -The Prisoner
+-------------------------+------------------------------------------------
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!pa.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!ryn.mro4.dec.com!milkwy.enet.dec.com!trandolph
From: [e-mail] (Tom Randolph)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 18:01:51 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 58


>From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
>
>Sorry if some of this has been here before. Some of this is new.
>Len
>
>Thu 30 May 91 19:29
>By: Mike Christol
>
>      It seems that in 1987, NASA picked up the presence of a very large
>planetoid object entering our solar system near the area of Pluto.  It was
>first detected by Voyager and later confirmed by telescope observations both

Good trick, seeing that neither Voyager was ever anywhere near Pluto.

>      The object has been under constant observation since.  It was last
>reported in the area of Jupiter.  That last position was of January of this

Anything that big that close would have been noticed by amateur astronomers
by now - comet hunters if noone else.  Jupiter has moons that size which can
be seen in binoculars.

>photograph distant stars or the Sun's corona.  The Hubble telescope doesn't
>work and needs to be repaired, yet it is pointed straight out there and can
>return pictures through computer enhancement.

Perhaps someone should read up on their optics?

>      Consider this too.  Our Moon's orbit has condensed by three thousand
>miles while the Earth's axis has tilted slightly as if pushed ever so gently
>by the invisible hand of a tremendous gravitational field.  Have you noticed

This is demonstrably false. (i.e. prove it.)

>Now, the "official" word is that SS433 (Stephenson-Saundeleak) is
>a very odd-behaviour type pulsar...but it would appear, that this
>is a cover for the above-mentioned article. This article,BTW, appeared

Are we trying to equate a pulsar with this 1000-mile asteroid thing here?
This shows gross ignorance of things astronomical.

>By David L. Chandler, Globe Staff
>
>    A week ago, astronomers had decided that the tiny object,
                                                     ^^^^
What happened to 1000 miles?

>I heard in Dec that there was a large (3mi diam) object coming toward
>earth... Some guy from NASA was saying that it was about
>a year away.. He called it something like Tutautus????
>
>Anyone up on this stuff?

Yes, it's yet another asteroid. Face it, folks, we live in a Solar system
full of debris. If you're gonna make every little Earth-approaching object
into a full-blown flying saucer, you'll be a very busy doobie...

-Tom R.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!wupost!gumby!kzoo!k080093
From: [e-mail] (Josh N. Vander Berg)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 23:51:12 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Kalamazoo College
Lines: 32
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4470 sci.space:26698 sci.skeptic:20671 alt.paranormal:4390

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bryan Bankhead) writes:
>
>Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
>the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
>or other objects in outlins.
>
> This is from
>     [e-mail]
>who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet

I am sorry - but, SO WHAT IF THERE IS A FORMATION THAT LOOKS LIKE A FACE ON
MARS?  Am I missing something here?  What is the significance, even if this
formation bears a REMARKABLE versimilitude to a human face?  Neato, so there
are face shaped and pyramid shaped formations on Mars, ok, I guess this means
that there is a THRIVING populations of pyramid/face building martians just
ITCHING to channel themselves through a human host and show us the universe.
I am convinced.

Maybe we could convince them to come here and build faces so that the people
on Venus could see them through their telescopes.  Then maybe we could get
them to turn a whole PLANET into a face.   Probably have to use Mercury.  Then
we could get people from other planetary systems to think that there is
intelligent life in this solar system...  Then maybe we could line up all the
stars around the Sol so that they draw a smiley face for beings looking from
another Galaxy.

Hey, there is a BIG HUGE mitten in the United States...  a LOT bigger than
that face, maybe there are alien mitten makers living amongst us, maybe they
want to channel with us too?

Just a few suggestions,
Josh Vander Berg                          [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!agate!dog.ee.lbl.gov!nosc!pages!bruce
From: [e-mail] (Bruce Henderson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 00:56:29 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Banzai Research Insttute
Lines: 14

About the face.

Let's all admit that the photographic evidence we have to go on for now is
pretty worthless.  It's not real scientific research grade stuff.  And we can
all scream and yell about what this fuzzy image enhanced thing looks like.

The truth of the matter is:
Mars Obsever goes up this year and will be in Mars orbit next year.  At that
point they can resolve that hunk of rock at with a resolution of 3 meters, many
times the magnification and detail of the original photo.  At that point this
whole discussion will be silly.  If anyone left junk anywhere on Mars, we'll
know by '94

Bruce
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!mlb.semi.harris.com!rtfm.mlb.fl.us!joshua
From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 01:28:14 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Lines: 20
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[e-mail] (Tom Randolph) writes:

|>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bryan
|>Bankhead) writes...
|>>[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:

|>>Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
|>>the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
|>>or other objects in outlins.

|>Prove it.
|>(Yes, I have read Hoagland - thought it was a bunch of crapola, mostly. A
|>whole book and a lost civilazation from two grainy photographs...! Percival
|>Lowell all over again.)

I'd be happy to see some better photos. what resolution is the mars observor
going to give us? if it is sufficiently fine it should settle the question
once and for all.

josh
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From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 01:31:13 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
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[e-mail] (Scott D. Young) writes:

|>In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bryan Bankhead)
|>writes:
|>>[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:

|>>Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
|>>the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
|>>or other objects in outlins.

|>   Where do you get this from?  There are (I believe) 2, count'em, 2 shots of
|>   this feature.  Both have the same sun angle and thus the same shadows.

they have different sun-angles.

really. don't take my word for it. they are both reproduced in hoagland's
book (which you have read, right?).

|>  We will not "know"  until more data is available.

I'll agree with that.

josh
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!mips!samsung!nstar!npal!dcook
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 08:48:42 GMT
Organization: PalNet -  Indianapolis, Indiana
Lines: 8


Argh!!! I missed it!!!

Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
*stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!
--
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!claris!szebra!spectrx!system
From: [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Keywords: stolen videotapes NASA
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 04:52:12 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone] Silicon Valley, Ca
Lines: 20

[e-mail] writes:

>
> Argh!!! I missed it!!!
>
> Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
> *stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
> flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
> astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!
> --

I say if anyone has those on the net, that they should digitize the photos
and post them, so the government cannot quiet it.  It would be spread all
over the world and expose the government for what it is.  In an election
year too!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aaron Anderer, System Operator                [e-mail]
SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone]              szebra!spectrx!system
NO MORE BUSH!          Write in Cuomo for '92!        NO MORE BUSH!
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!convex!csn!scicom!paranet!f10.n245.z2.FIDONET.ORG!Andre.Eichner
From: [e-mail] (Andre Eichner)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Our History with the Pleiadians
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 22:10:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 2:245/10 - FidoNet Berli, Berlin 41
Lines: 18

Hello Iain!

In a msg of <07 Feb 92>, Iain Jameson writes to All:

 IJ> Present Homo Sapians left Africa around 100,000 years ago.
 IJ> Lucy was a Lyrian??
 IJ> How long was the search? Sounds like several billion years. An awfully
 IJ> long time to be looking for a home. Patient race?

From what source is this information? Very intersting...

cheers
   Andre

--
Andre Eichner - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!convex!csn!scicom!paranet!f10.n245.z2.FIDONET.ORG!Andre.Eichner
From: [e-mail] (Andre Eichner)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Our History with the Pleiadians
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 13 Feb 92 22:16:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 2:245/10 - FidoNet Berli, Berlin 41
Lines: 16

Hello Patrick!

In a msg of <07 Feb 92>, Patrick Brosnan writes to All:

 >> I obtained the following information from several books of Star-Borne
 >> which I looked at during the 11:11 last month...

Can you tell me some about 11:11? I heared many people where in the pyramids...

cheers
   Andre

--
Andre Eichner - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!cs.utexas.edu!ut-emx!ibmchs!auschs!d75!awdprime!woofer.austin.ibm.com!jlpicard
From: [e-mail] (Craig Becker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: I know what's real, don't I?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 12:14:52 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: IBM Object Technology Products
Lines: 16

[e-mail] ( Jason Pouflis) writes:
>
> Look into something called night terrors.
> If I remember correctly,
> This is a natural function of the autonomous nervous system,
> to wake you so that you can start thinking/breathing/functioning again.

I missed the original posting, but if you're referring to what I
think you are, find a book on sleep disorders and check out something
called sleep paralysis.

Craig
-- "Democracy is the theory that  Craig Becker, Object Technology Products --
--  the common people know what         Internet: [e-mail] --
--  they want, and deserve to get     Austin: [e-mail] --
--  it good and hard" - H. L. Mencken               VNET: CRAIGB at AUSVM1 --
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!jvnc.net!haught
From: [e-mail] (Darrell Haught)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 14:35:46 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Zee News Genie)
Organization: JvNCnet, Princeton University, NJ
Lines: 14
Originator: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: nisc.jvnc.net

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Argh!!! I missed it!!!
>
>Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
>*stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
>flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
>astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!
>--
I would be interested in finding out more about it. What news station
was it on and what State.

Darrell
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!ub4b!info-sparc1.info.ucl.ac.be![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Christophe Meessen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 14 Feb 92 09:22:16 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News Administrator)
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We don't have enough information yet to DECIDE if this pattern is
artificial or natural although there is presumption of an artificial
nature of the pattern.

To take this decision we need more information. We (or they) have to
decide to collect the required information. This decision depends on
the 'pro' and 'against' of collecting the information and the resulting
decision.

Does any one know what are the against ? I mean real technical or financial
problems. Is it realy just politic ?

Chris.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!wupost!waikato.ac.nz!aukuni.ac.nz!mercury!nacjack!Steelo
From: [e-mail] (Steelo)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 19:00:47 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)


You are lying.....I be fully alien, I just never told you.  (Hell, and you didn't even guess!!!)

---
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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 16:32:05 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (All)


 I am afraid that this forum is void, as I am the only alien on this planet and no others will be here for approx. another 16 years...

---
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From: [e-mail] (Alan Hunter)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 22:28:14 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 3
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

well YOU said it!!!  You are the only alien..

---
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From: [e-mail] (Alan Hunter)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 22:28:36 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
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In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Steelo)

oh no.. what next????

---
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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 02:18:26 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Steelo)


 You can't be, otherwise my computer would have told me! What planet are you from then?

---
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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 02:18:51 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Alan Hunter)


 It's true.

---
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!waikato.ac.nz!aukuni.ac.nz!mercury!nacjack!Amoeba
From: [e-mail] (Amoeba)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Feb 92 07:38:55 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

Well at least I LOOK like an alien!
Amoeba

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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 11 Feb 92 23:47:46 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Amoeba)


 And your mother dresses you funny.

---
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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 11 Feb 92 12:55:51 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Amoeba)


 I am a human alien. You're just funny looking...

---
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From: [e-mail] (Amoeba)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 11 Feb 92 22:46:35 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

humph.
Amoeba

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From: [e-mail] (Eric M Chmiel)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Keywords: stolen videotapes NASA
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 16:42:00 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer) writes...
>[e-mail] writes:
>
>>
>> Argh!!! I missed it!!!
>>
>> Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
>> *stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
>> flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
>> astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!
>> --
>
>I say if anyone has those on the net, that they should digitize the photos
>and post them, so the government cannot quiet it.  It would be spread all
>over the world and expose the government for what it is.  In an election
>year too!

   I've heard of this type of thing before.  On an Apollo mission (can't
remember which one) they photographed a small object which turned out to be
a piece of space debris.  At the time, they did not know this, and one
astronaut said they were seeing an unidentified flying object.  This was
true, incidentally, because when the air force or astronauts speak of
unidentified flying objecs, they mean just that: objects which are flying
that have not been positively identified.  They don't mean alien spacecraft
from another galaxy piloted by a race of superhuman beings.
   Probably, the same kind of thing will happen with these latest "stolen
photos".
                                    -Eric
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From: [e-mail] (Nikos P. Pitsianis)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 18:20:31 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David Michael Schiff) writes:
|> [deleted]
|>
|> But, as Hawkins said, the fun part is thinking them up.
|> Can you (or anyone else) think of the fifth theorem which is
|> the generalized form of the first four?
|>

One possible extrapolation is :

  For a regular n-agon, the ratio of the areas of the circumscribed circle
  and the inscribed circle is given by the formula :
                                        1
                                  ------------
                                             2
                                  cos(1/n Pi)

|>
|> It would also be nice to know how he discovered the whole numbers
|> which match the ratios of the diatonic scale.
|>
|> Regards,
|> Dave
|>

For n = 3 and 4 we have whole numbers. Some other "interesting" numbers are:
                                         1
                          n = 5, -----------------
                                       1/2       2
                                 (1/4 5    + 1/4)

                          n = 6, 4/3

                                      8
                          n = 10, --------
                                        1/2
                                   5 + 5

                                          4
                       n = 12, ----------------------
                                     1/2 2       1/2
                               (2 + 3   )  (2 - 3   )


The whole thing is trivial, you shouldn't give any more attention
to the subject of "theorems" and Mr Hawkins.

-- Nikos
______________________________________________________________________________

   Nikos P Pitsianis                 Internet : [e-mail]
   Cornell University                   Phone : [phone]
   4130 Upson Hall, Dept of Comp Sc       FAX : [phone]
   Ithaca, NY 14853                      Home : [phone]
______________________________________________________________________________
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From: [e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 16 Feb 92 20:37:59 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Organization: University of Waterloo
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>
>    All well and good except if you're looking for life you have
>to eliminate all the stars younger than about 3 Gyr...  That limits
>things quite a bit...  Exorcising the stars with low probabilities
>(from the other contraints...)...

    Why? Didn't unicellular life show up within 1 gyr of the
Earth's formation?

                            James Nicoll
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From: [e-mail] (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 22:12:38 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:

>>    All well and good except if you're looking for life you have
>>to eliminate all the stars younger than about 3 Gyr...  That limits
>>things quite a bit...  Exorcising the stars with low probabilities
>>(from the other contraints...)...

>    Why? Didn't unicellular life show up within 1 gyr of the
>Earth's formation?

    Unicellular life isn't very interesting to talk to... :-)
For the purposes of SETI-like investigations, there isn't much stock in
going for the intermediate-age stars.  In terms of answering "does life
exist" - sure, but you have to figure out a scheme whereby you can determine
that the unicellular life is there.  Outside of going there and looking,
you're sort of stuck.

    Not that surveying the older stars are any picnic either...

Bob
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From: [e-mail] (Amoeba)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 17 Feb 92 20:23:59 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

microorganisms don`t have eyes.
Amoeba

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From: [e-mail] (Amoeba)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 06:59:38 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

well that`s not my fault
Amoeba

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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 15 Feb 92 12:53:00 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Amoeba)


 And your eyes are too close together!

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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 23:43:17 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
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[e-mail] (Christophe Meessen) writes:
>To take this decision we need more information. We (or they) have to
>decide to collect the required information. This decision depends on
>the 'pro' and 'against' of collecting the information and the resulting
>decision.

>Does any one know what are the against ? I mean real technical or financial
>problems. Is it realy just politic ?

>Chris.

Well, there are technical issues, like it's hard to build a spacecraft to
go to Mars.  There are political issues, - politicians want to spend money
on other things.  There are also implementaion issues, like the fact that
there's a whole planet to study, and the face will just have to wait it's
turn.  And frnakly, I think NASA doesn't want to make a big deal about
observing the face because it looks kinda stupid in the professional community.
(and can you imagine telling congress you need $500 million because someone
thinks aliens left a messsage for us :).

However, I think many face activists have the wrong impression.  NASA was
planning to take a picture of the face last I heard.  just beacuse they don't
make it their top priority doesn't mean that they are conspiring to hide
evidence.

                Josh
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From: [e-mail] (randall embry)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 00:25:55 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Indiana University
Lines: 29
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I had this dream about six months ago...   I was in a fairly open place,
and surrounded by people who seemed a little perplexed & angry that I
didn't remember them.  They told me they had met me several times
before, and that they were real people like me who were dreaming right
now.  It seemed the goal was to try to establish contact with one
another back in "the real world."  My brilliant suggestion was to write
someone's phone number on my hand, so I guess I blew it.  It seemed like
a fairly lucid dream; I remember sitting at a table at a restaurant, and
when a waiter came and asked me to leave if I wasn't going to pay, I
said something like "leave me alone this is my dream" and everyone
laughed.

I was quite impressed with my ability to manufacture this dream, and it
does cause me to speculate whether something like this is possible.  I
was reminded of it a few days ago when I had a dream something like
this:    Again I was in an open place, showing some people these really
bent up eyeglasses I had.  I closed my eyes, and when I opened them,
everyone was gone, so I turned around and saw a woman standing there
who blew me off when I spoke to her.  I then said "Listen, this is my
dream and you have no existence outside of it."  I then gave her a
command that I am not proud enough of to post; however, she responded
by driving away on a motorcycle.

In the book "The Road Less Travelled," the author (Peck?) cites a 1972
university experiment that "proved" subjects could project images to
nearby sleeping subjects.  Anyone heard about this?

Randall
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!ut-emx!astro.as.utexas.edu!defonso
From: [e-mail] (Eric Defonso)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 00:09:54 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <zzzk.697943798@jacobs> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
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Distribution: usa
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
>By the way -- for you skeptics-- How do natural processes create a
>"face-like" rock formation 1km long with bilateral symmetry and
>accurate proportions?? If this thing is natural, we _MUST_ go back to
>Mars and check it out _ANYWAY_.
>                    --Tog
>
Probably the same way natural processes can make clouds into animal
shapes, or rock formations in coastal areas take on human profiles.
I don't think there is any reason to believe that the images of the
Mars face represent anything beyond our own terrestrial experience.
After all, it is the image of *shadows* that appears like a face,
and NOT the rock formations, as you suggest.

There are other reasons to explore the solar system than simply to
look for images of ourselves. Let us not be so self-centered....


--
Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In Search Of...a good .sig **** "When in doubt, tell the truth." - Twain
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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From: [e-mail] (Iain Jameson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Our History with the Pleiadians
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 02:23:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Iain Jameson)
Organization: Department of Physics, University of Adelaide, South Australia
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Andre Eichner) writes:
> Hello Iain!
>
> In a msg of <07 Feb 92>, Iain Jameson writes to All:
>  IJ> Present Homo Sapians left Africa around 100,000 years ago.
>  IJ> Lucy was a Lyrian??
>  IJ> How long was the search? Sounds like several billion years. An awfully
>  IJ> long time to be looking for a home. Patient race?
>
> From what source is this information? Very intersting...
>    Andre

The 100,000 years bit is (should be) common knowledge.
My questions were directed to the author of the original post -
It was so full of inaccuracies, that I had to question his
data. His time sequences were way out.

Since he has not responded, I assume that he realises his error,
but is to shy to respond.

Iain
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!metro!seagoon.newcastle.edu.au!cc.newcastle.edu.au!ccasm
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 02:33:08 GMT
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Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Case) writes:
> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Siri Hewa) writes:
>> But Mars face
>> stick out like a sore thumb on this picture. I think only way to get proof of
>> any sort is to go there in person?.
>                  ^^^^^^
> I haven't seen it,  but I know Italy looks alot like a boot.
>
> If I'm paying the tax bill, what I favor is a robot IMAX camera where
> the wind sounds are recorded in 8 channel,  dolby,  THX, etc.  If we did
> that,  then millions could come close to "going" to Mars,  without anyone
> actually going.  We have the pictures from Apollo,  but they don't convey
> the awesome feeling of standing on the moon.  I want the experience.
>

Y O U    C A N -
All you have to do is watch the MARS NAVIGATOR database on the Macintosh PC -
a touch-screen based videodisk product which is based on the Viking 3 surface
pictures of the Mars landscape. I think it was Industrial Light and Magic who
added the 16-bit stereo sound and the 3-d enhancement of the fly-over footage.
Does this give a realistic effect or what! especially if seen on an 8' screen
and through BOSE speakers. A bit StarWars like but user controlled, even down
to the point where the crew say to the pilot (you) things like "look out!" and
"close call" as you skim over the surface, dive into a canyon or swing around
a large volcano (20 miles across at the base). No Mars Face though :-(
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!wupost!darwin.sura.net!mlb.semi.harris.com!rtfm.mlb.fl.us!joshua
From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 03:43:06 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <zzzk.697943798@jacobs> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: usa
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Lines: 9

[e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes:

|>There are other reasons to explore the solar system than simply to
|>look for images of ourselves. Let us not be so self-centered....

as someone has pointed out, mars observor launches this year, and it has
a resolution of 3 meters ... so we'll know by '94 one way or the other.

josh
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From: [e-mail] (Geoff McCaughan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 05:55:57 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue>
Organization: The Equinox Network CHCH NZ (Node SATORI)
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[e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:

> I had posted  the PYRAMIDS.JPG picture in various news-groups.
> I'm just wondering what You think about the Pyramids on mars ??
> Did You already take a look at it and what do You think about it ?
> Only optical delusion or proof of soemthing unexplainable ?
> Let me know !

Have you ever seen a ventifact?

Geoff - Sysop Equinox (equinox.gen.nz) [phone] (4 Lines)
Email:  [e-mail] - or - [e-mail]
        "If I post something lucid, is that satorial eloquence?"
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watdragon!watyew!jdnicoll
From: [e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 05:33:14 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>
>>>    All well and good except if you're looking for life you have
>>>to eliminate all the stars younger than about 3 Gyr...  That limits
>>>things quite a bit...  Exorcising the stars with low probabilities
>>>(from the other contraints...)...
>
>>    Why? Didn't unicellular life show up within 1 gyr of the
>>Earth's formation?
>
>    Unicellular life isn't very interesting to talk to... :-)
>For the purposes of SETI-like investigations, there isn't much stock in
>going for the intermediate-age stars.  In terms of answering "does life
>exist" - sure, but you have to figure out a scheme whereby you can determine
>that the unicellular life is there.  Outside of going there and looking,
>you're sort of stuck.
>
>    Not that surveying the older stars are any picnic either...

    I imagine that Lovelock would suggest looking for worlds whose
atmosphere is in what should be chemical disequilibrium. Lots of O2,
for example, suggests there must be something producing it continually.

                            James Nicoll
Path: ns-mx!uunet!olivea!apple!netcomsv!mork!sheaffer
From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 06:22:05 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 17
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20771 sci.space:26784 alt.paranormal:4404 alt.alien.visitors:4506

In article <[e-mail]> randall embry <[e-mail]> writes:

>In the book "The Road Less Travelled," the author (Peck?) cites a 1972
>university experiment that "proved" subjects could project images to
>nearby sleeping subjects.  Anyone heard about this?

And in his book "People of the Lie", Peck "proved" that some people
who appear to have mental illness are really possessed by devils.
(And this guy is a psychologist!!)
--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!ut-emx!astro.as.utexas.edu!defonso
From: [e-mail] (Eric Defonso)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 06:19:01 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Distribution: na
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin
Lines: 82

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Incidentally, are you aware that Vallee became interested in studying this
>phenomenon when he found astronomers destroying observation data of UFO
>events that they could not explain?

I'm interested to know what type of observation data astronomers had
that could possibly have contributed to UFO research in the first place.

[ other deletia ]

>>So, all you have to do is to convince astronomers, and other scientists,
>>that studying UFOs is going to teach us about *anything real*, apart
>>from human self-deception!!
>
>No, not necessarily.  The only people that need convincing are those who
>might be inquisitive enough to want to know what the phenomenon really,
>truly is.

Past experience has shown that many times, the phenomenon is something
quite explainable in terms of our current knowledge, i.e. weather,
hoaxing, etc. Because of this, there is not much enthusiasm among
scientists to pursue the subject when so much *real* science can be
done in the meantime.

I presume that the people who are already "working" on the problem
will let us know if they ever come up with anything substantive.

>
>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>about this phenomenon need apply.

Only those who have the time and money to spend on wild goose
chases, basing conclusions on anecdotal information and ignoring
the problem of unrepeatability need apply.

>BTW: Has it ever occurred to you that you may be limiting the sciences by
>allowing the study of only those things that would contribute to _known_
>fields (such as astronomy, biology, etc.)?  Is it not possible that a
>study of the _phenomena_ may yield an entirely _new_ science?

I for one wouldn't call astronomy a "known" science, although I
think I know what you mean. I agree with you in principle, actually -
but until there is at least some measure of real recurrence,
I don't think it's very sensible at all to pursue that avenue.
It involves an unjustifiable allocation of resources that I cannot
accept.
>
>Don't misunderstand me.  I'm not implying that we should study the
>phenomenon for the sake of creating a new science.  But, by limiting

There's nothing wrong with *developing* a new science; unless
you're trying to make one where there is no scientific method
of inquiry to begin with.

>our research to those things we already know about or we are sure will
>contribute only to _known_ fields is, well...., limiting.

When the possibility for real science arises in regard to the
"UFO phenomenon", I think you'll find a great many people
interested in the topic.

>
>Jim Graham - Scepticus Realisticus
>
>        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
>                          Neither do they speak for me.
> ______________________________________________________________________
>| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
>|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
>| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
>|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
>|______________________________________________________________________|


--
Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In Search Of...a good .sig **** "When in doubt, tell the truth." - Twain
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!ux.acs.umn.edu!csd1227
From: [e-mail] (Greg Larson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 08:07:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Minnesota
Lines: 28

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>
>There's nothing wrong with *developing* a new science; unless
>you're trying to make one where there is no scientific method
>of inquiry to begin with.
>
>>our research to those things we already know about or we are sure will
>>contribute only to _known_ fields is, well...., limiting.
>
>When the possibility for real science arises in regard to the
>"UFO phenomenon", I think you'll find a great many people
>interested in the topic.
>
>Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)

You are, of course, very wrong in that observation is an extremely important
part of science.  Much of current UFO research has to do with recording
events, i.e., building up a history of the phenomena.  If/when it does become
obvious that UFOs are something quite real and amazing, the information
gathered so far will be enormously useful.  Surely the relatively small
number of people actively involved is a small price to pay for potentially
enormous future benefits.  Your attitude represents the most unscientific
kind of thinking imagineable.

Greg.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!wupost!darwin.sura.net!convex!csn!scicom!paranet!p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Michael.Corbin
From: [e-mail] (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: A Survey!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 21:52:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/428.0 - <ParaNet(sm) , Arvada CO
Lines: 10

Donald,

What is the purpose of your survey, i.e., objectives?

Mike

--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!Sirius.dfn.de!zrz.tu-berlin.de!behse
From: [e-mail] (Juergen Behse)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.space,sci.skeptic,sci.physics
Subject: Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Summary: mars face
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <behse.698489924@tubue>
Date: 19 Feb 92 08:58:44 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (News  Manager)
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4510 alt.paranormal:4405 sci.space:26789 sci.skeptic:20777 sci.physics:17731
Nntp-Posting-Host: mikro.ee.tu-berlin.de

Hello,

I just have posted the 2 missing pictures from the book:
Leben auf dem Mars(live on  mars) by Joh. von Buttlar,

to the following newsgroup:
alt.binaries.pictures.misc

Go with Your nn-newsreader to this group, tag the 2 part files
and give the command:
:decode

Then the newsreader automatically decodes the uuencoded JPEG-pictures
to Your directory.

Then get any JPEG viewer or JPEG to GIF-converter to view them.

Here comes an info courtesty of Tom Lane of the independant JPEG-group,
which describes where to get JPEG software:



If you are looking for "canned" software, viewers, etc:

There is not a lot of pre-built, no-thought-required JPEG software available
yet.  This short list will no doubt grow with time.

For X Windows, John Bradley's XV version 2.00 is an excellent JPEG/GIF viewer.
It's available for FTP from export.lcs.mit.edu or grip.cis.upenn.edu.  The
file is called 'xv-2.00.tar.Z' and is located in the 'contrib' directory on
export or the 'pub' directory on grip.  XV's only real shortcoming is that
it does not fully exploit 24-bit displays (it reduces all images to 8 bits).
If you have a 24-bit display you will get better results from "xloadimage",
which is also available from export, file contrib/xloadimage.3.01.tar.Z.
Version 3.01 does not read JPEG files, but it will read the PPM files put
out by the free JPEG converter described below.  There is also a patched
version called "xli" (see files xli.* in same directory) that does read JPEG
directly.  However, xli is a quick hack rather than an official release;
caveat user.  Another good choice for X Windows is John Cristy's ImageMagick
package, also available from export, file contrib/ImageMagick.tar.Z.  The
viewer included in this package handles 24-bit displays correctly; for
colormapped displays, it does better (though slower) color quantization
than XV.

For MS-DOS, Handmade Software offers two (rather pricy) shareware programs:
Image Alchemy and GIF2JPG/JPG2GIF (contact [e-mail] for details).  The
PC versions of these programs are available for FTP from wuarchive.wustl.edu,
directory mirrors/msdos/graphics, files alchmy15.zip and gif2jpg5.zip; also
from SIMTEL20 and its other mirror sites.  (Image Alchemy is also available
as an executable for Sun Unix machines, but I don't know where to find it.)
GIF2JPG/JPG2GIF only perform JPEG<=>GIF format conversion.  Image Alchemy
converts files between these and many other formats, and can also display
images on some types of hardware.  The display option is pretty limited,
so you'll still want a separate viewer program.  (WARNING: GIF2JPG produces
a proprietary file format unless you specify -j.  Be sure to use -j if you
want to exchange JPEG files with other Usenet users.  For that matter, it's
not real clear that you should be posting JPEG files made from GIFs; see
section 5.)

For the Macintosh, Storm Technology has released a free program that can
decode and view JPEG images (though not create them).  This is called
Picture Decompress.  Make sure you get version 2.0.1 or later; earlier
versions are not compatible with JFIF file format.  This program can be
FTPed from sumex-aim.stanford.edu, directory /info-mac/app, file
picture-decompress-201.hqx.  You'll also need a tool for adjusting file type
codes; set the type of a downloaded image file to 'JPEG' to allow Picture
Decompress to open it.

If none of the above fits your situation, you can obtain and compile the
free JPEG converter program described below.  You'll also need a viewer
program, and if your viewer only handles GIF files, you'll want a separate
color quantization program (we recommend ppmquant from the PBMPLUS package
for Unix machines; on PCs, try Piclab).  This last requirement will go away
with the next release of the free code.

There are numerous commercial JPEG offerings, with more popping up every
day.  I recommend that you not spend money on one of these unless you find
the available free or shareware software vastly too slow.  In that case,
purchase a hardware-assisted product.  Ask pointed questions about whether
the product complies with the final JPEG standard and about whether it can
handle the JFIF file format; many of the earliest commercial releases are
not and never will be compatible with anyone else's files.


If you are looking for source code to work with:

Free, portable C code for JPEG compression is available from the Independent
JPEG Group, which I lead.  A package containing our source code,
documentation, and some small test files is available from several places.
The "official" archive site for this source code is ftp.uu.net (137.39.1.9
or 192.48.96.9).  Look under directory /graphics/jpeg; the current release
is jpegsrc.v2.tar.Z.  (This is a compressed TAR file; don't forget to
retrieve in binary mode.)  You can retrieve this file by FTP or UUCP.  Folks
in Europe may find it easier to FTP from nic.funet.fi (see directory
pub/graphics/programs/jpeg).  The source code is also available on
CompuServe, in the GRAPHSUPPORT forum (GO PICS), library 10, as jpsrc2.zip.

The free JPEG code provides conversion between JPEG "JFIF" format and image
files in PBMPLUS PPM, Utah RLE, Truevision Targa, and GIF file formats.
(However, output to GIF format is not of high quality at present; ditto for
colormapped Targa and RLE formats.)  The core compression and decompression
modules can easily be reused in other programs, such as image viewers.  The
package is highly portable; we have tested it on many machines ranging from
PCs to Crays.

We have released this software for both noncommercial and commercial use.
Companies are welcome to use it as the basis for JPEG-related products.
We do not ask a royalty, although we do ask for an acknowledgement in
product literature (see the README file in the distribution for details).
We hope to make this software industrial-quality --- although, as with
anything that's free, we offer no warranty and accept no liability.

The Independent JPEG Group is a volunteer organization; if you'd like to
contribute to improving our software, you are welcome to join.

If you are not reasonably handy at configuring and installing portable C
programs, you may have some difficulty installing the free source code.
Steve Davis ([e-mail]) has volunteered to maintain an archive of
pre-built executable versions of the free JPEG code for various machines.
His FTP archive is at procyon.cis.ksu.edu (129.130.10.80 -- this number is
due to change soon); look under /pub/JPEG to see what he currently has.
(The administrators of this system ask that FTP traffic be limited to
non-prime hours.)  This archive is not maintained by the Independent JPEG
Group, and files in it may not represent the latest source code.



For more information about JPEG in general or the free JPEG software in
particular, contact the Independent JPEG Group at [e-mail].

--
            tom lane
            organizer, Independent JPEG Group
Internet: [e-mail]    BITNET: tgl%cs.cmu.edu@carnegie



Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
Decentral Energy Research
email to: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 18:53:12 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 49

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Don Ecker) writes:
>Asteroids can be fatal to radio careers to. It seems that former
>science advisor to radio talk show host Chuck Harder, Richard
>Hoagland, embarrassed Harder on the air, thereby severing his
>weekly spot on Harders show. Harder had been speaking publicly on
>his program about an alleged asteroid that had been, according to
>what appeared to be a New York Times story from 1977 speeding its way to
>Earth, making what the story claimed were course changes. The Times article
>duly quoted purported scientists, and sounded very legit; it turned out that
>when the New York Times Index was checked, along with microfiche copies from
>that date and several days after, no such article could be found. It was
>someone's very real looking fabrication.

It wasn't an intentional hoax (except for the idiot who circulated it as
real, whoever he was.)  It's page 101 of a fictional book titled "The
Extraterrestrial Report", by Richard Siegel, John H. Butterfield, and
Jean-Claude Suares, Copyright 1978, published by A&W Publishers, Inc., 95
Madison Avenue, New York, New York 10016.  Library of Congress Catalog Card
Number 77-91031, ISBN # 0-89104-093-5.  (Just in case anyone wants to
check.)

The book contains a number of fake government documents, fake magazine
articles, and fake newspaper articles.  The government documents and
magazine articles are obvious satire.  The fake New York Times articles
don't have a satirical tone, unfortunately.  (Unless, considering the
publication date, the name "Lucas Hamill" is a reference to the movie "Star
Wars".)

I've often wondered whether the book could have been the inspiration for
a large part of the conspiracy scenario as we know it today.  It starts
with a document found in the Truman Library in which Truman is worried
about the aliens, then jumps to the present where a SETI team makes contact
with aliens.  The Federal Agency for Interstellar Contact (FAIC,
obviously) is formed to take control of the situation.  They announce
that the signal was a hoax and force the shutdown of the SETI facility,
while secretly continuing work on it themselves.  FAIC is a highly
secretive group, even President Carter doesn't have a clue about it.
Eventually the aliens, who are friendly, land and sign a treaty with us.
We grant them the right to fly through our solar system, and in return they
educate us about the universe.  They warn us about a parasitic race who are
on their way to Earth with a large spaceship to destroy us.  Eventually
astronomers detect this ship, which is covered up by claiming that it's an
asteroid.  Then the race is on to figure out a way to stop it.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 19:05:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 31

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
>*stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
>flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
>astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!

I'd be interested in it too!  I heard bits of a similar story on the
Fidonet UFO echo a few weeks ago.  The story I heard said that a spaceship
shot at the shuttle with some sort of beam, and the shuttle had to get out
of the way.  There's a tape showing the alleged incident (in fact, the
story I heard said it was "released" rather than "stolen"), but I haven't
seen it.  It was aired on a program called "ET Monitor", which I think is
on some sort of Christian satellite network but I'm not sure.

The version I heard doesn't say anything about 35 ships, just one.  Also,
if what I heard about the shuttle dodging some sort of beam weapon is
correct, the whole story's integrity is suspect.  Unlike every SF movie
ever made, you can't see things coming at light speed!  (Although it's
possible that it was just phrased awkwardly; maybe the shuttle had to dodge
the *spacecraft*, and the beam missed or was just a warning shot.)

I haven't heard anything about the audio on the tape.  There's an old story
about audio-only transmission from a shuttle that spotted an alien
spaceship, but as likely as not it was a hoax by someone on the ground.
(Shuttle audio is rebroadcast on various ham stations.)

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!bronze!venus.iucf.indiana.edu!graham
From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 15:27:01 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Distribution: na
Organization: Somewhere in Bloomington, Indiana
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4513 sci.space:26792 sci.skeptic:20779 alt.paranormal:4406
News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.3-4
Nntp-Posting-Host: venus.iucf.indiana.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] () writes...
>turn.  And frnakly, I think NASA doesn't want to make a big deal about
>observing the face because it looks kinda stupid in the professional community.
>(and can you imagine telling congress you need $500 million because someone
>thinks aliens left a messsage for us :).
>
>However, I think many face activists have the wrong impression.  NASA was
>planning to take a picture of the face last I heard.  just beacuse they don't
>make it their top priority doesn't mean that they are conspiring to hide
>evidence.
>
>                Josh

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, with references, but I believe that
_congress_ gave NASA a _mandate_ to take pictures of Cydonia with the
Mars Observer.

It was not NASA's decision.

>

Jim Graham

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
|______________________________________________________________________|
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!bronze!venus.iucf.indiana.edu!graham
From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 15:38:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Nntp-Posting-Host: venus.iucf.indiana.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>
>>Incidentally, are you aware that Vallee became interested in studying this
>>phenomenon when he found astronomers destroying observation data of UFO
>>events that they could not explain?
>
>I'm interested to know what type of observation data astronomers had
>that could possibly have contributed to UFO research in the first place.
>

_Unidentified_ flying objects comes to mind.

>[ other deletia ]
>
>>>So, all you have to do is to convince astronomers, and other scientists,
>>>that studying UFOs is going to teach us about *anything real*, apart
>>>from human self-deception!!
>>
>>No, not necessarily.  The only people that need convincing are those who
>>might be inquisitive enough to want to know what the phenomenon really,
>>truly is.
>
>Past experience has shown that many times, the phenomenon is something
>quite explainable in terms of our current knowledge, i.e. weather,
>hoaxing, etc. Because of this, there is not much enthusiasm among

Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.

>scientists to pursue the subject when so much *real* science can be
>done in the meantime.

"Real" science?  Define this in such a way that it directly contradicts
what I have been claiming.

>I presume that the people who are already "working" on the problem
>will let us know if they ever come up with anything substantive.
>
>>
>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>about this phenomenon need apply.
>
>Only those who have the time and money to spend on wild goose
>chases, basing conclusions on anecdotal information and ignoring
>the problem of unrepeatability need apply.

My statement about "truth" stands.

What you are asking for is "repeatability" of a _particular_ sighting.

What I have been talking about is the _phenomenon_ in a collective sense.

That is undeniable.  That is worth studying.

Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
black hole.

Then, show me how I can repeat the same experiments and get the same
results.

The bottom line is that you can't.  You can show me effects that point
to these things, but you can't _show_ me these "things".

In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.

Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
(whatever that may be) does not.

Now, let me rephrase the above....

"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
atom #1E37 is going to split does not.

Do you see my point?

>>BTW: Has it ever occurred to you that you may be limiting the sciences by
>>allowing the study of only those things that would contribute to _known_
>>fields (such as astronomy, biology, etc.)?  Is it not possible that a
>>study of the _phenomena_ may yield an entirely _new_ science?
>
>I for one wouldn't call astronomy a "known" science, although I
>think I know what you mean. I agree with you in principle, actually -
>but until there is at least some measure of real recurrence,
>I don't think it's very sensible at all to pursue that avenue.
>It involves an unjustifiable allocation of resources that I cannot
>accept.

Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.

>>Don't misunderstand me.  I'm not implying that we should study the
>>phenomenon for the sake of creating a new science.  But, by limiting
>
>There's nothing wrong with *developing* a new science; unless
>you're trying to make one where there is no scientific method
>of inquiry to begin with.

Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
evidence of this?

>
>>our research to those things we already know about or we are sure will
>>contribute only to _known_ fields is, well...., limiting.
>
>When the possibility for real science arises in regard to the
>"UFO phenomenon", I think you'll find a great many people
>interested in the topic.

The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
SETI research.  That is absurd.

So don't preach to me about "repeatability".

>Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)

Jim Graham

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
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From: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 15:06:13 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Organization: Field Robotics Center, CMU
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In-Reply-To: randall embry's message of Tue, 18 Feb 1992 19:25:55 -050

Randall,
Wake up!  Your still dreaming (amd confusing fact with fantasy).

--
Gerry Roston ([e-mail]) | II - A well regulated Militia, being
Field Robotics Center,          | necessary to the security of a free State,
Carnegie Mellon University      | the right of the people to keep and bear
Pittsburgh, PA, 15213           | Arms, shall not be infringed.
[phone]                  |
                                |
The opinions expressed are mine |
and do not reflect the official |
position of CMU, FRC, RedZone,  |
or any other organization.      |
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From: [e-mail] (Mark Gellis)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic
Subject: New Topic, or an Old One: Mass Drivers
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 16:00:59 GMT
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Purdue University
Lines: 16
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4516 sci.space:26796 sci.skeptic:20784

Followup-To:
Distribution: tub
Organization: Purdue University Computing Center
Keywords:


Does anyone have any information or sources on mass drivers/linear
accelerators?

I am particularly interested in what might be called "anticipated
performance data"--how massive are they, what kind of payloads will they
move, what kind of power requirements are involved, what kind of acceleration
will we see (100 gees, 2500 gees?), and so on.  Also, any news or rumors
about research, planned experiments, etc.?

Thanks in advance.
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From: [e-mail] (Craig Becker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Keywords: stolen videotapes NASA
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 14:44:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: IBM Object Technology Products
Lines: 16

>
> Argh!!! I missed it!!!
>
> Did anyone catch the nightly news, I believe on Friday, concerning the
> *stolen* video tape from NASA, which shows a shot from a space shuttle
> flight of 35 disks, and some interesting audio comments from the
> astronauts?  - Would be interested in hearing the total (correct?) story!

Which nightly news are you referring to? Local? In what city? More
details, please!

Craig
-- "Democracy is the theory that  Craig Becker, Object Technology Products --
--  the common people know what         Internet: [e-mail] --
--  they want, and deserve to get     Austin: [e-mail] --
--  it good and hard" - H. L. Mencken               VNET: CRAIGB at AUSVM1 --
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From: [e-mail] (Tim Parsons)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality
Keywords: mistake, UFOs, psi, creationism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 17:30:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Dept of CS Ball State University Muncie In
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    We could call it "lack of rigorous adherence to the Scientific Method,"
but that doesn't quite roll off the tongue, now does it?
    Examples are ubiquitous, though, whatever we call it.  This fallacy is
the main point behind the scientific method, which uses controlled conditions
to try to eliminate extraneous explanations.

Tim Parsons
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From: [e-mail] (Frank Tredeau)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:18:45 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: sci.skeptic
Organization: Concurrent Computer Corp. Westford MA.
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Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20789 sci.space:26802 alt.paranormal:4410 alt.alien.visitors:4519

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (randall embry) writes:

>I had this dream about six months ago...   I was in a fairly open place,
>and surrounded by people who seemed a little perplexed & angry that I
>didn't remember them.  They told me they had met me several times
>before, and that they were real people like me who were dreaming right
>now.  It seemed the goal was to try to establish contact with one
>another back in "the real world."  My brilliant suggestion was to write
>someone's phone number on my hand, so I guess I blew it.  It seemed like
>a fairly lucid dream; I remember sitting at a table at a restaurant, and
>when a waiter came and asked me to leave if I wasn't going to pay, I
>said something like "leave me alone this is my dream" and everyone
>laughed.

That was no dream.  That place was New Hampshire.
And you are George Bush.

F
o
d
d
e
r

Frank Tredeau             Concurrent Computer Corp.
              sez me
Path: ns-mx!uunet!tarpit!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:35:45 GMT
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
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 This is one topic covered in a recent Liberator text by Hatonn that
 you might find interesting and a bit strong. "Hatonn" is a Pleiadian
 Space Commander and it is left up to you the reader to determine
 what is presented is valid or not. I make *no* claims on the material.
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------

  ** From Phoenix Liberator January 7, 1992 Volume XVII Number 12 **

  Topic:REPTILIANS AND LITTLE GRAYS

  It is time I confirm and explain the presence of massive underground
  systems throughout your globe--which are very "human" oriented and
  occupied.  You will be told that these installations are headed and run
  as a hostage situation--by aliens.  Reptilians and Little Grays. BS!  Are
  there Reptilians and Little Grays present?  Indeed!  There are massive
  numbers of them--all cloned, replicated and terrifying.  You will further
  be told that they hold your government hostage.  More and deeper heaps of
  lies--they are produced by the good-will dedication and greedy money
  grubbing governments at the control of the Elite Committee of 300 who
  operate out of Switzerland and headed by the Royal Crown of England.
  These are the Satanic British Zionists originally known as the Serpent
  People. This is exactly why the Reptilians will be presented to you as
  the ones in control.  The Serpent is the symbol of Satan and these ones
  have never even bothered to lie to you about their label.

  Topic:UNEMPLOYED

  Sit quietly for a minute and consider numbers with me, for as these
  underground facilities are coming to finished status there are a lot of
  suddenly available unemployed.  You are showing increased numbers of
  unemployed NEW sign-ups of half a million a week.  You are talking now of
  millions out of work--from where?  Yes, from all over, but WHY?  How many
  people, say, in the area of Lancaster/Palmdale, California, might you
  personally know who work in the aerospace industry wherein groups work on
  items which are isolated and secret with penalty of death as reward for
  tattling?  Almost all is done on "need to know" basis and ones are going
  to realize they have been working on projects which were so unworldly as
  to shock Spielberg. Worse than what appears on the surface, they are
  subjected to mandatory testings, physicals, etc., where they are totally
  programmed "to forget" what they have seen and heard.  I am going to name
  some names and places (locations) so that you can check them out as to
  authenticity and then you will find it easier to accept truth as it is
  unfolded to you.  We will start in the local area of Southern California
  in the Edwards Air Force Base area extending in a large triangular shape
  which includes all the way to Pasadena, Long Beach, Palmdale, Lancaster,
  Tehachapi, Mojave, Edwards and China Lake--just for starters.  We have
  spoken often already about the areas of "51", "72", Dulce, etc., in
  Nevada, New Mexico and Arizona so we will leave it to suffice that
  duplication is present in those places as well.  Ones who have had the
  "privilege" of tourist rides into Yucca Mountain to check out the tunnels
  for planned nuclear waste sites will not be as shocked as the rest of you
  unsuspecting ones.  At Yucca Mountain alone there are over 35 major
  tunnels which totally catacomb the mountain at all levels as deep as
  several miles.  There is only one tunnel open for public eyes and it is
  impressive enough to stun the eyes and minds of hardened engineers.  In
  the Palmdale area beneath a "hanger" type building, which actually is
  movable on tracks, is a multilayer technology center over eight levels in
  depth and the size of a massive city.  The workers are mostly
  manufactured robotoids and synthetics made for labor with computer
  intelligence.  Human participants are of the "Ultra top-secret clearance"
  personnel.  At Edwards launch area in a bluff (butte) called Haystack,
  there is an even larger installation underground with incredible beam
  pulse systems, aircraft launchers, stealth equipment in coalition with
  the Soviet Cosmosphere program with total capability of destroying the
  planet in some 15 minutes.  Locked into that installation is a massive
  underground facility near Tehachapi called The Anthill (Northrup).  There
  are open silos wherein light laser systems are tested and cosmos-drones
  sent out like marching armies to probe electronically.  They are like
  little basketballs of light running usually to blue and sometimes
  golden/orange.  These particular installations are carved out with
  digging equipment which melts the mind as to possibilities as nothing
  stops them--not rock nor metal.  They are drills tipped with diamond bits
  and carve a 40 ft.  tunnel in mere hours.  Interconnecting these
  installations are high-speed transit rails with "trains" which "fly" on
  an electromagnetic system off the ground at incredible speed.  There has
  been a lot of "blasting", also, but covered by the stories of aircraft
  moving through the sound barrier and after a while it simply became that
  no-one paid any attention.

  Topic:BEINGS INVOLVED

  I don't even like to speak much of the Reptilians because they are
  dramatically for fear effect.  Some are simply beings with leathered type
  of covering for protection purposes and are no more than humans in
  costume.  The Little Grays fit into a different type of category and if
  not selectively handled get completely out of control.  These are both
  comprised of manufactured (soul-less) beings without compassion or
  feelings of any type.  They are very "strong" physically and the "Grays"
  can literally infiltrate into the substance around them, i.e., they can
  "float" or disperse through a wall or door, etc.  There is a third type
  of replicated being made in the form of that which is presented to you on
  television as an "Orange". These are computer-bright but basically clone
  laborers.  These are very human in appearance but too synthetic to fit in
  with your citizenry.  I am going to remind you--THESE ARE NOT SPACE
  ALIENS ALTHOUGH PATTERNED FROM ORIGINAL ALIEN ENTRIES OF EONS PAST. I
  hope you are beginning to get the picture, chelas.  These are the
  adversaries OF GOD and of we, the Hosts. They neither have the technology
  to traverse the cosmos nor are they even allowed into the space beyond
  the Earth orbiting system at best.  These ones are led and controlled by
  the entities who would Rule the Earth and they are the reflection of
  hybrid, emotionless beings who serve the World Order "Elite". They are
  basically Satanic tools and act on direct orders of the controllers.

  Topic:WAR OF THE "GODS"

  We don't speak of "Gods" as such, but the idea fits.  It is the time of
  sorting and separation of the participants (players) on the physical orb
  called Shan (Earth). It is the time of retrieval of God's children who
  are experiencing on the place for all sorts of varying reasons in
  soul-growth progression.  Evil intends to rule the globe and all things
  thereon.  But, he has already destroyed the bountiful wonders of the
  globe and it cannot continue as is.  Therefore, the plan is to take
  control through whatever means available--preferably leaving a remnant of
  Godly slave laborers and annihilation of other souled beings.  This will
  be accomplished in two ways.  l.  He will simply convince the souled
  being that God is not who and what He claims to be.  Those unthinking
  masses will simply be led down the "primrose" paths through the mire of
  lies and disbeliefs of truth.  These, for the most part, will be called
  Christians (by any other label).  These ones will be side-tracked into a
  belief system which revolves around the human physical being of, say, a
  Jesus Christ or Buddha, as adequate examples.  They will set their intent
  upon denying and "proving" the non-presence of God, Hosts, Goodly Aliens,
  etc.--anything of the Spiritual realms of Light. Their whole intent will
  claim infinite experience but will be entrapped in total physical and
  material matter.  2. He will simply enslave physically those who stand
  against him and as ones are no longer useful, they will be slain and/or
  used for testing, etc.  Disease will wipe out multitudes and then wars
  will annihilate millions, famine and exposure will get more and in the
  interim, all dissenters will be interned in compounds if they are thought
  to be dangerous to "the cause".  Ones who go about their business without
  great confrontation will be basically left alone if they are in areas
  wherein they are no bother.

  Topic:GOD WILL NOT INTERFERE

  There is full understanding between the higher "commands". Our people are
  not to be harmed.  This does not mean that ALL know this even though ones
  who attempt bodily harm are usually taken out a.s.a.p.  by their own
  group.  The adversary will not risk encounter with my Command. God's
  people are "off limits".  I suggest you be making very, very sure as to
  whether or not you are one of God's people.  Don't ask ME!  If you don't
  know then you better get awfully worried.  Does this mean that God's
  people will not be caught in anything nasty or negative?  No, many of you
  will perish and no place, as such, is safer than any other.  I can assure
  you that you will have colds and flu, get cold and get hot, hungry and
  tired just like everyone and anyone else.  You WILL be allowed to fulfill
  your mission whatever it might entail and you WILL BE RECLAIMED AND
  BROUGHT INTO SAFETY AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME. There is time left for
  action in almost unlimited manner if you utilize that time well.  Things
  are not in order to the point of desirability on the part of the Planners
  so you will simply work within that circumstance in which you find self.
  There are still some methods of assisting selves with security in ability
  to barter, etc., if you use intelligence.  Violence will simply get all
  of our workers killed and it will not be tolerated--if I have to tell you
  that point then you are going to harm more than serve good.  You will be
  sly as the serpent and gentle as the dove--dead martyrs serve no one.
  Your job is not to fight the war--yours is to bring Truth, put it to
  press, assist wherein you can by example without force or undue nagging
  for each will have to know for self.  We must have a "remnant" and that
  means that you of my command will not act in foolishness or you will be
  put to the side lest you endanger the entire lift-off program.  You will
  be given to know your task when appropriate and he who acts in greed will
  be put to last.  Know that we can beam you up into safety from Mars if
  need be.  I can get you aboard the Phoenix, for instance, which is far
  outside your orbiting place.

  Topic:OTHER PLACES IN THE U.S.

  There are massive bases in Canada but some of the more important
  strategic centers are, of course, around (under) Atlanta and Arkansas. In
  some of those areas there were already an underground "alien" race and
  massive tunneling complex.  There are also ancient tunnels under
  Tehachapi, for instance.  The military has now tunneled right to the side
  of the crystal in Tehachapi and we have now blocked their entry into that
  portion of their system.  Only a tiny portion of the crystal in point is
  allowed the use of Earthians.

  Topic:POISON WATER SUPPLY

  Other bad news includes a slow and deliberate addition of herbicides into
  the water systems of your cities.  Most is by accidental seepage from
  growing fields at very low levels of toxicity but now covering massive
  areas.  As water supplies dwindle in the areas stricken by drought there
  will be more and more actual toxic response to that pollution.  There
  will also be virus infection via water systems whereby whole villages and
  sections of cities will become ill within hours--simultaneously.  The
  cover-up is massive and "leakers" or "speakers" are dealt with instantly
  by either absolute negation of "law" or injection or by death--mostly the
  latter depending on the importance of the "squealer". You have ones in
  the local group who are targets who managed to survive all three types of
  assault.  I will tell you now, it is very difficult to kill one of my
  people.  Usually the journey to this side is vaguely remembered and
  almost always the trip itself is recalled and known at the time and again
  remembered at some time later.


  Topic:AM I TELLING YOU "IT IS OVER"?

  No indeed.  I am simply telling you that you must be ready for that next
  assault on your beings as we have described it in the past.  Remember, I
  told you that before you are through, the enemy will blame all things on
  aliens to prevent any of you being reclaimed by God--THE BATTLE IS FOR
  YOUR SOULS--ONE DIRECTION GIVES TOTAL FREEDOM AND THE OTHER ENSLAVEMENT
  AND YOU MUST DECIDE WHICH YOU WILL EXPERIENCE. How many will see through
  the facade of the physical illusion and into the co-creatorship which
  produced that illusion?  When you understand God then you will also
  understand that it only requires YOUR decision.  It is up to YOU to
  choose the gold or the gold-covered lead!  Both appear the same and often
  the lead covered in gold appears the more shiny and desirable to the
  fleshly experience.  The lead actually has more value in the higher
  experiences.  A guide to "clues" is also available to you who will
  mentally take a look.  The protocols and instructions are in place.
  Bridges, passes and area dams are now bombed (mined) and tracking
  stations already in place--to keep ones in the area wherein you ARE when
  the curtain falls.  This means a shut-down of all international travel,
  and interstate travel as well, as time passes.  The point is to actually
  lock you into a small area of location and one in which you can be easily
  controlled and accounted for.  Note the closure of one airline after
  another and note how many of those airline planes are at Mojave!  As
  surface travel is shut down those parts will be utilized for other types
  of vehicles and weapons.  The plan, of course, is to allow things to
  appear natural in their occurrence--i.e., the markets will fall and you
  will be in a depression but always with the prattling that "it is getting
  better"--"just a fluctuation".  You will be like the Russians--into
  disaster without realizing it happened to you.  In your confusion you
  will get deeper and deeper into the pit until the trap is closed.  Then
  the government will simply pull out all resources (welfare) and it will
  appear most spontaneous because, after all, a government without money
  cannot maintain anything.  The ignorant will remain ignorant and in
  denial until it is over and some will never know differently, much less
  admit that what we gave forth was right and correct.  Will you go down
  without revolution?  Probably not, but the bigger gun usually wins,
  especially if he has trained himself to be more clever.  You, dear ones,
  have been uneducated and many of your so-called educated adults can
  neither read nor write.

** End of topic **

Don


--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
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From: [e-mail] (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <![e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:04:40 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>
>And in his book "People of the Lie", Peck "proved" that some people
>who appear to have mental illness are really possessed by devils.
>(And this guy is a psychologist!!)

You seem to have made the determination (a priori) that "devils or demons" do
not exist, thus you use that to totally dismiss Mr. Peck's book and his
credibility.  A true skeptic would not hold such an opinion (skepticism must
be a two-edged sword to be true skepticism).  However, the burden of proof
that such people are possessed by demons is on Peck.  Did he present a
compelling case and well document it?  If not, then the proper conclusion
that one could say is "Mr. Peck, in my opinion, did not conclusively prove
his thesis that some mentally ill people are possessed by demons."  However,
if you cannot show fallacies in how he weaved together the evidence, then you
are not in a position to *authoritatively* dismiss his work (you do have the
right, however, to hold and state any *non-authoritative* opinion that you
like).  And, of course, anyone dismissing Mr. Peck's work and/or his
credibility must also put forth a compelling argument to substantiate their
dismissal, otherwise their opinion carries no weight whatsoever.

I have never read any of Mr. Peck's books, nor have I even heard of him.  Thus
I am not in a position to establish an opinion on his results nor on the man
himself.  If I do study his works, I may come to the opinion that the guy is
out to lunch.  However, I cannot make such a determination at this time nor
will I consider what others say about him using non-authoritative opinions,
as Mr. Sheaffer stated in the above posting.

Of course, this is Usenet, and here everything goes.  :^)

Jon Noring

--
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From: [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 21:45:49 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
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[e-mail] writes:

>> If I'm paying the tax bill, what I favor is a robot IMAX camera where
>> the wind sounds are recorded in 8 channel,  dolby,  THX, etc.  If we did
>> that,  then millions could come close to "going" to Mars,  without anyone
>> actually going.  We have the pictures from Apollo,  but they don't convey
>> the awesome feeling of standing on the moon.  I want the experience.
>Y O U    C A N -
>All you have to do is watch the MARS NAVIGATOR database on the Macintosh PC -
>a touch-screen based videodisk product which is based on the Viking 3 surface
>pictures of the Mars landscape. I think it was Industrial Light and Magic who
>added the 16-bit stereo sound and the 3-d enhancement of the fly-over footage.

I've always been impressed by ILM, but this tops it!  They have data from a
probe that never existed! (there were only two Vikings). I've been thinking
about doing something like this for Venus.  If anyone has any information
about programming codes, let me know.

                Josh Hopkins
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From: [e-mail] (Allen W. Sherzer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 21:57:37 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
Followup-To: Anywhere but sci.space
Organization: Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow
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Please drop sci.space from the followups to this thread.

  Many thanks
   Allen

--
+          They're just jealous because they don't have three               +
|          wise men and a virgin in the whole organization                  |
|     --Vincent Cianci on the ACLU suit to remove a nativity scene          |
+----------------------443 DAYS TO FIRST FLIGHT OF DCX----------------------+
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From: [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 21:52:45 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Distribution: na
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>>However, I think many face activists have the wrong impression.  NASA was
>>planning to take a picture of the face last I heard.  just beacuse they don't
>>make it their top priority doesn't mean that they are conspiring to hide
>>evidence.
>>
>>                Josh

>Someone correct me if I'm wrong, with references, but I believe that
>_congress_ gave NASA a _mandate_ to take pictures of Cydonia with the
>Mars Observer.
>It was not NASA's decision.

I've heard this from an unreliable source, but I don't have references for
or against it.  The issue isn't all that significant though, unless someone
can prove that NASA was planning to _not_ take a picutre of Cydonia before
congress got involved.  MO will go into polar orbit and take pictures of most
of Mars.  Just because NASA didn't want to make Cydonia a priority doesn't mean
they planned to go out of their way to avoid taking picuters every time MO
goes over the region.
            Josh Hopkins

>Jim Graham
>        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
>                          Neither do they speak for me.
> ______________________________________________________________________
>| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
>|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
>| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
>|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
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From: [e-mail] (Kathi Iannamico)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: .. .
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 21:55:36 GMT
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... .. .. .  /.. . ... . ... .
/..
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <8ddhwp=[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 19:17:49 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <![e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>You seem to have made the determination (a priori) that "devils or demons" do
>not exist, thus you use that to totally dismiss Mr. Peck's book and his
>credibility.

I been a BAD widdle boy! :)



> And, of course, anyone dismissing Mr. Peck's work and/or his
>credibility must also put forth a compelling argument to substantiate their
>dismissal, otherwise their opinion carries no weight whatsoever.
>
Sorry, that's backwards. Anyone ACCEPTING Peck's conclusion must put forth
a compelling reason why the "devil possession" hypothesis is correct,
and modern science is wrong.

The burden of proof ALWAYS lies on whoever makes extraordinary claims.

--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (Joe Gottman)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality
Keywords: mistake, UFOs, psi, creationism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 19:58:24 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: Joe Gottman
Organization: Dept of Math, Northwestern Univ
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This 'alibi mentallity' could also be called 'Sherlock Holmes's fallacy.'
One of his most famous sayings is "When you have eliminated the impossible,
whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Mycroft would
never have made such a mistake. :)

Joe Gottman
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From: [e-mail] (Rich Payne)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <=fdhm8=[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 19:25:24 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: na
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>
>>>Incidentally, are you aware that Vallee became interested in studying this
>>>phenomenon when he found astronomers destroying observation data of UFO
>>>events that they could not explain?
>>
>>I'm interested to know what type of observation data astronomers had
>>that could possibly have contributed to UFO research in the first place.
>>
>
>_Unidentified_ flying objects comes to mind.

You have re-named the phemonena, not identified data astronomers
might contribute. I can see that they _might_ have observations
and possibly some photographic evidence. They do watch the sky
more often than the rest of us I would think.

>>[ other deletia ]
>>
>>>>So, all you have to do is to convince astronomers, and other scientists,
>>>>that studying UFOs is going to teach us about *anything real*, apart
>>>>from human self-deception!!
>>>
>>>No, not necessarily.  The only people that need convincing are those who
>>>might be inquisitive enough to want to know what the phenomenon really,
>>>truly is.
>>
>>Past experience has shown that many times, the phenomenon is something
>>quite explainable in terms of our current knowledge, i.e. weather,
>>hoaxing, etc. Because of this, there is not much enthusiasm among
>
>Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.

Curiously, when many people _say_ UFO, they mean _alien spacecraft_.
So what they are talking about is not an unknown deserving of study,
but those darn aliens.

>>scientists to pursue the subject when so much *real* science can be
>>done in the meantime.
>
>"Real" science?  Define this in such a way that it directly contradicts
>what I have been claiming.
>
>>I presume that the people who are already "working" on the problem
>>will let us know if they ever come up with anything substantive.
>>
>>>
>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>>about this phenomenon need apply.

Need there be a single TRVTH? Or even just one phenomenon? I thought
we were dealing with an unknown? Hopefully I have guessed correctly
who originally said this.

>>
>>Only those who have the time and money to spend on wild goose
>>chases, basing conclusions on anecdotal information and ignoring
>>the problem of unrepeatability need apply.
>
>My statement about "truth" stands.

I tend to think that there is no truth, just different points of
view.

>What you are asking for is "repeatability" of a _particular_ sighting.
>
>What I have been talking about is the _phenomenon_ in a collective sense.
>
>That is undeniable.  That is worth studying.

As many believe, and many do not.

>
>Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
>laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
>a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
>black hole.

This seems to be a straw-man argument. The truth or falsity of the
above has no bearing upon the value of studying the "UFO phenomenon".
Nevertheless, fission, while not predictable, is quite repeatable,
and the rate can be measured. Now if only UFO observations were as
repeatable, this thread would never have existed. And there is
a pretty good theoretical basis behind black holes. What theory
perdicts UFO`s?

>Then, show me how I can repeat the same experiments and get the same
>results.

Is that not for those who claim that UFO are worth the study to
show?

>The bottom line is that you can't.  You can show me effects that point
>to these things, but you can't _show_ me these "things".
>
>In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.

No argument, but where do we go from here? This alone is not
sufficient.

>Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
>(whatever that may be) does not.

A flying saucer might be studied. How does one study a phenomenon?

>Now, let me rephrase the above....
>
>"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
>atom #1E37 is going to split does not.
>
>Do you see my point?

I see your point. But things with boring repeatability have never
been that difficult to study.

>>>BTW: Has it ever occurred to you that you may be limiting the sciences by
>>>allowing the study of only those things that would contribute to _known_
>>>fields (such as astronomy, biology, etc.)?  Is it not possible that a
>>>study of the _phenomena_ may yield an entirely _new_ science?
>>
>>I for one wouldn't call astronomy a "known" science, although I
>>think I know what you mean. I agree with you in principle, actually -
>>but until there is at least some measure of real recurrence,
>>I don't think it's very sensible at all to pursue that avenue.
>>It involves an unjustifiable allocation of resources that I cannot
>>accept.
>
>Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
>It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
>in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.

I think that the requirements to eat and pay the rent might
just possibly make it into the objective category. Unless you
make a living doing something else, and study the phenomenon on
your own.

>>>Don't misunderstand me.  I'm not implying that we should study the
>>>phenomenon for the sake of creating a new science.  But, by limiting
>>
>>There's nothing wrong with *developing* a new science; unless
>>you're trying to make one where there is no scientific method
>>of inquiry to begin with.
>
>Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
>the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
>evidence of this?

It is not possible to _prove_ that a thing does not exist.
Rather, the problem here is defining just what the phenomenon
is. Right now all we have is the 'phenomenon' label, and claims
of alien spacecraft. Would you care to try to get funding
based upon this?

>>
>>>our research to those things we already know about or we are sure will
>>>contribute only to _known_ fields is, well...., limiting.
>>
>>When the possibility for real science arises in regard to the
>>"UFO phenomenon", I think you'll find a great many people
>>interested in the topic.
>
>The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
>it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
>of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
>find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
>_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
>SETI research.  That is absurd.

While I think the chances of SETI working are so slim as to
make it a wasted effort, how does one compare SETI to a conspiricy
theory, and find an absurdity. Also you claim we have a UFO
'phenomenon', not alien intelligence, how do you reconcile that
with the clear implication that UFO are extraterrestial
intelligences above?

>So don't preach to me about "repeatability".
>
>>Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
>
>Jim Graham
>
>        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
>                          Neither do they speak for me.
> ______________________________________________________________________
>| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
>|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
>| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
>|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
>|______________________________________________________________________|


Rich

[e-mail]    Sig is at the cleaners.
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From: [e-mail] (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Summary: We should have more open-minded skepticism.
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 21:54:37 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 101
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20816 sci.physics:17761 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1012 alt.paranormal:4418 alt.alien.visitors:4529 sci.energy:7815

It all started from another thread:

In article [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>In article [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>>You seem to have made the determination (a priori) that "devils or demons" do
>>not exist, thus you use that to totally dismiss Mr. Peck's book and his
>>credibility.
>
>I been a BAD widdle boy! :)
>
>> And, of course, anyone dismissing Mr. Peck's work and/or his
>>credibility must also put forth a compelling argument to substantiate their
>>dismissal, otherwise their opinion carries no weight whatsoever.
>>
>Sorry, that's backwards. Anyone ACCEPTING Peck's conclusion must put forth
>a compelling reason why the "devil possession" hypothesis is correct,
>and modern science is wrong.

I can agree with that, but I also still hold the original view.  A small
point:  I believe (and this carries no weight, just my uneducated opinion :^) )
that the existence of intelligent beings beyond the ability of our present-day
scientific instruments to detect does not necessarily run counter to modern
science.  Saying it another way, the existence of "demons" and modern science
are not in conflict.  You'd have to elaborate on this, and define what you
mean by modern science.

>
>The burden of proof ALWAYS lies on whoever makes extraordinary claims.

Most Definitely.  We totally agree here.


***********************************************
End of this thread, now to start a new thread:
***********************************************


(WARNING: I just can't take it anymore - it's been building for a long time -
this was the straw that broke the camels back!  I got to get on my soapbox and
get it off my chest.)


The rest of us, including me, should maintain a healthy, not an unhealthy
skepticism about alternative scientific theories.  Unhealthy is accepting as
dogma everything we're taught, including present-day scientific theories, and
thus *arbitrarily* rejecting new theories if they seem too far away from
present-day thinking.  This, taken to its logical conclusion, can lead to
oppression, suppression and censorship of those who put forth new ideas
(e.g., Galileo, who suffered under religious-scientific dogma of his day).

Of course, I demand to be shown substantiating evidence and arguments, and the
burden of proof is on the presenter;  but I will give a *non-hostile*, even a
friendly, forum to anyone who puts forth theories and conjectures that run
counter to present-day thinking, no matter how bizarre.  Only by fostering
such an open climate can we maximize the creativity of our scientists and
scholars, and to advance scientific understanding;  a hostile climate to new
ideas will only stifle many (and fortunately not all) from working on and
presenting such new conjectures, ideas and theories, and thus stifle scientific
understanding itself.

And why do I say this?  Well, it's pretty obvious from reading many postings
on Usenet that many (but not all) scientists and engineers are fairly
intolerant (read:  hostile) of ideas and theories that run counter to what they
were taught and now believe.  And they will go through incredible effort to
act on their hostility and attempt to suppress any scholarly discussion.  Of
course, I ask, why the hostility?  (Maybe a psychologist can answer this.)

I myself experienced hostility against me for posting the Bearden papers to
sci.physics and alt.sci.physics.new-theories (I admit the conjectures given in
them are different, to say the least, and I have not formed a final opinion on
these conjectures - in fact that is why I posted them so those in the physics
community could give valuable feedback).  A few physicists gave me some useful
feedback (thanks!) on Bearden's conjectures;  these people I highly applaud
for rising above their emotions and giving constructive criticism.  However,
I received about 20 extremely hostile replies basically telling me to "keep
that shit off this newsgroup";  I wouldn't be surprised if several did not
even read the abstracts to the papers before determining that they were "shit".

I'm sure that others could give many more and better examples of scientific
intolerance, both past and present.  I'd also like to get feedback as to how
institutionalized scientific intolerance is today.

(I now climb down from my soapbox fully relieved to get it off my chest.)


Anyway, that's my $0.03 worth (inflation, you know).


Jon Noring  "the open-minded skeptical scientist"


--
=============================================================================
| Jon Noring          | [e-mail] | "The dogs bark, but the  |
| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   |  caravan moves on."      |
| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : [phone]   | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: [phone]   |  the bushes, and watch." |
=============================================================================
"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner;  quoted in 1987.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!ames!sun-barr!male.EBay.Sun.COM!jethro.Corp.Sun.COM!newstop!sun!amdcad!netcomsv!mork!payner
From: [e-mail] (Rich Payne)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 23:36:38 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <![e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>>
>>And in his book "People of the Lie", Peck "proved" that some people
>>who appear to have mental illness are really possessed by devils.
>>(And this guy is a psychologist!!)
>
>You seem to have made the determination (a priori) that "devils or demons" do
>not exist, thus you use that to totally dismiss Mr. Peck's book and his
>credibility.  A true skeptic would not hold such an opinion (skepticism must

A skeptic is a doubter, someone who says things like "show me". A true
skeptic would believe nothing that has not been demonstrated, and then
doubt the demonstration.

What exactly do you mean when you use the word skeptic? It is not a
sword, of any description as far as I know, and it has no edge.

Please elucidate.

>be a two-edged sword to be true skepticism).  However, the burden of proof
>that such people are possessed by demons is on Peck.  Did he present a

The value of any such proof would not be all that great unless it had
already been demonstrated that demons exist. To my knowledge, the existance
of demons has been claimed for thousands of years, but proof has been
sadly lacking for those who do not believe in them already. Along similiar
lines I have heard much about magic, but I have not seen magic of the
same type demonstrated. The stage magicians put on a better show.

>compelling case and well document it?  If not, then the proper conclusion
>that one could say is "Mr. Peck, in my opinion, did not conclusively prove
>his thesis that some mentally ill people are possessed by demons."  However,
>if you cannot show fallacies in how he weaved together the evidence, then you
>are not in a position to *authoritatively* dismiss his work (you do have the

Who would you say is in an _authoritative_ position to talk about demons?
Will they provide proof? And by what agency would they be an authority?

>right, however, to hold and state any *non-authoritative* opinion that you
>like).  And, of course, anyone dismissing Mr. Peck's work and/or his
>credibility must also put forth a compelling argument to substantiate their
>dismissal, otherwise their opinion carries no weight whatsoever.
>
>I have never read any of Mr. Peck's books, nor have I even heard of him.  Thus

I have one book, but have yet to read it. Z transforms come first right now.A

>I am not in a position to establish an opinion on his results nor on the man
>himself.  If I do study his works, I may come to the opinion that the guy is
>out to lunch.  However, I cannot make such a determination at this time nor
>will I consider what others say about him using non-authoritative opinions,
>as Mr. Sheaffer stated in the above posting.
>
>Of course, this is Usenet, and here everything goes.  :^)
>
>Jon Noring
>
>--
>=============================================================================
>| Jon Noring          | [e-mail] | "The dogs bark, but the  |
>| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   |  caravan moves on."      |
>| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : [phone]   | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
>| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: [phone]   |  the bushes, and watch." |
>=============================================================================
>"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
>coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
>nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner;  quoted in 1987.

Rich

[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!convex!linac!att!att!cbnewsd!press2
From: [e-mail] (barry.o.olson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Shriek of the Looney --Part One--
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 02:55:53 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 17



I thought the Pleidians were duped by the purple shades of
grey whom introduced decaf into their coffee magazines(storage
areas) without their knowledge. The loss of buzz caused the
Pleid's to grow soft and lazy, wherein the PSoG were able to
chase them off the planet and inhabit it themselves.
Thus the Pleid's ran into planet earth, where they cultivated
their precious brew once again. Many eons later did they
realize what happened to them, and decided to develop humans
to guard their magazines against further sabatoge by the
now Gray shades of Purple who were once the Purple shades of
Grey before the poles flipped on the Plaeidian planet they took
over.
But I could be wrong.

barry--
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!mips!pacbell.com!att!cbnewse!cbnewsd!press2
From: [e-mail] (barry.o.olson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Summary: face of the Gill MAn
Keywords: mars pyramids, mars face, fnord
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 03:06:59 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <zzzk.697943798@jacobs> <[e-mail]>
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Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
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I saw this face when the pics first came out. I suddenly recalled
a striking resemblance to the Gill Man in the movies "Creature
from the Black Lagoon". No, could it be? I recorded the movie once
and stop framed it at the gill man's face, and sure enough. A side
by side look at virtual twins! Now, if only I can find this Gill
Man and question him about it, or better yet, if NASA could locate
him. I think he was last seen living in the Amazon river.

barry--
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From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 04:05:48 GMT
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In article <=fdhm8=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...

>>Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.
>
>Curiously, when many people _say_ UFO, they mean _alien spacecraft_.
>So what they are talking about is not an unknown deserving of study,
>but those darn aliens.

Ah, but who cares?  If you read my previous posts, you won't find _me_
attributing UFO's to "alien spacecraft".  I've been arguing about the
phenomenon.  Once again, someone else (you, this time) is forcing the
"alien" issue.

Why?

>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>>>about this phenomenon need apply.
>
>Need there be a single TRVTH? Or even just one phenomenon? I thought
>we were dealing with an unknown? Hopefully I have guessed correctly
>who originally said this.

Absolutely.  Show me where I have insisted that there is _one_ truth to
be found here.

>>My statement about "truth" stands.

>
>I tend to think that there is no truth, just different points of
>view.

No offense, but doesn't this statement strike you as rather "unscientific"?

>>
>>Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
>>laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
>>a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
>>black hole.
>
>This seems to be a straw-man argument. The truth or falsity of the
>above has no bearing upon the value of studying the "UFO phenomenon".
>Nevertheless, fission, while not predictable, is quite repeatable,
>and the rate can be measured. Now if only UFO observations were as
>repeatable, this thread would never have existed. And there is
>a pretty good theoretical basis behind black holes. What theory
>perdicts UFO`s?

What theory predicts that atom 1E37 will divide?  Look, the point I'm
trying to make is that we keep hearing that the UFO phenomenon is not
repeatable in a laboratory.  Of course it isn't.  But neither are other
things which we _accept_ in science as valid.  I have yet to see the
difference.

Most importantly, much of science does NOT begin in the laboratory in
a repeatable setting.  It begins with _something_ that raises questions.

If that "something" has raised a question, then the next step is to
decide whether we can _try_ to answer it.  That is where the current
state of the study of the UFO phenomenon rests.  It has never gone
beyond this.

For one to cry that there is no "repeatable" evidence of the phenomenon
is to deny the birth of other scientific advances.  Many of those did
not start in a laboratory.  They started with _observation_, something
that should be a holy word to science.

Fission, as a phenomenon, is deliberately repeatable.  I agree.

However, there was a time when it was _not_.  It was only a "theory".

How did we achieve repeatability?  By studying the processes that we
thought should lead to it.  Call it a bit of forensic science if you
will.  In any case, we _believed_ (for the most part) that we should
be able to actually split something we could not see and still haven't.

At the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I'll go one step further and
say that fission is NOT repeatable and NOT predictable for any particular
single atom.  There is a probability that atom #1E37 _may_ divide.

>>
>>In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.

>
>No argument, but where do we go from here? This alone is not
>sufficient.

You and I agree on this.  The answer seems obvious to me.  You don't
argue that the _phenomenon_ is real (as I stated above).  So, if this
"alone is not sufficient", we do what science dictates that we do.

We study it further.

>
>>Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
>>(whatever that may be) does not.
>
>A flying saucer might be studied. How does one study a phenomenon?

Ask a psychologist.

>
>>Now, let me rephrase the above....
>>
>>"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
>>atom #1E37 is going to split does not.
>>
>>Do you see my point?
>
>I see your point. But things with boring repeatability have never
>been that difficult to study.

I would venture to say that the reporting of UFO sightings occurs quite
often worldwide.  Can we demand that a UFO appear?  No.  Therefore, it is
not repeatable on demand.  So what?  That doesn't change the fact that
thousands of reports occur annually.

>>
>>Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
>>It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
>>in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.
>
>I think that the requirements to eat and pay the rent might
>just possibly make it into the objective category. Unless you
>make a living doing something else, and study the phenomenon on
>your own.

No.  That makes it especially subjective.

>>Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
>>the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
>>evidence of this?
>
>It is not possible to _prove_ that a thing does not exist.
>Rather, the problem here is defining just what the phenomenon
>is. Right now all we have is the 'phenomenon' label, and claims
>of alien spacecraft. Would you care to try to get funding
>based upon this?

I'm not asking for that.  I simply meant that if you _are_ implying that
those who _do_ seriously study the subject (few as they may be) are not
doing so in a scientific manner, then you evidently have evidence of some
sort to lead you to make such an assertion.

As for defining the phenomenon...well...I don't see that as a problem.

The phenomenon _is_.  If one weighs most if not all of the anecdotal and
physical trace evidence, it's clear that there is no single _cause_ of
the phenomenon.  In fact, the phenomenon may be divided into categories.

And yes, I _did_ say "physical trace evidence".

I'll be happy to explain if you wish, but let's assume that I'm right.

What's the difference between this "trace" evidence and say, trace evidence
that the element Lead was once unstable?  We can't repeat that can we?

>>
>>The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
>>it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
>>of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
>>find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
>>_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
>>SETI research.  That is absurd.
>
>While I think the chances of SETI working are so slim as to
>make it a wasted effort, how does one compare SETI to a conspiricy
>theory, and find an absurdity.

"Conspiracy"?  What are you talking about?  Did I miss something?

>Also you claim we have a UFO
>'phenomenon', not alien intelligence, how do you reconcile that
>with the clear implication that UFO are extraterrestial
>intelligences above?

No, no, NO!  I am not equating the two.  I'm pointing out that "science"
is perfectly happy to look for something it has 0 evidence for (unless you
consider the fact that _we_ exist the evidence).  Yet, when we have
thousands of people worldwide making extraordinary claims, many with
physical traces, instrumental observations, etc., we laugh it off as
nothing.

>>>Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
>
>Rich
>
>[e-mail]    Sig is at the cleaners.

Regards,
Jim Graham

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
|______________________________________________________________________|
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lynx!cyclops.eece.unm.edu!rsquires
From: [e-mail] (Roger Squires)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality and grossly misposted maunderings
Summary: post your shit where it belongs
Keywords: wasted bandwidth, time, energy
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 03:30:25 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Lines: 11
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20820 alt.paranormal:4421 alt.alien.visitors:4534 talk.origins:15079

I've noticed in the last few days an increasing number of postings to
talk.origins that are cross-posted to groups like
    sci.skeptic
    alt.paranormal
    alt.alien.visitors
If those who are posting this *ahem* "stuff" would take the time to direct
their replys to The One Appropriate Group I would appreciate it, and perhaps
other readers would as well.  Thank you in advance!

Roger Squires
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!olivea!apple!netcomsv!mork!noring
From: [e-mail] (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: .. .
Message-ID: <andh![e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 23:52:26 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 18

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kathi Iannamico) writes:
>... .. .. .  /.. . ... . ... .
>/..

O.K., I give up, what does this mean?

Jon Noring

--
=============================================================================
| Jon Noring          | [e-mail] | "The dogs bark, but the  |
| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   |  caravan moves on."      |
| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : [phone]   | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: [phone]   |  the bushes, and watch." |
=============================================================================
"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner;  quoted in 1987.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!rpi!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utzoo!henry
From: [e-mail] (Henry Spencer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 05:25:57 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]> <8ddhwp=[e-mail]>
Followup-To: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology
Lines: 11
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20824 sci.space:26826 alt.paranormal:4422 alt.alien.visitors:4536

In article <8ddhwp=[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>>You seem to have made the determination (a priori) that "devils or demons" do
>>not exist, thus you use that to totally dismiss Mr. Peck's book and his
>>credibility.
>
>I been a BAD widdle boy! :)

Please take this out of sci.space, children. :-)
--
SVR4:  proving that quantity is         | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
not a substitute for quality.           |  [e-mail]  utzoo!henry
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!ames!data.nas.nasa.gov!mustang.mst6.lanl.gov!nntp-server.caltech.edu!SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU!CARL
From: [e-mail] (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 05:46:34 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>,<[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Distribution: na
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Lines: 22
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Nntp-Posting-Host: sol1.gps.caltech.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM) writes:
>Someone correct me if I'm wrong, with references, but I believe that
>_congress_ gave NASA a _mandate_ to take pictures of Cydonia with the
>Mars Observer.
>
>It was not NASA's decision.

To the best of my knowledge (i.e., do NOT take this as authoritative), nothing
in the mission profile was changed because of that mandate.  The observer would
have been in an orbit that would allow such photographs anyway.  All the
mandate did was to ensure that pictures of Cydonia are specifically mentioned
in the mission goals.  Let's see, given Congress's tendency to verbosity and
NASA's love of paperwork, how many trees do we need for the extra paper that
that mandate will cause to be used?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXes and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  NASA? UFO? FRIDAY NIGHT?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:31:10 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 15

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer) writes:
>I say if anyone has those on the net, that they should digitize the photos
>and post them, so the government cannot quiet it.  It would be spread all
>over the world and expose the government for what it is.  In an election
>year too!

While I wouldn't mind seeing one frame posted, any more would be a waste of
space.  I wouldn't call videotape very reliable as a credible source
anymore.  It's getting too cheap and easy to do high-quality video work.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: lucid dreams, OOBEs, etc. [was: Dreamland]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:40:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 22
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20828 alt.paranormal:4424 alt.alien.visitors:4539

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (randall embry) writes:

[experiences deleted]

>In the book "The Road Less Travelled," the author (Peck?) cites a 1972
>university experiment that "proved" subjects could project images to
>nearby sleeping subjects.  Anyone heard about this?

First off, I changed the subject line because the word "Dreamland" has a
particular meaning in alt.alien.visitors.  I also deleted sci.space from
the newsgroups because I couldn't see any relevance.

It would be my guess that rather than projecting your dreams to other
people, you might have been having some sort of out-of-body experience.  It
would be interesting to try to prove that it was real rather than imagined
by contacting one of the people from your dreams in real life.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 18:54:57 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 12

Someone in NZ may want to look into getting these users, or their entire
node, terminated.  I sent a message to the postmaster at the node they
appear to be coming from, but it may do no good if it's not the node
they're really using, not to mention that since it appears to be on Fidonet
it might not have a postmaster address.  It would be best for someone
familiar with the connectivity down there to work on it.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!nntp-server.caltech.edu!SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU!CARL
From: [e-mail] (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 06:22:14 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>,<[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: HST Wide Field/Planetary Camera
Lines: 18
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4541 sci.space:26829 sci.skeptic:20829 alt.paranormal:4425
Nntp-Posting-Host: sol1.gps.caltech.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins) writes:
>I've always been impressed by ILM, but this tops it!  They have data from a
>probe that never existed! (there were only two Vikings). I've been thinking
>about doing something like this for Venus.  If anyone has any information
>about programming codes, let me know.

NASA's already done something like this for Venus.  Well, it wasn't
interactive, but they've got a nice video clip of parts of Venus from the point
of view of someone flying over the surface.  Sorry, I don't know how you would
et a copy of it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXes and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uxa.cso.uiuc.edu!jbh55289
From: [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 07:09:07 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>,<[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
    [stuff about video from 'Viking 3' delet
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Lines: 21
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4542 sci.space:26830 sci.skeptic:20831 alt.paranormal:4426

>NASA's already done something like this for Venus.  Well, it wasn't
>interactive, but they've got a nice video clip of parts of Venus from the point
>of view of someone flying over the surface.  Sorry, I don't know how you would
>et a copy of it.

As I understand it, the Venus video hasn't been added to NASA's collection of
'free' movies yet. (mail me if you're interested and I'll send you the adress.
They have serveral hundred films you can get for the cost of postage).  I
think you can buy it from JPL though.  I have seen the other 'Movies' (LA,
Earth, Mars and Miranda), but what I had in mind was slightly different from
what they did.  I am thinking about doing still pictures, mostly because it
saves space, I (I should say we) don't plan to stretch the elevations any,
and with the venus data in particular, I'd like to add natural 'shadowing'
over the radar bright/dark surface data.  (And yes, I realize that shadows on
Venus are a little bit of an oxymoron :)

            Of course, you didn't really want to know, did you?
                Josh Hopkins

>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL
Path: ns-mx!uunet!bonnie.concordia.ca!ccu.umanitoba.ca!roholdr
From: [e-mail] (R Ross Holder Jr)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 04:59:21 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Lines: 63

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bruce Henderson) writes:

>About the face.

>Let's all admit that the photographic evidence we have to go on for now is
>pretty worthless.  It's not real scientific research grade stuff.  And we can
>all scream and yell about what this fuzzy image enhanced thing looks like.

True, the pictures aren't nearly as good as standing on the surface of Mars
looking up toward the giant face, walking around it and seeing it in 3D.  But
from what I've seen, I think it's pretty safe to infer that it is something
artificially made - probably, isn't it?  If we instantly conclude that it is
[1monly[0m a geological formation, why would the American government spend
- waste the people's money studying a rock?  But if it's more than just
rock - if it's the remanant of a long-dead civilization, isn't it important
that we find out what it is?

>The truth of the matter is:
>Mars Obsever goes up this year and will be in Mars orbit next year.  At that
>point they can resolve that hunk of rock at with a resolution of 3 meters, many
>>times the magnification and detail of the original photo.  At that point this
>whole discussion will be silly.  If anyone left junk anywhere on Mars, we'll
>know by '94

It is important to note that much the same was said of the Hubble Space Tele-
scope prior to its launch.  Oh yes, they said, we'll be able to see planets
orbiting distant stars - maybe even find evidence of extraterrestrial life!
But the equipment failed - just like the probe that located the Mars Face.
And I wouldn't be too surprised if the marvellous Mars Observer inherits some
strange post-launch "malfunction" just like many of its more recent
predecessors.  Shouldn't we give the Mars Face a little more attention, if
for no other reason than to spur a government into actively seeking to
inform its public about the Face's true nature?

>Bruce

I think it imporant for us to verify for once and for all the existance or
non-existance of alien life, and this is the perfect opportunity.  Who knows
what may be contained in the pyramids 15km away from the Face?  Are the
pyramids naturally occurring geological formations that just happen to be
near the Face?  Are they somehow linked to the Face's history?  What can they
tell us about alien civilizations?  These and similar questions make it
important for everyone from those who want to expose a giant government
coverup to those who are curious to justify the expense and effort involved
in findining out.

It is for this reason I believe that a dedicated probe should be constructed
and sent to gather additional information about the Face - examine it from
every angle - determine its exact contours, learn if the pyramids are hollow,
learn if the pyramids are pyramids, etc.  And in the interests of time,
plans should be made to send anthropologists and archaeologists to the site
of the Face and pyramids with the first manned mission to Mars, to perform
more detailed examinations - examinations impossible or impractical for
probes.  Plans such as this should be made now even on what little information
we have, given the potential importance of such an expedition's findings.


 ---------------------------------------------------------------
|R. Ross Holder, Jr.             | Home Address:                |
|([e-mail])     | 410-424 River Avenue         |
|Department of Philosophy     | Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada   |
|The University of Manitoba     | R3L 0C6   PH#: [phone]|
 ---------------------------------------------------------------
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!n8emr!bluemoon!coert!doctor
From: [e-mail] (Daniel Klugh)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 19:05:20 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue>
Organization: COERT BBS [phone]
Lines: 24
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4544 sci.space:26833 sci.skeptic:20833 alt.paranormal:4427

[e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:

> Hi,
>
> I had posted  the PYRAMIDS.JPG picture in various news-groups.
> I'm just wondering what You think about the Pyramids on mars ??
> Did You already take a look at it and what do You think about it ?
> Only optical delusion or proof of soemthing unexplainable ?
> Let me know !

Maybe the Doctor Who story "Pyramids of Mars" wasn't a story at all.

>
> Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
> Decentral Energy Research
> email to: [e-mail]


                The Doctor

[e-mail]
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!news.bbn.com!bbn.com!ncramer
From: [e-mail] (Nichael Cramer)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: New Topic, or an Old One: Mass Drivers
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 12:49:26 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Nichael Cramer)
Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman Inc., Interzone Office
Lines: 29
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20836 alt.alien.visitors:4545
NNTP-Posting-Host: bbn.com

[e-mail] (Mark Gellis) writes:

>Does anyone have any information or sources on mass drivers...

Well, speaking only from personal experience, they're _much_ worse the
closer you get to Boston.  Once you get outside 495 it's not noticiably
different from any other rural-ish area.

>I am particularly interested in what might be called "anticipated
>performance data"--how massive are they, ...

I'm not sure this is any of your business.

> ... what kind of payloads will they move...

Dodge Darts seem to be popular.  Lots of Saabs.  Your odd LeBaron... that
sort of thing.

> ... what kind of acceleration will we see (100 gees, 2500 gees?), ....

Your sense of scale here is totally out of line.  "Gee" --even several
hundred "gees"-- may be appropriate to, say, an ohio driver, but for a mass
driver you need something more along the lines of "Oh holy shit".

>Thanks in advance.

Any time.  Please call again.

N
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!convex!csn!scicom!paranet!f816.n107.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: The Shriek of the Looney --Part One--
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 12:57:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 28

In a message to All <13 Feb 92 12:11> Iain Jameson wrote:

 IJ> `Looney' yea shall cry.
 IJ> `Bugger off' yea shall command.
 IJ> But the prophet shall ingore yea and continue to write, and write
 IJ> and write, into the wee small hours - of things unknown and, so far,
 IJ> unsaid. In a style that will cause much confusion to the educated.

 IJ> By his writings shall yea know the prophet. By the billions of bits
 IJ> of information shall he come amoung you, the blind, and show you
 IJ> the truth. And the truth shall be written by the prophet for all
 IJ> to see. For there is no getting away from the words of the prophet.
 IJ> Kill files will avail you not, for the prophet writes much, and
 IJ> is a master of disguise, and yea shall not know who to kill, much to
 IJ> your distress.

Ha-HAAAA-Ha-ha-ha-hahahahaha!

Cheers, Iain!

Best,
  Clark


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!math.fu-berlin.de!news.netmbx.de!zelator!leo
From: [e-mail] (Stefan Hartmann)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: Face on Mars FAQ posting
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 10:54:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Puplic-Access-Xenix-System
Lines: 38
Xref: ns-mx sci.space:26840 alt.alien.visitors:4547 sci.skeptic:20837 alt.paranormal:4429

Hmm,
I think You forgot to mention, that there are nearby the face (15 Km away) a few
"pyramids", which are more interesting, than the "face", because such
rectangular and symetrical shadows can only be produced by something artificial!
We should focus onto the "pyramids" in our discussion , because the face could
also be a "well" illuminated mountain !

By the way, I have uploaded the 3 mars-pictures in JPEG format to the new
UFO-FTP-site. Here comes the info:


Hi to all UFO-sighting-pictures interested people !

 now I have found a FTP site, where we could store digitized  and scanned
 UFO-sighting pictures !
 It is phoenix.oulu.fi (130.231.240.17) and the directory is
 /pub/ufo_and_space_jpgs
Try to look for new pictures and utlities how to view them regulary.
If you also have  one or a few pictures to submit, please drop them to
/pub/incoming.The friendly sysop Jari will move them then to ufo_and_space_jpgs.

In this moment, there are only the 3 marsface and mars-pyramid-pictures I
have scanned from a book. But I will soon upload a lot more stuff, so we could
have a good discussion based on sightings-photos and not only words and talk !
Try to follow also the discussion in alt.alien.visitors-newsgroup !

Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
Decentral Energy Research
email to: [e-mail]


--

*******************************************************************************
*  Stefan Hartmann       This is how to contact me:                           *
*  EMAIL: [e-mail]                                            *
*  Phone : ++ 49 30 344 23 66      FAX : ++ 49 30 344 92 79                   *
*******************************************************************************
Path: ns-mx!uunet!math.fu-berlin.de!news.netmbx.de!zelator!leo
From: [e-mail] (Stefan Hartmann)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic
Subject: UFO-pictures-FTP-site created !!!
Summary: ufo
Keywords: ufo
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 11:03:41 GMT
Organization: Puplic-Access-Xenix-System
Lines: 42
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4548 sci.space:26841 alt.paranormal:4430 sci.skeptic:20838

Hi to all UFO-interested researchers out there,

here comes an info about the new created UFO-pictures-FTP-site.

The Sysop Jari was very kind to allow us to store the pictures and discussion
files about UFOs over there in Finland.

Please keep download in a limited way, cause they only have a 64 Kbits/sec.
line to Helsinki. In this moment already the access is very often verry slow !

Is there another site, that would like to create a mirror of this archive in
the US and one in Germany. Please Sysops contact me by email to create such
mirrors. Now the info:


Hi to all UFO-sighting-pictures interested people !

 now I have found a FTP site, where we could store digitized  and scanned
 UFO-sighting pictures !
 It is phoenix.oulu.fi (130.231.240.17) and the directory is
 /pub/ufo_and_space_jpgs
Try to look for new pictures and utlities how to view them regulary.
If you also have  one or a few pictures to submit, please drop them to
/pub/incoming.The friendly sysop Jari will move them then to ufo_and_space_jpgs.

In this moment, there are only the 3 marsface and mars-pyramid-pictures I
have scanned from a book. But I will soon upload a lot more stuff, so we could
have a good discussion based on sightings-photos and not only words and talk !
Try to follow also the discussion in alt.alien.visitors-newsgroup !

Best regards, Stefan Hartmann,c/o Workshop for
Decentral Energy Research
email to: [e-mail]


--

*******************************************************************************
*  Stefan Hartmann       This is how to contact me:                           *
*  EMAIL: [e-mail]                                            *
*  Phone : ++ 49 30 344 23 66      FAX : ++ 49 30 344 92 79                   *
*******************************************************************************
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!shodha.enet.dec.com!timpson
From: [e-mail] (Steve Timpson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 13:30:23 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 11
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4549 alt.conspiracy:12368 talk.religion.newage:9397


In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes...
>
>  ** From Phoenix Liberator January 7, 1992 Volume XVII Number 12 **
>
>  Topic:REPTILIANS AND LITTLE GRAYS


        Another paradnoid scitzophrinic surfaces.   Go back to sleep.

        Steve Food_for_the_Grays
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From: [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,talk.origins
Subject: Re: Alibi Mentality and grossly misposted maunderings
Keywords: wasted bandwidth, time, energy
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 13:42:05 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Roger Squires) writes:
>I've noticed in the last few days an increasing number of postings to
>talk.origins that are cross-posted to groups like
>    sci.skeptic
>    alt.paranormal
>    alt.alien.visitors
>If those who are posting this *ahem* "stuff" would take the time to direct
>their replys to The One Appropriate Group I would appreciate it, and perhaps
>other readers would as well.  Thank you in advance!

I started the whole thing, and I started it with these lines:
ME>When you followup to this, please edit the newsgroups line if
ME>you want to relate only to some of the subjects!

I posted it to all those groups because I had examples for this
way of thinking coming from UFOlogy, creationism, and psi.
What is the One Appropriate Group? Probably sci.skeptic?

--
-Caddy--(thomas kettenring, 2 dan, kaiserslautern, germany)-----
Because the hypothesized anomalous effect is not easily accommo-
dated within the prevailing scientific world-view, it is parti-
cularly important to assess the trustworthiness of each reviewed
experiment.  -  Radin and Nelson
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!lll-winken!taco!rock!mcnc!duke!cs.duke.edu
From: [e-mail] (this space for rent)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: A possible source of UFOs
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 08:26:34 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Duke University Computer Science Dept.; Durham, N.C.
Lines: 79

(the last four or so paragraphs of this article deal with the title
matter, so skip there if you like)

Not feeling much like doing my coursework, I have been poking around
on USENET to see what is out here.  A quick scan over the alt.sex.*
groups provided limited amusement (not to mention some nappy gifs I
rather wish I hadn't seen) & alt.ketchup is good for a few yocks.  But
*this* group is... unique.  I don't believe I have ever seen anything
more whacko in my life!

As far as I can tell, there seem to be two general types of UFO
"theories":

1) The new-age "Ashtar" or whatever theories which remind me of the TV
show "Star Blazers" (i.e. the Yamato anime movies) for some reason.
In these, some UFOs are our happy friends who want to help us be all
that we can be and will save us from the mean ETs.  These theories are
somewhat dreamy and pleasant and provide an amusing escape from the
cold reality of life on Earth.

2) The conspiracy "They Live"/"V" type theories in which ETs are out
to capture us and cook us up for dinner.  These theories provoke fear
into the hearts of the gullible but don't seem to serve any real
purpose, other than, perhaps, big laughs for the originators.

Each group of theories seems to have its own supporters.  Of course,
the two general groupings are not mutually exclusive, i.e. the bad
aliens can sure be coming to get us while the good aliens are trying
to help us out.

Here are some things to think about:
First, in reference to Class 1 theories (nice aliens): if all of
this is true, why haven't the aliens helped us out more?  We could
have avoided numerous bloody wars this century alone... If the
answer is the Prime Directive ("noninterference"), then why do we
know about them at all?

Second, in refence to Class 2 theories (bad aliens): if aliens are
super powerful, etc., why would they bugger around infiltrating our
governments and forcing us to use flouridated toothpaste and all when
they could just come and kick our asses?  Furthermore, why the hell
would they give a crap about us in the first place?  If they want to
have our planet to live on why don't they just wipe us all out (no
AIDS theories, please! ;)?  Or better yet, terraform another planet to
have all to themselves?  And what else could they possibly want from
us?  If they are as technologically able as it would seem, they
certainly must not need slaves, right?

   *    *    *

This group is, in a certain way, amusing.  For the most part, however,
it disturbs me to see so many people living beyond the bounds of
reality.  If the UFO phenomenon is "real", it is not a product of
external influences on Earth, it is the product of rapid change.  Our
technology has outstripped the ability of our culture to cope with
change.  People are suddenly faced with the choice of either adapting
or losing their marbles.  The nonsense flying around here (esp. that
Phoenix thing... whew!) is ample evidence for the latter.

I am not suggesting technological regression as a solution, by the
way.  I just think we need to work on developing ways to adapt
culturally to the way we are changing our lives.  Then we won't have
all these people falling through the cracks and turning to UFOlogy for
comfort and/or stimulation.  It is easy for the skeptics and such to
just point a finger to the posters (Don Allen comes to mind) of
this... stuff...  and say "Loony!".  Unfortunately, these people are
just tails of a "normal" distribution which centers somewhere around
people who like "professional" wrestling & tractor pulls & who watch
_A Current Affair_.

Although I don't pray, I do earnestly hope we will be able to adapt
our culture to the reality of who we are and what we are doing (as a
people) so that this decline in to mindlessness and worse is reversed.

And no, I am no psychologist or sociologist or anthropologist.  But
everyone is allowed to have their pet theories, right?  And this would
seem to be a place to spout most *anything* forth... :)

--james
Path: ns-mx!uunet!tellab5!jcj
From: [e-mail] (jcj)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re^2: Livermore Tests 2KW Laser Beam
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 14:58:42 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Distribution: na
Organization: Trough and Brew
Lines: 10
Originator: jcj@sunGb
Nntp-Posting-Host: sungb


>Did we *really* have to bring this into the conspiracy theory arena?
>There's no reason to believe that it's for anything other than its intended
>scientific purpose.

No way!  The New Beam Riders of the Purple Stage will pinhole those little
grey noseless bastards and Orionid Hemorrhoids into cosmic dust!  Yahoo!
Drill 'em, Dusty!
--
            [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!nntp-server.caltech.edu!SOL1.GPS.CALTECH.EDU!CARL
From: [e-mail] (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: lucid dreams, OOBEs, etc. [was: Dreamland]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 16:30:25 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>,<[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Nntp-Posting-Host: sol1.gps.caltech.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (randall embry) writes:
>
>[experiences deleted]
>
>>In the book "The Road Less Travelled," the author (Peck?) cites a 1972
>>university experiment that "proved" subjects could project images to
>>nearby sleeping subjects.  Anyone heard about this?
>
>First off, I changed the subject line because the word "Dreamland" has a
>particular meaning in alt.alien.visitors.  I also deleted sci.space from
>the newsgroups because I couldn't see any relevance.
>
>It would be my guess that rather than projecting your dreams to other
>people, you might have been having some sort of out-of-body experience.  It
>would be interesting to try to prove that it was real rather than imagined
>by contacting one of the people from your dreams in real life.

Then there's always the possibility that the dreams were influenced by a common
outside stimulus, which would be practically impossible to control for.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXes and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!sei.cmu.edu!drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu!cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!crabapple.srv.cs.cmu.edu!netnews.srv.cs.cmu.edu!gerry
From: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 16:18:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Organization: Field Robotics Center, CMU
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In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of 19 Feb 92 18:04:40 GMT

Jon
If I were to say that people with acne were actuallt Martians in
disguise, would you say:
a) He's full of shit.
b) I can not form an opinion, but the burden of proof is on him.

Although what you said about skepticism being a two edged sword is
correct, there are certain ideas that can be quickly flushed without
resorting to experimentation, etc.

Like pyschotics being ingabited by demon.

Or people with acne being Martians.

--
Gerry Roston ([e-mail]) | IX - The enumeration in the Constitution,
Field Robotics Center,          | of certain rights, shall not be construed
Carnegie Mellon University      | to deny or disparage others retained by the
Pittsburgh, PA, 15213           | people.
[phone]                  |
                                |
The opinions expressed are mine |
and do not reflect the official |
position of CMU, FRC, RedZone,  |
or any other organization.      |
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.travel,misc.misc,news.misc,tor.general,ont.general,ut.general,alt.alien.visitors,tor.news,soc.college.gradinfo,ut.dcs.gradnews
Subject: Apartment for summer sublet
Keywords: toronto, apartment, sublet
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 16:13:30 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, University of Toronto
Lines: 16
Xref: ns-mx rec.travel:21212 misc.misc:7168 news.misc:4099 alt.alien.visitors:4555 soc.college.gradinfo:1467



********** APARTMENT FOR SUMMER SUBLET **********


Downtown Toronto,
From May 17th until Aug 15

Large 1 bedroom apartment (Christie and Bloor)
good location, across from park, walk to university
Fully furnished and equipped.

non smoker

call [phone] (leave message)
email: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!glasgow!bru-cc!cs89ssg
From: [e-mail] (Sunil Gupta)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.space,sci.skeptic,sci.physics
Subject: Re: Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Summary: hmmmmm
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 14:01:53 GMT
References: <behse.698489924@tubue>
Organization: Brunel University, Uxbridge, UK
Lines: 28
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4556 alt.paranormal:4435 sci.space:26852 sci.skeptic:20852 sci.physics:17782

In article <behse.698489924@tubue>, [e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:
> Hello,
>
> I just have posted the 2 missing pictures from the book:
> Leben auf dem Mars(live on  mars) by Joh. von Buttlar,
>

well this is the reply from nasa (telnet  128.158.13.250)

=======START=====MESSAGE FROM NASA======10-Feb-92==10:55:00
The "face" on Mars is an interesting geological feature that resembles a face
because of its structure and pattern of shadows.
=======END=======MESSAGE FROM NASA=========================


its odd though Ive seen another mars "face" picture" but that in comaprison was
smaller and much sharper. The image that was posted appears to be no only
processed but touched up by hand. (The original showed the surrounding
landscape aswell. ) NOnetheless the phenonema is peculiar and undoubtedly we
will hear more if and when a manned mission arrives on Mars


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
           Sunil Gupta ---- member of the studentsoft project

    [e-mail]          [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From: [e-mail] (Chip Salzenberg)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 16:04:06 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: TC Telemanagement, Clearwater, FL
Lines: 6
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4557 alt.conspiracy:12381 talk.religion.newage:9403

Don Allen believes in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

'Nuff said.
--
Chip Salzenberg at Teltronics/TCT  <[e-mail]>, <[e-mail]>
      "Informix 4GL is not a 4G, and it's barely an L."  -- John Tombs
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!stl!stc!patb
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 17:13:57 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Organization: STC Telecomms, New Southgate, London, N11 1HB
Lines: 11

Hi all,
    In Cambridgeshire, England, last year another "circle" of some
mathematical interest appeared. It was roughly heart-shaped with circles of
various sizes around it. In fact it was strikingly similar to a mandelbrot set,
a complicated mathematical figure which can only be represented by a fractal.

    And it was awfully pretty.

    I think they're going to be even better this year.

    Pat
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From: [e-mail] (Mcirvin)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas
Summary: On Things We've Seen Before
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 18:35:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Harvard University Science Center
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Nntp-Posting-Host: husc10.harvard.edu

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>
>And why do I say this?  Well, it's pretty obvious from reading many postings
>on Usenet that many (but not all) scientists and engineers are fairly
>intolerant (read:  hostile) of ideas and theories that run counter to what they
>were taught and now believe.  And they will go through incredible effort to
>act on their hostility and attempt to suppress any scholarly discussion.  Of
>course, I ask, why the hostility?  (Maybe a psychologist can answer this.)
>
Often it's because, even if they've seen no evidence pro or con, the
ideas put forth are remarkably similar to ideas they've seen put
forth and never supported many times in the past.  Ideally we would
have the time to judge every new proposition on its own merits, but
when you've seen the Ph--------ia Ex------nt thread, or some incredible
vacuum electrogravitic free energy machine, come up for the nth
time, it is hard to remain open-minded.

This, of course, does not excuse rudeness or total blindness to
extraordinary claims, and we have to watch ourselves.  I was led
for a while by the detection of certain buzzphrases to reject
Tom van Flandern's statements about relativistic celestial
mechanics as severely misguided until I read the actual text
carefully and discovered that all of his factual statements were
correct.  His claims are not even extraordinary, but since his
descriptions of gravitational forces include words like
"instantaneous" I immediately assumed that he was a standard-
issue paradoxer.  I was quite wrong.

Matt McIrvin
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From: [e-mail] (Frank T Lofaro)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 18:03:39 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
    <[e-mail]>
Organization: Freshman, MCS general, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
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In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

From alt.paranormal (USENET): 20-Feb-92 Re: Dreamland Gerry
[e-mail] (919)

>Jon
>If I were to say that people with acne were actuallt Martians in
>disguise, would you say:
>a) He's full of shit.
>b) I can not form an opinion, but the burden of proof is on him.

>Although what you said about skepticism being a two edged sword is
>correct, there are certain ideas that can be quickly flushed without
>resorting to experimentation, etc.

>Like pyschotics being ingabited by demon.

>Or people with acne being Martians.

    That is a somewhat hollow argument. You are comparing the statement
being tested to something that is obviously ridiculous and then using
that as the basis for attacking the original statement. While it would
be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
of them are. If someone gets possessed by a demon (which I *do* believe
happens, though not very often), they will appear to unenlightened
science to be mentally ill. Modern science does not comprehend, nor is
it intended to explain, phenomina that deal with non-physical entities,
such as demons. Scientists do not understand the soul, spirits, and
demons and how they affect what appears to them to be the "real" world.

    There is *much* more to the world, than just the physical plane.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Frank Lofaro
Carnegie Mellon University
[e-mail] (128.2.11.131)
[e-mail] (128.2.35.186)
Disclaimer: If it isn't related to UNIX, don't hold me responsible for
my statements.
--------------------------------------------------------------
HELLO, I'm a signature virus!  Join in the fun and copy me into yours!
--------------------------------------------------------------
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From: [e-mail] (Leonard Spani)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 18:36:23 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Sender: spani@G (Leonard Spani)
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Organization: MPR Teltech Ltd.
Lines: 31
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4561 sci.space:26856 sci.skeptic:20857 alt.paranormal:4438

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Daniel Klugh) writes:
|> [e-mail] (Juergen Behse) writes:
|>
|> > Hi,
|> >
|> > I had posted  the PYRAMIDS.JPG picture in various news-groups.
|> > I'm just wondering what You think about the Pyramids on mars ??
|> > Did You already take a look at it and what do You think about it ?
|> > Only optical delusion or proof of soemthing unexplainable ?
|> > Let me know !
|>
|> Maybe the Doctor Who story "Pyramids of Mars" wasn't a story at all.
[sigs deleted]


Take a close look at the face on Mars...

It is a cyberman!


;-)

Leonard



--
***********************************************************************
| Leonard E. Spani      |       //!?\\         | (disclaimer-p)       |
| [e-mail]  |       \\?!//         | t                    |
***********************************************************************
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From: [e-mail] (Steelo)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 16:43:23 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 3
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Scourge)

Not a planet...a star.  I come from Alpha Centauri.

---
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From: [e-mail] (Steelo)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 16:42:53 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 3
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Alan Hunter)

Socrates was a pilot.  He flew.

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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Feb 92 14:23:05 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Amoeba)


 Little boys called Timmy Wimmy do tho...

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From: [e-mail] (Scourge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 15:35:43 GMT
Organization: Aliens from another Dimension.>!! ph(09)864-184
Lines: 4
In-Reply-To: [e-mail] (Steelo)


 Hate to inform you of this, but ther is no life on Alpha Centuri(Which IS a planet... (Earth is a star as well... using light reflected from the sun... basic 4th form science stuff...))

---
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!spdcc!rdonahue
From: [e-mail] (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 22:36:40 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: insert anything here
Lines: 15

[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:

>>    Not that surveying the older stars are any picnic either...

>    I imagine that Lovelock would suggest looking for worlds whose
>atmosphere is in what should be chemical disequilibrium. Lots of O2,
>for example, suggests there must be something producing it continually.

    Huh? Um... *how*?

    We can't even detect them (extra-solar planets) as it is yet,
let alone differentiate between their atmospheric constituencies...

Bob
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From: [e-mail] (Robert R. Mitchell (SEAS admin))
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Crop Circles and Science News...
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 00:34:34 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Distribution: na
Organization: SEASnet, University of California, Los Angeles
Lines: 14


I just stopped by the library to have a look at the
Feb 1, 1992 issue of Science News.
Guess which issue is the only one missing!
It _must_ be a conspiracy! :-)

Anyway, is there an ftp site somewhere that has
some of these images?

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DISCLAIMER:
"Don't blame _me_, _I_ didn't do it!" --Krusty the Clown
"Ididn'tdoitnobodysawmeyoucan'tproveanything!" --Bartman
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 22:54:11 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins) writes:
> [e-mail] writes:
>
>>> If I'm paying the tax bill, what I favor is a robot IMAX camera where
>>> the wind sounds are recorded in 8 channel,  dolby,  THX, etc.  If we did
>>> that,  then millions could come close to "going" to Mars,  without anyone
>>> actually going.  We have the pictures from Apollo,  but they don't convey
>>> the awesome feeling of standing on the moon.  I want the experience.
>>Y O U    C A N -
>>All you have to do is watch the MARS NAVIGATOR database on the Macintosh PC -
>>a touch-screen based videodisk product which is based on the Viking 3 surface
>>pictures of the Mars landscape. I think it was Industrial Light and Magic who
>>added the 16-bit stereo sound and the 3-d enhancement of the fly-over footage.
>
> I've always been impressed by ILM, but this tops it!  They have data from a
> probe that never existed! (there were only two Vikings). I've been thinking
> about doing something like this for Venus.  If anyone has any information
> about programming codes, let me know.
>
>                 Josh Hopkins
Josh (and others), I (CCASM) did NOT write the item re IMAX camera above, Bill
Case @ infonode.ingr.com did.

I did reply to Bill with information supplied by Apple Computer Aust. I just
checked my notes. It was Cameron McDonald Stuart, the Apple Aust. National
Education Systems Engineer who said it was "Viking 3" - who am I to know?
Perhaps he meant Apollo. It matters not. The MARS NAVIGATOR software is the
point of the discussion. It will probably have the right info in its database.
For anyone interested, as Bill was, in "going to MARS" it comes as close as you
can get at the moment.

Big Al.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!ispd-newsserver!laidbak!tellab5!jcj
From: [e-mail] (jcj)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Where are th AZ/NM references?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 23:04:58 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Organization: Trough and Brew
Lines: 12
Originator: jcj@sunGb
Nntp-Posting-Host: sungb


Awhile ago, somebody made a series of claims re: Apache attack 'copters,
roadblocks, etc. involved in a "CEIII"-like series of events in Arizona or
New Mexico.  He said he'd post specific references to local newspaper
articles allegedly written about this.  Were they posted and I missed
them?  Thanks.
--
              [e-mail]
"...they walk amoung us ...our friends from the Pleiades and the Lyra group
.. They will help us... For they are old and wise, and we have yet to
discover a pastry that will not go soggy in the microwave."
                ~The Shriek of the Looney (Book III)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au!uqcspe!cs.uq.oz.au!rhys
From: [e-mail] (Rhys Weatherley)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 00:54:45 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Lines: 46

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (R Ross Holder Jr) writes:

>I think it imporant for us to verify for once and for all the existance or
>non-existance of alien life, and this is the perfect opportunity.

The face will not prove the existence or non-existence of alien life.  If it
is not a face, then we are no closer to knowing if there are aliens or not.
If it is indeed a face, then we have one of the following possibilites:

    1. It's a freak formation of nature.
    2. It was created by aliens many many moons ago.
    3. It was created by aliens very recently (e.g. when they discovered
       that we were starting to get onto the road to space, and wanted
       to let us know that they are there).

If 1, then we have neither proved nor disproved the existence of aliens.  If 2,
then it doesn't prove that aliens exist _now_.  Just that they may have
existed sometime in the past.  It also doesn't prove that aliens don't exist
now either.  3 is the best bet, but not many people seem to give that one
credence, and there are easier ways to let us know they are there.  There's
also a fourth possibility (less likely than 1, 2 or 3):

    4. It was created by us before conditions on Mars degraded and forced
       us to move to Earth many many moons ago (I don't really put much
       store in this one, but it's a remote possibility - VERY remote).

If it's this one, then we haven't proved that aliens existed.  Only that
we were a little smarter in our early years than we thought we were.  But
we haven't proved that aliens don't exist either.

The "face" and the "pyramids" bear closer examination.  But no closer
examination than any other rock or feature on Mars.

Cheers,

Rhys.

P.S. I believe there are some pretty strange things that have happened over
     the last 40 years, of which aliens is one possible explanation.  But
     I have a healthy skepticism and keep my mind open.

+=====================+==================================+
||  Rhys Weatherley   |  The University of Queensland,  ||
||  [e-mail]  |  Australia.  G'day!!            ||
||       "I'm a FAQ nut - what's your problem?"         ||
+=====================+==================================+
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From: [e-mail] (Larry N. Osborne)
Newsgroups: alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas
Summary: Expecting tolerance in sci.skeptic or scientific methodology
Keywords: Pointless cross-postings
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 01:05:46 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mcirvin) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>>
>>And why do I say this?  Well, it's pretty obvious from reading many postings
>>on Usenet that many (but not all) scientists and engineers are fairly
>>intolerant (read:  hostile) of ideas and theories that run counter to what they
>>were taught and now believe. ...
>>
>Often it's because, even if they've seen no evidence pro or con, the
>ideas put forth are remarkably similar to ideas they've seen put
>forth and never supported many times in the past.  Ideally we would
>have the time to judge every new proposition on its own merits, but
>when you've seen the Ph--------ia Ex------nt thread, or some incredible
>vacuum electrogravitic free energy machine, come up for the nth
>time, it is hard to remain open-minded.
>
>This, of course, does not excuse rudeness or total blindness to
>extraordinary claims, and we have to watch ourselves.

There are also those who _enjoy_ irritating people who don't have the
same frame of reference.  It seems to me that posting OOBEs to
sci.skeptic is asking for a bashing, similarly the skeptics who
monitor alt.alien.visitors in order to point and laugh are morally
repugnant.  At one time I had sci.skeptic in my kill file, but there
were so many cross-posts that I was missing much of interest to me.  A
case in point is the Ph. Ex. refered to above.  The physicists are
only going to get upset and drown the thread with flames (I mix a
mean metaphor).

The article to which I'm following up, for example, was posted to:
sci.skeptic, sci.physics, alt.sci.physics.new-theories,
alt.paranormal, alt.alien.visitors, and sci.energy.  You may as well
try giving a wine tasting for an AA group(1) ... its impolite and only
causes ill-feelings.  (Although alt.sci.physics.new-theories is
probably the exception, there seem to be a majority of rational and
polite scientists there.)

For those on either side of the arguments, who claim that they are
attempting to educate the other, I say it's obvious that that approach
doesn't work.  Just ignore them, or, if they ask a question, answer
them briefly and politely.  I realize it's a lost cause, but limiting
cross-postings to groups inhabited by the same species would make for
fewer flamefests.

-oz

(1) This analogy was chosen on purpose, since many of us _need_ the
support of the like-minded.
--
[e-mail] (preferred)      | Larry N Osborne
[e-mail]                           | SLIS, 2550 The Mall
fax [phone]                             | University of Hawaii at Manoa
or via W.A.S.T.E.                               | Honolulu, Hawaii  96822
Path: ns-mx!uunet!europa.asd.contel.com!darwin.sura.net!mlb.semi.harris.com!rtfm.mlb.fl.us!joshua
From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 01:47:25 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Lines: 15

someone who should know better(?) writes:

>It is important to note that much the same was said of the Hubble Space Tele-
>scope prior to its launch.  Oh yes, they said, we'll be able to see planets
>orbiting distant stars - maybe even find evidence of extraterrestrial life!
>But the equipment failed - just like the probe that located the Mars Face.

I wasn't aware that the vikings failed.

this same person went on to say 'and probably this one will fail too';
isn't that jumping the gun a bit? I mean, wait for it to fail mysteriously,
then start into the conspiracy theories.


josh
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!rpi!kasprj
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kasprzak)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 02:39:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The Big Wedge
Lines: 24
Nntp-Posting-Host: operators.its.rpi.edu

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve Timpson) writes:
>
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes...
>>
>>  ** From Phoenix Liberator January 7, 1992 Volume XVII Number 12 **
>>
>>  Topic:REPTILIANS AND LITTLE GRAYS
>
>
>        Another paradnoid scitzophrinic surfaces.   Go back to sleep.
>
>        Steve Food_for_the_Grays

 No way! I love this stuff. I'm not sure which group you read this on,
because of the wide crossposting, but here on alt.conspiracy, I live for
the UFO stuff. It's so much more entertaining than the stupid who-shot-
JFK babble or the infantile antisemitic prattlings of bARF and the b-cpu
gang.
------------------------------------------------------------------
     __  Live from Capitaland, heart of the Empire State...
 ___/  | Jim Kasprzak, computer operator @ RPI, Troy, NY, USA
/____ *| Disclaimer: RPI pays me to work, not to think.
     \_| "A spirit with a vision is a dream with a mission" -Rush
      ====  e-mail: [e-mail] or [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!jwt!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Stollman)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 06:14:50 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (Waffle login)
Organization: The Matrix
Lines: 40


     Hello from the world of the wierd and strange.  This is Gary
Stollman, back from the Twilight Zone once again to give you an
idea of what has been going on lately in MY world.

     It seems that I have been responsible for bringing Jesus back
to Earth, and have been through so much in the past month or two
it would take (practically) a lifetime to tell it all!

     What I can tell you is that my family and friends are still
being exchanged by demons or aliens or whatever.  My mom had a
stroke, and is here now in our apartment in LA, trying to
recuperate from the paralysis which has left her immobile.  The
two "nurses" treating her are demon clones who have taken the
place of the real people, and they keep switching my real mom back
and forth with the fake one, whom they serve.  My father is also
being switched with a fake clone constantly.  As have been my two
sisters and my other relatives and friends.  These things are
demonic in nature, and I have asked God for help, and he has
answered my pleas!

     In the past few weeks, I have been transported by God to the
parallel dimension, where these beings come from, and back again.
The end result of this is that I have been responsible for the
start of the Second Coming of Christ.  Jesus is here now, and he
is going to take care of things in a hurry!  I have had the power
of God at my fingertips, as apparently I was the "Number 9" spoken
about in the musicians records, like the Beatles.  I have been
able to move through dimensions like through air, and I have
helped God to stop these things from taking us over.  There is
little more to say now, except tell everyone you know to pray,
long and hard!  It will help.

     These things have taken over all the hospitals and so forth
in LA, and the phone systems around the country.  They have a base
somewhere where they are holding the REAL people they have cloned.
If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
stand up and be counted as human beings, not some kind of play-
things.  This is Gary Stollman, signing off from LA, California,
USA.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!linac!att!cbnewsh!cbnewse!cbnewsd!press2
From: [e-mail] (barry.o.olson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Summary: CNN and Clones
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 04:28:24 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 17

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>
>      These things have taken over all the hospitals and so forth
> in LA, and the phone systems around the country.  They have a base
> somewhere where they are holding the REAL people they have cloned.
> If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
> stand up and be counted as human beings, not some kind of play-
> things.  This is Gary Stollman, signing off from LA, California,
> USA.


Hi Gary,

I watch CNN alot...alot...alot..."`)twassle ummph, and I haven't
noticed anything unusual. What is it we should look for?

barry--
Path: ns-mx!uunet!haven.umd.edu!ncifcrf!fcs260c2!toms
From: [e-mail] (Tom Schneider)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.space,sci.skeptic,sci.physics
Subject: Re: Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Summary: silly silly silly
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 04:25:48 GMT
References: <behse.698489924@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: NCI Supercomputer Facility, Frederick, MD
Lines: 23
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Sunil Gupta) writes:
>NOnetheless the phenonema is peculiar and undoubtedly we
>will hear more if and when a manned mission arrives on Mars

No, the only peculiar thing is how you think it means something.  Our brains
are probably wired to respond to anything that looks like a face, whether it is
there in reality or not.  Look at some clouds or an ink blot!  Go read this:

@article{Kendrick1987,
author = "K. M. Kendrick
 and B. A. Baldwin",
title = "Cells in Temporal Cortex of Conscious Sheep
Can Respond Preferentially to the Sight of Faces",
journal = "Science",
volume = "236",
pages = "448-450",
year = "1987"}

  Tom Schneider
  National Cancer Institute
  Laboratory of Mathematical Biology
  Frederick, Maryland  21702-1201
  [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: New Topic, or an Old One: Mass Drivers
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 16:12:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 26

In a message to All <19 Feb 92 18:00> Mark Gellis wrote:

 MG> Does anyone have any information or sources on mass drivers/linear
 MG> accelerators?


You mean Rail Guns?  Or something else (like Bull Guns?)  Rail Guns are electrically powered, Bull Guns (named for Gerald Bull) are chemically powered.

 MG> I am particularly interested in what might be called "anticipated
 MG> performance data"--how massive are they, what kind of payloads will they
 MG> move, what kind of power requirements
 MG> are involved, what kind of acceleration
 MG> will we see (100 gees, 2500 gees?), and so on.

No idea about performance data, but 100 g would have to be the absolute minimum.  Very few payloads can withstand them.  Max payload for railguns is a few pounds (could be more, but that's what I heard several years ago).  Dr. Bull was experimenting with artillery payloads over over a ton, though.  His guns were principally *not* orbital guns, but extreme long-range artillery.

He designed two such guns for Iraq in the late '80s (to counter Israel's Gabriel ICBMs and H-bombs).  Only one was actually completed, but it was not ready when the war came.  The Mossad murdered Dr. Bull in Brussels three years ago.

Best,
  Clark


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: This Forum
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 15:59:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 12

In a message to All <19 Feb 92 12:05> Amoeba wrote:

 Am> microorganisms don`t have eyes.
 Am> Amoeba

Or brains.


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!glasgow!degnans
From: [e-mail] (Easter Beagle)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: jpeg viewer required
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 09:38:52 GMT
Organization: Glasgow University Computing Science Dept.
Lines: 12

So now we've got a ufo ftp site.

All the pictures are in jpeg format!

So how's 'bout a jpeg viewer from someone?


L&K,


Stephen
.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ira.uka.de!sun.rhrk.uni-kl.de!efes.physik.uni-kl.de!kring
From: [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 12:59:41 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
Lines: 55

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>[e-mail] (Nikos P. Pitsianis) writes:
[..]
>>|>II) For an equilateral triangle, the ratio ot the areas of the
>>|>    circumscribed and inscribed circles is 4:1.
[other similar things deleted]
>
>I think the open-minded (but not so open your brains ooze out your
>ears) skeptic (the type I like to be) would say: Yes, but is the claim
>that these theorems have never been stated before true or false?
>Statements such as: "This is too trivial to be important" or "someone
>*must* have come up with this somewhere" are rather useless, I think.
>If we take the poster at his word that he looked everywhere he could
>for them and he couldn't find them, I would say it is up to *us* to
>find them somewhere. If we can't we have to look at what the discoverer
>claims to be his source (the circles) and the explanation as to how
>they inspired him, and see if that explanation is reasonable.

This whole thing is very similar to the Dinosaur Sketch from
Monty Python's Flying Circus, where Miss Anne Elk, guest in a
TV talk show, is interviewed because she has a new theory about
the brontosaurus.  It takes a lot of asking from the host and
a lot of "Ahem. Ahem." until she proudly presents that her theory
is: "All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much MUCH thicker
in the middle, and then thin again at the far end."

You see my point?  This has probably never been stated before too,
and it's evident to every person who knows anything about
dinosaurs, like those "theorems" are immediately evident to every
person who understands geometry.

>The man, staring at shapes he *believed* to be made by intelligent
>beings,
You want to say there is any serious doubt of that?

>searched so hard for meaning that he found it in the form of
>five as yet undiscovered theorems. [..] No, after showing that
>the theorems are probably new, we would
>need evidence that the very layout of the crop circles was *designed*
>to lead to the discovery of these theorems and again determine if this
>seems reasonable.

As you can find Elk's Theory by looking at an image of a
brontosaurus, you can find geometric relations by looking at
an image of geometric figures.  But I don't assume that anyone
would draw a brontosaurus with the intention of making somebody
else find this "new theory".


--
-Caddy--(thomas kettenring, 2 dan, kaiserslautern, germany)-----
Because the hypothesized anomalous effect is not easily accommo-
dated within the prevailing scientific world-view, it is parti-
cularly important to assess the trustworthiness of each reviewed
experiment.  -  Radin and Nelson
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!spdcc!dirtydog.ima.isc.com!ispd-newsserver!dj
From: [e-mail] (Dave Jones 253-1987)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 14:05:53 GMT
References: <behse.698489924@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Eastman Kodak
Lines: 36

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tom Schneider) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Sunil Gupta) writes:
>>NOnetheless the phenonema is peculiar and undoubtedly we
>>will hear more if and when a manned mission arrives on Mars
>
>No, the only peculiar thing is how you think it means something.  Our brains
>are probably wired to respond to anything that looks like a face, whether it is
>there in reality or not.  Look at some clouds or an ink blot!  Go read this:
>
<reference and sig deleted>

Agreed.  Anyone who has further questions should inspect the shadow cast
by the putative face.  That's the shadow cast by a conical formation,
a.k.a. a mountain.  If ETs had carved a face to be seen from any
angle, not just from overhead, it would have been much flatter.

Same goes for the "pyramids": the shadows cast by near-perfect cones are
the same as those cast by pyramids.  For a light source at infinity,
with little or no atmosphere, the light coming in at a low angle as in the
pictures, the shaded side of the cone has sharp edges.  Show me a sharp
edge anywhere in the sunlit side and I might believe in pyramids.  Oh,
if you wonder where the cones came from, check out some terrestrial
volcanos.

Final note: the random cratering that covers the surface of Mars clearly
occurs on both face and pyramids.  Those formations are *old*, certainly
much older than the human race, maybe even older than life on this
planet.  ETs would have had to be extremely farsighted to get the
features of our faces right in advance!  (Spare me the "inevitable
evolution" argument.  There ain't no such animal.)


--
| Dave Jones ([e-mail]) --------------------------|
| Eastman Kodak Co.    Rochester, NY 14653-7300                      |
| C++ will do for C what Algol-68 did for Algol! -----------------|
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!apple!claris!szebra!spectrx!system
From: [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: .. .
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 08:20:27 GMT
References: <andh![e-mail]>
Organization: SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone] Silicon Valley, Ca
Lines: 14

[e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:

> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kathi
> >... .. .. .  /.. . ... . ... .
> >/..
>
> O.K., I give up, what does this mean?

probably morse code, though I can't read it

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aaron Anderer, System Operator                [e-mail]
SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone]              szebra!spectrx!system
NO MORE BUSH!          Write in Cuomo for '92!        NO MORE BUSH!
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!masscomp!peora!tarpit!tous!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy
Subject: 3CI-GWEN-ELF,Tesla and the Military part 1/2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 06:37:56 GMT
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Lines: 350
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4583 alt.conspiracy:12423


This is part of a recent Phoenix Journal that you ones might be
highly interested in. As usual, I make *no* claims on the material
and you are free to do with it as you like.
---------------------------------------------------------------------



   THE PHOENIX LIBERATOR

  JANUARY 14, 1992 VOLUME XVII NUMBER 13


  ** Introduction To Hatonn **

  I am Gyeorgos Ceres Hatonn,Commander in Chief, Earth Project Transition,
  Pleiades Sector Flight Command, Intergalactic Federation Fleet. You may
  call me Hatonn. I am come in service unto the ONE GOD of Lighted
  Creation, and as "Host" unto His people who will be brought into His
  places long prepared for you.  My own "Captain" is Sananda, the Christed
  Being you have called by many names--now one *with* Creator/Creation.
  [Sananda: simply meaning of/with God]. We are not "mystical" nor even
  "mysterious" aliens.  We are the "Hosts" sent in preparation for His
  return, bringers of Truth according to His promise and to reveal the lies
  foisted upon you to claim your souls for the physical evil Elite
  controllers.  We come in total love and without intent of force,coercion
  or judging.  "Judging" is a state of evaluation of self in the presence
  of Creator in which _actions_ in the physical experience are evaluated.

  The information within the documents revealing Truth, _The Phoenix
  Journals_ and _Liberator_, are the outlays of lies and hidden facts for
  which you can find confirmation.  If you don't know the problems and the
  source of the problems, you can have no solutions.

  I do not "channel" ; I transmit on a frequency attuned to my "receiver"
  who is simply a translator of the pulses into English. This is true of
  all receivers who receive from any of this Command come forth with God
  for this transition of species and planet.

  The receivers mostly have no reference for material given until after the
  giving and then, only for their own confirmation and yours.  My petition
  is that you pay no attention to this _resource_ if it is confusing and
  uncertain unto you--LET TRUTH STAND ALONE IN ITS PRESENTATION--THE REST
  WILL FOLLOW IN PROPER SEQUENCE.


  ** End of Introduction **

  Date:1/4/92 #2 HATONN

  Topic:TODAY'S WATCH

  What I am going to reprint herein is material which can get a lot of
  people very "dead". I don't even see a way to acknowledge source without
  undue focus.  For the present I will simply thank "knowing" ones.  There
  WILL come a day of acknowledgment and appreciation unto you daring
  ones--but alas, it is not this day.  I have written recently regarding
  beams, and beam bases--flying craft and "proclaimed aliens".  I have
  drawn pictures for you which are so outrageous that even in the local
  sector there is total disbelief.  Well, what I have given you is true,
  ultra-top secret, and very much REAL. We will first speak of the hidden
  hands on the switches and the military uses of the electromagnetic
  spectrum.  I will not complicate the lives of ones herein by giving
  minute detail but I will give you enough to support Truth and, hopefully,
  cause you to think and stop hiding in the sand-bucket.

  Topic:MILITARY STRATEGY

  The current military strategy of the United States does not rest on
  nuclear weapons or elite strike forces, but is instead based on a
  doctrine known as 3CI or C(3)I.  (This stands for command, control,
  communications, and intelligence.) Through 3CI, the relative strength of
  your forces against those of the Soviet Union is constantly assessed, and
  the intent of the Soviets to deploy and use their forces against you is
  determined.  3CI provides intelligence to accomplish this task, as well
  as the means to communicate with and control your forces and to command
  them to counter perceived and actual threats.  The overall intent of this
  military doctrine is to know, instantaneously and at all times, the exact
  status of your forces and those of a particular enemy.  Weapons systems
  are simply the instruments that are used to deter or respond to an
  attack.  The military group provides powerful incentives for releasing
  forbidden impulses, inducing the soldier to try out formerly inhibited
  acts which he originally regarded as morally repugnant.  Your total
  military system has become an analog of a living organism, constantly
  sensing its environment, integrating information, and reaching decisions,
  and then acting on those decisions by using the appropriate weapons
  systems.  The "central nervous system" of your nation's global military
  organism is based on information-carrying electrical impulses that are
  transmitted by electromagnetic fields.  Its sensory organs are microwave
  scanners, satellites, and sophisticated devices designed to listen to an
  enemy's radio transmissions.  Instead of nerves, it uses radio
  communications with frequencies ranging from ELF (extra low frequency) to
  superhigh microwaves.  The muscles of the military organism range from
  ground troops to nuclear missile systems.  There are a number of "brains"
  in the organism, located both in the continental United States and in
  various overseas locations.  The organism is capable of operating on its
  own, with only the theoretical restraint of approval from the White
  House. Every aspect of 3CI depends upon the unrestricted use of all
  frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum at unlimited power
  densities.  Now, please, realize that this is not new information and we
  have written extensively about this system.  What is important this day
  is that you must realize you have now joined forces with "that enemy" and
  you have no control of anything you have in space.  The enemy has
  absolute and total superior capability.  The last of the network was
  hooked up and tested sufficiently on New Year's Day.  Fortunately you are
  still present to ponder it for if the testing system had ignited the
  radioactive belt about your planet--you would really have a hot-foot by
  now.  You-the-people will be brought into control and submission in a
  number of very sophisticated ways--through these systems which will send
  out instructions and everything from music to biological diseases.

  Topic:A LITTLE PERTINENT HISTORY

  This military doctrine evolved following the end of World War II and was
  then shaped by two factors.  The first was the practical experience of
  using electromagnetic fields for communications and sensing (primarily
  radar) during the Korean War. Do you not find it interesting that Bush is
  in Korea this very day?  The second factor was the later availability of
  transistorized equipment and the development of exotic electronic sensing
  and communication systems, which occurred during the Vietnam conflict.
  Vietnam was the proving ground for the basic concepts of 3CI, and it has
  been characterized as the first all-electronic war--from manipulation of
  individual personnel to misadventures with herbicides and mass control.
  A number of advanced technologies were tested--for example, long-range
  reconnaissance patrols operating far behind Vietcong lines were equipped
  with solar-powered, high-frequency radios.  These devices enabled members
  of a patrol to communicate with one another via military satellites 200
  miles up in space and to be in instantaneous communication with the White
  House. Note that I did not say "President". The President at a given time
  is only a show-piece utilized by the Elite Planners and there are several
  replicas of the one you see moving about here and there.  Also, remember,
  that since that Vietnam War thousands of those Viet Cong have been
  shipped to Mexico, entered your U.S. nation, and stand ready, willing and
  able to blow every major dam and bridge in your nation--all the way to
  the Arctic.  They are special troops trained in demolition and will blow
  every strategic "crossing" facility of every major city, etc., on cue.  I
  have written extensively about this--in detail along with the Communist
  (Soviet) equipment and personnel already in Mexico and now crossing your
  borders--in full view now that you are such good "friends"--tanks and
  all.  You are going to have to get the JOURNALS if you have any desire to
  get informed at all.  You can "excuse" until doomsday but it won't change
  an iota of your circumstance.  You can throw stones at Hatonn and
  denounce and deny--but if you want the Truth and how it IS--get the
  material we have furnished you!  There will never again be opportunity
  for such investment in your survival and passage.  We cannot bring the
  price of the material down any further for there is a constant deficit in
  production of over $20,000 a month in trying to get you informed!  I can
  only ask that you honor and support America West and our writers for you
  hold the gift of life and survival as well as Truth of "passage" in your
  hands.  So be it.  This system, the doctrine of 3CI, has matured into a
  global scale based on maximum utilization of electromagnetic energy and
  pulse systems--mostly through the sophisticated testing on the military
  "soldiers" (troops) in that Vietnam War. Two things happened; in the
  physicals and injections, etc., the soldiers were implanted with
  "receiver chips" whereby the instructions could be sent directly and
  individually as well as in group reception.  As other substances were
  "tested" the manipulation could be studied by differing experiments and
  enhancement of any transmission by direct control.  The only restriction
  ever placed on this military doctrine since its inception was derived
  from the period of time immediately following World War II and during the
  beginning of the "Cold War". In the early 1950's, the Department of
  Defense recognized the need for some sort of "safe exposure standard" for
  microwaves.  This led directly to the establishment of the Tri-Services
  Program, based in the Rome Air Development center in Rome, New York,
  which was given the task of determining this standard.  However, even
  before the Tri-Services Program began, the military eagerly adopted the
  concept that only thermal effects were damaging to living organisms.
  Based solely in calculations, the magic figure of 10 milliwatts per
  square centimeter was adopted by the Air Force as the standard for safe
  exposure.  Subsequently, the thermal-effects concept has dominated policy
  decisions to the complete exclusion of nonthermal bioeffects.  While the
  10 mW/cm2 standard was limited to microwave frequencies, the thermal
  concept was extended to all other parts of the electromagnetic spectrum.
  Unless it heated tissue, electromagnetic radiation was thought to be
  harmless, so there were no limits placed on exposure to frequencies below
  microwave.

  Topic:THE CONSPIRACY

  The military organism was designed on the 10-mW standard and, once in
  place, it had to be defended against the possibility of nonthermal
  bioeffects.  The recognition and validation of these effects would mean
  the collapse of the total organism and the death of 3CI. By the early
  1970's it was fully apparent that scientists and engineers involved in
  the program were sucked into a massive conspiracy--especially in the
  early programs involving electrical control systems and the bioeffects of
  electromagnetic fields.  It was quickly seen that evidence for nonthermal
  effects was viewed as a total threat to national security.  Safety was
  not a consideration, because the military mind-set of the time held that
  despite the lack of actual hostilities, you were in a state of war with
  the Soviet Union--and dear ones, it has never before or since been
  otherwise.  It was known that your ability to prevail in that conflict
  required the virtually unlimited use of electromagnetic energy for all four
  facets of the 3CI doctrine. This view led to the policy of denying any
  nonthermal effects from any electromagnetic usage, whether military or
  civilian. To accomplish this policy objective, several specific actions were
  taken, as  follows: Control over the scientific establishment was maintained
  by allocating research funds in such a way as to ensure that only "approved"
  projects--that is, projects that would not challenge the thermal-effects
  standard--would be undertaken.  Further, the natural reactionary tendency
  of science was capitalized upon by enlisting the support of prominent
  members of the engineering and biological professions.  In some
  instances, scientists were told that nonthermal effects did occur, but
  that national security objectives required that they be exceptionally
  well established before they became public knowledge.  Many scientists'
  goals were subverted by unlimited grant funding from the military and by
  easy access to the scientific literature.  The formal scientific
  establishments of the United States were mobilized.  When serious
  challenges to the thermal-effects standard were raised publicly, eminent
  scientific boards, associations, or foundations were provided with
  lucrative "contracts" to evaluate the state of knowledge of bioeffects of
  electromagnetic fields.  These investigations resulted in the production
  of voluminous "reports". All of those reports shared certain
  characteristics.  Scientific data indicating nonthermal bioeffects were
  either ignored or subjected to extensive and destructive review.  Those
  examined were required to have much higher standards of possible validity
  than reports indicating no such bioeffects.  Scientists who reported the
  existence of nonther-mal bioeffects were ridiculed and were portrayed as
  being outside of the mainstream, nuts and nit-wit troublemakers.  Actual
  disinformation was utilized and still is, to create a false impression:
  for example, while a statement such as "There is no evidence for any
  effects of pulsed magnetic fields on humans" would have been literally
  true, it would have ignored the many reports of such effects on
  laboratory animals and the fact that no actual tests had been conducted
  on humans.  It was common practice to include an "executive summary" with
  the massive report.  These summaries never reflected the data that were
  actually hidden in the full report.  A group of "manufactured" experts
  was produced to serve as spokesmen and expert witnesses.  Does this all
  sound familiar?  How about a few "UFO experts" which are never backed-up
  and yet the public is always given the old "...there is no evidence to
  back up.......".  Further, the reporters will give you this line
  immediately after giving you a report on present "evidence". It will all
  be mechanically "read" to you with a "new type of grasshopper found in
  South Africa" having just as much emphasis and importance as given a 10.6
  earthquake in Indiana. These were people with few qualifications for
  research in this (or any) scientific field related or otherwise, who were
  provided with magnificently large research grants and placed on many
  committees, boards, and international governmental commissions dealing
  with the bioeffects of electromagnetic energy.  Superficially, they
  appeared to be prominent researchers, until one discovered that the
  actual number of scientific papers they had produced was minimal or nil.
  These "experts" were, and still are, used to testify in legal proceedings
  dealing with civilian installations such as power lines and
  microwave-relay systems.  Scientists who persisted in publicly raising
  the issue of harmful effects from any portion of the electromagnetic
  spectrum were discredited, disposed of and/or literally "taken-out" or
  "adjusted"--whichever better serves the ongoing purpose.  An "adjusted"
  person can still be functionally active according to the "new
  programming".

  Topic:WILL THE GOVERNMENT DENY ALL THIS MATERIAL I BRING?

  Of course--through the UFO disinformers, conspirators, etc.  But worse,
  they don't really mind the information now flowing to you-the-people for
  early on it is recognized that most of you readers will simply deny it
  and throw it out.  Then, as proof is brought forth it will be used to
  show you how "trapped they were" and "had to cover it for your own good"
  and "after all, those nasty little aliens made us do it!"  In other
  words, there is such a mess going on that they don't really know HOW TO
  BREAK THE NEWS TO YOU WITHOUT GIVING THEIR OWN "COVER" AWAY. THAT WILL
  NOT BE IN POINT A BIT LATER ON AFTER YOU HAVE NO GUNS!  In fact, chelas,
  much of the confirming information comes to us via undercover operatives
  of the government itself--hoping we use it to set up the uncovering
  scenario above.  It is simply one of the higher forms of deceit and
  insulting usage of your intelligence.  Despite the application of these
  measures, the question of harmful effects did not go away but instead
  increased in intensity.  The position of the government has thus been
  forced to change.  The government's initial complete denial of any
  nonthermal effects was followed by acceptance of some nonthermal effects,
  although these were characterized as being unimportant and transient.  At
  present, the official position is that while there are some nonthermal
  effects that may be harmful, further study is required before any sudden
  action is taken.  These studies are going on, but all are under the aegis
  of either the Defense Department or the industry involved.  And, of
  course, this only includes the range of electromagnetic spectrum in
  point--it does not include beam weaponry as such.  The policy objective
  as presented has been achieved, and the exposure of both civilians and
  military personnel to electromagnetic radiation continues.  You are not
  dying of cancers caused by sugar in your pop--you are a planet being
  radiated to death!  There has not been given you an exposure safe chart
  like your ideal weight charts.  That is because you are all in terminal
  contamination with no intent to change the thrust.  There is ample
  reason, chelas, to be pretty sure that it basically remains pretty fixed
  at the now discredited 10 mW/cm2 standard, or even higher in certain
  essential situations.  The reason given is the lead time needed for
  weapons-system development--in other words, the ends justify the means
  and disinformation.  After all, you are only servants and intended slaves
  for the Elite. Also, there are too many of you anyway and that alone is a
  major problem--you are nothing except laboratory test animals to this
  group of would-be rulers.  Operation at lower power levels would
  materi-ally degrade system performance, allegedly producing a situation
  hazardous to national security.  Deployment of powerful and exotic
  electromagnetic systems continues, with little, if any, consideration
  given to the potential impact of these systems on the health and safety
  of the public.

  Topic:THE GROUND-WAVE EMERGENCY NETWORK (GWEN)

  While there are many such weapons systems, the GWEN system is a
  particularly good example.  GWEN is a communications system which has now
  been connected and major construction completed (putting a lot more
  workers in the unemployment lines).  It operates in the very low
  frequency (VLF) range, with transmissions between 150 and 175 kHz.  This
  VLF range was selected because its signals travel by means of ground
  waves--electromagnetic fields that hug the ground--rather than by
  radiating into the atmosphere.  This is a dandy way to get across the
  Arctic regions and encircle the globe quite effectively and most
  easily--i.e., that touted "Woodpecker" system.  This also accounts for
  the "Wormwood" code--because it can burrow like an earthworm without
  interference by any substance--right through rock, water, etc.  It is a
  bit confused by large pools of oil and/or fat cells.  A chubby body is
  not always such a bad thing to have if you are in line of direction or a
  target for the individual take-out beams.  The only protection on Earth
  comes from the frequencies our Command can offer to physically disrupt
  the pulses.  I suggest you remember that when you denounce your higher
  brethren.  The signals drop off quite sharply with distance, and a single
  GWEN station transmits to a 360-degree circle radiating out from it to a
  distance of about 250 to 300 miles.  So now you have it--a need for
  repetitive relay stations--a full GRID, if you will.  This is now in
  total operation in conjunction with the Elite to every part of the
  globe.  In addition the Elite warriors have a total blanket of
  Cosmospheres and Platforms to insure control of that system.  These are
  NOT hostile "aliens" unless you call a "foreign person" an "alien". The
  GWEN system consists of stations, each with a tower 300-500 feet high and
  you won't think anything about them other than "television", "radio",
  phone relays, etc.  The stations are spaced from 200 to 250 miles apart,
  so that a signal can go from coast to coast by hopping from one station
  to another.  The back-up is a total system which also bounces off
  satellites so that, as of now, 1992, the entire civilian population of
  the United States (and world) are exposed to these GWEN transmissions.
  The rationale for the existence of this network is the government's
  projected concept that nuclear war is winnable if a fail-safe
  communications system is available for use during and following a nuclear
  attack.  It is more deceit to make you fork up the manpower and money for
  the system without having to resort to the "black budget black-hole".
  Such a system, they will tell you, would permit the U.S. to order its
  nuclear-missile submarine fleet to launch an attack against the aggressor
  nation.  The physical nature of nuclear war requires that this system
  operate by ground-wave transmission.  Big Brother is really taking care
  of you little citizens!

--------------------Continued in GWEN part 2 -------------------------------

Don

--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!news.iastate.edu!IASTATE.EDU!danwell
From: [e-mail] (Daniel A Ashlock)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Keywords: mars face
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 15:04:31 GMT
References: <behse.698489924@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Daniel A Ashlock)
Organization: Iowa State University
Lines: 23

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Tom Schneider)
writes:
                           [references deleted at end]
>Sunil Gupta writes:
>>Nonetheless the phenonema is peculiar and undoubtedly we
>>will hear more if and when a manned mission arrives on Mars
>
>
>    No, the only peculiar thing is how you think it means something.  Our
>brains are probably wired to respond to anything that looks like a face,
>whether it is there in reality or not.  Look at some clouds or an ink blot!

   I remember reading an article in Science 86, not long before it folded,
about the horrible time that industrial light and magic had simulating faces.
They were sure they had done as good a job on the faces as everything else
and yet the faces looked fake.  Their working hypothisis is that the human
brain is exceptionally good at recognizing faces.

>   Tom Schneider
>   National Cancer Institute
>   Laboratory of Mathematical Biology
>   Frederick, Maryland  21702-1201
>   [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!tellab5!jcj
From: [e-mail] (jcj)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 14:53:53 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:

>> If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
>
>I watch CNN alot...alot...alot..."`)twassle ummph, and I haven't
>noticed anything unusual. What is it we should look for?

They screwed up the Lynn Russell clone's hair color.  And I mean
BIGTIME.
--
              [e-mail]
"...they walk amoung us ...our friends from the Pleiades and the Lyra group
.. They will help us... For they are old and wise, and we have yet to
discover a pastry that will not go soggy in the microwave."
                ~The Shriek of the Looney (Book III)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!masscomp!peora!tarpit!tous!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy
Subject: 3CI-GWEN-ELF,Tesla and the Military part 2/2
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Date: 21 Feb 92 06:41:18 GMT
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
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  -------------------------GWEN part 2-----------------------------------


  Topic:ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSE (EMP)

  One aspect of nuclear war that is not well publicized is the EMP
  phenomenon. This becomes VERY IMPORTANT because you WILL experience it.
  An electromagnetic pulse is a very short, intense burst of
  electromagnetic energy that is produced by the explosion of a nuclear
  weapon in space. If an EMP were produced by a nuclear explosion 100 miles
  above Kansas City, for instance, its energy would be so intense that it
  would shut off ALL electric-power systems, destroy all computers and
  magnetic disks or tape records, destroy the guidance systems of missiles
  and the computer and communication systems of military and commercial
  aircraft, and shut down all radio communications--ACROSS THE ENTIRE
  UNITED STATES! The military organism would be decapitated. In the military
  scenario, the United States would then be faced with capitulation or
  nuclear destruction. Theoretically, ground-wave communications would still
  be possible. However, the theory is tenuous.  The GWEN hardware is
  transistor based; even if placed in "hardened" bunkers, it would be
  vulnerable to an EMP. In addition, the EMP would produce major ground
  currents in the path of the GWEN signals that could decrease their
  transmission capabilities. Finally, the locations of all GWEN stations are
  known to the enemy and thus are vulnerable to attack.  Not such a good
  show, is it? Nonetheless, the military mind (whew--mutually exclusive
  terms) has conceived of using the GWEN network to maintain communications
  following such a decapitating EMP attack.  This is not the place for a
  full argument concerning the values and options of nuclear war, but in my
  opinion the reason for the existence of this system is specious in itself
  as for between-the-lines assumptions.  Dear ones, nuclear war is not
  "winnable". All may not perish--but the war is NOT WINNABLE. FOR THIS
  VERY REASON, YOU HAVE BEEN LEFT DEFENSELESS WITHOUT SHELTERS WHILE
  BILLIONS AND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS HAVE BEEN POURED INTO UNDERGROUND
  FACILITIES FOR SECURITY OF THE ELITE PUPPET-MASTERS. You WILL wake up or
  you WILL perish. The potential harm to the civilian population from the
  operation of GWEN has not been addressed. GWEN is a superb system, in
  combination with cyclotron resonance, for producing behavioral
  alterations in the civilian population. The average strength of the steady
  geomagnetic field varies from place to place across the various
  geological areas such as the United States. Therefore, if one wished to
  resonate a specific ion in living things in a specific locality, one
  would require a specific frequency for that location. The spacing of GWEN
  transmitters 200 miles apart across the United States would allow such
  specific frequencies to be "tailored" to the geomagnetic-field strength
  in each GWEN area. This piece of information is well-known to the
  "Planners" of the network and, of course, is in full capability of
  operation NOW. What of these various in-point frequencies?  Why doesn't
  someone in your wondrous UFO community demand a bit of sharing with one
  frequency "expert" who is only annoyed with plagiarism (which objection
  will be more understandable now), etc. Why don't you check out the
  "frequency tables" of your beloved brother, Cathie. Does he know all
  this? Oh, Chelas, spare me! You have accomplished the sophistication of the
  newest in "killing fields". Dharma, allow us a break so that this can be
  edited while we work on the next writing. We need this to the public
  without delay.We are making progress and ones who will hear and see
  deserve the best that we can offer. Salu.

  Date:1/4/92 #3 HATONN/TESLA

  As we write on these subjects, especially regarding pulsing wireless
  forms of energy--ever comes the inquiry: "Why can't we seem to wireless
  transmit energy, etc., like Nikola Tesla projected?" You can--you are just
  not allowed to do so. Energy and transmission of electricity is the energy
  bondage method of a planet. Do you actually think the Elite money-mongers
  would allow such a thing as free energy and/or allow healing methods
  utilizing free energy and magnetic frequency? Grow up, chelas, the world
  is big and mean and most nasty indeed. A bit later after this writing I
  will see if there is time and energy left to simply ask Nikola to expound
  on the subject of wireless transmission and his own experience. I believe
  you who doubt our presence and resources might be interested if not
  totally captivated by the access to these higher beings awaiting their
  ability to work with you when the time becomes feasible.  Let us continue
  now, however, with the subject at hand and speak of the new killing
  fields:

  Topic:ELECTROMAGNETIC WEAPONS

  While the military was vigorously denying the very existence of
  bioeffects from electromagnetic-field exposure, such bioeffects were
  actually being explored as potential weapons--weapons with the enormous
  advantage of being totally silent and imperceptible. If you are a bit
  terrified at this point I suggest you are normal and quite rightful in
  your responses. This is a most deadly game and you are the sitting targets
  this very day as you are being worn away and debilitated, totally
  controlled and manipulated almost beyond the point of recovery. The EMP
  concept has been extended through the development of devices that
  generate EMP pulses without the need for nuclear explosions. Such devices
  can be deployed for use against enemy command and control centers or
  against aircraft in order to produce failure of electronic equipment.
  This can also be directed against any civilian location and or group. A
  derivative of this program is HPM (high-power pulsed microwave), a system
  producing intense, extremely short pulses of microwave.Several types,
  ranging in frequency from 1200 MHz to 35 GHz with powers up to 1000
  megawatts, are tested and ready for use. These are also ready for use as
  weapons against humans and, against these weapons, no gun can even be
  relatively compared. There is a report which can (or maybe can't be)
  acquired which deals with the testing program of the Microwave Research
  Department at the Walter Reed Army Institute of Research. It states,
  "Microwave energy in the range of 1 to 5 GHz, a militarily important
  range, penetrates all organ systems of the body and thus puts all organ
  systems at risk." Effects on the central nervous system are considered
  very important. The testing program, begun in 1986, is divided into four
  parts: 1) prompt debilitation effects; 2) prompt stimulation through
  auditory effects; 3) work interference/stoppage effects; and 4) effects
  on stimulus-controlled behavior. The report goes on to state, "Microwave
  pulses appear to couple to the central nervous system and produce
  stimulation similar to electrical stimulation unrelated to heat." It
  appears that HPM is capable of altering behavior in the same fashion as
  Delgado's electrical stimulation (which we will not go into herein). The
  production of cognitive and behavioral alterations by HPM is a
  sledgehammer effect in comparison to the subtle alterations produced by
  ELF fields. According to a 1982 Air Force review of biotechnology, ELF has
  a number of potential military uses, including "dealing with terrorist
  groups, crowd control, controlling breaches in security at military
  installations, and antipersonnel techniques in tactical warfare." The same
  report states, "Electromagnetic systems would be used to produce mild to
  severe physiological disruption or perceptual distortion or
  disorientation. They are silent, and countermeasures to them may be
  difficult to develop." Just know, readers, that a whole group and class of
  weapons, based on electromagnetic fields, has been pretty well perfected
  and added to the muscles of the military organism.  The 3CI doctrine is
  still growing and expanding. The military can and is able to completely
  control the minds of the civilian population. I make no attempt here to
  review in any detail the relationship between military considerations and
  the hazards of man-made electromagnetic fields. This complex and dangerous
  situation lies outside the scope of this small writing and few would have
  any understanding regarding the details, except for an indication of how
  the political policies derived from it have effectively removed the
  public recognition of the hazards. The military establishment and
  government fully realize that the survival of the military organism is
  well worth the sacrifice of the lives, health and life function of large
  segments of the American population--the goal of conquest has been
  accomplished. You-the-people have only ONE countering measure and THAT
  LIES WITH GOD AND WE THE HOSTS. WHICH WILL IT BE, AMERICA? Dharma,
  appended are some maps of the area in the "Tehachapi's" of the Northrop
  installation (See inserts later.) wherein the massive underground
  terminal from Edwards is located. You will note that there are numerous
  silos for egress and ingress of air-ships with markings of some of the
  saucer exit/entrance portals with all sorts of landing pods. I suggest you
  take this very seriously for the structures at Edwards are even more
  sophisticated, while covered by the rocket launch test area. By the way,
  these installations are directly tied underground to the JPL labs in
  Pasadena, California with facilities for immediate evacuation when the
  earthquake comes or the nuclear war. Only a few are, however, on the list
  for evacuation. It is totally amazing that so many of you have worked for
  years on portions of this killer machine and never realized you were
  involved. Yes, it would boggle the mind. The tunnel itself is made totally
  flexible at the fault zone with inconceivable strengthening to prevent
  rupture. In that particular evacuation tunnel connected to a massive
  underground installation which has radiating "arms" right to the ocean
  and underground sub bases, craft can travel at several times the speed of
  sound. Remarkable? No, someone just worked diligently toward their goal
  while you slept and forgot yours. Overlook the poor quality of the
  pictures (maps) as you are most certainly NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE THEM. I
  will not show you pictures of Edwards or other installations for it is
  far too risky at this time.  Northrup is out in the fringes of desert and
  isolation and almost "unknown"--I will not endanger any by showing more
  recognized facilities. There are many of these so-isolated facilities of
  unknown locations scattered about your landscape--this is only one and is
  not even particularly large, relatively. It serves a unique purpose or I
  would not speak of it. I just don't want any readers being shocked when
  the government and military start producing "little gray aliens", etc.
  Your very lives and freedom depend on your KNOWING THE TRUTH. I can only
  remind my own crew that these nerds have to get through ME to get to
  you--so be it, try it and make my day! Perhaps it is time for me to brush
  up on my target practice. Hit my people and it is classified by all
  Universal law as "aggression", and I have right of defense and
  protection. It could get pretty hot for my beam system is pretty good
  while leaving no evidence to tell the tale--just pure and simple
  evaporation! I do not mean "rendering invisible" I mean "rendering
  evaporated"! I am here to inform my people and instruct them so we can
  bring them home--we have no intention of interference on your place and
  we will tolerate no interference in our mission. Mankind as a whole has
  pretty much decided to go with the evil influences and it is each one's
  right to do that, but the planet will be cleansed by her own doing and
  our people will not be left to the terrific holocaust. We will summon ours
  from the corners of your planet. If the world decides as a whole to change
  its path--wondrous goodness shall take place. If not, we will gather our
  own and leave you to your resources. I will step aside and welcome our old
  friend and comrade, Nikola. Many hours have been spent with this scribe
  and this rather eccentric brother and I am honored to sit quietly while
  there is a bit of sharing of memories--not often given since presentation
  in March of 1904. He is given to honoring the request to share and I bow
  to this brilliant personage. I salute you and you will make your own
  connection for I no longer leave my circuit--thank you. I shall, however,
  bid you good-day.

  Topic:TESLA REMEMBERS

  It is lonely I am for a good snow-covered day for communion as we have
  had in the past with sharing and visitation. It is indeed sad that ones
  deny the contact and choose their own mystical journeys instead of
  honoring their contract for service--choosing to "run away" before the
  cake is finished to the serving. Impatience and greed are the curse of
  man. It is impossible to resist your courteous request extended on an
  occasion of such moment in the life of your JOURNAL. Your request has
  vivified the memory of our beginning friendship, of the first imperfect
  attempts and underserved successes, of kindnesses and misunderstandings.
  Always it brings painfully to mind the greatness of early expectations,
  the quick flight of time, and alas! the smallness of realizations. The
  following was given to the world but so few paid heed and then, as is the
  case in the human experiment--the mystery found its way into the hands of
  evil doers. Let me look back toward the close of your year 1898 in which a
  systematic research, carried on for a number of years with the object of
  perfecting a method of transmission of electrical energy through the
  natural medium, led me to recognize three important necessities: first,
  to develop a transmitter of great power; second, to perfect means for
  individualizing and isolating the energy transmitted; and, third, to
  ascertain the laws of propagation of currents through the earth and the
  atmosphere. Various reasons, not the least of which was the help proffered
  by my friend Leonard E. Curtis and the Colorado Springs Electric Company,
  determined me to select for my experimental investigations the large
  plateau, two thousand meters above sea-level, in the vicinity of that
  delightful resort, which I reached late in May, 1899. I take note that
  the general area is still a bustling center of activity, mostly
  underground now, for completion of that which I was not destined to
  finish in my sojourn--now turned to the most heinous of uses in
  destruction and control of the masses of civilians into imprisonment of a
  world. I had not been there but a few days when I congratulated myself on
  the happy choice and I began the task, for which I had long trained
  myself, with a grateful sense and full of inspired hope. The perfect
  purity of the air, the unequaled beauty of the sky, the imposing sight of
  a high mountain range, the quiet and restfulness of the place--all around
  contributed to make the conditions for scientific observation ideal. To
  this was added the exhilarating influence of a glorious climate and a
  singular sharpening of the senses. In those regions the organs undergo
  perceptible physical changes. The eyes assume an extraordinary limpidity,
  improving vision; the ears dry out and become more susceptible to
  sound. Objects can be clearly distinguished there at distances such that I
  prefer to have them told by someone else, and I have heard--this I can
  venture to vouch for--the claps of thunder seven and eight hundred
  kilometers away. I might have done better still had it not been tedious to
  wait for the sounds to arrive, in definite intervals, as heralded
  precisely by an electrical indicating apparatus--nearly an hour before. In
  the middle of June, while preparations for other work were going on, I
  arranged one of my receiving transformers with the view of determining,
  in a novel manner, experimentally, the electric potential of the globe
  and studying its periodic and casual fluctuations. This formed part of a
  plan carefully mapped out in advance. A highly sensitive, self-restorative
  device, controlling a recording instrument, was included in the secondary
  circuit, while the primary was connected to the ground and an elevated
  terminal of adjustable capacity. The variations of potential gave rise to
  electric surgings in the primary; these generated secondary currents,
  which in turn affected the sensitive device and recorder in proportion to
  their intensity. The earth was found to be, literally, alive with
  electrical vibrations, and soon I was deeply absorbed in this interesting
  investigation. No better opportunities for such observations as I intended
  to make could be found anywhere. Colorado is a country famous for the
  natural displays of electric force. In that dry and rarefied atmosphere
  the sun's rays beat the objects with fierce intensity. I raised steam, to
  a dangerous pressure, in barrels filled with concentrated salt solution,
  and the tin-foil coatings of some of my elevated terminals shriveled up
  in the fiery blaze. An experimental high-tension transformer, carelessly
  exposed to the rays of the setting sun, had most of its insulating
  compound melted out and was rendered useless. Aided by the dryness and
  rarefaction of the air, the water evaporates as in a boiler, and static
  electricity is developed in abundance. Lightning discharges are,
  accordingly, very frequent and sometimes of inconceivable violence. On one
  occasion approximately twelve thousand discharges occurred in two hours,
  and all in a radius of certainly less than fifty kilometers from the
  laboratory. Many of them resembled gigantic trees of fire with the trunks
  up or down. I never saw fire balls, but as a compensation for my
  disappointment I succeeded later in determining the mode of their
  formation and producing them artificially. Never be dismayed or
  disappointed at that which is given and which at the moment seems without
  merit--for it can only open the way into deeper and more profound
  information as you allow your mind to consider the circumstance.In the
  latter part of the same month I noticed several times that my instruments
  were affected stronger by discharges taking place at great distances than
  by those near by. This puzzled me very much. What was the cause? A number of
  observations proved that it could not be due to the differences in the
  intensity of the individual discharges, and I readily ascertained that
  the phenomenon was not the result of a varying relation between the
  periods of my receiving circuits and those of the terrestrial
  disturbances. One night, as I was walking home with an assistant,
  meditating over these experiences, I was suddenly staggered by a
  thought. Years ago, when I wrote a chapter of my lecture before the
  Franklin Institute and the National Electric Light Association, it had
  presented itself to me, but I had dismissed it as absurd and impossible.
  I banished it again. Nevertheless, my instinct was aroused and somehow I
  felt that I was nearing a great revelation. It was on the third day of
  July--the date I shall never forget--when I obtained the first decisive
  experimental evidence of a truth of overwhelming importance for the
  advancement of humanity. A dense mass of strongly charged clouds gathered
  in the west and towards the evening a violent storm broke loose which,
  after spending much of its fury in the mountains, was driven away with
  great velocity over the plains. Heavy and long persisting arcs formed
  almost in regular time intervals. My observations were now greatly
  facilitated and rendered more accurate by the experiences already
  gained. I was able to handle my instruments quickly and I was prepared.
  You see, it is always good to be prepared and therefore be able to move
  on without interrupting distractions. If you are, for instance, trying to
  survive you certainly have no time for invention other than to the
  problem immediately at hand. I suggest you pay close attention to your
  friend, Gyeorgos, come forth to give you a hand in your tedious journey.
  We are not yet of that higher level of total understanding and cannot
  serve in the same guidance capacity. I, myself, am most limited to my
  realm of expertise and as of yet have no need of more general "life"
  knowledge in the "knowingness". I am most happy to be of assistance to
  you but I feel no obligation nor pressure to serve in that capacity
  longer. I found my journey on your place to be most disagreeable for the
  most part--an evil civilization filled with vile vipers. At any rate, back
  to my story--the recording apparatus being properly adjusted, its
  indications became fainter and fainter with the increasing distance of
  the storm, until they ceased altogether. I was watching in eager
  expectation. Surely enough, in a little while the indications again began,
  grew stronger and stronger and, after passing through a maximum,
  gradually decreased and ceased once more. Many times, in regularly
  recurring intervals, the same actions were repeated until the storm
  which, as evident from simple computations, was moving with nearly
  constant speed, had retreated to a distance of about three hundred
  kilometers. Nor did these strange actions stop then, but continued to
  manifest themselves with undiminished force. Subsequently, similar
  observations were also made by my assistant, Mr. Fritz Lowenstein, and
  shortly afterward several admirable opportunities presented themselves
  which brought out, still more forcibly, and unmistakably, the true nature
  of the wonderful phenomenon. No doubt whatever remained: I was observing
  stationary waves. As the source of disturbances moved away the receiving
  circuit came successively upon their nodes and loops. Impossible as it
  seemed, your planet, despite its vast extent, behaved like a conductor of
  limited dimensions. The tremendous significance of this fact in the
  transmission of energy by my system had already become quite clear to
  me. Not only was it practicable to send telegraphic messages to any
  distance without wires, as I recognized long before, but also to impress
  upon the entire globe the faint modulations of the human voice, far more
  still, to transmit power, in unlimited amounts, to any terrestrial
  distance and almost without any loss whatsoever. With these stupendous
  possibilities in sight, with the experimental evidence before me that
  their realization was henceforth merely a question of expert knowledge,
  patience and skill, I attacked vigorously the development of my
  magnifying transmitter, now, however, not so much with the original
  intention of producing one of great power, as with the object of learning
  how to construct the best one. This is, essentially, a circuit of very
  high self-induction and small resistance which, in its arrangement, mode
  of excitation and action, may be said to be the diametrical opposite of a
  transmitting circuit typical of telegraphy by Hertzian or electromagnetic
  radiations. It is difficult to form an adequate idea of the marvelous
  power of this unique appliance, by the aid of which the globe will be
  transformed. The electromagnetic radiations being reduced to an
  insignificant quantity, and proper conditions of resonance maintained,
  the circuit acts like an immense pendulum, storing indefinitely the
  energy of the primary exciting impulses and impressions upon the earth
  and its conducting atmosphere uniform harmonic oscillations of
  intensities which, as actual tests have shown, may be pushed so far as to
  surpass those attained in the natural displays of static electricity.
  Simultaneously with these endeavors, the means of individualization and
  isolation were gradually improved. Great importance was attached to this,
  for it was found that simple tuning was not sufficient to meet the
  vigorous practical requirements. The fundamental idea of employing a
  number of distinctive elements, co-operatively associated, for the
  purpose of isolating energy transmitted, I trace directly to my perusal
  of Spencer's clear and suggestive exposition of the human nerve
  mechanism. The influence of this principle on the transmission of
  intelligence, and electrical energy in general, cannot as yet be
  estimated, for the art is still in the embryonic stage; but many
  thousands of simultaneous telegraphic and telephonic messages, through
  one single conducting channel, natural or artificial, and without serious
  mutual interference, are certainly practicable, while millions are
  possible. On the other hand, any desired degree of individualization may
  be secured by the use of a great number of co-operative elements and
  arbitrary variation of their distinctive features and order of
  succession. For obvious reasons, the principle will also be valuable in
  the extension of the distance of transmission. Progress, though of
  necessity slow, was steady and sure, for the objects aimed at were in a
  direction of my constant study and exercise. It is, therefore, not
  astonishing that before the end of 1899 I completed the task undertaken
  and reached the results which I announced in June, 1900, every word of
  which was most carefully weighed. Much was already accomplished towards
  making my system commercially available, in the transmission of energy in
  small amounts for specific purposes, as well as on an industrial scale.
  You will note that even that far back in counting--facts were held from
  you for remember that I speak of 1900 at the turn of the century.With
  that thought in mind can you really be confounded and surprised to find
  these heinous systems for destruction so sophisticated and perfected?
  The results attained by me had made my scheme of intelligence
  transmission, for which the name of "World Telegraphy", easily
  realizable. It constituted, in its principle of operation, means employed
  and capacities of application, a radical and fruitful departure from what
  had been theretofore done. I had no doubt that it would prove very
  efficient in enlightening the masses, particularly in still uncivilized
  countries and less accessible regions, and that it would add materially
  to general safety, comfort and convenience, and maintenance of peaceful
  relations. You see, in all generations there are we dreamers who believe
  that man is generally "good" and "sharing" as of God projection--not
  so--for too late we learn that the adversary called evil and Satanic is
  always at work in the vineyards ready to steal the tanks of good wine and
  poison the masses with the sour brew. My outlay involved the employment of
  a number of plants, all of which are capable of transmitting
  individualized signals to the uttermost confines of the earth. Each of
  them would be preferably located near some important center of
  civilization and the news it received through any channel would be
  flashed to all points of the globe. A very cheap and simple device, which
  could be carried in one's pocket, would then be set up somewhere on sea
  or land, and would record the world's news or such special messages as
  might be intended for it. Thus the entire earth would be converted into a
  huge brain, as it were, capable of response in every one of its
  parts. Little could I then realize that the adversary would utilize such
  wonders for the deceiving of an entire civilization. Since a single plant
  of but one hundred horse-power could operate hundreds of millions of
  instruments, the system would have a virtually infinite working capacity,
  and it could immensely facilitate and cheapen the transmission of
  intelligence. Man is so ungracious and cruel to his fellowman as to
  astound the senses. The first of these central plants would have been
  completed at that time had it not been for unforeseen delays which,
  fortunately, had nothing to do with its purely technical features. But
  this loss of time, while vexatious, was, after all, proven to be a
  blessing in disguise. The best design of which I knew at the time had been
  adopted, and the transmitter would emit a wave complex of a total maximum
  activity of ten million horse-power, one percent of which is amply
  sufficient to "girdle the globe". This enormous rate of energy delivery,
  approximately twice that of the combined falls of Niagara, is obtainable
  only by the use of certain artifices, which I was to make known in due
  course. For a large part of the work which I did I was indebted to the
  noble generosity of Mr. J. Pierpont Morgan and the world owes to this one
  man much of the despoiling and imprisonment of a planet. I was as deceived
  as any of you present personages by that contractioning viper. I found him
  most welcome and stimulating, as it was extended at a time when those,
  who had since promised most, were the greatest of doubters. Little do we
  see the deceit in the hand which offers assistance and means destruction
  and theft. I honored my friend, Stanford White, for much unselfish and
  valuable assistance. The work advanced, and though the results seemed to
  me to be tardy, they were sure to come. Meanwhile, the transmission of
  energy on an industrial scale was not neglected. The Canadian Niagara
  Power Company offered me a splendid inducement, and I felt that, next to
  achieving success for the sake of the art and gift unto my fellowman, it
  would give me the greatest satisfaction to make their concession
  financially profitable to them. In this first power plant, which I worked
  long at the designing, I proposed to distribute ten thousand horse-power
  under a tension of one hundred million volts, which I was now able to
  produce and handle with extreme safety. This energy would be collected all
  over the globe, preferably in small amounts, ranging from a fraction of
  one to a few horse-power. One of its chief uses would be the illumination
  of isolated homes. It would take very little power to light a dwelling
  with vacuum tubes operated by high-frequency currents and in each
  instance a terminal a little above the roof would be more than
  sufficient. Another valuable application would be the driving of clocks
  and other such apparatus. These clocks would be exceedingly simple, would
  require absolutely no attention and would indicate rigorously correct
  time. The idea of impressing upon the earth American time is fascinating
  and very likely to become popular was my thought on the matter. I was
  going to be able to offer a great convenience to the whole world with a
  plant of no more than ten thousand horse-power. How could I know that the
  carbon fuels would hold the entire world hostage to the thieves of the
  environment and the civilization? The introduction of that system would
  give opportunities for invention and manufacture such as have never
  presented themselves before and were never again presented to the
  people. Knowing the far-reaching importance of this first attempt and its
  effect upon what would be future development, I proceeded slowly and most
  carefully.  Experience taught me not to assign a term to enterprises the
  consummation of which is not wholly dependent on my own abilities and
  exertions. I was hopeful that these great realizations would not be far
  off, and I knew that when this first work would be completed they would
  follow with mathematical certitude. When the great truth seemingly
  accidentally revealed and experimentally confirmed would be fully
  recognized, the planet, with all its appalling immensity, was to electric
  currents virtually no more than a small metal ball and that by this fact
  many possibilities, each baffling imagination and of incalculable
  consequence, were rendered absolutely sure of accomplishment; when that
  first plant would be inaugurated and it would be shown that a telegraphic
  message, almost as secret and non-interferable as a thought, could be
  transmitted to any terrestrial distance, the sound of the human voice,
  with all its intonations and inflections, faithfully and virtually
  instantly reproduced at any other point of the globe--and that to be
  followed by instant reproductions and reflections of images and so forth,
  the energy of a waterfall made available for supplying light, heat or
  motive power, anywhere--on sea, or land, or high in the air--humanity
  could and would be stirred up like an active ant-hill. Oh, the excitement
  coming was too incredible for me to contain. Ah alas, could it really have
  been meant that this wondrous gift of gifts would fall into the hands of
  the Elite evil manipulators and withholders of goodness. My dear old
  friend, I have rambled on in my memory trek and I see that you must now
  finger each symbol on a board when there is facility in your time for
  picking up the thought patterns. I wonder if your people of your time will
  awaken to their heritage in time to utilize any of these wondrous gifts
  kept to the Elite deceivers? Ah, it has ever been thus on the planets of
  dense immorality of experience. The lessons are great but the surge of
  evil is always so great and the stand with and for God so shallow. I can
  only wish you well and share that which I have to gift. I look forward to
  again welcoming you home and I shall keep the teapot at boil so that we
  can sip and share. How wondrous it would be to succeed in this present
  mission that man might experience true greatness in his own time of
  manifestation instead of always succumbing to the demonic thieves of
  expression. I bid you peace and appreciation for allowing my sharing as
  our paths are destined to intertwine and for that gift I am most
  pleased. I bid you good-day and may insight shine upon you as you walk the
  path. This is Nikola to close with my best blessings upon you who effort
  to change the journey into a lighted blessing for all--may it come to
  pass!

** End of Topic **


Don


--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cis.ohio-state.edu!rutgers!rochester!cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!crabapple.srv.cs.cmu.edu!netnews.srv.cs.cmu.edu!gerry
From: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 15:46:53 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]>
    <[e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gerry Roston)
Organization: Field Robotics Center, CMU
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Nntp-Posting-Host: onion.frc.ri.cmu.edu
In-Reply-To: Frank T Lofaro's message of Thu, 20 Feb 1992 13:03:39 -0500

In article <[e-mail]> Frank T Lofaro <[e-mail]> writes:
   From alt.paranormal (USENET): 20-Feb-92 Re: Dreamland Gerry
   [e-mail] (919)

   >Jon
   >If I were to say that people with acne were actuallt Martians in
   >disguise, would you say:
   >a) He's full of shit.
   >b) I can not form an opinion, but the burden of proof is on him.

   >Although what you said about skepticism being a two edged sword is
   >correct, there are certain ideas that can be quickly flushed without
   >resorting to experimentation, etc.

   >Like pyschotics being ingabited by demon.

   >Or people with acne being Martians.

       That is a somewhat hollow argument. You are comparing the statement
   being tested to something that is obviously ridiculous and then using
   that as the basis for attacking the original statement. While it would
   be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
   demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
   of them are. If someone gets possessed by a demon (which I *do* believe
   happens, though not very often), they will appear to unenlightened
   science to be mentally ill. Modern science does not comprehend, nor is
   it intended to explain, phenomina that deal with non-physical entities,
   such as demons. Scientists do not understand the soul, spirits, and
   demons and how they affect what appears to them to be the "real" world.

       There is *much* more to the world, than just the physical plane.

Frank,
You've got your head shoved so far up your as, you can't see daylight.
If you honestly believe that my argument is any more hollow than the
one about demons, I have a bridge to sell you.  This talk of gods and
demons are hold-overs from our progenitors who could not explain the
world they see.  These stories are suitable for campfires and dolts
who can not form logical explinations for the world around them.  The
only reason that people give these tales more creedacne than my straw-
man is that these tales have been around far longer, they have the
support of very strong political groups and people are afraid to
attack them.

--
Gerry Roston ([e-mail]) | Society is produced by our wants, and
Field Robotics Center,          | government by our wickedness;...
Carnegie Mellon University      | Thomas Paine
Pittsburgh, PA, 15213           |
[phone]                  |
                                |
The opinions expressed are mine |
and do not reflect the official |
position of CMU, FRC, RedZone,  |
or any other organization.      |
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From: [e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 16:42:14 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Organization: University of Waterloo
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>
>>>    Not that surveying the older stars are any picnic either...
>
>>    I imagine that Lovelock would suggest looking for worlds whose
>>atmosphere is in what should be chemical disequilibrium. Lots of O2,
>>for example, suggests there must be something producing it continually.
>
>    Huh? Um... *how*?
>
>    We can't even detect them (extra-solar planets) as it is yet,
>let alone differentiate between their atmospheric constituencies...

    Oops. I was assuming a century or two of research, to get the
ability to detect extra-solar planets remotely. That is barely within
the realm of possibility, isn't it?

    What is Earth's radio noise output like these days? Assuming no
attempt on our part to be noticed by hypothetical ETIs, would it be
obvious to the ETIs why the sun (or a close companion to it) appeared
to be a major radio source?

                            James Nicoll
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!aero.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (R. S. Statsinger)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 17:39:54 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Ssaymssik Inc.
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>
>   [psychotic delusions ommitted]
>

Oh shit, we've got another one. Somebody get the thorazine.....

Bob S.

"Everything you know is WRONG......"
            - Firesign Theatre
Path: ns-mx!uunet!infonode!doink!jim
From: [e-mail] (James B. Reed)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 17:46:22 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: jim@doink (James B. Reed)
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL.
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gerry Roston) writes:
|> This talk of gods and
|> demons are hold-overs from our progenitors who could not explain the
|> world they see.  These stories are suitable for campfires and dolts
|> who can not form logical explinations for the world around them.

So your basic assumption is that any explanation that involves God or a
demon is not logical.  That demonstrates your beliefs and biases but it
has nothing to do with logic.

Using logic on your statement (and assuming you statement is true), we must
conclude that Isaac Newton was a campfire.  He believed in God, but he
certainly was not a dolt who could not form logical explanations for the
world around him.

I removed sci.space from the Newsgroups line because this discussion doesn't
belong there.  You can respond to me via email if you wish.

--
James B. Reed                | If at first you don't succeed,
DAZIX, An Intergraph Company | Find out why,
[e-mail]        | **THEN** try again.
[phone]               |
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!stl!stc!patb
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: rec.travel,misc.misc,news.misc,tor.general,alt.alien.visitors,tor.news,soc.college.gradinfo,ut.dcs.gradnews
Subject: Re: Apartment for summer sublet
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 16:48:02 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Organization: STC Telecomms, New Southgate, London, N11 1HB
Lines: 10
Xref: ns-mx rec.travel:21262 misc.misc:7184 news.misc:4105 alt.alien.visitors:4591 soc.college.gradinfo:1478

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>********** APARTMENT FOR SUMMER SUBLET **********

What's this doing in "alt.alien.visitors" ? Perhaps you want to give the aliens
a little summer vacation from what is probably a very Spartan system of
underground tunnels ?

Sorry. Couldn't resist.

    Pat
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!cumesb!anselmo
From: anselmo@cumesb (Andrew P. Anselmo)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Yet another test; please ignore
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 19:39:39 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (The Daily Lose)
Organization: Columbia University Department of Mechanical Engineering
Lines: 10


This is a test of the emergency broadcast system.
In the event of an emergency...
This is only a test.

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Andrew Anselmo / Department of Mechanical Engineering / Columbia University
   236A SW Mudd Building 212-854-2965 / [e-mail]
                    Independently Owned and Operated.
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From: [e-mail] (Ed McCreary)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 19:16:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Organization: Compaq Computer Corp.
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins) writes:
>>I've always been impressed by ILM, but this tops it!  They have data from a
>>probe that never existed! (there were only two Vikings). I've been thinking
>>about doing something like this for Venus.  If anyone has any information
>>about programming codes, let me know.
>
>NASA's already done something like this for Venus.  Well, it wasn't
>interactive, but they've got a nice video clip of parts of Venus from the point
>of view of someone flying over the surface.  Sorry, I don't know how you would
>et a copy of it.

They've done quite a few.  I believe the original research into this
technique was done at JPL.  I've seen _LA, the Movie_, _Mars, the Movie_
and _Europa, the Movie_.  (I think Europa, it was one of the Jovian
moons.)  It's quite breath taking to watch.  Try contacting the public
affairs offices of NASA or JPL.  They may provide video tapes for educational
use.  You can get an amazing amount of material either free or real
cheap if you dig enough.



--
[e-mail]     Computers are like Old Testament gods;
[e-mail]                      lots of rules and no mercy.
#include <stddisclaimer.h>                                  Joseph Campbell
                "Ooooohhhh we got movie sign!!" MST3K
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!access.usask.ca!ccu.umanitoba.ca!roholdr
From: [e-mail] (R Ross Holder Jr)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 19:48:54 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
Lines: 65

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Joshua Geller) writes:

>someone who should know better(?) writes:

[stuff deleted...]

>>But the equipment failed - just like the probe that located the Mars Face.

>I wasn't aware that the vikings failed.

He's sort of "got me" here...  I'd _heard_ that the Mars Face was located
by a probe that was sent to Mars by the United States to study the Martian
moons.  Unfortunately, I heard this over a local radio broadcast some time
ago and I haven't heard anything more since then.  Was the Mars Face first
located by the Viking Probes?  If not, why didn't we hear about all the
Mars Face just after the Vikings landed???

>this same person went on to say 'and probably this one will fail too';
>isn't that jumping the gun a bit? I mean, wait for it to fail mysteriously,
>then start into the conspiracy theories.

I suppose if I had based my belief in the "conspiracy theory" solely on the
malfunctions of a couple of probes, I'd be guilty of "jumping the gun".
Luckily, there's evidence here on earth that a government conspiracy exists -
documents that are leaked occasionally, incidents similar to Hangar 19,
incidents similar to a recent encounter the Belgian Airforce allegedly had
with several UFOs (albeit reported on a television show that resembles the
National Enquirer), not to mention numerous individual "close encounters"
ordinary people have had over the last 40 years.  Granted, leaked documents
could all be forgeries, the discussions on Hangar 19 have largely consisted
of conjecture (since, if true, it's a military secret anyway), shows like
Hard Copy, A Current Affair could be misrepresenting the facts - misleading
people into thinking there is a conspiracy in order to develop stories to
"sell" to the public, and the individual "encounters" of ordinary people
could all be explained away as weather baloons, hoaxes, optical illusions
and/or mistakes.  The Crop Circles could all be natural phenomenon.

And I could be Emperor of Rome.

My point is believers in "The Conspiracy Theory" are probably not arriving
at their conclusions in the half-cocked fashion that has been suggested by
some.  My own personal beliefs are derived from all of the above being a
little too coincidental for me to accept and an inherent distrust in govern-
ment.  At the very least suggesting a conspiracy theory isn't wrong.  The
suggestion that I should know better than to do this is the suggestion that
I put a blind trust in all of the alternative explainations being valid
without question.  But I do question...and will continue to question until
it is conclusively shown that all of the alternative explanations for these
phenomena are the causes of them.

Whatever my own view, everyone should be reluctant to dismiss the "Conspiracy
Theory".  If there is a conspiracy theory, isn't it in everyone's interest
to find out about it?  Do we want our governments to decieve us?  Do we want
our judgement so impeded by a lack of information - do we want to live in
a society where the government manipulates the opinons of its citizens through
providing government-selected information?  Isn't it important, with all this
at stake, that we consider "The Conspiracy Theory?"


 ---------------------------------------------------------------
|R. Ross Holder, Jr.             | Home Address:                |
|([e-mail])     | 410-424 River Avenue         |
|Department of Philosophy     | Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada   |
|The University of Manitoba     | R3L 0C6   PH#: [phone]|
 ---------------------------------------------------------------
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!linac!convex!schumach
From: [e-mail] (Richard A. Schumacher)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 21:09:26 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Nntp-Posting-Host: starman.convex.com
X-Disclaimer: This message was written by a user at CONVEX Computer
              Corp. The opinions expressed are those of the user and
              not necessarily those of CONVEX.

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (James B. Reed) writes:
>Using logic on your statement (and assuming you statement is true), we must
>conclude that Isaac Newton was a campfire.  He believed in God, but he
>certainly was not a dolt who could not form logical explanations for the
>world around him.

Yes, Newton was a genius, but he was not infallible. Some of his
views were completely wrong (such as those that led him to write
tens of thousands of words on alchemy as a science), or even lunatic
(his deathbed statement that his proudest achievement was to die a
virgin).

So stop with these ridiculous appeals to authority, already.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!spdcc!rdonahue
From: [e-mail] (Bob Donahue)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 22:07:29 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: insert anything here
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[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>>[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>>>[e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:

>>>>    Not that surveying the older stars are any picnic either...

>>>    I imagine that Lovelock would suggest looking for worlds whose
>>>atmosphere is in what should be chemical disequilibrium. Lots of O2,
>>>for example, suggests there must be something producing it continually.

>>    Huh? Um... *how*?
>>    We can't even detect them (extra-solar planets) as it is yet,
>>let alone differentiate between their atmospheric constituencies...

>    What is Earth's radio noise output like these days? Assuming no
>attempt on our part to be noticed by hypothetical ETIs, would it be
>obvious to the ETIs why the sun (or a close companion to it) appeared
>to be a major radio source?

    UM --- that's one of the better suggestions.  You could get
several things from this: the distance from the Earth to the Sun,
as well as the rotation and revolution periods of the Earth as well...
I don't know how many Janskys the Earth puts out, offhand.

    The big problem here is of course where to look...  Even FM
is a pretty large bandwidth to sample, and there isn't and logical reason
for ETs to start looking there (that I know of).

Bob
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From: [e-mail] (Grant Edwards)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 21:46:36 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
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Organization: Rosemount, Inc.
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[e-mail] (Frank T Lofaro) writes:
: From alt.paranormal (USENET): 20-Feb-92 Re: Dreamland Gerry
: [e-mail] (919)
:
: >Jon
: >If I were to say that people with acne were actuallt Martians in
: >disguise, would you say:
: >a) He's full of shit.
: >b) I can not form an opinion, but the burden of proof is on him.
: >
: >Although what you said about skepticism being a two edged sword is
: >correct, there are certain ideas that can be quickly flushed without
: >resorting to experimentation, etc.
: >
: >Like pyschotics being ingabited by demon.
: >
: >Or people with acne being Martians.
:
:     That is a somewhat hollow argument. You are comparing the statement
: being tested to something that is obviously ridiculous and then using
: that as the basis for attacking the original statement. While it would
: be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
: demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
: of them are.

It is _your_ opinion that martians are more ridiculous that demons.
At least Mars is a real place that has been observed and visited.
Although current evidence doesn't give any indication of life on Mars
(and I don't want to hear about stupid faces and pyramids) the
existence of life on a terrestrial planet has precedent.  Hell, or
wherever demons come from, hasn't been observed or visited.  In my
opinion it is much more likely that somebody is a Martian than sombody
is possessed by demons.

There is as much evidence to support the _claim_ that I am a Martian as
there is that I am possessed by demons.  NONE!

There _is_ evidence that schizophrenia and other psychotic disorders
are organically caused.  Why invent demons?

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  The land of the rising
Rosemount Inc.                                |SONY!!
                                              |
[e-mail]                 |
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!news.u.washington.edu!gibdo!tvp
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 00:05:33 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: clearer than blir
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>>The man, staring at shapes he *believed* to be made by intelligent
>>beings,
>You want to say there is any serious doubt of that?
>
>>searched so hard for meaning that he found it in the form of
>>five as yet undiscovered theorems. [..] No, after showing that
>>the theorems are probably new, we would
>>need evidence that the very layout of the crop circles was *designed*
>>to lead to the discovery of these theorems and again determine if this
>>seems reasonable.
>
>As you can find Elk's Theory by looking at an image of a
>brontosaurus, you can find geometric relations by looking at
>an image of geometric figures.  But I don't assume that anyone
>would draw a brontosaurus with the intention of making somebody
>else find this "new theory".

I think the most definitive statement of what I was trying to say is:
To be rigorous, I would like the discoverer of the theorems describe a
general method of decoding crop circles which anyone could apply to
future formations. If it were then possible for observers to
independently arrive at identical new theorems based on a given
formation, this would be strong evidence that the crop circles had
been intelligently designed and represented a symbolic language of
sorts. Especially if the formation were found to contain "instructions"
that led the observer to the theorem.

If he claims there really was no formal method of decoding, I would
say the question is up in the air because of the *possibility* that
concentration on the geometric shapes had led to a Eureka discovery of
new theorems. Without any further evidence to guide us, each
individual must decide for him/herself which explanation seems more
reasonable: Eureka discovery or intelligent formations. I think either
is possible, the latter certainly more exciting, but which is
reasonable without any other evidence? Whichever a given person
chooses, he/she should not be derided for his/her choice. And until
the matter is settled the phenomenon should continue to be studied,
as it is of interest to many people.

-- Tad Perry
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!netcomsv!mork!payner
From: [e-mail] (Rich Payne)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <7=gh#f=[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 16:52:56 GMT
Distribution: na
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 288


>In article <=fdhm8=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...

>>>Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.
>>
>>Curiously, when many people _say_ UFO, they mean _alien spacecraft_.
>>So what they are talking about is not an unknown deserving of study,
>>but those darn aliens.

>Ah, but who cares?  If you read my previous posts, you won't find _me_
>attributing UFO's to "alien spacecraft".  I've been arguing about the
>phenomenon.  Once again, someone else (you, this time) is forcing the
>"alien" issue.

>Why?

I'm not forcing this or any other issue. This -->is<-- alt.alien.visitors,
and if you have followed the other threads, you will know about the planet
ummo, the greys, several conspiracies, etc...  And they do belong here.
How is it that you can act as they are not part of the phenomena? Any
study which ignores part of the data cannot be considered unbiased.

>>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>>>>about this phenomenon need apply.
>>
>>Need there be a single TRVTH? Or even just one phenomenon? I thought
>>we were dealing with an unknown? Hopefully I have guessed correctly
>>who originally said this.

>Absolutely.  Show me where I have insisted that there is _one_ truth to
>be found here.

I see above  ">>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth".
And I checked, these were your words. Are you saying the "the truth"
is non-singular?

>>>My statement about "truth" stands.

>>
>>I tend to think that there is no truth, just different points of
>>view.

>No offense, but doesn't this statement strike you as rather "unscientific"?

Scientific investigation is good for exploring objective reality. But
"truth" is not an objective reality. I would say that any study
go find some objective "truth" would absolutely not be a scientific
investigation.

>>>>
>>>>Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
>>>laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
>>>a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
>>>black hole.
>>
>>This seems to be a straw-man argument. The truth or falsity of the
>>above has no bearing upon the value of studying the "UFO phenomenon".
>>Nevertheless, fission, while not predictable, is quite repeatable,
>>and the rate can be measured. Now if only UFO observations were as
>>repeatable, this thread would never have existed. And there is
>>a pretty good theoretical basis behind black holes. What theory
>>perdicts UFO`s?

>>What theory predicts that atom 1E37 will divide?  Look, the point I'm
>>trying to make is that we keep hearing that the UFO phenomenon is not
>>repeatable in a laboratory.  Of course it isn't.  But neither are other
>>things which we _accept_ in science as valid.  I have yet to see the
>>difference.

>Most importantly, much of science does NOT begin in the laboratory in
>a repeatable setting.  It begins with _something_ that raises questions.

>If that "something" has raised a question, then the next step is to
>decide whether we can _try_ to answer it.  That is where the current
>state of the study of the UFO phenomenon rests.  It has never gone
>beyond this.

>For one to cry that there is no "repeatable" evidence of the phenomenon
>is to deny the birth of other scientific advances.  Many of those did
>not start in a laboratory.  They started with _observation_, something
>that should be a holy word to science.

The key here is that repeatable phenomena _can_ be investigated. If
we had only reports of uranium atome splitting, and from at best
questionable sources, would we be talking about fission today?

>Fission, as a phenomenon, is deliberately repeatable.  I agree.

>However, there was a time when it was _not_.  It was only a "theory".

As I recall, atoms at the time were considered unsplitable. Theory
denied that atome could split. Only after it was undisputably
observed was the phenomenon given proper study, and the nuclear
sciences were born.

>How did we achieve repeatability?  By studying the processes that we
>thought should lead to it.  Call it a bit of forensic science if you
>will.  In any case, we _believed_ (for the most part) that we should
>be able to actually split something we could not see and still haven't.

Did we achieve repeatability? Is this not intrinsic to either
the phenomenon or to our methods of observation?

>At the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I'll go one step further and
>say that fission is NOT repeatable and NOT predictable for any particular
>single atom.  There is a probability that atom #1E37 _may_ divide.

This is solidly accepted as scientific fact. But still the rate of
decay can easily be measured, and hence we have half-lives. What is
the half-life of a phenomenon? Or a UFO? And how would you measure
this?

>>>
>>>In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.
>

>>No argument, but where do we go from here? This alone is not
>>sufficient.

>You and I agree on this.  The answer seems obvious to me.  You don't
>argue that the _phenomenon_ is real (as I stated above).  So, if this
>"alone is not sufficient", we do what science dictates that we do.

I guess that I was unclear. I agree that the phenomena exists.
That was what was meant by "No argument."

>We study it further.

It does not neccesarily follow that the existance of a phenomena
makes it worthwhile to study. It may or may not be. But there are
an infinite number of things to study (OK, a very large number),
and neither you nor I nor anyone has time or resources to study
them all. So we go with out strengths.

>>
>>>Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
>>>(whatever that may be) does not.
>>
>>A flying saucer might be studied. How does one study a phenomenon?

>Ask a psychologist.

Then who are we discussion UFO's as a subject for scientific
investigation?

>>
>>>Now, let me rephrase the above....
>>>
>>>"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
>>>atom #1E37 is going to split does not.
>>>
>>>Do you see my point?
>>
>>I see your point. But things with boring repeatability have never
>>been that difficult to study.

>I would venture to say that the reporting of UFO sightings occurs quite
>often worldwide.  Can we demand that a UFO appear?  No.  Therefore, it is
>not repeatable on demand.  So what?  That doesn't change the fact that
>thousands of reports occur annually.

So what? Let's not confuse "repeatable on demand" with completely
random in place and time. If only the place were repeatable, then
one might set up some sort of automated equipment to look for
EM bursts, changes in the magnetic field, etc...  But it is difficult
to monitor the entire world at all times.

>>>
>>>Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
>>>It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
>>>in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.
>>
>>I think that the requirements to eat and pay the rent might
>>just possibly make it into the objective category. Unless you
>>make a living doing something else, and study the phenomenon on
>>your own.

>No.  That makes it especially subjective.

I would say that requirements for food, shelter, and clothing are
objective. To each their own I guess.

>>>Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
>>>the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
>>>evidence of this?
>>
>>It is not possible to _prove_ that a thing does not exist.
>>Rather, the problem here is defining just what the phenomenon
>>is. Right now all we have is the 'phenomenon' label, and claims
>>of alien spacecraft. Would you care to try to get funding
>>based upon this?

>I'm not asking for that.  I simply meant that if you _are_ implying that
>those who _do_ seriously study the subject (few as they may be) are not
>doing so in a scientific manner, then you evidently have evidence of some
>sort to lead you to make such an assertion.

Did I say that ">those who _do_ seriously study the subject" do so
unscientifically? I don't see it in rereading. And therefore I do
not seem to have made any assertions. You, above, do say that
there is valid scientific investigation going on. Would you be so
kind as to elucidate?

>As for defining the phenomenon...well...I don't see that as a problem.

Once again, we have a label : UFO. This is just a bit short of
defining the phenomenon for my taste. Would you care to spell out
what you mean by the "phenomenon" for me?

>The phenomenon _is_.  If one weighs most if not all of the anecdotal and
>physical trace evidence, it's clear that there is no single _cause_ of
>the phenomenon.  In fact, the phenomenon may be divided into categories.

>And yes, I _did_ say "physical trace evidence".

>I'll be happy to explain if you wish, but let's assume that I'm right.

>What's the difference between this "trace" evidence and say, trace evidence
>that the element Lead was once unstable?  We can't repeat that can we?

I still do not think that atomic decay is a proper parallel to the
UFO phenomenon.

>>>
>>>The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
>>>it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
>>>of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
>>>find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
>>>_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
>>>SETI research.  That is absurd.
>>
>>While I think the chances of SETI working are so slim as to
>>make it a wasted effort, how does one compare SETI to a conspiricy
>>theory, and find an absurdity.

>"Conspiracy"?  What are you talking about?  Did I miss something?

Keep reading alt.aliens.visitors, if you have not seem any conspiracy
theories, you will. Many posts are cross-posted to alt.conspiracy.

>>Also you claim we have a UFO
>>'phenomenon', not alien intelligence, how do you reconcile that
>>with the clear implication that UFO are extraterrestial
>>intelligences above?

>No, no, NO!  I am not equating the two.  I'm pointing out that "science"
>is perfectly happy to look for something it has 0 evidence for (unless you

But they are lookin for something they can detect using well known
tools and techniques. And in places where they might expect to find
life.

>consider the fact that _we_ exist the evidence).  Yet, when we have
>thousands of people worldwide making extraordinary claims, many with
>physical traces, instrumental observations, etc., we laugh it off as
>nothing.

I'll admit, after much study, I still do not know what to make of the
phenomenon. But cleary there is much fraud and fakery. And many of
the observations are natural phenomenon under unusual circumstances.
And many extrordinary claims are made. Why does the onus of proof
rest upon the scientific community?

>>>>Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
>>
>>Rich
>>
>>[e-mail]    Sig is at the cleaners.
>
>Regards,
>Jim Graham
>
>        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
>                          Neither do they speak for me.
> ______________________________________________________________________
>| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
>|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
>| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
>|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
>|______________________________________________________________________|

Rich again

[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!hp-col!col!lpj
From: [e-mail] (Laura Johnson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Re: This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 20 Feb 92 19:44:28 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division
Lines: 7

> why would the American government spend
>- waste the people's money studying a rock?

Hadn't you noticed? The American government is in the business
of spending and wasting people's money. That's what it does.

-LJ (feeling cynical today)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!bronze!venus.iucf.indiana.edu!graham
From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 02:18:45 GMT
References: <7=gh#f=[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
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In article <7=gh#f=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>
>>In article <=fdhm8=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>
>>>>Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.
>>>
>>>Curiously, when many people _say_ UFO, they mean _alien spacecraft_.
>>>So what they are talking about is not an unknown deserving of study,
>>>but those darn aliens.
>
>>Ah, but who cares?  If you read my previous posts, you won't find _me_
>>attributing UFO's to "alien spacecraft".  I've been arguing about the
>>phenomenon.  Once again, someone else (you, this time) is forcing the
>>"alien" issue.
>
>>Why?
>
>I'm not forcing this or any other issue. This -->is<-- alt.alien.visitors,
>and if you have followed the other threads, you will know about the planet
>ummo, the greys, several conspiracies, etc...  And they do belong here.
>How is it that you can act as they are not part of the phenomena? Any
>study which ignores part of the data cannot be considered unbiased.

First, I realize this is alt.alien.visitors.  However, the original thread
started with someone (Don Allen I think) posting some statistics concerning
the percentage of astronomers that thought the UFO phenomenon should
receive further scientific study.  There was _no_, 0, nadda mention of
"aliens" in that post.

The fact that Don posted here may _imply_ that aliens should be attributed,
but the content of the post shows otherwise.

Granted, maybe we should take this to sci.skeptic, and if you desire this,
I'll start adding it to the newsgroups: line, but I suspect that if we
do, those folks will tell us that it belongs in alt.alien.visitors, since
the armchair skeptic is the one that _usually_ makes the attribution when
the debate becomes difficult for them to handle.

>
>>>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>>>>>about this phenomenon need apply.
>>>
>>>Need there be a single TRVTH? Or even just one phenomenon? I thought
>>>we were dealing with an unknown? Hopefully I have guessed correctly
>>>who originally said this.
>
>>Absolutely.  Show me where I have insisted that there is _one_ truth to
>>be found here.
>
>I see above  ">>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth".
>And I checked, these were your words. Are you saying the "the truth"
>is non-singular?

No, _you_ implied this.

>
>>>>My statement about "truth" stands.
>
>>>
>>>I tend to think that there is no truth, just different points of
>>>view.
>
>>No offense, but doesn't this statement strike you as rather "unscientific"?
>
>Scientific investigation is good for exploring objective reality. But
>"truth" is not an objective reality. I would say that any study
>go find some objective "truth" would absolutely not be a scientific
>investigation.

Ok.  You have your own definition of "truth".  That's fine, as long as we
both know this.

My definition of "truth" is a simple one.  A "fact" is a "truth".  Something
that is a part of objective reality is a "truth".

Let's stop playing with words and address the issue, ok?

>>>>>
>>>>>Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
>>>>laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
>>>>a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
>>>>black hole.
>>>
>>>This seems to be a straw-man argument. The truth or falsity of the
>>>above has no bearing upon the value of studying the "UFO phenomenon".
>>>Nevertheless, fission, while not predictable, is quite repeatable,
>>>and the rate can be measured. Now if only UFO observations were as
>>>repeatable, this thread would never have existed. And there is
>>>a pretty good theoretical basis behind black holes. What theory
>>>perdicts UFO`s?
>
>>>What theory predicts that atom 1E37 will divide?  Look, the point I'm
>>>trying to make is that we keep hearing that the UFO phenomenon is not
>>>repeatable in a laboratory.  Of course it isn't.  But neither are other
>>>things which we _accept_ in science as valid.  I have yet to see the
>>>difference.
>
>>Most importantly, much of science does NOT begin in the laboratory in
>>a repeatable setting.  It begins with _something_ that raises questions.
>
>>If that "something" has raised a question, then the next step is to
>>decide whether we can _try_ to answer it.  That is where the current
>>state of the study of the UFO phenomenon rests.  It has never gone
>>beyond this.
>
>>For one to cry that there is no "repeatable" evidence of the phenomenon
>>is to deny the birth of other scientific advances.  Many of those did
>>not start in a laboratory.  They started with _observation_, something
>>that should be a holy word to science.
>
>The key here is that repeatable phenomena _can_ be investigated. If
>we had only reports of uranium atome splitting, and from at best
>questionable sources, would we be talking about fission today?

And are all (in fact most) _sources_ of sighting reports "questionable"?

What are you implying?

>>Fission, as a phenomenon, is deliberately repeatable.  I agree.
>
>>However, there was a time when it was _not_.  It was only a "theory".
>
>As I recall, atoms at the time were considered unsplitable. Theory
>denied that atome could split. Only after it was undisputably
>observed was the phenomenon given proper study, and the nuclear
>sciences were born.

Again, I think we need to agree on a definition of "undisputably
observed".  You seem to keep avoiding my insistance that I have been
talking about the ufo _phenomenon_.  Not a singular report of a strange
object seen in the sky by Bayou Bill.

I think UFO's have been "undisputably observed".  If not, tell me why
you disagree and what would change your mind.  Remember that I am
referring to what I consider the undeniable existance of the _phenomenon_,
NOT a particular object.

>>How did we achieve repeatability?  By studying the processes that we
>>thought should lead to it.  Call it a bit of forensic science if you
>>will.  In any case, we _believed_ (for the most part) that we should
>>be able to actually split something we could not see and still haven't.
>
>Did we achieve repeatability? Is this not intrinsic to either
>the phenomenon or to our methods of observation?

Yes.  At the macro level, that is true.

Suppose you really wanted to study the ufo phenomenon.  How would _you_
propose achieving repeatability of a phenomenon that exists but is
"transient" in nature?

>>At the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I'll go one step further and
>>say that fission is NOT repeatable and NOT predictable for any particular
>>single atom.  There is a probability that atom #1E37 _may_ divide.
>
>This is solidly accepted as scientific fact. But still the rate of
>decay can easily be measured, and hence we have half-lives. What is
>the half-life of a phenomenon? Or a UFO? And how would you measure
>this?

Does it matter?  What is the "half-life" of the violent crime phenomenon?

What is the "half-life" of the ball-lightning phenomenon?

What is the "half-life" of the earthquake "phenomenon"?

How would you measure these?

The point I'm making is that not all "phenomena" are predictable,
reproducible on demand, and directly measurable.  Some of these are
readily accepted by science as valid, even though science can't
really practice what it preaches when faced with them.

>
>>>>
>>>>In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.
>>
>
>>>No argument, but where do we go from here? This alone is not
>>>sufficient.
>
>>You and I agree on this.  The answer seems obvious to me.  You don't
>>argue that the _phenomenon_ is real (as I stated above).  So, if this
>>"alone is not sufficient", we do what science dictates that we do.
>
>I guess that I was unclear. I agree that the phenomena exists.
>That was what was meant by "No argument."
>
>>We study it further.
>
>It does not neccesarily follow that the existance of a phenomena
>makes it worthwhile to study. It may or may not be. But there are
>an infinite number of things to study (OK, a very large number),
>and neither you nor I nor anyone has time or resources to study
>them all. So we go with out strengths.

I agree.  So, if one chooses to "study" the phenomenon _scientifically_,
why the stigma on those who actually attempt this?

Who decides what is "worthy"?  The government?  You?  Me?  The rest of
"science"?

If we are asking for money to study, then it makes sense that the
moneygiver makes the decision (either directly or indirectly).

But that says absolutely nothing about how "worthy" something is of
scientific study.  It is, in a sense, a straw man.

If we are arguing the merits of studying one phenomenon over another,
based on available funding, then we are discussing...well...the topic
of funding.

However, that was not and is not why this thread on astronomers and
ufos began.

>
>>>
>>>>Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
>>>>(whatever that may be) does not.
>>>
>>>A flying saucer might be studied. How does one study a phenomenon?
>
>>Ask a psychologist.
>
>Then who are we discussion UFO's as a subject for scientific
>investigation?

Can you ask this again?  I don't understand the above (it's garbled).

Sorry.

>>>
>>>>Now, let me rephrase the above....
>>>>
>>>>"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
>>>>atom #1E37 is going to split does not.
>>>>
>>>>Do you see my point?
>>>
>>>I see your point. But things with boring repeatability have never
>>>been that difficult to study.
>
>>I would venture to say that the reporting of UFO sightings occurs quite
>>often worldwide.  Can we demand that a UFO appear?  No.  Therefore, it is
>>not repeatable on demand.  So what?  That doesn't change the fact that
>>thousands of reports occur annually.
>
>So what? Let's not confuse "repeatable on demand" with completely
>random in place and time. If only the place were repeatable, then
>one might set up some sort of automated equipment to look for
>EM bursts, changes in the magnetic field, etc...  But it is difficult
>to monitor the entire world at all times.

Well, we do that with meteorologically satellites all the time :-).
We do it with geological instruments all the time.

In certain "flaps" of sightings, it is done.  But, it is _still_ not
seriously considered or studied by mainstream science.

The opportunity has shown itself numerous times, but...no bites.

And, when someone within the Ufology community (and I refer to the
serious investigators, not the channeling space brother folks),
that too is conveniently ignored because armchair sceptics have already
made up their minds.

There is a wealth of data gathered via investigation by serious
investigators, that is just _waiting_ to be chewed upon (and perhaps
spit out) by mainstream science, but it doesn't even bite.

>>>>
>>>>Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
>>>>It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
>>>>in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.
>>>
>>>I think that the requirements to eat and pay the rent might
>>>just possibly make it into the objective category. Unless you
>>>make a living doing something else, and study the phenomenon on
>>>your own.
>
>>No.  That makes it especially subjective.
>
>I would say that requirements for food, shelter, and clothing are
>objective. To each their own I guess.
>

In a collective sense, I could stretch the word "objective" to make it
fit.

In any case, these are givens.  The "worthiness" of getting answers to
unanswered questions is still purely subjective.

>>>>Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
>>>>the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
>>>>evidence of this?
>>>
>>>It is not possible to _prove_ that a thing does not exist.
>>>Rather, the problem here is defining just what the phenomenon
>>>is. Right now all we have is the 'phenomenon' label, and claims
>>>of alien spacecraft. Would you care to try to get funding
>>>based upon this?
>
>>I'm not asking for that.  I simply meant that if you _are_ implying that
>>those who _do_ seriously study the subject (few as they may be) are not
>>doing so in a scientific manner, then you evidently have evidence of some
>>sort to lead you to make such an assertion.
>
>Did I say that ">those who _do_ seriously study the subject" do so
>unscientifically? I don't see it in rereading. And therefore I do
>not seem to have made any assertions. You, above, do say that
>there is valid scientific investigation going on. Would you be so
>kind as to elucidate?

Hmmm.  I should point out that _you_ used the word "valid" above.

The most obvious investigation that comes to mind is that of
Trans en Province.  That was an actual _trace_ case.  Sorry, but there
were not pieces of unidentified craft.  There _was_ true scientific
analysis of soil and botanic traces, but three different laboratories.

If you really want the poop, I'll get the references next week since
they're at work.

In a nutshell, an unusual object was observed to have hit or skimmed
the ground, only to take off again shortly after.

The traces left were unexplainable characteristic changes to the soil
in the immediate vicinity of the object, and unusual changes to surrounding
plantlife.

Soil samples were submitted to 3 (if I recall) laboratories, went through
various tests, and all three reports were in agreement.

>
>>As for defining the phenomenon...well...I don't see that as a problem.
>
>Once again, we have a label : UFO. This is just a bit short of
>defining the phenomenon for my taste. Would you care to spell out
>what you mean by the "phenomenon" for me?

Apparently we both misunderstand each other.

When talking about the UFO phenomenon, I see two distinct categories
ripe for study.

a.) A particular sighting, case, whatever you wish to consider.  This
    is the most difficult (IMO) to study, since it is by definition
    a transient phenomenon.

b.) The phenomenon.  Even this may be subdivided into categories, such
    as the abduction phenomenon, which is slowly but surely beginning
    to be studied by real scientists and some respected scientists in the
    field of psychology.

    In any case, when I refer to the study of the _phenomenon_, I am
    referring to the fact that _something_ is going on.  It simply
    hasn't been explained.

>>The phenomenon _is_.  If one weighs most if not all of the anecdotal and
>>physical trace evidence, it's clear that there is no single _cause_ of
>>the phenomenon.  In fact, the phenomenon may be divided into categories.
>
>>And yes, I _did_ say "physical trace evidence".
>
>>I'll be happy to explain if you wish, but let's assume that I'm right.
>
>>What's the difference between this "trace" evidence and say, trace evidence
>>that the element Lead was once unstable?  We can't repeat that can we?
>
>I still do not think that atomic decay is a proper parallel to the
>UFO phenomenon.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

While atomic decay is repeatable and predictable on the macro scale,
you cannot make a particular atom split.

The UFO phenomenon exists.  It is not repeatable _on demand_.  It is
repeatable in the sense that it continues.  It is not predictable
on a macro scale, but is somewhat predictable on the "regional" scale
(ie flaps usually occur over an extended period in a particular area).

>
>>>>
>>>>The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
>>>>it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
>>>>of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
>>>>find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
>>>>_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
>>>>SETI research.  That is absurd.
>>>
>>>While I think the chances of SETI working are so slim as to
>>>make it a wasted effort, how does one compare SETI to a conspiricy
>>>theory, and find an absurdity.
>
>>"Conspiracy"?  What are you talking about?  Did I miss something?
>
>Keep reading alt.aliens.visitors, if you have not seem any conspiracy
>theories, you will. Many posts are cross-posted to alt.conspiracy.

But that's my point.  What does any conspiracies have to do with this
discussion?  I haven't implied any, have I?

>>>Also you claim we have a UFO
>>>'phenomenon', not alien intelligence, how do you reconcile that
>>>with the clear implication that UFO are extraterrestial
>>>intelligences above?
>
>>No, no, NO!  I am not equating the two.  I'm pointing out that "science"
>>is perfectly happy to look for something it has 0 evidence for (unless you
>
>But they are lookin for something they can detect using well known
>tools and techniques. And in places where they might expect to find
>life.

You mean like eyes to look at instruments?  Minds to form hypothesis?

The truth is, in SETI, they really don't _know_ what to look for.  They
_assume_ that communication is most likely to occur at certain "magic"
frequencies.

They are looking for something they can detect, as you said.  But
_why_ are they looking _where_ they're looking?

Look, it is very common for people to attribute UFO's to ETI.

There really is no evidence to support that assumption.

However, don't you find it ironic that we would be spending millions
looking for something light years away that we have yet to sense,
let alone have any evidence for, and yet, right here at home we have
thousands of reports of unidentified objects annually, which most
people naturally (but perhaps mistakenly) attribute to little green
men, and yet, we don't pay attention?

We search for ETI elsewhere with little probability of success, yet
ignore the possibility of better success right here at home.

>
>>consider the fact that _we_ exist the evidence).  Yet, when we have
>>thousands of people worldwide making extraordinary claims, many with
>>physical traces, instrumental observations, etc., we laugh it off as
>>nothing.
>
>I'll admit, after much study, I still do not know what to make of the
>phenomenon. But cleary there is much fraud and fakery. And many of
>the observations are natural phenomenon under unusual circumstances.
>And many extrordinary claims are made. Why does the onus of proof
>rest upon the scientific community?

Who said it does?  Not me.  I didn't mean to imply that.  All I will
assert is that the onus of further serious study rests with those
most qualified to do so.  That is known as responsibility.

If proof comes from that, fine.

That is why I made an earlier remark about forensic science.  It _is_
a science, you know.  It's sole purpose is to _study_ any available
evidence (usually in the form of traces), and come to some sort of
conclusion.

But, if that was never done, a criminal case would have a difficult
time proceeding.

In like manner, true, serious investigation into the ufo phenomenon is
a precursor to doing any real "science" (IMO).  That isn't happening
in mainstream science except perhaps in the field of psychology.

>
>Rich again
>
>[e-mail]

Jim Graham - ditto

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
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Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!m.cs.uiuc.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uxa.cso.uiuc.edu!jbh55289
From: [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 03:23:22 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Lines: 31
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4602 sci.space:26907 sci.skeptic:20910 alt.paranormal:4460

[e-mail] (Ed McCreary) writes:

    [stuff on movies of flight over planetary surfaces deleted]

>>NASA's already done something like this for Venus.  Well, it wasn't
>>interactive, but they've got a nice video clip of parts of Venus from the point
>>of view of someone flying over the surface.  Sorry, I don't know how you would
>>et a copy of it.

>They've done quite a few.  I believe the original research into this
>technique was done at JPL.  I've seen _LA, the Movie_, _Mars, the Movie_
>and _Europa, the Movie_.  (I think Europa, it was one of the Jovian
>moons.)  It's quite breath taking to watch.  Try contacting the public
>affairs offices of NASA or JPL.  They may provide video tapes for educational
>use.  You can get an amazing amount of material either free or real
>cheap if you dig enough.

Yes, I mentioned this in a follow up post.  As I recall, it was not Europa,
but Miranda, a moon of Uranus.  Europa is one of the smoothest bodies is the
solar system, and, as such, doesn't make for very interesting terrain.

I also invited people to mail me if they want the adress to write to for NASA
videos.  I don't have the adress here, but I will have it tomorrow, and will
mail all those who ask for it then.

                Josh Hopkins
>-
>[e-mail]     Computers are like Old Testament gods;
>[e-mail]                      lots of rules and no mercy.
>#include <stddisclaimer.h>                                  Joseph Campbell
>                "Ooooohhhh we got movie sign!!" MST3K
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!utzoo!censor!comspec!becker!bdb
From: [e-mail] (Bruce Becker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.brother-jed,alt.desert-shield.erotica,alt.exploding.kibo,alt.fishing,alt.tasteless,alt.true.crime
Subject: boom
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 18:06:20 GMT
Organization: G. T. S., Toronto, Ontario
Lines: 33
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4603 alt.brother-jed:945 alt.exploding.kibo:80 alt.fishing:3725 alt.tasteless:7855


        DEAD HUNTERS GIVEN FINAL SHOTGUN BLAST
                   Associated Press


         DES MOINES, Iowa - The way Jay  Knudsen
      sees  it,  the ashes of dead hunters don't
      belong in urns  on  the  mantle.  So,  for
      about  the cost of a funeral and sometimes
      a lot less, he will take the ashes to  the
      sportsman's   favourite   marsh   or  bear
      country and blast them to smithereens.

         "We  can't  get  you  to  heaven,"   he
      advertises, "but we promise to land you in
      the happy hunting ground."

         A landscaper by trade, Mr. Knudsen  has
      an off-season service for the survivors of
      dedicated hunters.  He  loads  ashes  into
      shotgun  shells,  performs whatever ritual
      the family wishes and then blasts away.

         "This is not a morbid thing,  to  shoot
      ol' Joe down the barrel of a shotgun in an
      area he loved to hunt," Mr. Knudsen said.


--
  ,u,     Bruce Becker        Toronto, Ontario
a /i/     Internet: [e-mail], [e-mail]
 `\o\-e     UUCP: ...!lsuc!becker!bdb
 _< /_     "Ceci n'est pas un \"" - Rene "Day" Taxi # 12 & 35
Path: ns-mx!uunet!verifone.com!ed_l1
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 22:01:21 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]> <8ddhwp=[e-mail]>
Organization: VeriFone Inc., Honolulu HI
Lines: 28
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:20912 sci.space:26910 alt.paranormal:4461 alt.alien.visitors:4604

In article <8ddhwp=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
> In article <![e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>> And, of course, anyone dismissing Mr. Peck's work and/or his
>>credibility must also put forth a compelling argument to substantiate their
>>dismissal, otherwise their opinion carries no weight whatsoever.
>>
> Sorry, that's backwards. Anyone ACCEPTING Peck's conclusion must put forth
> a compelling reason why the "devil possession" hypothesis is correct,
> and modern science is wrong.
>
> The burden of proof ALWAYS lies on whoever makes extraordinary claims.

Oh?  Like your claim that he is wrong without any evidence to support
that contention?  That's pretty extraordinary.

Hmmm.  Sounds like personal opinion to me; carries only as much weight
as anyone else's personal opinion.

>
> --
>
>         Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]
>
>  Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

Not suprising....

However, a _real_ skeptic would withhold opinion without adequate evidence.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: California CE-3's
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 03:48:01 GMT
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 22

Yesterday I saw an ABC news report on an anonymous family in California who
claim that they're visited by aliens every night.  The aliens probe them
with beams of light, sometimes right through the ceiling of the house while
the family is awake.  They made drawings of the ships and they look fairly
complex, with rows of lights or jets on the bottom.  They also have
videotape of them, but the videotape just shows large, pale circular
lights.  As a telescope owner, I'm nearly certain it's way out of focus
(like part of the Scranton tape was) and possibly insufficiently bright as
well -- would someone please buy these guys a low-light camera and show
them how to use it?  Or a floodlight?  (The report even mentioned that
people claim the tape is a camera effect, though they didn't offer any
explanation of what lights were responsible for it.)  On the other hand,
the lights move independently of each other and change brightness.

The local news anchor mentioned the obvious question:  Why didn't the news
crew stick around until nighttime?

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!asuvax!anasaz!qip!billy
From: billy@anasaz (Bill Moore)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Where are th AZ/NM references?
Message-ID: <1992Feb21.182332.27345@anasaz>
Date: 21 Feb 92 18:23:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Anasazi, Inc.  Phoenix, Az
Lines: 17

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (jcj) writes:
->
->Awhile ago, somebody made a series of claims re: Apache attack 'copters,
->roadblocks, etc. involved in a "CEIII"-like series of events in Arizona or
->New Mexico.  He said he'd post specific references to local newspaper
->articles allegedly written about this.  Were they posted and I missed
->them?  Thanks.
->--
I'm the one who challenged this claim and to whom he promised to respond.
He has not.  Since I live in Arizona, read the "local" newspapers he refered
to and, despite my interest in UFOs, never noticed any such story, I doubt
he will.
-
--
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
     Bill Moore     [e-mail]    [phone]
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Path: ns-mx!uunet!hoptoad!chroma
From: [e-mail] (Steve Kudlak)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 13:43:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Mountain View Labs Genetic Engineering
Lines: 91

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Don Ecker) writes:
>>Asteroids can be fatal to radio careers to. It seems that former
>>science advisor to radio talk show host Chuck Harder, Richard
>>Hoagland, embarrassed Harder on the air, thereby severing his
>>weekly spot on Harders show. Harder had been speaking publicly on
>>his program about an alleged asteroid that had been, according to
>>what appeared to be a New York Times story from 1977 speeding its way to
>>Earth, making what the story claimed were course changes. The Times article
>>duly quoted purported scientists, and sounded very legit; it turned out that
>>when the New York Times Index was checked, along with microfiche copies from
>>that date and several days after, no such article could be found. It was
>>someone's very real looking fabrication.
>
>It wasn't an intentional hoax (except for the idiot who circulated it as
>real, whoever he was.)  It's page 101 of a fictional book titled "The
>Extraterrestrial Report", by Richard Siegel, John H. Butterfield, and
>Jean-Claude Suares, Copyright 1978, published by A&W Publishers, Inc., 95
>Madison Avenue, New York, New York 10016.  Library of Congress Catalog Card
>Number 77-91031, ISBN # 0-89104-093-5.  (Just in case anyone wants to
>check.)
>
>The book contains a number of fake government documents, fake magazine
>articles, and fake newspaper articles.  The government documents and
>magazine articles are obvious satire.  The fake New York Times articles
>don't have a satirical tone, unfortunately.  (Unless, considering the
>publication date, the name "Lucas Hamill" is a reference to the movie "Star
>Wars".)
>
>I've often wondered whether the book could have been the inspiration for
>a large part of the conspiracy scenario as we know it today.  It starts
>with a document found in the Truman Library in which Truman is worried
>about the aliens, then jumps to the present where a SETI team makes contact
>with aliens.  The Federal Agency for Interstellar Contact (FAIC,
>obviously) is formed to take control of the situation.  They announce
>that the signal was a hoax and force the shutdown of the SETI facility,
>while secretly continuing work on it themselves.  FAIC is a highly
>secretive group, even President Carter doesn't have a clue about it.
>Eventually the aliens, who are friendly, land and sign a treaty with us.
>We grant them the right to fly through our solar system, and in return they
>educate us about the universe.  They warn us about a parasitic race who are
>on their way to Earth with a large spaceship to destroy us.  Eventually
>astronomers detect this ship, which is covered up by claiming that it's an
>asteroid.  Then the race is on to figure out a way to stop it.
>
>--
> *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
> Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
> 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
> Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)


%This might not be the place for it, but WOWZERS! this would make a great
novel or sci-fi novel. I have read J.G. Ballard who supposedly has a great
ability to synthesize and produce something that contains an admixture of
stories with parts that sound like they have been extracted from Government
Documents written in that Government Document Style. I was never very
impressed by these things, perhaps it was becasue he kind of has a few too
many moral/philosophical axes to grind, and things seemed a little too
preachy in a sneaky way.

What I would be really interested in is a set of books that proport to
go on in this sort of style, with "fictional newspaper reports" and
"fictional government documents" and the like, or something that mixes
fact and fiction for some effect like UFO ideas. I am less interested
in the actual factual veracity of these materials, although some idea
of that would be nice, and more in the "romantic content" of them. That
is what they express about human emotions, desires and relations to
the concept of "alieness". Things thazt sound particualrly convincing
would be a good idea. I have read a lots of the "Commander X" type of
books about the proported underground tunnels, secret underground basis
etc. but they never seemed even emotionally convincing to me. There
were a few of the "alien breeding experiments" and "aliens created
humans beings from simian ancestors" that sounded at least emotionally
appealing and interesting.

The big thing for me is that over the years I have become much more
interested in what all this means emotionally and intellectually to
people and less interested in the hardcore "nuts and bolts" although
I really do think that many people including nuts-and-boltzers, sceptics,
mystics and others do bring interesting insights to the area, but
there does seem to be a dearth of "good written material" in my not
so humble opinion. So any helpful material would be much appreciated.


                Thanks,
                Sends Steve

[e-mail]

"Even Monkeys Fall From Trees"
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!news.cs.indiana.edu!lynx!carina.unm.edu!vjmurphy
From: [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: California CE-3's
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 19:05:55 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Lines: 36

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>Yesterday I saw an ABC news report on an anonymous family in California who
>claim that they're visited by aliens every night.  The aliens probe them
>with beams of light, sometimes right through the ceiling of the house while
>the family is awake.  They made drawings of the ships and they look fairly

   Couldn't be beams of light - ceilings tend to stop those.

>complex, with rows of lights or jets on the bottom.  They also have
>videotape of them, but the videotape just shows large, pale circular

   No surprise here.  You would think with all the camcorders out
 these days, one person would be able to actually film a UFO without
 focusing problems.  Bullshit about aliens affecting electronics is
 a cop-out.

>lights.  As a telescope owner, I'm nearly certain it's way out of focus
>(like part of the Scranton tape was) and possibly insufficiently bright as
>well -- would someone please buy these guys a low-light camera and show
>them how to use it?  Or a floodlight?  (The report even mentioned that
>people claim the tape is a camera effect, though they didn't offer any
>explanation of what lights were responsible for it.)  On the other hand,
>the lights move independently of each other and change brightness.
>
>The local news anchor mentioned the obvious question:  Why didn't the news
>crew stick around until nighttime?
>
   Because then the aliens would be scared away.  Yeah, right.



--
                   Phred Platypus [ [e-mail] ]
"Technology is a way of organizing    \
the universe so that man doesn't       \   The Grammarian of Vengeance
have to experience it."   -- Max Frisch \
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!wupost!darwin.sura.net!Sirius.dfn.de!zrz.tu-berlin.de!math.fu-berlin.de!news.netmbx.de!unido!mcsun!uknet!pyrltd!lucifer!mikeb
From: [e-mail] (Mike Brady)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Feb 92 17:00:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Distribution: eunet
Organization: Lucas Powertrain Systems, Electronic Control Group, UK
Lines: 20
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4609 sci.space:26928 sci.skeptic:20918 alt.paranormal:4465


I remember reading of the first picture ever sent back by
Viking.  As the picture materialised on the screen those at
mission control were amazed to see a perfect letter 'E' on the
top corner.  Feeling slightly foolish they waited expectantly
for the rest of the message to appear.  It didn't.  It was just
a freak of nature.

Or was it?

Mike.

(source: i think it was Michener's faction novel 'Space')


///////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
//// It was me, not the company, although I was there.\\\\
//     I may be a germ up God's nose having the most    \\
//// unusual dream or else ... shshsh ... WOW ... it's real !!
///////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watdragon!watyew!jdnicoll
From: [e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 01:47:02 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: University of Waterloo
Lines: 25

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>
>>    What is Earth's radio noise output like these days? Assuming no
>>attempt on our part to be noticed by hypothetical ETIs, would it be
>>obvious to the ETIs why the sun (or a close companion to it) appeared
>>to be a major radio source?
>
>    UM --- that's one of the better suggestions.  You could get
>several things from this: the distance from the Earth to the Sun,
>as well as the rotation and revolution periods of the Earth as well...
>I don't know how many Janskys the Earth puts out, offhand.
>
>    The big problem here is of course where to look...  Even FM
>is a pretty large bandwidth to sample, and there isn't and logical reason
>for ETs to start looking there (that I know of).
>

    A hstory question here: anyone know how much of the way we use
radio (in terms of radio vs TV broadcasts, etc) is forced on us by
physics and how much was a 'fluke' product of early decisions in the
field (Like, for example, early radio stations using a range of frequencies,
forcing later EMR  communications to use other frequencies)?

                            James Nicoll
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!news.bbn.com!hsdndev!husc-news.harvard.edu!husc8.harvard.edu!mcirvin
From: [e-mail] (Mcirvin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new id
Summary: Accidental cross-postings
Keywords: Pointless cross-postings
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 03:10:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Harvard University Science Center
Lines: 21
Nntp-Posting-Host: husc8.harvard.edu

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Larry N. Osborne) writes:
>
>The article to which I'm following up, for example, was posted to:
>sci.skeptic, sci.physics, alt.sci.physics.new-theories,
>alt.paranormal, alt.alien.visitors, and sci.energy.  You may as well
>try giving a wine tasting for an AA group(1) ... its impolite and only
>causes ill-feelings.  (Although alt.sci.physics.new-theories is
>probably the exception, there seem to be a majority of rational and
>polite scientists there.)

The cross-posting to this group was an accident-- I neglected to
fully monitor the Newsgroups: line in the post in sci.physics to
which I was following up.  I'm sorry if this caused any hard feelings;
I didn't post that just to bait alt.alien.visitors et al. readers, but to
explain an attitude existing in sci.physics (which is the reason for
the references to a sci.physics regular).

Again, I apologize for the posting and shall try to be more vigilant
in the future (this message is not being crossposted).

Matt McIrvin
Path: ns-mx!uunet!jwt!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Stollman)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 02:10:44 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Waffle login)
Organization: The Matrix
Lines: 40

[e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:

> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
> >
> >      These things have taken over all the hospitals and so forth
> > in LA, and the phone systems around the country.  They have a base
> > somewhere where they are holding the REAL people they have cloned.
> > If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
> > stand up and be counted as human beings, not some kind of play-
> > things.  This is Gary Stollman, signing off from LA, California,
> > USA.
>
>
> Hi Gary,
>
> I watch CNN alot...alot...alot..."`)twassle ummph, and I haven't
> noticed anything unusual. What is it we should look for?
>
> barry--

************
Well, when -I- watch it, and then suddenly switch to CNN headline news,
they have switched it to the SAME story I was just watching...Please
note, this has nothing to do with anyone except ME...The same thing goes
(or went) for the local affiliates here in LA...My mom was replaced by
respectively, Jesus, an alien clone created by the CIA, and several other
beings trying to destroy my credibility but basically my family...I am
not joking around about all this...I am QUITE sane, although I have been
forced illegally into mental hospitals around the country over the past
10 years...I have the proof...Pretty soon these things are gonna really
regret having screwed around with MY family!!

One of the proof consists of documents on which not only MY signature was
forged to obtain my medical records, but that of my case manager as
well...HIS CLONE signed the document, and you can clearly see the
difference in the signatures...I have had to wait years to get the proof,
but they are all gonna pay dearly...That is, if God doesn't get them
first!!!

        Gary
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!psuvax1!hsdndev!husc-news.harvard.edu!husc8.harvard.edu!mcirvin
From: [e-mail] (Mcirvin)
Newsgroups: alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas
Summary: The cross-posting was an accident.  I'm sorry.
Keywords: Pointless cross-postings
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 03:38:35 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Harvard University Science Center
Lines: 33
Xref: ns-mx alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1036 alt.paranormal:4466 alt.alien.visitors:4613
Nntp-Posting-Host: husc8.harvard.edu

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Larry N. Osborne) writes:
>
>There are also those who _enjoy_ irritating people who don't have the
>same frame of reference.  It seems to me that posting OOBEs to
>sci.skeptic is asking for a bashing, similarly the skeptics who
>monitor alt.alien.visitors in order to point and laugh are morally
>repugnant. [...]

>
>The article to which I'm following up, for example, was posted to:
>sci.skeptic, sci.physics, alt.sci.physics.new-theories,
>alt.paranormal, alt.alien.visitors, and sci.energy.  You may as well
>try giving a wine tasting for an AA group(1) ... its impolite and only
>causes ill-feelings.  (Although alt.sci.physics.new-theories is
>probably the exception, there seem to be a majority of rational and
>polite scientists there.)

The cross-posting to which you refer was an accident; I was following
up to an article posted in sci.physics and many other places, and
neglected to edit the Newsgroups: line.  Of the places where it
was posted, the two really inappropriate ones are alt.paranormal
and alt.alien.visitors;  I have already posted an apology in the
latter but seem to be having trouble posting to the former.

I assure you that the intention was not to bait anybody.  I was
trying to answer a question in sci.physics about what the questioner
thought was an intolerant attitude on the part of scientists, and
if I used fighting words, I'm sorry about that too.  .net.impoliteness
displeases me as much as it does you.

Again, I apologize for the mistake.

Matt McIrvin
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From: [e-mail] (Carl J Lydick)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 04:41:22 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Mike Brady) writes:
>
>I remember reading of the first picture ever sent back by
>Viking.  As the picture materialised on the screen those at
>mission control were amazed to see a perfect letter 'E' on the
>top corner.  Feeling slightly foolish they waited expectantly
>for the rest of the message to appear.  It didn't.  It was just
>a freak of nature.

Even more interesting is the fact that in the first picture sent back by the
Viking lander, the Martian sky was BLUE.  Later, the folks as JPL recalibrated
the sensing instruments.  It still seems like quite a cooincidence to me that
the "miscalibration" resulted in something with a color scheme
indistinguishable from parts of Arizona.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl J Lydick | INTERnet: [e-mail] | NSI/HEPnet: SOL1::CARL

Disclaimer:  Hey, I understand VAXes and VMS.  That's what I get paid for.  My
understanding of astronomy is purely at the amateur level (or below).  So
unless what I'm saying is directly related to VAX/VMS, don't hold me or my
organization responsible for it.  If it IS related to VAX/VMS, you can try to
hold me responsible for it, but my organization had nothing to do with it.
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From: [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 06:16:56 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>[e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:
>
>************
>Well, when -I- watch it, and then suddenly switch to CNN headline news,
>they have switched it to the SAME story I was just watching...Please
>note, this has nothing to do with anyone except ME...The same thing goes
>(or went) for the local affiliates here in LA...My mom was replaced by
>respectively, Jesus, an alien clone created by the CIA, and several other
>beings trying to destroy my credibility but basically my family...I am

    Your mom was replaced by Jesus?  Did you notice the sex change
 immediately?  An alien clone created by the CIA?  Which is it:
 alien or American Made?

>not joking around about all this...I am QUITE sane, although I have been
>forced illegally into mental hospitals around the country over the past
>10 years...I have the proof...Pretty soon these things are gonna really
>regret having screwed around with MY family!!

    Ooooohh.

>
>One of the proof consists of documents on which not only MY signature was
>forged to obtain my medical records, but that of my case manager as
>well...HIS CLONE signed the document, and you can clearly see the
>difference in the signatures...I have had to wait years to get the proof,

     If it really WAS a clone, his handwriting would be the same.  I
 think you probably mean "doppleganger."


>but they are all gonna pay dearly...That is, if God doesn't get them
>first!!!
>

    But wasn't your mom replaced by Jesus?  If so, then God is
 probably in on this too.  Looks like you'll have to take Him out
 as well.


--
"You ask me if sex is one of the most   \\    //     Phred Platypus
  important things in life?  Absolutely. \\  //  Grammarian of Vengeance
  But the lack of it is even likelier     \\// [ [e-mail] ]
  to drive you nuts."  -- Harlan Ellison   \/       Vincent J. Murphy
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From: [e-mail] (Donald Yett)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 08:36:59 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
>>[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
>>
>>>    What is Earth's radio noise output like these days? Assuming no
>>>attempt on our part to be noticed by hypothetical ETIs, would it be
>>>obvious to the ETIs why the sun (or a close companion to it) appeared
>>>to be a major radio source?
>>
>>
>>    The big problem here is of course where to look...  Even FM
>>is a pretty large bandwidth to sample, and there isn't and logical reason
>>for ETs to start looking there (that I know of).
>>

Why wouldn't it be logical to look in those frequency ranges?  Let's see now, in radio astronomy, it is well known that
planets such as Jupiter have emissions in the 10M band...  Inquriring minds would only have to look approximately 30MHz
above that in order to find the beginning of the low VHF television band..  Any 'ET' supposedly looking for other life
would no doubt be doing a broad-band spectrum analysis of surrounding regions just to plot anything out of the ordinary.

Why search in the lower frequency ranges?  Well, let's just say that it would be the lowest common denominator.  Most
early technological societies would have to start in those frequency ranges, because the technology needed to transmit
in that frequency range is minimal.  In the under-200MHz range we are already visible to all stars within say a 75 year
radius.  Narrow the range to approxamitly 40 years, and we probably are brighter than the Sun in the under 20GHz range.

If I was an ET astronomer, I would be highly interested in why within roughy 75 years, there has appeared with growing
intensity a radio source out of seemingly nowhere that at this point outshines it's star over a broad range of frequencies
under 20GHz.  Many of the frequencies being pulsed at precise very fast intervals at very high power, and others with
evidence of many types of modulation.

If they have skeptics there, no doubt some would be coming up with possibilities of a compact star, or be saying that
it is just noise.  But further analysis would no doubt show that the patterns are chaotic indeed, but still follow a
fairly predictable non-random pattern.  If they have recievers sensitive enough, they may be able to decode some of
our modulation after zeroing in on some of the stronger non-pulsed [non-radar] information carrying frequencies.

But then, you may be right...  It may just be illogical that they would be looking at all, no doubt their leadership may
be just as thick-skinned as our world's, and they will be discussing philosophy and politics instead of providing the
money [or whatever they may use] to actually do something beyond talk.

I just had another thought along those lines, maybe this is the reason our governments don't want to fund SETI like
projects: 'If we are so conspicous, they'll come to us' [Hell of a pompous attitude to take, eh?].

Isn't it amazing that UFO sightings really started [in the UFO sense] in the mid to late '40's?  Roughly 20 to 30
years after most of the ground-breaking research into higher frequencies in radio.  And has increased stedily since
in every culture, in every corner of the globe.  If a SETI-like project were to become reality [highly unlikely], they
should concentrate primarily within a 40 year radius in order to find anything, and to look for earth-like transmissions
and modulation, as if they have recieved our communications, and also decoded our modulation methods, would it not also
be likely that they would attempt to resond in like fashion?  Even if they do not understand our languages, would it not
be strange to hear a 20 to 40 year old radio broadcast or see a TV broadcast from that time frame coming from an amplified
source in the vicinity of another star?  It would effectively get the point across that the message was recieved, eh?  Of
course such a broadcast would have to be sustained until contact was made [after all we might not be looking in the right
direction for some time], but it would probably be justified on the part of the ETs, how often do you find out that you are
not alone in the universe?  Wouldn't we do the same?

Enough said, I'll await your cheers [and jeers] for this little speech!

--
+-------------------------+----------------------------------------------------
| [e-mail]  | I will not be pushed, stamped, filed, indexed,
|   Just my opinions!     | briefed, debriefed, or numbered! - #6, The Prisoner
+-------------------------+----------------------------------------------------
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Cry of the Phar Right -- Part 21/60
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 17:34:00 GMT
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In a message to All <11 Feb 92 19:03> Andrew Ormsby wrote:

 AO> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail]
 AO> (Don Allen) writes:

 AO>   "There  does  exist  an  international  Anglophile  network which
 AO>                                           ^^^^^^^^^^
 AO>   operates, to some extent, in the way the Radical  Right  believes
 AO>   the Communists act.  In fact, this network, which we may identify
 AO>   as  the  Round  Table Groups, has no aversion to cooperating with
 AO>   the Communists--and frequently does so."

 AO> According to my dictionary, an Anglophile is someone with excessive
 AO> admiration of English customs. Does this mean an end to tea drinking
 AO> as we know it?

Please don't despair, Andrew.  The Right-Wing International Anglophile conspiracy may yet prevail!  Of course, this victory would lead inevitably to forced tea-drinking, caning, Pedophilia, and BBC-1 write-ins among the educated classes.

Personally I approve of this, because I'm not averse to a nice bit of crumpet from time to time myself.  :-)

Also, before we condemn the Right-Wing International Anglo-pedophile plot, we should ask ourselves honestly if we are *really* prepared for the alternative.  Without order, decorum and caning, the world would be reduced to a giant Monty Python Cheese Shop sketch.  Besides which, we would be forced to stop using Third-World babies to make the upholstery for our Jags.  It would be an environment too alien and ungratifying to bear.

 AO> Is it possible to summarise this "Cry of the Pheonix" thread? I've
 AO> only glanced at a small part of it. Seems pretty incoherent to me.

Incoherent?  REALLY??

 AO> What is it all about?  Something to do with JFK?  Or Japanese food?

Well, according to the alien master Hatoon (or Cartoon or Poltroon or something), William Milton Cooper of California killed JFK with some blowfish sushi.  Then Governor Connally covered up the crime by shooting JFK, himself, and Lee Harvey Oswald...

I know it's confusing.

Cheers,
  R. Clark Matthews


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Book: Cry of The Phoenix - Whut to do?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 17:14:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
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In a message to All <11 Feb 92 19:01> Don Allen wrote:

 DA> I make no claims of the material and as such it is presented to you
 DA> to do with as you see fit.

Hi Don.  This Hatonn stuff you posted is electronic.

I'm not complaining, but I have to print it out before I can put it in my birdcage.  I have found this to be time-consuming, but well worth the effort.

Thank you for sharing that with us!  :-)

Best,
  Clark

PS -- After studying W.M. Cooper's claims re: the Kennedy's driver, I have come to a startling conclusion:  COOPER killed JFK!  U heard it here first.





--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Do Not Accept Cthulhu Cheques!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 17:27:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
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In a message to All <11 Feb 92 19:02> [e-mail] wrote:

 jo>  I told him latest news from this dimension and prepared some coffee.
 jo>  Then he gave me a pouch containing some Cthulhumoney. After this
 jo>  my bed got a brand new place and Cthulhu got his dimensional link
 jo>  to work again.

Hello, Johan!

Congratulations on your Cthulhumoney!  But be warned:  Do not accept Cthulhucheques!

Best,
  Clark


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Grey Aliens Sighted .... Again
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 18:01:00 GMT
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In a message to Jerry Michael Grimm <12 Feb 92 09:11> Michael Corbin wrote:

 MC> The bottom line is that Bill Cooper just doesn't
 MC> hold water,

Hi Mike.  Sounds like Mr. Cooper has prostate trouble to me.  Combined with his Dementia Praecox, it's a terrible tragedy.

Of course, he's had a full life and he got away with killing JFK, so he can't complain.

 MC> so anything he says should be taken with a large
 MC> block of salt and tongue planted firmly in cheek.

Or alternatively, anything he says is a large block of something else.

Cheerio,
  Clark



--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
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INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!apple!amdcad!netcomsv!mork!payner
From: [e-mail] (Rich Payne)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 04:02:43 GMT
References: <7=gh#f=[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: na
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In article <7=gh#f=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>>
>>>In article <=fdhm8=[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes...
>>>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>>>>>>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer) writes...
>>
>>>>>Absolutely, and there is a large percentage of unknowns remaining.
>>>>
>>>>Curiously, when many people _say_ UFO, they mean _alien spacecraft_.
>>>>So what they are talking about is not an unknown deserving of study,
>>>>but those darn aliens.
>>
>>>Ah, but who cares?  If you read my previous posts, you won't find _me_
>>>attributing UFO's to "alien spacecraft".  I've been arguing about the
>>>phenomenon.  Once again, someone else (you, this time) is forcing the
>>>"alien" issue.
>>
>>>Why?
>>
>>I'm not forcing this or any other issue. This -->is<-- alt.alien.visitors,
>>and if you have followed the other threads, you will know about the planet
>>ummo, the greys, several conspiracies, etc...  And they do belong here.
>>How is it that you can act as they are not part of the phenomena? Any
>>study which ignores part of the data cannot be considered unbiased.
>
>First, I realize this is alt.alien.visitors.  However, the original thread
>started with someone (Don Allen I think) posting some statistics concerning
>the percentage of astronomers that thought the UFO phenomenon should
>receive further scientific study.  There was _no_, 0, nadda mention of
>"aliens" in that post.
>
>The fact that Don posted here may _imply_ that aliens should be attributed,
>but the content of the post shows otherwise.

It's not that it was or was not mentioned before. I brought it up because
is is an aspect of the phenomena. Are you advocating study of the phenomena,
selected parts of the phenomena, or something else that I am missing
completely?

>Granted, maybe we should take this to sci.skeptic, and if you desire this,
>I'll start adding it to the newsgroups: line, but I suspect that if we
>do, those folks will tell us that it belongs in alt.alien.visitors, since
>the armchair skeptic is the one that _usually_ makes the attribution when
>the debate becomes difficult for them to handle.

I see no real point in moving. As you say, it belongs here as much as there.

>>>>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth
>>>>>>>about this phenomenon need apply.
>>>>
>>>>Need there be a single TRVTH? Or even just one phenomenon? I thought
>>>>we were dealing with an unknown? Hopefully I have guessed correctly
>>>>who originally said this.
>>
>>>Absolutely.  Show me where I have insisted that there is _one_ truth to
>>>be found here.
>>
>>I see above  ">>>>>Only those who are interested in establishing the truth".
>>And I checked, these were your words. Are you saying the "the truth"
>>is non-singular?
>
>No, _you_ implied this.

This seems to be dodging the issue. I quoted your words, and you respond that
it was only what I had implied. And this issue seems irrelevant anyway. Hows
about either you just clairiy whatever it is you mean, or we drop this?

>>
>>>>>My statement about "truth" stands.
>>
>>>>
>>>>I tend to think that there is no truth, just different points of
>>>>view.
>>
>>>No offense, but doesn't this statement strike you as rather "unscientific"?
>>
>>Scientific investigation is good for exploring objective reality. But
>>"truth" is not an objective reality. I would say that any study
>>go find some objective "truth" would absolutely not be a scientific
>>investigation.
>
>Ok.  You have your own definition of "truth".  That's fine, as long as we
>both know this.
>
>My definition of "truth" is a simple one.  A "fact" is a "truth".  Something
>that is a part of objective reality is a "truth".
>
>Let's stop playing with words and address the issue, ok?

As above, lets do. But I would like to point out that one can tell the exact
truth, and be 100% wrong. But I would prefer that we refer to "scientific
truths" as established facts or something similiar.

>>>>>>
>>>>>>Simple question:  You want repeatability.  Show me how you can, in a
>>>>>laboratory environment, _predict_ exactly which atom will divide in
>>>>>a nuclear fission reaction.  Show me a real, honest to goodness
>>>>>black hole.
>>>>
>>>>This seems to be a straw-man argument. The truth or falsity of the
>>>>above has no bearing upon the value of studying the "UFO phenomenon".
>>>>Nevertheless, fission, while not predictable, is quite repeatable,
>>>>and the rate can be measured. Now if only UFO observations were as
>>>>repeatable, this thread would never have existed. And there is
>>>>a pretty good theoretical basis behind black holes. What theory
>>>>perdicts UFO`s?
>>
>>>>What theory predicts that atom 1E37 will divide?  Look, the point I'm
>>>>trying to make is that we keep hearing that the UFO phenomenon is not
>>>>repeatable in a laboratory.  Of course it isn't.  But neither are other
>>>>things which we _accept_ in science as valid.  I have yet to see the
>>>>difference.
>>
>>>Most importantly, much of science does NOT begin in the laboratory in
>>>a repeatable setting.  It begins with _something_ that raises questions.

True.

>>>If that "something" has raised a question, then the next step is to
>>>decide whether we can _try_ to answer it.  That is where the current
>>>state of the study of the UFO phenomenon rests.  It has never gone
>>>beyond this.
>>
>>>For one to cry that there is no "repeatable" evidence of the phenomenon
>>>is to deny the birth of other scientific advances.  Many of those did
>>>not start in a laboratory.  They started with _observation_, something
>>>that should be a holy word to science.
>>
>>The key here is that repeatable phenomena _can_ be investigated. If
>>we had only reports of uranium atome splitting, and from at best
>>questionable sources, would we be talking about fission today?
>
>And are all (in fact most) _sources_ of sighting reports "questionable"?

How many UFO photo's have turned up being faked? It was once a quick was to
get publicity. This is a fact easily established by a trip to the library.
Do you say this is not true?

>What are you implying?

Nothing, I'll say it clearly. There has been much fakery, fraud, lying,
deliberatly falsified evidence, and involvement by para-normal/newage
<beyond> science persons in the UFO phenomena. Even without the governments
involvement, this would make a UFO study a questional endeavor for anyone
seeking a career in science.

BTW, those who have read the Conden<sp?> report claim that the text of the
study is at odds with the conclusion, which is what most people read. One
of these days I hope to find time to read this.

>>>Fission, as a phenomenon, is deliberately repeatable.  I agree.
>>
>>>However, there was a time when it was _not_.  It was only a "theory".
>>
>>As I recall, atoms at the time were considered unsplitable. Theory
>>denied that atome could split. Only after it was undisputably
>>observed was the phenomenon given proper study, and the nuclear
>>sciences were born.
>
>Again, I think we need to agree on a definition of "undisputably
>observed".  You seem to keep avoiding my insistance that I have been
>talking about the ufo _phenomenon_.  Not a singular report of a strange
>object seen in the sky by Bayou Bill.

My point is that a phenonema cannot be observed, only events. In this
case the events that make up the phenomena have proved difficult to
observe. Any study of the phenomena would seem to _require_ better
observations as a bare minimum. Or perhaps the 'men in black' will
prevent any such observations?? :^)  Are they not part of the phenomena
as well?

>I think UFO's have been "undisputably observed".  If not, tell me why

Agreed, but the key here is the U --> unidentified.

>you disagree and what would change your mind.  Remember that I am
>referring to what I consider the undeniable existance of the _phenomenon_,
>NOT a particular object.

Are you referring to the UFO's, or to the observations of UFO's as the
phenomena, or both?

>>>How did we achieve repeatability?  By studying the processes that we
>>>thought should lead to it.  Call it a bit of forensic science if you
>>>will.  In any case, we _believed_ (for the most part) that we should
>>>be able to actually split something we could not see and still haven't.
>>
>>Did we achieve repeatability? Is this not intrinsic to either
>>the phenomenon or to our methods of observation?
>
>Yes.  At the macro level, that is true.
>
>Suppose you really wanted to study the ufo phenomenon.  How would _you_
>propose achieving repeatability of a phenomenon that exists but is
>"transient" in nature?

I have no good ideas on how to study the phenomena. The obvious approach
would be to record all sitings, and look at an area showing the highest
frequency of observations. This may or may not bear fruit.

>>>At the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I'll go one step further and
>>>say that fission is NOT repeatable and NOT predictable for any particular
>>>single atom.  There is a probability that atom #1E37 _may_ divide.
>>
>>This is solidly accepted as scientific fact. But still the rate of
>>decay can easily be measured, and hence we have half-lives. What is
>>the half-life of a phenomenon? Or a UFO? And how would you measure
>>this?
>
>Does it matter?  What is the "half-life" of the violent crime phenomenon?
>
>What is the "half-life" of the ball-lightning phenomenon?
>
>What is the "half-life" of the earthquake "phenomenon"?
>
>How would you measure these?

The point was that we have a measure, in this case half-life. It is appropriate
for radioactive decay, and a few other models as far as I know, and none of
them are mentioned in your list. A better question would seem to be, by what
metric do we measure the phenomena, or aspects of the phenomena. If you cannot
answer this, the best you can do would be to mindlessly gather all data
possible in the hopes of distilling some key relationships. When I first got
Appleworks in 1985(?) my first project was to enter all the data from the
bermuda triangle books to see what I could find. The one clear relationship
was that the highest number of reported missing ships were in December and
June (if I remember correctly). Winter storms and summer tropical storms and
squalls would explain almost everything. There was a low noise level for the
rest of the months. And if you have two hypothesis that explain an observation
equally well, the rule is that the simplest is preferred.

>The point I'm making is that not all "phenomena" are predictable,
>reproducible on demand, and directly measurable.  Some of these are
>readily accepted by science as valid, even though science can't
>really practice what it preaches when faced with them.

And in all these there is some key metric that characterizes the phenomena.

>>
>>>>>
>>>>>In like manner, I and others claim that the UFO _phenomenon_ is real.
>>>
>>
>>>>No argument, but where do we go from here? This alone is not
>>>>sufficient.
>>
>>>You and I agree on this.  The answer seems obvious to me.  You don't
>>>argue that the _phenomenon_ is real (as I stated above).  So, if this
>>>"alone is not sufficient", we do what science dictates that we do.
>>
>>I guess that I was unclear. I agree that the phenomena exists.
>>That was what was meant by "No argument."
>>
>>>We study it further.
>>
>>It does not neccesarily follow that the existance of a phenomena
>>makes it worthwhile to study. It may or may not be. But there are
>>an infinite number of things to study (OK, a very large number),
>>and neither you nor I nor anyone has time or resources to study
>>them all. So we go with out strengths.
>
>I agree.  So, if one chooses to "study" the phenomenon _scientifically_,
>why the stigma on those who actually attempt this?

See above, but this is still something that must be dealt with.

>Who decides what is "worthy"?  The government?  You?  Me?  The rest of
>"science"?
>
>If we are asking for money to study, then it makes sense that the
>moneygiver makes the decision (either directly or indirectly).
>
>But that says absolutely nothing about how "worthy" something is of
>scientific study.  It is, in a sense, a straw man.

I would say that the word "worthy" requires a value judgement. So
there would seem to be no absolute worthyness. Just many personal value
judgements.

>If we are arguing the merits of studying one phenomenon over another,
>based on available funding, then we are discussing...well...the topic
>of funding.

If a serius study is to be done, it will have to be funded somehow.

>However, that was not and is not why this thread on astronomers and
>ufos began.

Threads drift, and this is neither right or wrong. But to ignore what
others say while complaining that others are not responding to what
you said (and this happens all too often) is not the basis of a
reasonable discussion. I was generalizing here, please do not read the
"you" above as referring to yourself. But specifically, you have done
some of this.

>>
>>>>
>>>>>Evidence for the _phenomenon_ exists.  Evidence for a particular "UFO"
>>>>>(whatever that may be) does not.
>>>>
>>>>A flying saucer might be studied. How does one study a phenomenon?
>>
>>>Ask a psychologist.
>>
>>Then who are we discussion UFO's as a subject for scientific
>>investigation?
>
>Can you ask this again?  I don't understand the above (it's garbled).
>
>Sorry.

Is the UFO phenomena a phenomena requiring scientific study, or psychological
study?

>>>>
>>>>>Now, let me rephrase the above....
>>>>>
>>>>>"Evidence for the phenomenon of nuclear fission exists.  Evidence that
>>>>>atom #1E37 is going to split does not.
>>>>>
>>>>>Do you see my point?
>>>>
>>>>I see your point. But things with boring repeatability have never
>>>>been that difficult to study.
>>
>>>I would venture to say that the reporting of UFO sightings occurs quite
>>>often worldwide.  Can we demand that a UFO appear?  No.  Therefore, it is
>>>not repeatable on demand.  So what?  That doesn't change the fact that
>>>thousands of reports occur annually.
>>
>>So what? Let's not confuse "repeatable on demand" with completely
>>random in place and time. If only the place were repeatable, then
>>one might set up some sort of automated equipment to look for
>>EM bursts, changes in the magnetic field, etc...  But it is difficult
>>to monitor the entire world at all times.
>
>Well, we do that with meteorologically satellites all the time :-).
>We do it with geological instruments all the time.

Then why is there no evidence for the phenomena from these sources?
This is data.

>In certain "flaps" of sightings, it is done.  But, it is _still_ not
>seriously considered or studied by mainstream science.
>
>The opportunity has shown itself numerous times, but...no bites.
>
>And, when someone within the Ufology community (and I refer to the
>serious investigators, not the channeling space brother folks),
>that too is conveniently ignored because armchair sceptics have already
>made up their minds.

What have the serious investigators done? What has been ignored?

>There is a wealth of data gathered via investigation by serious
>investigators, that is just _waiting_ to be chewed upon (and perhaps
>spit out) by mainstream science, but it doesn't even bite.

And where is this data kept? Statistical investigation could be done
by anyone with a background easily attained at city college at night.
And the number crunching is easily done by a PC with a stat package.
It does not require a multimillion-dollar investigation if there is
good data already available. If they have useful data and cannot figure
out what to do with it, "serious inverstgator" seems a bit strong to me.

>>>>>
>>>>>Justifiability is a purely subjective thing in the sciences (usually).
>>>>>It's a straw man. If you're fighting for money, it matters.  If you're
>>>>>in pursuit of _answers_ to unanswered questions, it's meaningless.
>>>>
>>>>I think that the requirements to eat and pay the rent might
>>>>just possibly make it into the objective category. Unless you
>>>>make a living doing something else, and study the phenomenon on
>>>>your own.
>>
>>>No.  That makes it especially subjective.
>>
>>I would say that requirements for food, shelter, and clothing are
>>objective. To each their own I guess.
>>
>
>In a collective sense, I could stretch the word "objective" to make it
>fit.
>
>In any case, these are givens.  The "worthiness" of getting answers to
>unanswered questions is still purely subjective.

Agreed, and this is a problem, not an asset.

>>>>>Such as?  You imply that there is no scientific method in the study of
>>>>>the UFO phenomenon.  That is blatantly false.  Would you care to provide
>>>>>evidence of this?
>>>>
>>>>It is not possible to _prove_ that a thing does not exist.
>>>>Rather, the problem here is defining just what the phenomenon
>>>>is. Right now all we have is the 'phenomenon' label, and claims
>>>>of alien spacecraft. Would you care to try to get funding
>>>>based upon this?
>>
>>>I'm not asking for that.  I simply meant that if you _are_ implying that
>>>those who _do_ seriously study the subject (few as they may be) are not
>>>doing so in a scientific manner, then you evidently have evidence of some
>>>sort to lead you to make such an assertion.
>>
>>Did I say that ">those who _do_ seriously study the subject" do so
>>unscientifically? I don't see it in rereading. And therefore I do
>>not seem to have made any assertions. You, above, do say that
>>there is valid scientific investigation going on. Would you be so
>>kind as to elucidate?
>
>Hmmm.  I should point out that _you_ used the word "valid" above.

I did, it would save much time if we would get to the point rather that
bickering about who said what. Are the investigation you refer to valid
(in a scientific sense) or not?

>The most obvious investigation that comes to mind is that of
>Trans en Province.  That was an actual _trace_ case.  Sorry, but there
>were not pieces of unidentified craft.  There _was_ true scientific
>analysis of soil and botanic traces, but three different laboratories.
>
>If you really want the poop, I'll get the references next week since
>they're at work.

Not right now, midterms you know (or do now). Perhaps you could mail them
and I could get to them when time allows.

>In a nutshell, an unusual object was observed to have hit or skimmed
>the ground, only to take off again shortly after.
>
>The traces left were unexplainable characteristic changes to the soil
>in the immediate vicinity of the object, and unusual changes to surrounding
>plantlife.
>
>Soil samples were submitted to 3 (if I recall) laboratories, went through
>various tests, and all three reports were in agreement.

What did they agree on?

>>
>>>As for defining the phenomenon...well...I don't see that as a problem.
>>
>>Once again, we have a label : UFO. This is just a bit short of
>>defining the phenomenon for my taste. Would you care to spell out
>>what you mean by the "phenomenon" for me?
>
>Apparently we both misunderstand each other.
>
>When talking about the UFO phenomenon, I see two distinct categories
>ripe for study.
>
>a.) A particular sighting, case, whatever you wish to consider.  This
>    is the most difficult (IMO) to study, since it is by definition
>    a transient phenomenon.
>
>b.) The phenomenon.  Even this may be subdivided into categories, such
>    as the abduction phenomenon, which is slowly but surely beginning
>    to be studied by real scientists and some respected scientists in the
>    field of psychology.
>
>    In any case, when I refer to the study of the _phenomenon_, I am
>    referring to the fact that _something_ is going on.  It simply
>    hasn't been explained.

Better, but "something unexplained" is very vague. Guarenteed to generate
misunderstandings. Perhaps it would help to summarize the aspects of the
phenomena. This would clairfy what is being discussed and what is not.

>>>The phenomenon _is_.  If one weighs most if not all of the anecdotal and
>>>physical trace evidence, it's clear that there is no single _cause_ of
>>>the phenomenon.  In fact, the phenomenon may be divided into categories.
>>
>>>And yes, I _did_ say "physical trace evidence".
>>
>>>I'll be happy to explain if you wish, but let's assume that I'm right.
>>
>>>What's the difference between this "trace" evidence and say, trace evidence
>>>that the element Lead was once unstable?  We can't repeat that can we?
>>
>>I still do not think that atomic decay is a proper parallel to the
>>UFO phenomenon.
>
>I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

Then perhaps it would be best to choose another parallel, or an analogy
that can be agreed upon. Even better, drop them all and deal with the
topic itself.

>While atomic decay is repeatable and predictable on the macro scale,
>you cannot make a particular atom split.
>
>The UFO phenomenon exists.  It is not repeatable _on demand_.  It is
>repeatable in the sense that it continues.  It is not predictable
>on a macro scale, but is somewhat predictable on the "regional" scale
>(ie flaps usually occur over an extended period in a particular area).
>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>The possibility for _science_ has existed for some time.  Unfortunately,
>>>>>it has never been seriously pursued by the mainstream, primarily because
>>>>>of the false and unfortunate _stigma_ attached to the subject.  What I
>>>>>find ironic is that many scientists who find any suggestion that the
>>>>>_phenomenon_ should be studied laughable have no problem with current
>>>>>SETI research.  That is absurd.
>>>>
>>>>While I think the chances of SETI working are so slim as to
>>>>make it a wasted effort, how does one compare SETI to a conspiricy
>>>>theory, and find an absurdity.
>>
>>>"Conspiracy"?  What are you talking about?  Did I miss something?
>>
>>Keep reading alt.aliens.visitors, if you have not seem any conspiracy
>>theories, you will. Many posts are cross-posted to alt.conspiracy.
>
>But that's my point.  What does any conspiracies have to do with this
>discussion?  I haven't implied any, have I?

I think that they are _part_ of the phenomena.

>>>>Also you claim we have a UFO
>>>>'phenomenon', not alien intelligence, how do you reconcile that
>>>>with the clear implication that UFO are extraterrestial
>>>>intelligences above?
>>
>>>No, no, NO!  I am not equating the two.  I'm pointing out that "science"
>>>is perfectly happy to look for something it has 0 evidence for (unless you
>>
>>But they are lookin for something they can detect using well known
>>tools and techniques. And in places where they might expect to find
>>life.
>
>You mean like eyes to look at instruments?  Minds to form hypothesis?
>
>The truth is, in SETI, they really don't _know_ what to look for.  They
>_assume_ that communication is most likely to occur at certain "magic"
>frequencies.
>
>They are looking for something they can detect, as you said.  But
>_why_ are they looking _where_ they're looking?
>
>Look, it is very common for people to attribute UFO's to ETI.
>
>There really is no evidence to support that assumption.
>
>However, don't you find it ironic that we would be spending millions
>looking for something light years away that we have yet to sense,
>let alone have any evidence for, and yet, right here at home we have
>thousands of reports of unidentified objects annually, which most
>people naturally (but perhaps mistakenly) attribute to little green
>men, and yet, we don't pay attention?

Not necessarily, I find it hard to believe that they will not make many
useful observations, and that there will not be some benefit. I just doubt
that they will find what they are looking for.

>We search for ETI elsewhere with little probability of success, yet
>ignore the possibility of better success right here at home.

Again, you equate UFO with ETI. This time directly. And yet you take
me to task for bring up aliens? This confuses me a great deal.

>>
>>>consider the fact that _we_ exist the evidence).  Yet, when we have
>>>thousands of people worldwide making extraordinary claims, many with
>>>physical traces, instrumental observations, etc., we laugh it off as
>>>nothing.
>>
>>I'll admit, after much study, I still do not know what to make of the
>>phenomenon. But cleary there is much fraud and fakery. And many of
>>the observations are natural phenomenon under unusual circumstances.
>>And many extrordinary claims are made. Why does the onus of proof
>>rest upon the scientific community?
>
>Who said it does?  Not me.  I didn't mean to imply that.  All I will
>assert is that the onus of further serious study rests with those
>most qualified to do so.  That is known as responsibility.

I do not see that this follows at all. The onus of proof lies upon those
making the claims requiring proof. Regardless if there are those better
qualified or not, that is a non-sequitor.

>If proof comes from that, fine.
>
>That is why I made an earlier remark about forensic science.  It _is_
>a science, you know.  It's sole purpose is to _study_ any available
>evidence (usually in the form of traces), and come to some sort of
>conclusion.

Forensic science deals with evidence, not observations. It will be useful
only if there is some physical trace left behind. This is rarely the
case as I understand it. But I think that assumptions build into the
firensic sciences (like humans are involved using known materials and
equipment) might render forensics less usable than you might think.
If all they could do was say "event X happened, we do not know how it
was done, and the observations cannot be reproduced by known tools and
techniques", then no useful conclusions would be forthcoming.

>But, if that was never done, a criminal case would have a difficult
>time proceeding.

And perhaps they are already occupied with investigating human crimes.

>In like manner, true, serious investigation into the ufo phenomenon is
>a precursor to doing any real "science" (IMO).  That isn't happening
>in mainstream science except perhaps in the field of psychology.
>
>>
>>Rich again
>>
>>[e-mail]
>
>Jim Graham - ditto
>
>        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
>                          Neither do they speak for me.
> ______________________________________________________________________
>| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
>|           dolmen![e-mail]                        |
>| BBS:      The PORTAL DOLMEN BBS/ParaNet ALPHA-GAMMA (sm) (9:1012/13) |
>|            [phone], 24hrs.                                    |
>|______________________________________________________________________|

Rich again, again!
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!hpscdc!hplabs!hpfcso!jle
From: [e-mail] (Jer/ Eberhard)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: .. .
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 01:59:26 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard, Fort Collins, CO, USA
Lines: 9

> > >... .. .. .  /.. . ... . ... .
     S   I  I  E   I  E S   E S   E

SO, it didn't really mean anything.

Jer/ Eberhard, (SLASH), HAM = N0FZD     | Hewlett-Packard - MS99, 1UP10,15'East
Pilot: COMM, INST, CFI-Airplane & Glider| 3404 East Harmony Road [phone]
CAP CFI, Check & Mission, Pikes Peak 218| Fort Collins, Colorado  80525-9599
EMAIL:  [e-mail] or [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Gordon Bruce)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Keywords: mars pyramids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 22 Feb 92 00:12:38 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: poster
Organization: Stanton Public Domain Systems, Stanton, Ca.
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4623 sci.space:26937 sci.skeptic:20922 alt.paranormal:4467

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Scott D. Young) writes:
>
> >[e-mail] (Jesse Flint) writes:
>
> >Indeed the 'face' resembles a human face in ALL THREE DIMENSIONS, unlike
> >the facelike examples used to compare it with, most only resembling facees
> >or other objects in outlins.
>
>    Where do you get this from?  There are (I believe) 2, count'em, 2 shots of
>    this feature.  Both have the same sun angle and thus the same shadows. No
>    oblique-angle shots or shots with other sun-angles exist.  Thus your
>    statement is ridiculous.  The face looks like a face when the sun shines at
>    one particular angle and when viewed from a certain angle.  That is all we
>    "know" to date.  It may be that the feature resembles a face at other angles,
>    or not.  We will not "know"  until more data is available.
>
>
>    Scott Young
>    [e-mail]

Scott,

Your information is incorrect.

The two shots of the Face on Mars were taken at two different angles of the
spacecraft with respect to he feature.  The photographs were also taken at
two different times in the Martian day and with a two week interval between
the two pictures.  The shadows and angles in the two photos are not the same
and do indeed provide sufficient data to construct a three dimensional image.

I have read Hoagland's book.  I also obtained copies of the pictures of the
feature.  The feature is there.  Does this mean that there was, at sometime
in the past, a civilization on Mars?  No.

Does it mean that the feature should be ignored and forgotten?  I believe
that the answer is also No.  Because we encounter something that is not
expected does not mean it is a hoax or someone's over-active immagination.
Because some individuals are ready to state that the feature is an artifact
does not make it an artifact.  Conversely, because some individuals are ready
to state that the feature is a natural formation does not make it a natural
formation.

A true skeptic will look at the available information and based on the
evidence reach some sort of a conclusion.  The photos indicate something
that is unusual and (to me) interesting.  Are the features artifacts
left by some long gone civilization?  I don't know.  There is not enough
information available to prove this.  Are the features a natural formation?
I don't know. There is not enough evidence to prove this either.

My conclusion is that there is photographic evidence of some unusual features
on the surface of Mars.  There is not enough evidence to determine what the
features are.

Most of us who are interested in the Face on Mars are not claiming that it is
an artifact.  We are only saying that it (and the other near by features)
deserve a closer look.  It was suggested that the next Mars probe be timed to
pass over the area in question and take some closer photos.  It is my
understanding that NASA officials have agreed to do this.

Gordon










--
===============================================================================
| Gordon Bruce; DataComm Consultant |  The opinions expressed here are mine   |
| [e-mail]             |  and are not necessarily the opinions   |
| stanton!bruce                     |  of my clients or employers.            |
===============================================================================
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!menudo.uh.edu!brmd1
From: [e-mail] (Kevin Brown)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 04:40:50 GMT
References: <![e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Kevin Brown)
Organization: Minimal.
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In article <[e-mail]> Frank T Lofaro <[e-mail]> writes:
>From alt.paranormal (USENET): 20-Feb-92 Re: Dreamland Gerry
>[e-mail] (919)
>
>>Jon
>>If I were to say that people with acne were actuallt Martians in
>>disguise, would you say:
>>a) He's full of shit.
>>b) I can not form an opinion, but the burden of proof is on him.
>
>>Although what you said about skepticism being a two edged sword is
>>correct, there are certain ideas that can be quickly flushed without
>>resorting to experimentation, etc.
>
>>Like pyschotics being ingabited by demon.
>
>>Or people with acne being Martians.
>
>    That is a somewhat hollow argument. You are comparing the statement
>being tested to something that is obviously ridiculous and then using
>that as the basis for attacking the original statement.

And what, exactly, makes one statement "obviously ridiculous" and the other
not?

>While it would
>be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
>demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
>of them are.

Wrong.  Look, if you can say "Some psychotics are the way they are because
they are possessed by demons" then I can say that "Some people are nice
because they're possessed by Santa Claus".  Both statements are of the
same form, and both are equally ridiculous.

The reason, of course, is simple: neither Santa Claus nor demons have any
significant positive physical evidence supporting their existence.


>If someone gets possessed by a demon (which I *do* believe
>happens, though not very often)

And why do you believe that this happens at all?  What physical evidence
to you have in support of the existence of demons?  None?

Then why don't you believe in Santa Claus as well?

>they will appear to unenlightened
>science to be mentally ill.

"Unenlightened science", eh?

You want to know how far your boogieman beliefs have gotten mankind?  Take
a look at the Inquisition and the Salem Witch Trials.  Then try to come
up with some *positive* contribution such beliefs have made (that cannot
as easily be attributed to something else).  Bet you can't.

I, on the other hand, can come up with *lots* of goodies that are the
result of "unenlightened science".  The computer I'm typing this on,
for example.  My car, for example.  Air conditioning.  Television.
Radio.  Lasers (which get you things like compact discs).  VCRs.
Photography of all forms, from black and white still pictures to
full-color, 70mm Dolby Surround theater films.  Aircraft.  And on and
on and on.  Shall I continue?

>Modern science does not comprehend, nor is
>it intended to explain, phenomina that deal with non-physical entities,
>such as demons.

Well, gee, if the phenomenon is not something that science can deal with,
then the phenomenon has no physical manifestation.  In other words, if
you can see it, then science can deal with it.

>Scientists do not understand the soul, spirits, and
>demons and how they affect what appears to them to be the "real" world.

Not surprising, since the things you mention have no discernable physical
effects.  Physical effects like the wild-eyed stare of the psychopath.

>    There is *much* more to the world, than just the physical plane.

Yeah?  Go ahead.  Prove it.

>Frank Lofaro
>Carnegie Mellon University
>[e-mail] (128.2.11.131)
>[e-mail] (128.2.35.186)


        Kevin Brown ([e-mail])
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!pacbell.com!att!cbfsb!cbnewsc!chapin
From: [e-mail] ( Tom Chapin )
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 05:02:39 GMT
References: <8ddhwp=[e-mail]>
Organization: Hickory Ridge - Lisle, IL
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Robert Sheaffer writes:
>The burden of proof ALWAYS lies on whoever makes extraordinary claims.

And just who gets to define what is ordinary and what is extraordinary?

Right.  If it agrees with the worldview of my group, it's ordinary.
And if not, that makes it extraordinary.  Can you say, "circular
argument"?

If it's unacceptable for a Christian to claim that the Bible is true
because it agrees with his worldview and all his group agrees, then
it ain't acceptable for "skeptics" to try to pull the same trick.


--
         tom chapin                [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (James T. Green)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 05:14:17 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
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Once the Mars Observer gets to Mars, it should take a series of
photos of the "face" from several angles and sun angles
so we can settle once and for all if it really is a boring
rock...or an interesting one.

Whatever it looks like, I'd say the Mars face is as natural as
the "Man" in the moon.

/~~~(-: James T. Green :-)~~~~(-: [e-mail] :-)~~~\
|                                                               |
|    Slogans of two generations:  1972:  Question Authority!    |
|                                 1992:  Why Ask Why?           |
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From: [e-mail] (Paul Callahan)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 05:21:38 GMT
References: <8ddhwp=[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet news system)
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[e-mail] ( Tom Chapin ) writes:

>And just who gets to define what is ordinary and what is extraordinary?

I do.  But it's more fun to leave everyone else guessing.

By the way, people with acne really are Martians.

--
Paul Callahan
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!csn!scicom!paranet!f816.n107.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Gateway Test
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 01:47:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 13


Hi everybody.  Could a few of you respond to this test?

I'm wondering if my gateway is actually letting anything out of here...

Thanks,
  Clark


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
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From: [e-mail] (Dwight Wilson)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 07:02:47 GMT
References: <8ddhwp=[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet news system)
Organization: The Johns Hopkins University CS Department
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Paul Callahan) writes:
>[e-mail] ( Tom Chapin ) writes:
>
>>And just who gets to define what is ordinary and what is extraordinary?
>
>I do.  But it's more fun to leave everyone else guessing.
>
>By the way, people with acne really are Martians.
>

And we want your women.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!cleveland.Freenet.Edu!aa440
From: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Another Elvis Sighting
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 20:10:56 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Lines: 28
Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns5.ins.cwru.edu


While working routine police patrol we had a call of a large fat man with
side-burns trying to steal big and fat clothes from a local store while
eating a pizza in one hand and running out of the store with garments in
the other hand.

The description was as follows:

Rather large, fat man, with greying side-burns and white sequined body suit
singing "Jailhouse Rock" as he fled the store.  As he made his way through
the exit, an eye witness heard and saw him turn to a store clerk and say,
"Thank you very much" - in Elvis lingo.

The clerk quickly identified this person as an aging Elvis who could still
rattle off a good rendition of the above listed song.

Police did a perimeter containment procedure but fat Elvis fled through the
defenses.

After careful examination, the police have learned that Elvis had been
working and hanging out at a local burger joint as a senior citizen trying
to attain the rank of burger manager.

More Elvis info to follow as soon as the report, fingerprints, and in-store
camera footage are developed and processed.

I think we got him this time boys!!!
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Under law, can you indict an alien for rape?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 20:18:04 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Lines: 13
Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns5.ins.cwru.edu


Let's just say that you are out minding your own business listing to
Led Zeppelin on the CD player in your car when you see a big blue flash
of light and all systems go dead except what the aliens are interested
in - your peter.

You get out and are floated into a craft when you are assaulted - sexu-
ally by a female from the planet Vulva.  She is having her way with you
several times and you now want to file charges.  Can you do so under
present law?  Is there recourse against illegal and/or alien intercourse?
Will the members of present day women advocacy groups side with aliens?
Will George Bush have to change his last name?
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!news
From: [e-mail] (Donald Yett)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 07:54:48 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Donald Yett)
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kevin Brown) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> Frank T Lofaro <[e-mail]> writes:
>>From alt.paranormal (USENET): 20-Feb-92 Re: Dreamland Gerry
>>[e-mail] (919)

[ Petty bickering removed ]

Please stop cross-posting your flames to aav...  this conversation belongs in sci.skeptic, alt.flames, alt.petty.bickering,
or some other more appropriate place.  If I feel like reading your argument, I'll look over there..

--
+-------------------------+----------------------------------------------------
| [e-mail]  | I will not be pushed, stamped, filed, indexed,
|   Just my opinions!     | briefed, debriefed, or numbered! - #6, The Prisoner
+-------------------------+----------------------------------------------------
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 20:22:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Lines: 55
Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns5.ins.cwru.edu


In a previous article, [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) says:

>     Hello from the world of the wierd and strange.  This is Gary
>Stollman, back from the Twilight Zone once again to give you an
>idea of what has been going on lately in MY world.
>
>     It seems that I have been responsible for bringing Jesus back
>to Earth, and have been through so much in the past month or two
>it would take (practically) a lifetime to tell it all!
>
>     What I can tell you is that my family and friends are still
>being exchanged by demons or aliens or whatever.  My mom had a
>stroke, and is here now in our apartment in LA, trying to
>recuperate from the paralysis which has left her immobile.  The
>two "nurses" treating her are demon clones who have taken the
>place of the real people, and they keep switching my real mom back
>and forth with the fake one, whom they serve.  My father is also
>being switched with a fake clone constantly.  As have been my two
>sisters and my other relatives and friends.  These things are
>demonic in nature, and I have asked God for help, and he has
>answered my pleas!
>
>     In the past few weeks, I have been transported by God to the
>parallel dimension, where these beings come from, and back again.
>The end result of this is that I have been responsible for the
>start of the Second Coming of Christ.  Jesus is here now, and he
>is going to take care of things in a hurry!  I have had the power
>of God at my fingertips, as apparently I was the "Number 9" spoken
>about in the musicians records, like the Beatles.  I have been
>able to move through dimensions like through air, and I have
>helped God to stop these things from taking us over.  There is
>little more to say now, except tell everyone you know to pray,
>long and hard!  It will help.
>
>     These things have taken over all the hospitals and so forth
>in LA, and the phone systems around the country.  They have a base
>somewhere where they are holding the REAL people they have cloned.
>If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
>stand up and be counted as human beings, not some kind of play-
>things.  This is Gary Stollman, signing off from LA, California,
>USA.
>
>
>
>

Gary, you deserve to live in L.A.  Your a natural.

Also, if you send me $4995, I'll take care of all of your problems, and
half of the debt that I owe.  But, we'll both be happy!!!

Gary, get a life, remember to put a condom on that rectal thermometer
while the nurse ponders why you don't have butt hair!!!
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Isn't it interesting?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 20:24:09 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Lines: 8
Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns5.ins.cwru.edu


Isn't it interesting that Graceland and Dreamland have two things in
common:

# 1 - Both end in land

# 2 - Both have probably had Elvis over for dinner
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From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 14:33:07 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
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[e-mail] (James T. Green) writes:

|>Once the Mars Observer gets to Mars, it should take a series of
|>photos of the "face" from several angles and sun angles
|>so we can settle once and for all if it really is a boring
|>rock...or an interesting one.

|>Whatever it looks like, I'd say the Mars face is as natural as
|>the "Man" in the moon.

what odds would you give?

josh
Path: ns-mx!uunet!boulder!ucsu!horton.Colorado.EDU!tarrall
From: [e-mail] (The Admiral, actually)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 12:21:04 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: _USS Christopher Pike_, NCC-1779-A
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Nntp-Posting-Host: horton.colorado.edu

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (jcj) writes:
|In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:
|
|>> If you don't believe me, watch CNN "real" closely!  It is time to
|>
|>I watch CNN alot...alot...alot..."`)twassle ummph, and I haven't
|>noticed anything unusual. What is it we should look for?
|
|They screwed up the Lynn Russell clone's hair color.  And I mean
|BIGTIME.

Hmm.  I wondered what was wrong with Hannah Storm.  I figured that
either she'd changed her make-up style or that she's about 2-3 months
pregnant.  Silly me.

I guess Bernie's clone injured his wrist in a tussle then?

--
-- The Admiral          Email address:  [e-mail]
---------------------------- ghewmey Daghaj SoH ---------------------------
|  What I want to see in the paper:  "Rockies sign Puckett and Sandberg"  |
|  --------------------> HOW ABOUT THOSE TWINS???? <--------------------  |
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From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part1
Keywords: Review Footage
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 21:27:57 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 58


    My first post to a.a.s. I would like to give a short review on
the Video-Photo-Document Package that I bought back in 1987. It came
from Book Brokers in Orlando, Fla. I don't know if there was a review
on this information yet, if so I would like a copy of it.i

FIRST: The Movie Footage

This is what the advertisement said:

    Full Color and Sound. SEE and HEAR this amazing video. Unpre-
cedented in content. Shown on television in Japan to millions of people,
as a NEWS SPECIAL. Experience the Japanese film crew's unbridled excitement
as they view and video tape the U.F.O!

    SEE and HEAR of the many discoveries that were found during the
super slow motion testing and film analysis! Hear what the experts have to
say about this film.

    See dematerialization and rematerialization of the U.F.O. See the
strange light shift that occurs during the tranformation! See a UFO as big
as a HOUSE hovering above a well traveled hightway! Hear the sound of this
UFP as it passes overhead.

    People in the Japanese Government call this footage "CONCLUSIVE
PROOF", and "the best photographic evidence to date!" Now, see if for
yourself, with your own eyes. YOU BE THE JUDGE!!

My (Ok, I'll be the JUDGE :-) REVIEW:

    The movie footage was on CHEAP T-120 VHS tape, very low quality
so I had to watch the footage thru the `snow' made by the recording.
It was YES YOU GUEST RIGHT a japanese makeover of `Billy Maiers' Beam
Ships that he took on 8mm film. They videotaped Billies film and ran
it thru a slo-mo machine. Also they put it thru video enhanced zooms of
the UFO's. The film crew gave their best shot to debunk the film and
gave it a passing grade. It was done rather well in my opinion, too bad
the tape was such a low quality, the footage would have been much better.
They ruled out trick photography because of the more then 1/120 second
frame speed of the dematerialization and rematerialization. It couldn't
be done so that part was true. They ruled out the saucer on a string by
the way the ships were flying from left to right and back again without
any error in the starting and stopping. Also the camera never moved and
there was always a reference in the camera. One shot was when a beam
ship was flying circles around a big Evergreen Tree to prove it wasn't
a model. The tree moved from the force of the ship back and forth. It
died within 6 to 12 months.


--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####Amateur Radio Packet: [e-mail]####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!mucs!mccuts!zzassgl
From: [e-mail] (Geoff Lane)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 13:39:04 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Manchester Computing Centre, Oxford Road, Manchester, M13 9PL, England.
Lines: 8
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As someone else has said - If you do manage to come up with a wonderful new
idea you would be trampled in the rush of others claiming that they thought
of it first.

--
Geoff. Lane.                                  Janet: [e-mail]
UTS Sys Admin, Manchester Computing Centre, Oxford Rd, Manchester, M13 9PL
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!deccrl!news.crl.dec.com!hollie.rdg.dec.com!pa.dec.com!shodha.enet.dec.com!timpson
From: [e-mail] (Steve Timpson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 13:58:35 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 14
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Leonard Spani) writes...

>Take a close look at the face on Mars...
>
>It is a cyberman!


        Looks more like... like ARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH

        TED KENNEDY!!!!!!!!!!!!! AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH


        Steve Food_for_the_Grays
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From: [e-mail] (Steve Timpson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 14:04:11 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 11


In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes...
>
>     Hello from the world of the wierd and strange.  This is Gary
>Stollman, back from the Twilight Zone once again to give you an
>idea of what has been going on lately in MY world.

        The FRAUD returnith.


        Steve Food_for_the_Grays
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!stl!stc!patb
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 15:19:52 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Organization: STC Telecomms, New Southgate, London, N11 1HB
Lines: 14
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Richard A. Schumacher) writes:
>
>Yes, Newton was a genius, but he was not infallible. Some of his
>views were completely wrong (such as those that led him to write
>tens of thousands of words on alchemy as a science)...

When Newton was criticized by a fellow scientist for his interest in astrology
(or else alchemy - I'm not sure which) his reply was something like as follows:

"I, Sir, have studied the subject. You have not.".

It still holds, Richard.

    Pat
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!transfer!lectroid!sw.stratus.com!tarl
From: [e-mail] (Tarl Neustaedter)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 03:29:42 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: sci.skeptic
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
Lines: 84
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
> [ Skepticism about devils ]
> (WARNING: I just can't take it anymore - it's been building for a long time -
> this was the straw that broke the camels back!  I got to get on my soapbox and
> get it off my chest.)
>
> The rest of us, including me, should maintain a healthy, not an unhealthy
> skepticism about alternative scientific theories.
> [...healthy vs unhealthy skepticism...]
> And why do I say this?  Well, it's pretty obvious from reading many postings
> on Usenet that many (but not all) scientists and engineers are fairly
> intolerant (read:  hostile) of ideas and theories that run counter to what
> they were taught and now believe.

There is a reason for this hostility. The random theories presented are
frequently supplied by someone who doesn't know what he is talking about,
and the hostile person will sometimes know more than a little about the
subject being discussed. It can be very frustrating to deal with someone
who claims to be able to invalidate centuries of work with a grandiose idea,
and hasn't bothered to read as much as an elementary text in the subject
being discussed.

Ideas are a dime a dozen. Crackpots produce ideas by the gross tonne.
Science, and indeed, knowledge itself, is not ideas. It is validated
facts and mathematical relationships between cause and effect allowing
accurate predictions to be generated.

Anything less is simply useful for fertilizing petunias. Indistinguishable
from what comes out of the south end of a north-bound steer.

When someone has a fantastic idea about the structure of the universe,
he/she/it should spend some time to determine whether this new idea
violates any of the existing knowledge our society has built up in the
past several centuries. If it does, perhaps what it violates should be
re-examined; but until that happens, the new idea is useless. Note that
re-examined means re-measuring whatever result you don't like; if said
re-examination produces the same result, your idea has already failed.

Presuming the new idea doesn't violate any existing knowledge (this will
probably take several years to determine); Differences between what the
new idea predicts and what the standard model (of whatever you are
replacing) predicts should be determined. These will probably be tiny
effects that will be difficult to observe - otherwise we would have seen
them before. Then you should design and execute an experiment which
tests the realms where the two models differ. This should take you
several more years. At this point, you can publish.

So much for what you should do; This group will never be used in that
context. This group is for people arrogant enough to believe that they
can, without detailed knowledge of a subject, use sheer inspiration to
out-do everyone who came before them, who actually bothered to understand
what they were dealing with. This group is for conspiracy theorists who
believe that studying existing science will "pollute" them and destroy
their inspiration. This group is for people who believe in fairies and
divine inspiration being supreme over observation, math and hard work.

Does that sound hostile? It should.

Now, if you want to discuss new theories, discuss:
   a) The solar neutrino problem. There was a recent paper addressing
      this that hasn't made it out to the general press yet. What does
      it say, and what are it's potential flaws?
   b) Supernova mechanics. There are some known problems with the existing
      supernova model, which were brought to light by Sanduleak -69.202
   c) Developments in merging quantum mechanics with gravity; There have
      been attempts, what have they involved, and what are their flaws?
      Which changes have recently cropped up?
   d) Cosmology; big-bang vs cyclic vs other; What evidence points to
      which theories, what flaws do they have. What work has been done
      in getting a big-bang to produce a non-isotropic universe?

(my interest in astronomy is showing).

   e) High-temeperature superconductivity in doped CuO ceramics. Changes
      to the BCS theory to accomodate these superconductors - news about
      work to determine if phonons are involved in these superconductors.

If some of the potential changes or new theories are your own, so much the
better. But if you have a theory on supernovas and don't know what the
Chandrasekhar limit is, expect to get hammered.
--
         Tarl Neustaedter    [e-mail]
         Marlboro, Mass.    Stratus Computer
Disclaimer: My employer is not responsible for my opinions.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!hela.iti.org!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Video-Photo-Documents Part3
Keywords: Review Documents
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 22:30:44 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 26


    HoHummm! With the package came a bunch of bad photocopies of
declassified documents of all kinds of UFO trivia. Plus a reproduction
of a Photograph, allegely showing a humaniod alien body preserved in a
transparent viewing case, and other information from the UFO CRASH AT
AZTEC.

    Etc etc etc....
    So...  Anybody seen these documents? They look pretty ratty,
    if I feel like it I'll weed thru it and see if anything is
    worth typing up. I just found this folder of all the UFO
    goodies that I had filed away since I got it back in 1987.
    So I decided to bring them up on a.a.v. More Fun then Humans
    are allowed.....



--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####Amateur Radio Packet: [e-mail]####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!hela.iti.org!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part2
Keywords: Review Photo
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 23 Feb 92 22:17:39 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 110


    My Review on the Satellite Photograph of a UFO.

First the Advertisement:

    A first time ever SATELLITE PHOTOGRAPH OF A U.F.O. with
documented authentication!

    This photograph was taken by a weather satellite, making it the
only OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT satellite photo ever released of a U.F.O! People
in the U.S. government call this photograph "IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE THAT
U.F.O's EXIST!!"

    See the U.F.O as being V-shaped in the front and rectangular in
the rear, with a port vision, and four contrails. See the U.F.O flying
at 5000 miles per hour, while climbing out of the atmosphere. The Earth
is viewed in the background, documenting its presence!

    THIS IS CONCLUSIVE PROOF THAT U.F.O'S EXIST!!

    The satellite photo will cone to you, complete with one glossy
size 8"x10" color picture of the U.F.O., and all supporting AUTHENTICATED
DOCUMENTS.

DOUBLE YOUR MONEY BACK GUARENTEE, IF NOT AS ADVERTISED HEREIN!!

My Review Comment:

    SO!!! HAHAHAHA..... Well I did get a glossy 8"x10" picture of
a flying `Baseball HomeBase Plate' :-) There wasn't much color in the
color picture mostly some grayscale `blue-white'. I personnally don't
know what it is and to me it might just might be something so...
here is what the AUTHENTICATED DOCUMENTS say :-).

---------------------------STARTING DOCS-----------------------------
Mid-America Remote sensing Center
Murray State Univ, Murray, KY
                            Oct 31, 1985

To Whom It May Concern:

    The image in question appears to be the output of a satellite
remote sensing device. To the best of my knowledge the information
depicted on the image in question is authentic.

                        Thomas C. Kind, PhD.
                        Professor
                        Dept. of Geosciences

#2

To Whom It May Concern:

On the eveing of Oct 30, 1985, I examined an electronic negative image
which appears to be a genuine, untampered, unretouched image.

Stephen J Robertson
Owner, Robertson's Creative Photography

#3

Southeast Missouri State Univ.
Cape Girardeau, Missouri
                        Friday, Nov 1, 1985

To Whom It May Concern:

    I am Professor of Physics (highest rank) at Southeast Missouri
State Univ. hold tenure, and served as chairman of the department of
physics for nearly twenty years. I have not served as chairman for about
three years.
    I have held several offices in state science organizations,
including the office of President of the Missouri Academy of Science and
President of the American Association of Physics Teachers, Missouri Section.

                        Dr Harley D. Rutledge

(Notice the above person never mentions the Photograph :-)

#4

Southeast Missouri State Univ.
Cape Girardeau, Missouri
                        Nov 1, 1985

To whom it may concern:

I have examined the imagery of concern to Dr. Rutledge.
The background terrain appears to match a portion of irregular
coastline and associated islands centered approximately 40 kilometers
southwest of Vladivostok, U.S.S.R., in the vicinity of latitude 43deg
N; longitude 331deg E.

                ?. Ray Knox
                Professor of Geology

==============================EOT DOCS===============================




--
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From: [e-mail] (Tom Schneider)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 16:55:22 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Four stages of acceptance: (J.B.S. Haldane, Journal of Genetics #58, 1963)
i) this is worthless nonsense;
ii) this is an interesting, but perverse, point of view;
iii) this is true, but quite unimportant;
iv) I always said so.

I haven't been able to find the original reference, unfortunately.  Does
anybody have access to the original journal to locate the exact pages?

  Tom Schneider
  National Cancer Institute
  Laboratory of Mathematical Biology
  Frederick, Maryland  21702-1201
  [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (ron house)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <house.698888095@helios>
Date: 23 Feb 92 23:34:55 GMT
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[e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:

>Of course, I demand to be shown substantiating evidence and arguments, and the
>burden of proof is on the presenter;  but I will give a *non-hostile*, even a
>friendly, forum to anyone who puts forth theories and conjectures that run
>counter to present-day thinking, no matter how bizarre.  Only by fostering
>such an open climate can we maximize the creativity of our scientists and
>scholars, and to advance scientific understanding;  a hostile climate to new
>ideas will only stifle many (and fortunately not all) from working on and
>presenting such new conjectures, ideas and theories, and thus stifle scientific
>understanding itself.

I have noticed intolerance to unusual ideas also.  I heartily second all
your comments above.

--

Ron House.                 USQ
([e-mail])  Toowoomba, Australia.
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From: [e-mail] (ZAPHOD BEEBLEBROX II)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Philedelphia Experiment
Summary: pex
Keywords: ph
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 10:53:14 GMT
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I need information about the Philadelphia Experiment for a book that I'm
writing.Please mail me at [e-mail]
      Thanks in advance   ..ZBII
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From: [e-mail] (JIM GRAHAM)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Astronomers & Ufos
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 19:20:35 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rich Payne) writes...
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>Let's stop playing with words and address the issue, ok?
>
>As above, lets do. But I would like to point out that one can tell the exact
>truth, and be 100% wrong. But I would prefer that we refer to "scientific
>truths" as established facts or something similiar.

Of course.

>
>>And are all (in fact most) _sources_ of sighting reports "questionable"?
>
>How many UFO photo's have turned up being faked? It was once a quick was to
>get publicity. This is a fact easily established by a trip to the library.
>Do you say this is not true?

I agree.  But, would you really accept photographs as valid scientific
"evidence"?  If not, then faked photos are irrelevant.

>>you disagree and what would change your mind.  Remember that I am
>>referring to what I consider the undeniable existance of the _phenomenon_,
>>NOT a particular object.
>
>Are you referring to the UFO's, or to the observations of UFO's as the
>phenomena, or both?

Both.

>
>Threads drift, and this is neither right or wrong. But to ignore what
>others say while complaining that others are not responding to what
>you said (and this happens all too often) is not the basis of a
>reasonable discussion. I was generalizing here, please do not read the
>"you" above as referring to yourself. But specifically, you have done
>some of this.

That's only because too often, the discussion becomes tangential and the
original issue is lost in the noise.

>
>>Can you ask this again?  I don't understand the above (it's garbled).
>>
>>Sorry.
>
>Is the UFO phenomena a phenomena requiring scientific study, or psychological
>study?

You mean, there's a difference?!!! :-)

>
>
>I did, it would save much time if we would get to the point rather that
>bickering about who said what. Are the investigation you refer to valid
>(in a scientific sense) or not?

Agreed.  I think they are "valid".

>
>>Soil samples were submitted to 3 (if I recall) laboratories, went through
>>various tests, and all three reports were in agreement.
>
>What did they agree on?

Oops!  I forgot to say.  I'll let you know when I get to my references.

>
>>But that's my point.  What does any conspiracies have to do with this
>>discussion?  I haven't implied any, have I?
>
>I think that they are _part_ of the phenomena.

No.  I think they are symptoms, but not an intrinsic part of the phenomena.

>
>>However, don't you find it ironic that we would be spending millions
>>looking for something light years away that we have yet to sense,
>>let alone have any evidence for, and yet, right here at home we have
>>thousands of reports of unidentified objects annually, which most
>>people naturally (but perhaps mistakenly) attribute to little green
                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>men, and yet, we don't pay attention?
>
>Not necessarily, I find it hard to believe that they will not make many
>useful observations, and that there will not be some benefit. I just doubt
>that they will find what they are looking for.
>
>>We search for ETI elsewhere with little probability of success, yet
>>ignore the possibility of better success right here at home.
>
>Again, you equate UFO with ETI. This time directly. And yet you take
>me to task for bring up aliens? This confuses me a great deal.

No.  I do not make that equation.  Read my statement above, again.  My
point is that mainstream science makes the equation in order to conveniently
set study of the phenomenon aside.  Yet, when faced with the question of
ETI, they will conveniently and without much yelling, carry SETI.

If I appear to have made the equation of UFO=ETI, I didn't intend to.

Still confused?

>
>>Who said it does?  Not me.  I didn't mean to imply that.  All I will
>>assert is that the onus of further serious study rests with those
>>most qualified to do so.  That is known as responsibility.
>
>I do not see that this follows at all. The onus of proof lies upon those
>making the claims requiring proof. Regardless if there are those better
>qualified or not, that is a non-sequitor.

Why?  If I claim that I have gangrene in my foot, don't you think it's
reasonable to get a more qualified person (a medical doctor) to examine
the foot before I personally choose to amputate?

>
>>That is why I made an earlier remark about forensic science.  It _is_
>>a science, you know.  It's sole purpose is to _study_ any available
>>evidence (usually in the form of traces), and come to some sort of
>>conclusion.
>
>Forensic science deals with evidence, not observations. It will be useful
>only if there is some physical trace left behind. This is rarely the
>case as I understand it. But I think that assumptions build into the
>firensic sciences (like humans are involved using known materials and
>equipment) might render forensics less usable than you might think.
>If all they could do was say "event X happened, we do not know how it
>was done, and the observations cannot be reproduced by known tools and
>techniques", then no useful conclusions would be forthcoming.

True.

>
>
>Rich again, again!

Jim Graham - ditto, ditto.

        -> ->Disclaimer: I do not speak for my company. <- <-
                          Neither do they speak for me.
 ______________________________________________________________________
| Internet: [e-mail]                              |
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Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ccwf.cc.utexas.edu!dougmc
From: [e-mail] (Doug McLaren)
Newsgroups: talk.bizarre,alt.is.too,alt.alien.visitors,alt.alien,alt.finals.suicide,alt.my.head.hurts,alt.noise,alt.sex.wizards,misc.test,alt.test
Subject: Laura's 22nd birthday !!!!
Summary: wish her a happy birthday !
Keywords: birthday 22 Mr. Winky
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 21:26:19 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (The Daily Lose)
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Approved: are you kidding ?
Xref: ns-mx talk.bizarre:50813 alt.alien.visitors:4649 alt.sex.wizards:266 misc.test:13392 alt.test:13432
Originator: [e-mail]

Today (Feb 24) is Laura's ([e-mail]) 22nd birthday ...
Send her some mail and tell her to have a good one !
(and tell her she needs to have a party ! :)

Thanks ...   Doug

--
The opinions stated above are mine (and quite possibly mine alone!)  However,
 for a brief time, and a nominal fee, they can be yours too.  Operators are
    standing by!   Call Now!  DouG McLareN, [e-mail]
"It's not totally empty ... there's a chiapet."
"That's not a chiapet ... that's last month's meatloaf !"

--
The opinions stated above are mine (and quite possibly mine alone!)  However,
 for a brief time, and a nominal fee, they can be yours too.  Operators are
    standing by!   Call Now!  DouG McLareN, [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (MARGARET HAMILTON)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: test
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 22:08:25 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet News Administration)
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this is a test. ignore it.
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From: [e-mail] (Mark)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets (M.S.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 00:10:12 GMT
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In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of Sun, 23 Feb 1992 01: 47:02 GMT
X-News-Reader: VMS NEWS 1.11

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:

> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bob Donahue) writes:
> >[e-mail] (James Davis Nicoll) writes:
> >
> >>    What is Earth's radio noise output like these days? Assuming no
> >>attempt on our part to be noticed by hypothetical ETIs, would it be
> >>obvious to the ETIs why the sun (or a close companion to it) appeared
> >>to be a major radio source?
> >    The big problem here is of course where to look...  Even FM
> >is a pretty large bandwidth to sample, and there isn't and logical reason
> >for ETs to start looking there (that I know of).
> >
>
>     A hstory question here: anyone know how much of the way we use
> radio (in terms of radio vs TV broadcasts, etc) is forced on us by
> physics and how much was a 'fluke' product of early decisions in the
> field (Like, for example, early radio stations using a range of frequencies,
> forcing later EMR  communications to use other frequencies)?
>
>                             James Nicoll

A lot of the way we use radio is dictated by physics, TV requires that much
more information be sent per second than radio (the picture needs lots of
data).  Basically a large information rate requires a large bandwidth and
at low radio frequencies large bandwidth transmissions crowd the available
spectrum --this is why the gov't (FCC) allocates the higher frequency bands
to TV, radar, etc. and the lower bands to less information intensive use (like
shortwave amateurs).

But as far as the Earth's radio emission is concerned there is a more
interesting problem estimating the difficulty of aliens detecting us
or our detecting them--->  We've only used radio for maybe 80 years and TV/
radar for 45 years.  The Earth has only been emitting EM waves at large power
levels for the last few decades of this period. But notice what we're doing
now -- we're replacing our old radio and TV antennas with cable TV, satellites,
and fiber optic cable which leak almost no detectable power to space.  So
by about the year 2000 almost all information will go through optic fibers and
high bandwidth/high frequency comsats (at low power levels because of the
efficiency of modern amplifiers and antennas).  Earth may only be detectable
for this short half century window, if the ET's don't look soon they'll miss us.
If the ET's have a similar shift to low emission technology we'll never see them
unless they transmit signals to space on purpose.

Mr. Donahue brought up the question of where should we look in the huge EM
band.  It may not be total guesswork because the ET's should be at least as
clever as us and we know that there frequencies where the interstellar medium
absorbs background radio noise, like the region around 1420 MHz.  This is one
of the places we would send messages so they might also.

--- Mark ----
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From: [e-mail] (Josh 'K' Hopkins)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 00:33:24 GMT
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[e-mail] (Joshua Geller) writes:

>[e-mail] (James T. Green) writes:

>|>Once the Mars Observer gets to Mars, it should take a series of
>|>photos of the "face" from several angles and sun angles
>|>so we can settle once and for all if it really is a boring
>|>rock...or an interesting one.

If  I recall correctly, MO will go into a roughly sun synchronus orbit.  It
may be able to take pictures from slightly different angles, but don't count
on the sun angle being much different.

>|>Whatever it looks like, I'd say the Mars face is as natural as
>|>the "Man" in the moon.

>what odds would you give?

If I gambled, I'd say it was very likely.  I'm not a bookie, so I wouldn't
know how to pick the numbers.
>josh
        Josh Hopkins
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From: [e-mail] (Blair P. Houghton)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 23:49:28 GMT
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I dunno about "less hostility;" but certainly less ignorant
hostility.

Just saying "that's stupid, go back in your hole and seal
the trap-door behind you!" is not science.

                --Blair
                  "It is, however, great fun
                   when done correctly. :-)"
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From: [e-mail] (Walter D. Pullen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: A perspective on the topic of "good" and "evil" extraterrestrials.
Summary: Nobody is coming to invade Earth except perhaps our own fears.
Keywords: 11:11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 02:01:57 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
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     The subject of "good" vs. "bad" extraterrestrial civilizations
has come up often lately, and I felt I would share this information
with those who are interested in knowing the possibilities of our
interactions with other worlds. I took the excepts below from "Bashar:
Blueprint for Change - A Message from Our Future", by Darryl Anka and
Luana Ewing. The book is "channeled" from an extraterrestrial by the
name of Bashar, although don't let that label add to or take away from
the content of the message. Bashar comes from our "future", or rather
from a loving alien society that we will soon be very similar to. This
is a truly amazing book with all kinds of wisdom, hope, and accurate
information. There is lots more I can say from this source, but for
now, here is a question and answer session about the topic at hand:
(Loving thanks to you-know-who-you-are for loaning the book to me!)

--

Q:        What about a planet with a life system that has developed with a
     war-like mentality, one that can enter this part of our galaxy with
     intentions on conquering? Will that likely happen, Bashar?

     Understand that individuals with that intention do not really get
very far. The idea is also that your energy as a world now has changed
sufficiently so that even if there should be another civilization
close at hand with intention of conquering and dominating, they would
be hard pressed to even find you now. For your vibration is a little
bit too different from any society that might actually with to push
themselves into space with war-like intentions of coming here to take
over.
     Now, the idea is also that traveling in space is actually
traveling within. And true, space travel is not the idea of what your
technology is right now, where in a sense you are sliding around on
the *surface* of space. When you understand how to breach the barriers
of space and time itself, you will discover it requires a very highly
integrated attitude, and a highly integrated attitude makes it very
unlikely you will ever be of a war-like nature, and in fact you would
not get very far if you were. For even if you were to make the
attempt, you would most likely find yourselves dispersed at the other
end....
     The idea of war-like planets in conquering modes can and have
happened, but they are usually relegated to certain levels of
dimensionality. Many times that means they actually have to be in
physical proximity to each other, and in our perception, not on any
level is there a race of such a nature within hundreds of light years
of your world. For the idea is this: now that your vibration is
changing into a modality they would not even begin to be able to
understand, they probably would not find you even if they looked. So
in a sense, that makes *you* the most war-like planet around... and
*we* have no fear of you. Therefore, in actual fact, if there were
going to be any concern at all, it would probably be from our end, not
yours.

Q:        But aren't there wars between other planets?

     If we might draw an analogy to what many of you have assumed
*must* exist elsewhere in the universe, simply because it exists upon
your planet....
     In a sense, there are other places, and have been interactions
throughout the different galaxies, that might loosely amount to what
you call warfare. There have been many variations of this theme on
many different worlds from time to time. You are not unique in that.
But the idea many of you have perceived, which has to do with alien
consciousness that may have negative intentions toward other worlds:
this particular negative intention does not always manifest itself in
the absolute format you would recognize as warfare.
     For recognize, in many ways warfare is quite improbable in terms
of galactic and stellar distances. There is rarely any need for such
an idea, since there is always more than enough room for expansion,
and therefore more than enough room for different ideologies. Every
civilization is a different reality in many ways, and generally
speaking one reality is usually experienced only by one civilization
until they make agreements to share common frequencies, common wave
lengths between different worlds - which then allows them to interact
in various ways.
     But if they do not make that agreement, then chances are they
will rarely encounter other civilizations if they are not of a mind to
interact with those other civilizations in mutually beneficial ways...
unless they wish to lure themselves to civilizations that as a whole
are choosing to function as victims, and draw to themselves - out of
their fears, out of their doubts - the idea of a conquering
civilization. However, even this notion is usually not able to be
played out in your typical fashion of warfare and domination. For, as
we said earlier, the stellar distances make this very improbable.
     Do recognize also that although it may seem symbolically like
planets are being conquered, none can be conquered if they do not
vibrate to the idea that they *can* be. And thus you will find that
the so-called best safeguard to the idea is to simply know you are not
of that vibration, that idea. And they, not being of the same reality,
will never find you. If they should come to what represents - to them
- your planet, it will not - to them - seem to be at all inhabited.
     So the idea, more often than not, of what could be considered a
conquering race, and a conquered race - to use the terms loosely -
would be simply the willingness of the conquered to give up their
power completely to the conqueror, to allow their lives to be run by
someone else, and to have all their power removed and all the
responsibility for the creation of their lives taken from them. But
not taken without their consent, for it cannot happen without that
consent.
     Thus the type of warfare that has occurred in this sense has
simply been one of a people succumbing to an idea and allowing
themselves to fall in line, to fall under the domination and the
auspices of another civilization successfully using the idea of
seduction to lure that civilization under their banner. The
"conquering" civilization then is able to increase its numbers and
increase its strength very literally by talking the other civilization
into allowing themselves to be dominated. They can do this by taking
responsibility for their needs, by pretending to take care of those
needs, and by removing from them in the process all of their ability
to know and believe they can create their own lives as they choose
them to be.
     This is the type of warfare that is more common. Is is a mental idea,
a psychic idea, in that sense. But even that, in our experience, is a
relatively uncommon thing. For not *that* many civilizations we have
encountered are that willing to forget who and what they are to the
degree where they would attract such a liaison with another
civilization that would even *want* that type of dominion over other
worlds. Both of these ideas are relatively rare in our experience.
     All the ideas of what you now represent to be war-like
projections into space are, for the most part, in your long distant
past. Do understand something: though we are not saying the scenario
that has been painted in literal terms is actually literal, the idea
of your science fiction stories - particularly the one you call *Star
Wars* - did carry with it one of the strongest insights of all, and
that is that you were told it was a long time ago. For indeed it no
longer has anything really to do with your present. At least not, as
you say, in your neck of the woods! It is a representation of the old
cycle of negativity, and a connection to many other star systems
through which you have come. It was simply applied to a future format.

Q:        Bashar, my understanding is that some of those space beings, such
     as those connected to the dark side of Orion, are hostile to Earth and
     Earthlings.

     We will discuss this idea with you if you will first understand
that the idea of any consciousness which could be said to be
negatively oriented can only form connections with individuals who
believe that those supposedly negative individuals have the power to
force connections of that nature upon them. In other words, only your
fear and concern that they may have that type of power will actually
give them the power necessary to form a link with anyone in your
civilization. Otherwise just recognize that there are many so-called
negative individuals and negative consciousnesses in many other
worlds, just as there are many negatively oriented individuals on your
own planet.
     It does not mean that they must interact with you. And if you are
willing to be the vibration, the frequency, and the attitude of the
perspective of the reality you choose to be, then they will not be
able to intercept your reality. Recognize that the primary idea of
negativity is not specifically isolated to the constellation you refer
to as Orion; it does involve many other systems throughout the local
galaxy.
     As we have said, many of the individuals on your planet now are
literally reincarnated Orions, and they have formed a connection to
that origin point, so to speak, reincarnating upon Earth to allow
themselves to learn the balance point of the positive and negative
polarities so that they can create only positive manifestation in
their lives. They can switch themselves to a frequency that is out of
reach of the former negativity that was inherent in the original
parent systems of the Orion area.
     You will find that time and space being what they are, and all
things being simultaneous, some of these original Orion negative
consciousnesses still have the ability to be picked up on be whichever
individuals on your planet may still choose to function along the same
old style frequency - time and space not being a barrier to the idea
of telepathic contact on any level.
     However, it is also important to recognize that many of the
individuals of the Orion influence, or "persuasion," have been, and
are now, allowing themselves to crystallize into a very balanced idea
of polarity. In the original home systems that energy in turn has
allowed them to now be the creation and existence of light as well as
negativity.
     Therefore, it would be our advice and our suggestion to you that
you simply do not focus on the idea that there are negative beings who
exist in the universe - other than those who exist on your own planet
- that could perhaps interact with you against your will, and focus on
the reality you choose to be. Then, by the fact that you will be on a
different frequency, this will place you completely beyond the reach
of anyone who is not on the same loving frequency.

Q:        Well then, how do we stop wars and have a peaceful planet?

     Please understand that if you believe in peace, then you do not
have to hate war. YOU DO NOT GET PEACE BY HATING WAR; YOU GET PEACE BY
LOVING PEACE. Hate only reinforces the things you say you do not
prefer, because that's what you are focusing on. *Be* peace; *live*
peace. *Breathe* peace; *Share* peace. Love, unconditional love, will
transform your entire world in the twinkling of an eye. UNCONDITIONAL
love for all.

--

-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|     Walter D. "Cruiser1" Pullen     |     [e-mail]     |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|   "Who am I, What am I?  As I am, I am not.  But as we are, I AM.  And to   |
-   you my creation, My Perfect Love is your Perfect Freedom. And I will be   -
|   with you forever and ever, until the End, and then forever more." - GOD   |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!pacbell.com!att!cbnewse!cbnewsd!press2
From: [e-mail] (barry.o.olson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 04:47:29 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 14

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Donald Yett) writes:
>
> Isn't it amazing that UFO sightings really started [in the UFO sense] in the mid to late '40's?  Roughly 20 to 30
> years after most of the ground-breaking research into higher frequencies in radio.  And has increased stedily since

I used to be an avid UFO buff for at least 10 years straight('68-78')
approximately. I remember reading about sightings of dirigibles in the
mid to late 1800's before they were manufactured and used.
If this is accurate, they first appeared in modern times in the form
of airships or zeppelins. It wasn't until mid 1940'(?) they were sighted
as flying discs near Mt. Ranier in Washington state.
Any support?

barry olson
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!spool.mu.edu!agate!stanford.edu!rock!taco!eos.ncsu.edu!rmaddy
From: [e-mail] (RICHARD M ADDY)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.brother-jed,alt.desert-shield.erotica,alt.exploding.kibo,alt.fishing,alt.tasteless,alt.true.crime
Subject: Happy Hunter
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 04:39:42 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: North Carolina State University
Lines: 63
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4656 alt.brother-jed:952 alt.exploding.kibo:83 alt.fishing:3732 alt.tasteless:7938
To: [e-mail]

You've got to read this.  By the way, I don't quite have the hang
of this feature - you may get multiple copies.
In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bruce Becker) writes:
Xref: taco alt.brother-jed:940 alt.fishing:4748 alt.tasteless:7857
alt.true.crime:49
Path:
taco!lll-winken!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!spool.mu.edu!think.com!mips!swrinde
e!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!utzoo!censor!comspec!becker!bdb
From: [e-mail] (Bruce Becker)
Newsgroups:
alt.alien.visitors,alt.brother-jed,alt.desert-shield.erotica,alt.explodi
ing.kibo,alt.fishing,alt.tasteless,alt.true.crime
Subject: boom
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 21 Feb 92 18:06:20 GMT
Organization: G. T. S., Toronto, Ontario
Lines: 33


        DEAD HUNTERS GIVEN FINAL SHOTGUN BLAST
                   Associated Press


         DES MOINES, Iowa - The way Jay  Knudsen
      sees  it,  the ashes of dead hunters don't
      belong in urns  on  the  mantle.  So,  for
      about  the cost of a funeral and sometimes
      a lot less, he will take the ashes to  the
      sportsman's   favourite   marsh   or  bear
      country and blast them to smithereens.

         "We  can't  get  you  to  heaven,"   he
      advertises, "but we promise to land you in
      the happy hunting ground."

         A landscaper by trade, Mr. Knudsen  has
      an off-season service for the survivors of
      dedicated hunters.  He  loads  ashes  into
      shotgun  shells,  performs whatever ritual
      the family wishes and then blasts away.

         "This is not a morbid thing,  to  shoot
      ol' Joe down the barrel of a shotgun in an
      area he loved to hunt," Mr. Knudsen said.


--
  ,u,     Bruce Becker        Toronto, Ontario
a /i/     Internet: [e-mail], [e-mail]
 `\o\-e     UUCP: ...!lsuc!becker!bdb
 _< /_     "Ceci n'est pas un \"" - Rene "Day" Taxi # 12 & 35

--
---------------------------------------------
Richard Addy
NCSU
[e-mail]

"One Objects!
   One is miffed in the extreme!"
           - Eupathic Impulse
                  _Jack_the_Bodiless_
                      Julian May
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!mips!munnari.oz.au!newsroom.utas.edu.au!cam!esk!rhoge1
From: rhoge1@esk (Robert James Hoge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: TEST POST: Please Respond
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 04:47:08 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston
Lines: 14

References: <[e-mail]>
Sender:Kid
Followup-To:Len
Organization: University of Tasmania at Launceston

Just a reply from your letter to see if there was anything to it first.
Australia - Reply "Kid" only!

C
C
C
 D
D
Uni od  Tasmania Launceston
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!stanford.edu!rock!taco!eos.ncsu.edu!rmaddy
From: [e-mail] (RICHARD M ADDY)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.brother-jed,alt.desert-shield.erotica,alt.exploding.kibo,alt.fishing,alt.tasteless,alt.true.crime
Subject: Re: Happy Hunter
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 04:54:25 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (RICHARD M ADDY)
Organization: Project EOS - North Carolina State University
Lines: 13
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4658 alt.brother-jed:953 alt.exploding.kibo:84 alt.fishing:3733 alt.tasteless:7939

--
Sorry about that - I was trying to send the posting to another user.
And with my name plastered across the header! The Shame!
---------------------------------------------
Richard Addy
NCSU
[e-mail]

"One Objects!
   One is miffed in the extreme!"
           - Eupathic Impulse
                  _Jack_the_Bodiless_
                      Julian May
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 00:14:19 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 30

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (R Ross Holder Jr) writes:
>It is important to note that much the same was said of the Hubble Space Tele-
>scope prior to its launch.  Oh yes, they said, we'll be able to see planets
>orbiting distant stars - maybe even find evidence of extraterrestrial life!

Planets orbiting distant stars aren't evidence of extraterrestrial life.  I
don't know what you're talking about.

>But the equipment failed - just like the probe that located the Mars Face.

Phobos failed (and I know about the pictures and all that.)  But I think
the face was located by Viking, which (as far as I know) lived about as
long as it was expected to.  Not only that, but wasn't the face noticed
some time after the pictures were taken?  (Lots of pictures take a while to
look at.)

>And I wouldn't be too surprised if the marvellous Mars Observer inherits some
>strange post-launch "malfunction" just like many of its more recent
>predecessors.

While we're speculating, there was some speculation last year (I think)
that the Mars Observer had been secretly launched on one of the
DOD-dedicated space shuttle flights.  And then there's Cooper's story that
we've been to Mars in the 1950s.  (I'd like to see evidence of *that*!)

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.space,sci.skeptic,sci.physics
Subject: Re:  Zoomed Mars-face,inka-city posted to alt.binaries!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 00:28:34 GMT
References: <behse.698489924@tubue> <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors, sci.skeptic
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 24
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4660 alt.paranormal:4492 sci.space:27008 sci.skeptic:20980 sci.physics:17957

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Sunil Gupta) writes:
>well this is the reply from nasa (telnet  128.158.13.250)
>
>=======START=====MESSAGE FROM NASA======10-Feb-92==10:55:00
>The "face" on Mars is an interesting geological feature that resembles a face
>because of its structure and pattern of shadows.
>=======END=======MESSAGE FROM NASA=========================

While I'm generally skeptical about claims with so little evidence (like
the Face), I don't see how NASA could have the *definitive* answer without
getting up there and checking it out.

>its odd though Ive seen another mars "face" picture" but that in comaprison was
>smaller and much sharper. The image that was posted appears to be no only
>processed but touched up by hand.

I've seen one that was touched up to look like "Bob".  (It was smoking a
pipe, of course.)

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re:  mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 00:34:21 GMT
References: <behse.697924019@tubue> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 17
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4661 sci.space:27009 sci.skeptic:20981 alt.paranormal:4493

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Leonard Spani) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Daniel Klugh) writes:
>|> Maybe the Doctor Who story "Pyramids of Mars" wasn't a story at all.
>
>Take a close look at the face on Mars...
>
>It is a cyberman!

The thought had occurred to me.  As well as the logo of Mercury Records,
and the cover of the recent Elton John tribute album.  Which really goes to
show you how the mind works, while meaning absolutely nothing.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 00:39:15 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 19

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan) writes:
>       In Cambridgeshire, England, last year another "circle" of some
>mathematical interest appeared. It was roughly heart-shaped with circles of
>various sizes around it. In fact it was strikingly similar to a mandelbrot set,
>a complicated mathematical figure which can only be represented by a fractal.

I had heard that this was a hoax by some local students, but I don't know
if that story itself is true.  Anybody know for sure?

Also, while the Mandelbrot set itself is a fractal, a stylistic
approximation of it is not a fractal and requires no computation at all.
(Other than symmetry along one axis.)  It could have been produced by
humans as easily as any other geometric pattern with a little planning.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 01:14:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 25

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (R Ross Holder Jr) writes:
>He's sort of "got me" here...  I'd _heard_ that the Mars Face was located
>by a probe that was sent to Mars by the United States to study the Martian
>moons.  Unfortunately, I heard this over a local radio broadcast some time
>ago and I haven't heard anything more since then.  Was the Mars Face first
>located by the Viking Probes?  If not, why didn't we hear about all the
>Mars Face just after the Vikings landed???

It takes time and people to sort through all the pictures.  (Nobody's going
to put face-recognition in the software of a planetary probe, after all).

The Russians did send two probes to Mars, years after the Vikings I think.
If I remember rightly, one died on the way and the other died under
circumstances which, if reports are correct, could be construed as odd.
(The probes were called Phobos, which is the name of one of the Martian
moons, and one was photographing one of the moons when it died.  But I
don't know if they were only going to look at the moons, or at Mars also.
And to add confusion, there was an old ('60s or '70s, I think) Russian
theory that the Martian moons were spacecraft.)

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 01:29:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 21

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve Kudlak) writes:

>What I would be really interested in is a set of books that proport to
>go on in this sort of style, with "fictional newspaper reports" and
>"fictional government documents" and the like, or something that mixes
>fact and fiction for some effect like UFO ideas.

I haven't read any of them so I can't give you any personal opinions, but
"Majestic" by Whitley Strieber is based on the Roswell / MJ-12 scenario,
Sydney Sheldon's "The Doomsday Conspiracy" is fiction but has a UFO coverup
theme, and then there's a British book and TV show (movie?) called
"Alternative 3" that's *really* UFO-conspiracy oriented, to the extent that
there's been quite a bit of debate over whether it might actually be real.
And I almost forgot "Genesis" and its sequels by W. A. Harbinson,
which are in just as controversial a situation as "Alternative 3".

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!dsinc!bagate!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  California CE-3's
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 01:32:33 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 29

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>>Yesterday I saw an ABC news report on an anonymous family in California who
>>claim that they're visited by aliens every night.  The aliens probe them
>>with beams of light, sometimes right through the ceiling of the house while
>>the family is awake.  They made drawings of the ships and they look fairly
>
>   Couldn't be beams of light - ceilings tend to stop those.

You're right of course, but remember that a lot of UFO reports tend to have
paranormal elements.

>>complex, with rows of lights or jets on the bottom.  They also have
>>videotape of them, but the videotape just shows large, pale circular
>
>   No surprise here.  You would think with all the camcorders out
> these days, one person would be able to actually film a UFO without
> focusing problems.  Bullshit about aliens affecting electronics is
> a cop-out.

Just to keep the record straight, nobody claimed interference, at least not
as far as was mentioned.  I fully agree, as I said, that *whatever* it was
was severely out of focus.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lynx!carina.unm.edu!vjmurphy
From: [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  California CE-3's
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 08:00:13 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque
Lines: 27

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>
>You're right of course, but remember that a lot of UFO reports tend to have
>paranormal elements.
>

    Yes, that way it makes it impossible to explain things.

>
>Just to keep the record straight, nobody claimed interference, at least not
>as far as was mentioned.  I fully agree, as I said, that *whatever* it was
>was severely out of focus.
>
    I did not mean to imply that interference was caused in this case, but
it is an excuse used in the past.  You would think that if someone was
filming a potentially earth-shattering event, he would make sure the
focus was sharp.  The fact that it wasn't tells us something.





--
"You ask me if sex is one of the most   \\    //     Phred Platypus
  important things in life?  Absolutely. \\  //  Grammarian of Vengeance
  But the lack of it is even likelier     \\// [ [e-mail] ]
  to drive you nuts."  -- Harlan Ellison   \/       Vincent J. Murphy
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!news.bbn.com!noc.near.net!mars.caps.maine.edu!maine.maine.edu!umasp
From: [e-mail], , National Headquarters>
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 04:24:12 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Maine System
Lines: 40

In reference to the posting by one Gary Stollman, the Board of Directors
at Clones of America would like to respond by saying that we are not in
any way responsible for turning Gary's mother, Mrs. Stollman, into Jesus.
Further, rumors that we turned his father into a Can of Spam are simply
not true.  We, at Clones of America, strive to bring you the best clones
possible at reasonable prices.  Anyone dissatisfied with the results of
their clone, may request a full refund of the purchase price (less shipping).
Don't be misled by vicious lies and rumors about extra body parts and
incorrectly attached sex organs.  All such stories are merely attempts to
discredit us by our competition.  To the perveyors of such lies, we at
Clones of America say 'Go fuck yourself!', which, with a clone, is considered
technically possible.  We want the people of this planet to be happy with
their clones...to derive the maximum benefit from them.  Feel free to call
us anytime to discuss cloning options and to receive a free price list.
Our number is 1-800-4CLONES.  Thank you for your attention.  Before leaving,
however, we would like to say one last thing to Gary Stollman:

It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood.
We've cloned everyone that we possibly could,
Are you next?
Could you be next?

We've cloned all your neighbors and relatives too,
and now we're out looking for somebody new,
Are you next?
Could you be next?

We have always wanted to clone a wacko,
just like you.
To see you go mad, like your mom and dad,
and your neighbors too.

So, lets make the most of this beautiful day,
we brought our new clone gun, so 'Come out and play!'

Think about it, it won't hurt a bit,
Won't you be our victim.

Won't you please, won't you please,
please won't you be our victim.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ira.uka.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!sun.rhrk.uni-kl.de!efes.physik.uni-kl.de!kring
From: [e-mail] (Thomas Kettenring)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 11:34:58 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <![e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: FB Physik, Universitaet Kaiserslautern, Germany
Lines: 19
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4494 alt.alien.visitors:4668 sci.skeptic:20991

In article <[e-mail]>, Frank T Lofaro <[e-mail]> writes:
>    That is a somewhat hollow argument. You are comparing the statement
>being tested to something that is obviously ridiculous and then using
>that as the basis for attacking the original statement. While it would
>be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
>demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
>of them are.

You fail to see that there are different standards of ridiculosity(?).
Your demons are "obviously ridiculous" to me, like Gerry's Martians
with acne are to you.  Gerry uses a statement that is obviously
ridiculous to *everyone* (I hope) to demonstrate you the feeling
other people have when you talk of demons (my interpretation).

-Caddy--(thomas kettenring, 2 dan, kaiserslautern, germany)-----
Because the hypothesized anomalous effect is not easily accommo-
dated within the prevailing scientific world-view, it is parti-
cularly important to assess the trustworthiness of each reviewed
experiment.  -  Radin and Nelson
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!malgudi.oar.net!yfn.ysu.edu!ysub!psuvm!dam137
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 16:17:21 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]
Organization: Penn State University
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4669 sci.space:27022 sci.skeptic:21001 alt.paranormal:4496

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(Josh 'K' Hopkins) says:
>
>>|>Whatever it looks like, I'd say the Mars face is as natural as
>>|>the "Man" in the moon.
>
>>what odds would you give?
>
>If I gambled, I'd say it was very likely.  I'm not a bookie, so I wouldn't
>know how to pick the numbers.
>>josh
>                Josh Hopkins
>

We should also remember that faces in rocks also occur on the Earth without
the help of intelligence.  I believe the place is called "The Man In The
Mountain" in New Hampshire.  Its a natural rock outcrop that looks very
like an old man's face...

Dave
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
When you remove the impossible, whatever's left, no matter how improbable,
   is the answer...                           --Sir Arthur C. Doyle
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!malgudi.oar.net!yfn.ysu.edu!ysub!psuvm!dam137
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets (M.S.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 16:47:08 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail].
Organization: Penn State University
Lines: 10

Just a side note...just recently, I remember seeing a list of the closest and
most visible stars to earth and the probability calculations worked out as to
which of them were most likely to contain planets, which would have class M
(earth-like) planets, and some other planetary types, and which would be the
best probable planets for life "as we know it" to exist...

If anyone knows where I can get a copy of this list, could they please send it
my way via E-Mail (no need to waste bandwidth...).

Dave
Path: ns-mx!uunet!hela.iti.org!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Books (Was:Re:  Something Wicked This Way Comes?)
Summary: Anybody read these books?
Keywords: Books Books more Books
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 19:11:44 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 55

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
[Steve Kudlak stuff was here]
>
>I haven't read any of them so I can't give you any personal opinions, but
>"Majestic" by Whitley Strieber is based on the Roswell / MJ-12 scenario,
>Sydney Sheldon's "The Doomsday Conspiracy" is fiction but has a UFO coverup
>theme, and then there's a British book and TV show (movie?) called
>"Alternative 3" that's *really* UFO-conspiracy oriented, to the extent that
>there's been quite a bit of debate over whether it might actually be real.
>And I almost forgot "Genesis" and its sequels by W. A. Harbinson,
>which are in just as controversial a situation as "Alternative 3".

    People that are into books probably are reading this threads so
here it goes. Anybody read the following UFO Books and give an opinion?

`UFP Crash at Aztec' -A well kept secret
By Willian S. Steinman & Wendelle C. Stevens
ISBN: 0-934269-05-X

`UFO Photographs around the World Vol 1'
ISBN: 0-934269-00-9

`UFO Photographs around the World Vol 2'
ISBN: 0-934269-01-7

`UFO Contact from the Reticulum'
By: Wendelle Stevens
ISBN: 0-93785-06-3

`Light Years'
By: Gary Kinder
ISBN: 0-87113-139-0

`Extraterrestrials among us'
By: George Andrews
ISBN: 0-87542-010-9

`The Goblin Universe'
By: Ted Holiday
ISBN: 0-87542-310-8

`UFO's over modern China'
By: Stevens and Dong
ISBN:0-9608558-3-1


--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!comp.vuw.ac.nz!waikato.ac.nz!aukuni.ac.nz!mercury!nacjack!richard
From: [e-mail] (Richard Vowles)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Recent juvenile posts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 11:18:32 GMT
Organization: Malleus Maleficarum - Nil Mortifi Sine Lucre
Lines: 18


Regarding the recent posts from various members of Dimension BBS that
pass through this BBS, they have been spoken to and will refrain from
doing it in the future.

Sorry about the inconvenience, but please don't post me any more mail.
It costs.

Richard

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
In complete darkness we are all the same. It is only our knowledge and
wisdom that seperates us. Don't let your eyes deceive you.

"I make sure I spread my villainy thinly...." - Bernadette Mooney

USENET  : [e-mail]       The Demi-Monde : 199:310/1
FIDONET : Richard Vowles 3:772/110.0   Amateur Radio  : ZL1UTF
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!ames!sun-barr!olivea!uunet!mcsun!uknet!edcastle!aisb!cstr!rjc
From: [e-mail] (Richard Caley)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 09:13:20 GMT
References: <8ddhwp=[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Network News Administrator)
Organization: Centre for Speech Technology Research
Lines: 15
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:21026 sci.space:27043 alt.paranormal:4498 alt.alien.visitors:4673
In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of 24 Feb 92 05:02:39 GMT

In article <[e-mail]>, Tom Chapin (tc) writes:

Robert Sheaffer writes:
rs> The burden of proof ALWAYS lies on whoever makes extraordinary claims.

tc> And just who gets to define what is ordinary and what is extraordinary?

Whoever you are trying to convince, obviously.

You don't have to produce extrodinary proof unless you wish people who
find your claims extrodinary to believe you.

--
[e-mail]            _O_
                     |<
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!netcomsv!ctedge!bogus!root
From: [e-mail] (David Grant)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets (M.S.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 00:18:08 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Bogus.COM -- Public Access Network Services
Lines: 13

<[e-mail]> writes:

>
> If anyone knows where I can get a copy of this list, could they please send i
> my way via E-Mail (no need to waste bandwidth...).
>
> Dave

I'd also like a copy, so maybe a post wouldn't be out of order.

<smile>

  ** Bogus -- Public Access Network Services [phone] 14400 HST/V.32 **
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms
From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Under law, can you indict an alien for rape?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Feb 92 18:08:56 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
Lines: 7

Sounds like Phil Klass's challenge to report abductions to the FBI.

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!usenet.coe.montana.edu!news.u.washington.edu!uw-beaver!pullen
From: [e-mail] (Walter D. Pullen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: A field trip on an extraterrestrial spacecraft.
Summary: A guided meditation
Keywords: 11:11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 09:25:11 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: University of Washington Computer Science
Lines: 164

--
     Haven't you ever wanted to take a trip aboard an extraterrestrial
rayship into space? Well we can, here and now! This article contains a
short guided meditation where the reader takes an inner visit aboard
the mother ship of a loving alien race. Believe it or not, I would say
this is a rather accurate rendition of what it actually is like aboard
"typical" spacecraft, at least those not limited to our 3rd dimension!
The passage is another excerpt from the book "Bashar: Blueprint for
Change. A Message from Our Future", by Darryl Anka and Luana Ewing,
which is "channeled" from an extraterrestrial named Bashar (although
don't let that label add to or take away from the feeling.) For those
who have been expressing interest in this book, it is 302 pages
($13.95 or so) available from New Solutions Publishing; Seattle, WA;
ISBN# 1-56284-113-0. The back cover of it reads as follows:

--
                "Bashar, are we going to blow ourselves up?"
"No!! Your civilization has already decided on a collective
 subconscious level not to do so.
  You all chose to be here in this transformational age to see that you
   do NOT replay Atlantis and destroy yourselves and your world this time
    around.
     Around the year 1997 a spark will be ignited in your Middle East....
      There will be a complete transformation in that entire area....
       By your year 2027 your world will be absolutely interwoven into the
        Galactic Association of Worlds - as an equal member.
         We have no need for you to believe us. We are here to assist you in
          believing in yourselves.
           The only time you have struggle and pain is when you are trying to
            be someone you are not, fighting your natural flow.
             When you remove guilt from your tool box, you will realize that
              nothing is too good or too simple to be true; nothing is too
               wondrous or too ecstatic to be yours.
                You deserve all you can conceive of...."
--

And now let us take you on a field trip to the Solar Wind, our mother
ship.... Close your eyes.

In your mentality have the picture of the room you have created around
you, and envision each individual, all of you together, all at once,
surrounded by a blue crystalline bubble of energy. This bubble is your
elevator, your ship. Relax and allow yourselves now to become the
devices within the ship that activate it. Leave the idea of your
earthly devices and tools behind; pay attention to them no more. You
are the transference point; you are the ship.

Allow yourselves to recognize that the crystalline shell is quite
transparent; you can see through it and you can see the room. In
whatever way works best for you, in your imagination feel and see at
the same time the room around you dissolve into a gray, fog-like
state. You are all now together in this ship; you are all linked and
you are all breathing the same energy.

Breathe it in three times deeply and prepare yourselves. Align
yourselves; assimilate yourselves; unite yourselves. Feel the
connection; feel that while you are individuals, every single other
individual in this craft is *you*! - an extension of you, an
expression of you, a facet of you. You are all one, one master
crystal. And this crystal, in allowing the white light of your
consciousness to glow within its very core, within its very heart, now
comes alight with life and light, energizing the entire crystalline
craft and rising above the Earth - higher and higher into the upper
atmosphere, into what you call space.

Rising, you look down below. You see out of the fog now everything
clearing into brilliant space, black with white stars everywhere. You
see the beautiful Earth below you, shining like the jewel that it is,
in the velvet curtain of deepest space, and you send your love. You
see and feel and taste and hear the love of the Earth that is
supporting you, that is extending you on its arm, extending you on
your journey out into space. You are riding on the crest of the wave
of the heart of your planet.

Now as it offers you the jewels of space, you look up. You see
suspended in space before you a long cylindrical metallic object. It
is approximately a mile in length. You allow yourselves now to see an
opening in the side of this metallic object, wider and wider as you
approach. You enter that opening, and as it closes below you, you are
surrounded by a whiteness. You may sense in that whiteness, here and
there, solid or nebulous, consciousness peering at you, smiling with
you, loving with you, fading in and out - out of the milky whiteness.
But laughing and sharing joy all around.

Allow yourselves to know that you can now begin to explore any area in
any way, any aspect of this ship you so desire. There will always be
someone with you in some capacity. You will also always be connected
and feel the experiences of every other person you came with.

Now you are exiting the bubble and entering the milky whiteness of the
ship, exploring and breathing the new atmosphere. Feel the gentle
touches and caresses of the beingness all around you. Scatter and
explore; enjoy and become fascinated by what you discover. Taste,
touch, hear, feel, see, marvel. Recognize that you are sharing and
participating in the creation of a multitude of worlds. Experience and
take to heart these experiences.

Whether or not it appears to make sense to you, allow yourselves to
interpret, in whatever way you so desire, the different chambers and
areas of the ship. Let yourselves have the opportunity to recognize
that in a very real way you are projecting astrally a portion of your
consciousness. And that you are going to be funneling that information
back to your idea of your earthly selves, incorporating that
information into your very molecular structure. You will be feeding
this information into the atmosphere around you, and when you carry
this atmosphere back to your planet Earth, you will release the
information and energy on your planet - to change the very air that
you breathe, to change the very energy that sustains you.

Explore to your heart's content. Feel the vibrant pulse of life and
light, for it is light itself which powers the vessel, and all vessels
like it. It is the very heart and soul of the movement of space and
time through the central core of this ship that creates the illusion
of the ship's motion through all the dimensions of reality. Now be
aware of the whereabouts of each other. Gather yourselves back
together into your docking bay, into the milky whiteness. Feel the
caresses and the kisses that are given to you from heart to heart and
soul to soul.

As you form your craft round and about you in its crystalline beauty,
and the iris opens below you, allow yourselves to drift back outside
the hull into space and begin your travel toward planet Earth.
Recognize now, as you bid farewell, that this is not goodbye, that
this experience is directly with you now and it always shall be. And
as you look down through the crystalline bottom of your energy craft,
you see once again the beauty of the jewel of your Earth. Recognize
that it is in every way truly a new world to explore in all of its
unlimited fascination and facets.

You are eager to allow the atmosphere of the new crystalline reality
that you know you are participating within to burst upon contact with
your Earth and allow the shards of brilliant seed-like beauty to go
scattering everywhere, reflecting the beautiful light of your central
star. And as you sink gently back to Earth, see your feet gently touch
the ground. Send roots deep down to drink of the nourishment of the
fluid of the life and light of your home world, while knowing that all
worlds are your home world. Know that the life you are, the Earth you
are, is the nourishment that will allow you to grow toward the light
as high as you wish to go.

Know that every one of you have incorporated the information of the
experience in your own way, encoded it within you, and it will release
in its own fashion, after your own kind. And that much of your dream
reality can become vivid and vibrant. There may be more release, more
malleability, more recognition that life around you is but what you
dream it to be. Allow yourselves to know that it was a real
experience, and that you have projected a portion of yourselves aboard
that craft.

In every way there is still, and always will be, a portion of
yourselves aboard that craft that we will share, that you will share
together with us. We thank you for your participation, and we will
allow you to remember: ALL REUNIONS ARE SIMPLY AWAKENINGS TO THE UNION
THAT ALREADY EXISTS EVERYWHERE, EVERYWHEN.

--

-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|     Walter D. "Cruiser1" Pullen     |     [e-mail]     |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|   "Who am I, What am I?  As I am, I am not.  But as we are, I AM.  And to   |
-   you my creation, My Perfect Love is your Perfect Freedom. And I will be   -
|   with you forever and ever, until the End, and then forever more." - GOD   |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
Path: ns-mx!uunet!ihz.compuserve.com!dzecchini
From: [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 09:42:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
Lines: 29
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4677 sci.space:27054 sci.skeptic:21035 alt.paranormal:4502


Alright, everyone...if you wanted my opinion in the first place, I figure
that now's the best time to give it, after I've had a good chance to peruse
the images.

I've spent about 30-45 minutes studying both the non-enhanced and the
enhanced blow-up photos of the "face on Mars".  And IMHO, there is NO
I repeat, NO significant evidence that suggests that the potential facial
features are symmetrical in nature, and the pattern of shadows appears
to be a one-sided effect that leaves much too much to the imagination
to be considered anything more than a natural formation.

In other words, there probably isn't a right-hand side to the face, and
the remainder boils down to three small hills, off-center, on a larger
hill that obscures part of the side in shadow.

No big deal.

I may be wrong, but at this point, that's my opinion, and hey, that's what
opinions are all about, now isn't it.

Be seeing you...


--
         David "Maelstrom" Zecchini | "It may be better to be a live jackal
       [e-mail] | than a dead lion, but it is better still
 [e-mail] | to be a live lion.  And usually easier."
           [e-mail] | -Robert A. Heinlein
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!scicom!paranet!p0.f605.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Mike.Keithly
From: [e-mail] (Mike Keithly)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Gateway Test
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 24 Feb 92 15:48:01 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/605.0 - MICAP(sm) Net, Littleton CO
Lines: 19


 > Hi everybody.  Could a few of you respond to this test?
 I suppose you are getting out to here so far..
                Mike Keithly
 > I'm wondering if my gateway is actually letting anything out
 > of here...

 > Thanks,
 >   Clark


 > --- XRS 4.5!
 >  * Origin: The Wrong Number BBS - ParaNet(sm) PI (201)
 > 451-3063 (1:107/816)

--
Mike Keithly - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!scicom!paranet!f816.n107.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Gateway Test
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 01:22:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 19

In a message to Clark Matthews <24 Feb 92 08:48> Mike Keithly wrote:

 MK> I suppose you are getting out to here so far..
 MK>                Mike Keithly

Thanks, Mike!  Now to see if anything comes back from the Internet.

I have assumed that my addressing is working correctly, but I get no responses to my posts.  Maybe it's my BREATH???  :-)

BTW, how's XRS working for you?  Let me know in ParaNet Sysop if I can help.

Best,
  Clark


--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!psgrain!percy!parsely!agora!trifid
From: [e-mail] (Roadster Racewerks)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 06:34:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <house.698888095@helios>
Organization: Open Communications Forum
Lines: 9
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:21036 sci.physics:18037 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1064 alt.paranormal:4503 alt.alien.visitors:4680 sci.energy:7895



Well, the theory behind "think tanks" is that we should listen to *all* input,
even the most bizarre and exotic. Not just for intellectual freedom, but
because a really "left field", unworkable theory might just trigger a *useful*
theory in another person who hears of it and is set to thinking along
unfamiliar lines...

Suze
Path: ns-mx!uunet!haven.umd.edu!darwin.sura.net!ukma!psuvax1!psuvm!dam137
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 14:05:59 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Penn State University
Lines: 21

I'd have to disagree to a point.  The hostility is actually quite well.  It
creates two healthy climates.  First of all, by being hostile, you are forcing
people to continuously look over their work and examine everything with the
finest detail.  If their work is valid, they will amass the proof necessary
to defeat all arguments against it.  The work will stand on its own merits
and no one will be able to logically and/or argumentativly (is there such a
word?) destroy the work.  Secondly, it keeps a lot of crackpot theories off
of the net.  If someone knows that they will be torn to shreads if they post
something either off the wall or inconclusive, they will be less likely to
post it.  Either way, the hostility works out for the benifit of the group.
Those of us doing the yelling, however, must also be able to realize when we
can no longer refute an argument and must be strong enough to put our
pride aside and say, "I guess your theory is valid and I was wrong."  When
both sides do their job, then the community in the whole will put out higher
quality work, even if it does take a bit more time.  Sure, scientists in the
past have been criticized, called fools, made fun of, arrested, and so on, but
in the end, those who had valid theories that withstood the "hostile" critics
went on to be considered some of the brightest minds in the history of human-
kind.

Dave
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!news.iastate.edu!IASTATE.EDU!danwell
From: [e-mail] (Daniel A Ashlock)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 14:46:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <house.698888095@helios> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Daniel A Ashlock)
Organization: Iowa State University
Lines: 18
Xref: ns-mx sci.skeptic:21040 sci.physics:18041 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1066 alt.paranormal:4505 alt.alien.visitors:4682 sci.energy:7896

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Roadster
Racewerks) writes:
> Well, the theory behind "think tanks" is that we should listen to *all*
input,
> even the most bizarre and exotic. Not just for intellectual freedom, but
> because a really "left field", unworkable theory might just trigger a
*useful*
> theory in another person who hears of it and is set to thinking along
> unfamiliar lines...
>
> Suze

   Yes, well, but compare the amount of left field theorizing that
actually goes on with the amount optimal to jumpstart useful research.
I suspect we have saturated the market.

Dan
[e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!masscomp!frank
From: [e-mail] (Frank Tredeau)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.physics,alt.sci.physics.new-theories,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.energy
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Keywords: Open-minded skepticism
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 18:25:04 GMT
References: <house.698888095@helios> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: sci.skeptic
Organization: Concurrent Computer Corp. Westford MA.
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Roadster
Racewerks) writes:
> Well, the theory behind "think tanks" is that we should listen to *all*
input,
> even the most bizarre and exotic. Not just for intellectual freedom, but
> because a really "left field", unworkable theory might just trigger a
*useful*
> theory in another person who hears of it and is set to thinking along
> unfamiliar lines...
>
> Suze

Just a leetle old clarification, Suze. I think what you
are discribing is problem solving technique called
'brain storming'. A Think Tank is a place where a bunch
of 'top experts in the field' get together and compare notes.
This would be places like MIT or the Rand Corp. or
Cal Tech.
  The main diffrence is any group can 'brain storm' and people
at 'think tanks' try not to look foolish.

Frank Tredeau
sez me
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  Something Wicked This Way Comes?
Keywords: Alternative 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 19:01:02 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:

>theme, and then there's a British book and TV show (movie?) called
>"Alternative 3" that's *really* UFO-conspiracy oriented, to the extent that
>there's been quite a bit of debate over whether it might actually be real.

"Alternative 3" was actually an *April Fools Day* hoax from Anglia TV in
the U.K. about 15 years ago. Then Maj. Wayne Aho picked up on the
paperback book version of it, then Gray Barker did a column about
it and, bingo, *all* the paranoids of UFOland started to take "Alternative
3" seriously!

What, by the way, does "Alternative 3" claim? Only that there's a
secret, joint US/USSR space program to move the earth's elite to Mars
to escape "global warming." To accomplish this, they have created a
work force of kidnapped persons who have been turned into zombies to
work in secret bases on the moon. And of course, they'll kill
anyone who finds this out.

Nothing too remarkable in any of that, is there? :)


--

        Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - [e-mail]

 Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!

               "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
      - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
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From: [e-mail] (Reply to [e-mail])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Fireball???
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 20:27:42 GMT
Organization: Ziff-Davis, Medford MA
Lines: 18

Hi all,

Just a quick one:

I heard a quick mention on a local radio station here in Boston of a
'fireball' seen in the sky sometime earlier this week, or last weekend.
I believe the reporter said it had been seen by people in 3 states, and
I thought it was in the Carolina's, but don't hold me to that.

It was mentioned that there was still no explaination of what it was.
Did anyone else hear or read anything about this???


Please post any info, NO email.

Thanks,

Markp
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From: [e-mail] (Iain Jameson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Shriek of the Looney --Part One--
Message-ID: <ijameson.699156562@adelphi>
Date: 27 Feb 92 02:09:22 GMT
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Nntp-Posting-Host: adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au

[e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:

>I thought the Pleidians were duped by the purple shades of
>grey whom introduced decaf into their coffee magazines(storage
>areas) without their knowledge. The loss of buzz caused the
>Pleid's to grow soft and lazy, wherein the PSoG were able to
>chase them off the planet and inhabit it themselves.
>Thus the Pleid's ran into planet earth, where they cultivated
>their precious brew once again. Many eons later did they
>realize what happened to them, and decided to develop humans
>to guard their magazines against further sabatoge by the
>now Gray shades of Purple who were once the Purple shades of
>Grey before the poles flipped on the Plaeidian planet they took
>over.
>But I could be wrong.

>barry--

No, that's what the Reptiods want you to think.
Did I mention the role of the Reptoids? Not to
worry, you will learn all there is to know about
Reptiods in part 29 of "The Shriek of the Looney".
Send me your money. Decaf was not introduced until
galactic year 501 after the unification. The effect
was quite nasty. A number of star systems were
destroyed by the Pleiadians in their attempt to find
a full bodied coffee. Not even the Purple Shades of
Grey stooped so low as to decaf the coffee, probably
because they did not think of it. But then, what would
a tea drinker know about coffee and its effect on higher
life forms?

Iain.
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From: [e-mail] (barry.o.olson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Shriek of the Looney --Part One--
Summary: coffee wars and croissants
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 02:57:48 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <ijameson.699156562@adelphi>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 26

In article <ijameson.699156562@adelphi>, [e-mail] (Iain Jameson) writes:
>
> No, that's what the Reptiods want you to think.
> Did I mention the role of the Reptoids? Not to
> worry, you will learn all there is to know about
> Reptiods in part 29 of "The Shriek of the Looney".
> Send me your money. Decaf was not introduced until
> galactic year 501 after the unification. The effect
> was quite nasty. A number of star systems were
> destroyed by the Pleiadians in their attempt to find
> a full bodied coffee. Not even the Purple Shades of
> Grey stooped so low as to decaf the coffee, probably
> because they did not think of it. But then, what would
> a tea drinker know about coffee and its effect on higher
> life forms?
>
> Iain.


Damn, my reference, _Complete and Comprehensive history of the
Inter-Galactic Coffee and Croissant Wars of the 3rd Nebula_ by
Reambut Doobtwister ISBN 009 435 800 4941-000 000 000.243 000.

This guy went out of his way in the introduction to disavow any
connection to Reptoids, and disclaimed himself too. Who can you
trust? Cost me 1400 zekebots too!
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Stollman)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 21:44:06 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (Waffle login)
Organization: The Matrix
Lines: 43


     This is to all those who think I am nuts or just playing a
vicious joke on you all.  I AM the guy who jumped onto the live
set of KNBC in 1987 and held a toy gun to the head of Consumer
Advocate David Horowitz, and forced him to read a statement on
live tv about how the CIA and alien forces had taken over my
family and replaced them with clones of some kind.  I DID it
not out of insanity, but out of desperation, having had exhausted
all "normal" means of aquiring relief from the devious things that
were happening to my family and friends and the people around me.
I have since learned that these things have been demonic in
nature, and HAVE involved the secret government behind the U.S.
government.  I HAVE had angels sent by God trying to save me, and
one of these DID take the place of my mom in an effort to save my
family.  YES, I KNOW how it sounds, but I swear that it is
the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, which is
what I SHOULD have said five years ago at a trial which didn't
take place.  I plea bargained my way out of a felony charge, and
have suffered greatly for my actions.

     Now, I know this is ridiculous, impossible, and so forth, to
believe to the "average" person, but it IS the truth!  I am
currently in the process of writing a book about the whole thing,
titled, "The Invasion of the Human Race" which is pretty
appropriate.  I have an account on GEnie, and if any of you
frequent it, you might want to check out the Writers BB, Cat 4,
Top 29 for my "column".  I also have an account on Compuserve, but
it has expired.  I am going to be renewing it soon as well.
Please believe me when I say that these things are all serious and
quite serious as well.  I have tried to tell you what has been
happening in the quickest (although perhaps not the best) means
possible.  This is due to these forces still being present around
me here in LA and active.  However, (know how this sounds!) God IS
bringing the matter to a close.  I have a personal relationship
with Him, something I never thought possible myself in my youth,
and He is taking care of things.  The stuff about Jesus and other
dimensions is the honest truth.  It will take a whole book to just
tell what happened with all that in the past few weeks!  Anyways,
feel free to write to my address if you would like more info on
any part of this.  Or, if you are on GEnie, I am G.STOLLMAN.  Take
care, and I will give you more details when possible.

     Gary Stollman
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From: [e-mail] ( Tom Chapin )
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic,sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 04:17:03 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Hickory Ridge - Lisle, IL
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Richard Caley writes:
>Tom Chapin writes:
>> And just who gets to define what is ordinary and what is extraordinary?
>
>Whoever you are trying to convince, obviously.
>You don't have to produce extrodinary proof unless you wish people who
>find your claims extrodinary to believe you.

Oh.  So which claims are ordinary and which are extraordinary is
not something that can be decided with scientific objectivity, but
only with biased subjectivity.  Thank you.  I was wondering how
scientists decided such things.  Turns out to be exactly the same
way as those they claim to oppose.


--
         tom chapin                [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 21:03:11 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:


|>Alright, everyone...if you wanted my opinion in the first place, I figure
|>that now's the best time to give it, after I've had a good chance to peruse
|>the images.

|>I've spent about 30-45 minutes studying both the non-enhanced and the
|>enhanced blow-up photos of the "face on Mars".  And IMHO, there is NO
|>I repeat, NO significant evidence that suggests that the potential facial
|>features are symmetrical in nature, and the pattern of shadows appears
|>to be a one-sided effect that leaves much too much to the imagination
|>to be considered anything more than a natural formation.

have you seen both images?

|>In other words, there probably isn't a right-hand side to the face, and
|>the remainder boils down to three small hills, off-center, on a larger
|>hill that obscures part of the side in shadow.

|>No big deal.

OK, what odds would *you* give me?

|>I may be wrong, but at this point, that's my opinion, and hey, that's what
|>opinions are all about, now isn't it.

I don't know what it is, but I think the possibility that they are artifacts
is real enough that I will take bets with attractive odds.

josh
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From: [e-mail] (Geoff McCaughan)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: Face on Mars FAQ posting
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 10:50:47 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The Equinox Network CHCH NZ (Node SATORI)
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[e-mail] (Stefan Hartmann) writes:

> Hmm,
> I think You forgot to mention, that there are nearby the face (15 Km away) a
> "pyramids", which are more interesting, than the "face", because such
> rectangular and symetrical shadows can only be produced by something artifici
> We should focus onto the "pyramids" in our discussion , because the face coul
> also be a "well" illuminated mountain !

So could the pyramids.

Grab a dictionary, look up 'ventifact', this will give you a clue.
Finding one could be trickier, try a museum in a large city, or a text
on geology/geography. If you see one, you might understand those
pictures better.

The museum here has a nice one from Antartica on display.

Be very careful with assertions like "can only be produced by something
artificial", there may be a mundane explanation ready to jump out and
surprise you.

| Geoff - Sysop Equinox (equinox.gen.nz) [phone] (4 Lines)
| Email:  [e-mail]
|         "If I post something lucid, is that satorial eloquence?"
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From: [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 06:49:22 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
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Josh,

You really want me to give you odds?

Well, to answer your question, I HAVE seen both of the images...(and in
addition, the images from a book called "The Face on Mars" that I picked
up in the library.  If you want to see enhanced images, THAT book has
images that are INCREDIBLY over-enhanced.)

And the odds that I would give you AGAINST this particular photo being
a pre-shaped, alien artifact are along the order of 10,000,000 to 1.

The largest doundation for that being, simply put, that they just don't LOOK
like they HAVE to be an artifact.  Granted, there is a SLIM possiblity
that it COULD be non-natural in origin, but there is NO significant evidence
that I can see in either of the photos that indicates that there is symmetry
between the two sides, or that the effect is anything more than just
shadows.

Try this, try looking at the images from a completely different angle,
say, upside down or sideways,and THEN try to see if theere appears to be a
complete symmetry formed.

Sorry, bud...just don't see it.

Be seeing you...(and probably not IT! <g>)

--
         David "Maelstrom" Zecchini | "It may be better to be a live jackal
       [e-mail] | than a dead lion, but it is better still
 [e-mail] | to be a live lion.  And usually easier."
           [e-mail] | -Robert A. Heinlein
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From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  This Whole Mars Face Off
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 13:08:53 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Organization: STC Telecomms, New Southgate, London, N11 1HB
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Hi people,
    This is a quick digression from the debate.

    Jose Arguelles, in his book "The Mayan Factor" mentions a proposal by
Japanese-American artist, Isamu Noguchi. He wanted to build a sculpture, a mile
wide, of a face looking skyward. It was never built but the title of it was to
be "The Sculpture to be Seen from Mars". And this happened 29 years before the
Viking probe had photographed the Mars face.

    Pat
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From: [e-mail] (alexander aranyosi)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 07:32:59 GMT
References: <[e-mail] <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (alexander aranyosi)
Followup-To: sci.space
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gerry Roston) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> Frank T Lofaro <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>                                                        While it would
>   be crazy to say that all or most psychotics are really possessed by
>   demons, it is *perfectly reasonable* to say or believe that some or many
>   of them are. If someone gets possessed by a demon (which I *do* believe
>   happens, though not very often), they will appear to unenlightened
>   science to be mentally ill. Modern science does not comprehend, nor is
>   it intended to explain, phenomina that deal with non-physical entities,
>   such as demons. Scientists do not understand the soul, spirits, and
>   demons and how they affect what appears to them to be the "real" world.

Ok... let us take schizophrenia as an example.  Schizophrenia occurs in one
out of every 100 people.  In the present population, that amounts to about
50 million people worldwide.  Assume for the moment that some cases of
schizophrenia are caused by demon possession.  Even if the percentage of
cases is incredibly small, a large number of people would be possessed
by demons.  However, it has been shown that schizophrenia can be "cured"
(I use quotes, because stopping treatment causes a relapse) by treatment
with dopamine, a neurotransmitter.  Thus we can assume that some of these
cases of demon possession (assuming that this form of insanity happens
often enough to make it worth talking about at all) have been cured by
dopamine treatment.  The actual method by which dopamine cures schizophrenia
has not been established; it is only known that it works.  Since science
can be described as the task of naming and explaning things, it seems just
as reasonable to attribute the original problem to "demons" as to a "chemical
imbalance" (which, really, does not explain the problem any better than the
word "demons").  Thus we can say that demons and/or a chemical imbalance
cause schizophrenia.  Dopamine cures schizophrenia.  So dopamine counteracts
the action of either the demons or the chemical imbalance.  My point is that
the word "demons" is just another way of saying "something scientific
research hasn't explained yet," so it works just as well as "a chemical
imbalance" or "the oogily monster" to describe the problem.  Another good
example is gravity; as far as I am aware, no one knows the exact cause of
gravitational attraction.  It could be caused by a thousand demons inhaling
at the same time.  Because we can predict and model the effect of gravity
in any situation, it falls under the realm of science.  The point of
science is not "can we explain the reason behind every event that happens?";
that is left to philosophers.  The point of science is "can we explain
HOW an event happens, and can we predict its occurrence in the future?"
The existence or nonexistence of demons have absolutely nothing to do
with science.

A.J. Aranyosi
[e-mail]
(P.S. I know my handle is the name of a vampire.  I didn't pick it myself,
so don't blame me.  I personally wanted Wintermute. :)
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From: [e-mail] (Scott D. Young)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 06:49:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada
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In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Joshua Geller) writes:

>[e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:

>I don't know what it is, but I think the possibility that they are artifacts
>is real enough that I will take bets with attractive odds.

>josh

   A question...if they are left by some long-dead civilization, why is it
   we only found a face, and not football stadiums or cities or nuclear
   reactors?  I mean, if you are going to build something, and you can only
   build one "something" of such huge size (time/effort constraints, whatever)
   how many people would build a face that only hypothetical "aliens" (as in
   non-Martians) could see?  If someone in the government said, "Let's not
   build all those bombers, but a 200 mile long bust of Elvis," you know what
   they'd do to him?  They'd chase him up a tree and set fire to it.

      Such blatant stupidity and waste of resources *could* explain why these
   Martians aren't around anymore, though.  (OK, maybe one- Dan Quayle.)   :)

   Scott Young
   [e-mail]
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From: [e-mail] (Aaron Anderer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: jpeg viewer required
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 04:50:51 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone] Silicon Valley, Ca
Lines: 25

[e-mail] (Easter Beagle) writes:

>  So now we've got a ufo ftp site.
>
>  All the pictures are in jpeg format!
>
>  So how's 'bout a jpeg viewer from someone?

since jpeg is a 24bit color type file, on the pc there is not a viewer
for it(other than image alchemy).  but what you might want is
gif2jpg and jpg2gif, so you can view them with your favorite gif viewer.
you can get that from

                [e-mail]

                       send a message containing

/GET /public/ibm/graphics/gifjpg.zip

the file is approx 77k and is for the IBM PC/MS-Dos

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aaron Anderer, System Operator                [e-mail]
SPECTROX SYSTEMS [phone]              szebra!spectrx!system
NO MORE BUSH!          Write in Cuomo for '92!        NO MORE BUSH!
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: airships [was: Re:  Star Systems With Habitable Planets]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 18:27:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: The 'Jinky the Fruit Bat' Fan Club
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:
>I used to be an avid UFO buff for at least 10 years straight('68-78')
>approximately. I remember reading about sightings of dirigibles in the
>mid to late 1800's before they were manufactured and used.
>If this is accurate, they first appeared in modern times in the form
>of airships or zeppelins. It wasn't until mid 1940'(?) they were sighted
>as flying discs near Mt. Ranier in Washington state.
>Any support?

The odd thing about the airship sightings of the late 1800s is that a lot
of them included *human* occupants, and there were reports of humans
claiming to have built them.  There was a series about the phenomenon in
the May, June, and July 1973 issues of Fate.

Has anyone heard of C.A.A. Dellschau or a secret society called NYMZA,
other than through the Fate articles?

--
 *  From the disk of: | [e-mail]                 | "They don't tell me
 Jim Shaffer, Jr.     | uunet!cbmvax!vanth!jms         | nothin', so I find
 37 Brook Street      | [e-mail] | out all I can."
 Montgomery, PA 17752 | [e-mail]      |      (Phil Collins)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!spool.mu.edu!olivea!apple!netcomsv!hotcity!kirkm
From: [e-mail] (Kirk Marcroft)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Should there be less hostility towards new ideas and theories?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 09:05:48 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: BBS
Lines: 110

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Tarl
Neustaedter) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jon Noring) writes:
>> [ Skepticism about devils ]
>> (WARNING: I just can't take it anymore - it's been building for a long time -
>
>> this was the straw that broke the camels back!  I got to get on my soapbox an
>d
>> get it off my chest.)
>>
>> The rest of us, including me, should maintain a healthy, not an unhealthy
>> skepticism about alternative scientific theories.
>> [...healthy vs unhealthy skepticism...]
>> And why do I say this?  Well, it's pretty obvious from reading many postings
>> on Usenet that many (but not all) scientists and engineers are fairly
>> intolerant (read:  hostile) of ideas and theories that run counter to what
>> they were taught and now believe.
>
>There is a reason for this hostility. The random theories presented are
>frequently supplied by someone who doesn't know what he is talking about,
>and the hostile person will sometimes know more than a little about the
>subject being discussed. It can be very frustrating to deal with someone
>who claims to be able to invalidate centuries of work with a grandiose idea,
>and hasn't bothered to read as much as an elementary text in the subject
>being discussed.
>
>Ideas are a dime a dozen. Crackpots produce ideas by the gross tonne.
>Science, and indeed, knowledge itself, is not ideas. It is validated
>facts and mathematical relationships between cause and effect allowing
>accurate predictions to be generated.
>
>Anything less is simply useful for fertilizing petunias. Indistinguishable
>from what comes out of the south end of a north-bound steer.
>
>When someone has a fantastic idea about the structure of the universe,
>he/she/it should spend some time to determine whether this new idea
>violates any of the existing knowledge our society has built up in the
>past several centuries. If it does, perhaps what it violates should be
>re-examined; but until that happens, the new idea is useless. Note that
>re-examined means re-measuring whatever result you don't like; if said
>re-examination produces the same result, your idea has already failed.
>
>Presuming the new idea doesn't violate any existing knowledge (this will
>probably take several years to determine); Differences between what the
>new idea predicts and what the standard model (of whatever you are
>replacing) predicts should be determined. These will probably be tiny
>effects that will be difficult to observe - otherwise we would have seen
>them before. Then you should design and execute an experiment which
>tests the realms where the two models differ. This should take you
>several more years. At this point, you can publish.
>
>So much for what you should do; This group will never be used in that
>context. This group is for people arrogant enough to believe that they
>can, without detailed knowledge of a subject, use sheer inspiration to
>out-do everyone who came before them, who actually bothered to understand
>what they were dealing with. This group is for conspiracy theorists who
>believe that studying existing science will "pollute" them and destroy
>their inspiration. This group is for people who believe in fairies and
>divine inspiration being supreme over observation, math and hard work.
>
>Does that sound hostile? It should.
>
>Now, if you want to discuss new theories, discuss:
>   a) The solar neutrino problem. There was a recent paper addressing
>      this that hasn't made it out to the general press yet. What does
>      it say, and what are it's potential flaws?
>   b) Supernova mechanics. There are some known problems with the existing
>      supernova model, which were brought to light by Sanduleak -69.202
>   c) Developments in merging quantum mechanics with gravity; There have
>      been attempts, what have they involved, and what are their flaws?
>      Which changes have recently cropped up?
>   d) Cosmology; big-bang vs cyclic vs other; What evidence points to
>      which theories, what flaws do they have. What work has been done
>      in getting a big-bang to produce a non-isotropic universe?
>
>(my interest in astronomy is showing).
>
>   e) High-temeperature superconductivity in doped CuO ceramics. Changes
>      to the BCS theory to accomodate these superconductors - news about
>      work to determine if phonons are involved in these superconductors.
>
>If some of the potential changes or new theories are your own, so much the
>better. But if you have a theory on supernovas and don't know what the
>Chandrasekhar limit is, expect to get hammered.
>--
>         Tarl Neustaedter    [e-mail]
>         Marlboro, Mass.    Stratus Computer
>Disclaimer: My employer is not responsible for my opinions.
60
You are obviously an egotist! Who's to stuck on him self to concider other
peoples idea's. I consider any Idea to be valid. It is people like you that
pass over potential brake thruoughs using excuses like "that will never lead
any were!, we've tried that don't bother!, It will never work!". A good
example of this was the Magnetic Uranium Inrichment proccess that was given up
on back in the 50's by the American Gov. So what happens?! Iraq picks up the
idea about 15 years ago and inproves on it! so that it's efficient and
practical!
Yes I think if some one is going so far as to publish their idea that they do
need to support it with some kind of theory that can be broven in part.

As for radical idea's here's one that will likely choke most of you hard core
dogma types(as above). This is part of a theory that I hope to publish one
day. The basic idea involves extending the periodic table in to the 4th
demension. Why?. It would explain why matter is unstable at the top of the
periodic table as it stands now.

Wookie

P.S. It's people like you that made the dark ages popular and tried to stop
some one like  Neuton!
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!wupost!uunet!ogicse!orstcs!jacobs.CS.ORST.EDU!zzzk
From: [e-mail] (Ken Eshelby)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <zzzk.699178139@jacobs>
Date: 27 Feb 92 08:08:59 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Oregon State University, Computer Science Dept
Lines: 48
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4699 sci.space:27116 sci.skeptic:21095 alt.paranormal:4524
Nntp-Posting-Host: jacobs.cs.orst.edu

[e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:


>Alright, everyone...if you wanted my opinion in the first place, I figure
>that now's the best time to give it, after I've had a good chance to peruse
>the images.

>IMHO, there is NO
>I repeat, NO significant evidence that suggests that the potential facial
>features are symmetrical in nature, and the pattern of shadows appears
>to be a one-sided effect that leaves much too much to the imagination
>to be considered anything more than a natural formation.

  But, how can you just dismiss it?  If you can't see what the shadow
  hides, how do you, or don't you know that there is a face, with
  pupils (says Hoagland), and the whole sha-bang?.

>In other words, there probably isn't a right-hand side to the face, and
                       ^^^^^^^^
  That sounds like the speculation that proponents of the face use..

>No big deal.

  to you...

>I may be wrong, but at this point, that's my opinion, and hey, that's what
>opinions are all about, now isn't it.

  That's exactly right.

  It seems everyone is caught up on this face thing, and seem to regard
  the rest of the unusual objects on Cydonia, LIKE:  what about the
  complex that seems to be east of the face mesa?  The whole city
  fascinated me.  Was that all hooey?  Even the "Fort" and the "D&M
  Pyramid" and the calculations of the rise of the summer solstice with
  the cliff as a flat back drop, could be a result of a low res picture.

  But what if it's not?  Isn't taking the chance to go back and get better
  resolution photo's worth it?  I think THAT was Hoagland's point.  If we
  never ask, "What if?" then I guess we could just dismiss everything into
  non-existence.


>Be seeing you...

  On Mars, I hope!

-ken
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!csn!scicom!paranet!f816.n107.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Video-Photo-Documents Part3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 07:20:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 24

In a message to All <24 Feb 92 12:01> Steve Urich wrote:

 SU>        So...  Anybody seen these documents? They look pretty ratty,
 SU>        if I feel like it I'll weed thru it and see if anything is
 SU>        worth typing up. I just found this folder of all the UFO
 SU>        goodies that I had filed away since I got it back in 1987.

Hi Steve.  I don't know about the documents, but I have 5 GIFs on my BBS that ostensibly show an alien in a case of some kind.  The GIF files were captured some time ago from a video of the specimen.  It is the ghastliest little thing I've seen in a long, long time.

But having said that -- it looks familiar, doesn't it??  Jim Schaffer & I had some conversations about it on my board ... we both think it's fake (or a terrestial life-form, anyway).  But I can't for the life of me remember what it is.  For some reason, I keep thinking it's a seahorse -- the largest species can get a couple of feet long.  But the pictures I have don't resemble the seahorse ... so there we are.

Please let us know if you succeed in identifying it.

Best,
  Clark





--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ub!csn!scicom!paranet!f816.n107.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
From: [e-mail] (Clark Matthews)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 07:27:00 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:107/816 - The Wrong Num, Jersey City NJ
Lines: 135

In a message to All <24 Feb 92 12:01> Steve Urich wrote:

 SU>        My Review on the Satellite Photograph of a UFO.

 SU> First the Advertisement:

 SU>        A first time ever SATELLITE PHOTOGRAPH OF A U.F.O. with
 SU> documented authentication!

 SU>        This photograph was taken by a weather satellite, making it the
 SU> only OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT satellite photo ever released of a U.F.O! People
 SU> in the U.S. government call this photograph "IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE THAT
 SU> U.F.O's EXIST!!"


Steve, I think it's GREAT that you're obtaining and critiquing these UFO kits -- could you supply the addresses of the people who offer them?

Obviously your reviews of the Alien picture and the Satellite UFO affadavits convey a big caveat emptor -- but if you could supply the name/address of the people offering these kits, we could be sure of what we're getting.

I've got a lot of old Rex Research stuff here -- it's not about alien.visitors but is about Alternate Technology.  Maybe I could contribute some crits of this stuff -- which varies from interesting to laughable.

Thanks!
  Clark



 SU>        See the U.F.O as being V-shaped in the front and rectangular in
 SU> the rear, with a port vision, and four contrails. See the U.F.O flying
 SU> at 5000 miles per hour, while climbing out of the atmosphere. The Earth
 SU> is viewed in the background, documenting its presence!

 SU>        THIS IS CONCLUSIVE PROOF THAT U.F.O'S EXIST!!

 SU>        The satellite photo will cone to you, complete with one glossy
 SU> size 8"x10" color picture of the U.F.O., and all supporting AUTHENTICATED
 SU> DOCUMENTS.

 SU> DOUBLE YOUR MONEY BACK GUARENTEE, IF NOT AS ADVERTISED HEREIN!!

 SU> My Review Comment:

 SU>        SO!!! HAHAHAHA..... Well I did get a glossy 8"x10" picture of
 SU> a flying `Baseball HomeBase Plate' :-) There wasn't much color in the
 SU> color picture mostly some grayscale `blue-white'. I personnally don't
 SU> know what it is and to me it might just might be something so...
 SU> here is what the AUTHENTICATED DOCUMENTS say :-).

 SU> ---------------------------STARTING DOCS-----------------------------
 SU> Mid-America Remote sensing Center
 SU> Murray State Univ, Murray, KY
 SU>                                                        Oct 31, 1985

 SU> To Whom It May Concern:

 SU>        The image in question appears to be the output of a satellite
 SU> remote sensing device. To the best of my knowledge the information
 SU> depicted on the image in question is authentic.

 SU>                                                Thomas C. Kind, PhD.
 SU>                                                Professor
 SU>                                                Dept. of Geosciences

 SU> #2

 SU> To Whom It May Concern:

 SU> On the eveing of Oct 30, 1985, I examined an electronic negative image
 SU> which appears to be a genuine, untampered, unretouched image.

 SU> Stephen J Robertson
 SU> Owner, Robertson's Creative Photography

 SU> #3

 SU> Southeast Missouri State Univ.
 SU> Cape Girardeau, Missouri
 SU>                                                Friday, Nov 1, 1985

 SU> To Whom It May Concern:

 SU>        I am Professor of Physics (highest rank) at Southeast Missouri
 SU> State Univ. hold tenure, and served as chairman of the department of
 SU> physics for nearly twenty years. I have not served as chairman for about
 SU> three years.
 SU>        I have held several offices in state science organizations,
 SU> including the office of President of the Missouri Academy of Science and
 SU> President of the American Association of
 SU> Physics Teachers, Missouri Section.

 SU>                                                Dr Harley D. Rutledge

 SU> (Notice the above person never mentions the Photograph :-)

 SU> #4

 SU> Southeast Missouri State Univ.
 SU> Cape Girardeau, Missouri
 SU>                                                Nov 1, 1985

 SU> To whom it may concern:

 SU> I have examined the imagery of concern to Dr. Rutledge.
 SU> The background terrain appears to match a portion of irregular
 SU> coastline and associated islands centered approximately 40 kilometers
 SU> southwest of Vladivostok, U.S.S.R., in the vicinity of latitude 43deg
 SU> N; longitude 331deg E.

 SU>                                ?. Ray Knox
 SU>                                Professor of Geology

 SU> ==============================EOT DOCS===============================

 SU> --
 SU> ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP
 SU> |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 SU> ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me
 SU> in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 SU> ###############----------------------|Ve
 SU> ###############----------------------|Ve SU> ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo
 SU> |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 SU> ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo
 SU> |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 SU> ##
 SU> ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 SU> ####       ####Amateur Radio Packet:
 SU> [e-mail]####       ####
 SU> _###############_________________________
 SU> ###############_________________________
 SU> --- ConfMail V4.00
 SU> * Origin: Paranet(sm) - The world's leading UFO Investigative

--
Clark Matthews - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!pa.dec.com!shodha.enet.dec.com!timpson
From: [e-mail] (Steve Timpson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 13:58:29 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
Lines: 25


In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes...
>
>     This is to all those who think I am nuts or just playing a
>vicious joke on you all.  I AM the guy who jumped onto the live


        Gary,

        Everything you  have  written  in  this  file proves that you are
        either a RAVING  MAD MAN or an utter FRAUD.  Personally I believe
        that you believe what  you are writing but I also believe you are
        a complete lunatic.  You need help desperatly.

        You  are  not  going to find any believers here in the  world  of
        reality which you apparently have no concept of.  I would suggest
        you find  a  good  shrink and work real hard on getting a grip on
        yourself.

        Steve Food_for_the_Grays

        P.S  I have a coworker who claims  that  he  is the original Gary
        Stollman and you are a clone that  went  bad and escaped from the
        local  Clone  demolition  planet and that you should  be  Soylent
        Green right now.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!utzoo!henry
From: [e-mail] (Henry Spencer)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 16:40:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail] <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: U of Toronto Zoology
Lines: 8
Xref: ns-mx sci.space:27122 alt.paranormal:4525 alt.alien.visitors:4703 sci.skeptic:21099

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (alexander aranyosi) writes:
>Ok... let us take schizophrenia as an example...

Can this discussion PLEASE be taken out of sci.space?  It has lost whatever
tenuous connection it ever had to spaceflight.
--
The X Window system is not layered, and | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
it was not designed. -Shane P. McCarron |  [e-mail]  utzoo!henry
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!stl!stc!patb
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Crop Circles
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 16:50:04 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Organization: BNR Europe, New Southgate, London. N11 1HB.
Lines: 18

Greetings Earthlings,

    Jim Shaeffer (I think) recently wondered whether the mandelbrot crop
circle which appeared in England last year was a hoax. I cannot prove it was or
was not but here is part of what the magazine, "Kindred Spirit" (Winter 1991)
has to say on it:

    "...Farming neighbours recorded the formation on cine film; they were
convinced it could not have been hoaxed, the corn had been flattened evenly,
there were single stems of standing wheat between the circles, there were no
footmarks or signs of machinery..."

    Pat
--
Patrick Brosnan.  <[e-mail]> || ...!mcsun!ukc!stc!patb
Northern Telecomm, Oakleigh Rd South, London N11 1HB. Phone : [phone]

"In Lake'ch (I am another yourself)" - Mayan code of honour.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!stl!stc!patb
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Recent juvenile posts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 16:59:34 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (System Administration)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Patrick Brosnan)
Organization: STC Telecomms, New Southgate, London, N11 1HB
Lines: 9

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Richard Vowles) writes:
>
>Regarding the recent posts from various members of Dimension BBS that
>pass through this BBS, they have been spoken to and will refrain from
>doing it in the future.
>
I hope it was quick and painless.

    Pat
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!aero.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (R. S. Statsinger)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 18:05:00 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Ssaymssik Inc.
Lines: 9

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>
> [inanities ommitted]
>

Stollman, you are a LUNATIC. PLEASE commit yourself to an institution
before you hurt yourself or anyone else.

RS
Path: ns-mx!uunet!usc!aero.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (R. S. Statsinger)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 18:11:26 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Ssaymssik Inc.
Lines: 6

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>
> [psychotic babbling ommitted]
>

Stollman, you are a RAVING LUNATIC.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!decwrl!mcnc!duke!jek
From: [e-mail] (this space for rent)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Fireball???
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 17:09:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Duke University Computer Science Dept.; Durham, N.C.
Lines: 26

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Reply to [e-mail]) writes:
>
>I heard a quick mention on a local radio station here in Boston of a
>'fireball' seen in the sky sometime earlier this week, or last weekend.
>I believe the reporter said it had been seen by people in 3 states, and
>I thought it was in the Carolina's, but don't hold me to that.
>It was mentioned that there was still no explaination of what it was.
>Did anyone else hear or read anything about this???

I didn't see it.

But, in March of 1989, I did see most of the northern part of the sky
turn blood red, with a large white 'V' with its vertex just above the
horizon and the open part close to the zenith.

Pretty freaky, if you ask me.

Of course, it turned out to just be the effects of unusually strong
atmospheric ionization (?) and the V was a couple of jet contrails.
This particular atmospheric disturbance caused sightings of the aurora
borealis all the way down to Jamaica, as I recall.  Pretty nifty.

--
James Kittock -- Class of 92 -- Computer Science/Mathematics, Duke University
[e-mail] | mcnc!duke!jek | PO Box 5750, Duke Station, Durham, NC 27706
  I would gladly risk feeling bad, if only I could taste my dessert. - Data
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!wupost!ukma!asuvax!anasaz!qip!billy
From: billy@anasaz (Bill Moore)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part1
Keywords: Review Footage
Message-ID: <1992Feb24.172432.4575@anasaz>
Date: 24 Feb 92 17:24:32 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Anasazi, Inc.  Phoenix, Az
Lines: 30

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve Urich) writes:

... stuff introducing the Meiers film deleted ...
->
->    See dematerialization and rematerialization of the U.F.O. See the
->strange light shift that occurs during the tranformation! See a UFO as big
->as a HOUSE hovering above a well traveled hightway! Hear the sound of this

Watch the tree branches, not the UFO, during this sequence.  The splice
can be seen very easily with the naked eye.  The "light shift" and sudden
jump of the branches shows the change in lighting and wind conditions
between the two sequences. Also, in other sequences, watch the cloud patterns
in the background to see where splices occur.

->They ruled out trick photography because of the more then 1/120 second
->frame speed of the dematerialization and rematerialization. It couldn't
->be done so that part was true. They ruled out the saucer on a string by

Horn swoggle.  This particular sequence was a large part of why Mr. Meiers
was discredited.  As decribed above, changes in "swaying" branches and
lighting conditions from one frame to the next are indicitive of splicing,
not magic.  What's "true" is that the film was altered.

... more horn swoggle deleted ...


--
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
     Bill Moore     [e-mail]    [phone]
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!ukma!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 20:26:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 100

[e-mail] (Clark Matthews) writes:

>Steve, I think it's GREAT that you're obtaining and critiquing these UFO kits -- could you supply the addresses of the people who offer them?

Sure can but let me warn you this stuff was purchased back around 1987.
I'm surprised you didn't get any UFO junk from them I'm sure you did.
I bought a book out of a magazine, somehow they got my last name mispelled.
So everytime I see my last name mispelled that way I know it was Junk mail
for UFO and even New Age mailorder places. I think they might have turned
to NewAge `warez' :-). I haven't seen any UFO junkmail in a while here is
the address. Ask them for the UFO catalog I guess.

Book Brokers
P.O. Box 13924
Orlando, FLA 32859

The last catalog I got from them I think was when I bought the
Video/Photo/Document Kit from them.

They have loads of stuff, books, UFO audio Tapes of UFO witnesses,
Investigators and Researchers.

Here is a list of the Audio Tapes:

Ann Druffel- Southern California Straight Line Mystery in UFO Sightings
Stanton Friedman- Fact, Fiction, and Flying Saucers
Richard Haines- Photo Analysis of an Alleged UFO
Cynthia Hind- African Tribal Reaction to UFO's
Alan Holt- UFO Propulsion; Pulsed radiator nad Crystalline Structure
J. Allen Hynek- The case angainst "ET"
Bill Moore- UFO's ...Most Highly Classified Subject
Richard Neal- The Abduction Phenomena
Richard Niemtzow- Physiological Effects from luminous U.A. Phenomena
Jacques Vallee- Techniques for screening UFO reports
Travis Walton- "UFO abductee"

$5.00 Each at the time...

Also a list of tapes made from the 24th Annual UFO Conference, Burbank, CA
June 12-14 1987

Looks like all of the above were at the conference so I won't waste time
typing the list :-).

Here is a Video List they had:

UFO'S ARE REAL........(90MIN)
UFO: TOP SECRET.......(90MIN)
BEAMSHIP; THE MOVIE FOOTAGE (59MIN)
BEAMSHIP; THE METAL...(45MIN)
BEAMSHIP; THE MEIER CHRONICLES (100MIN)

Beamship; The Metal sounds interesting listen to this:

The remarkable metal specimans delivered to the Swiss contactee be the
Pleiadian cosmonauts represented various states of their spacecraft
developement and contributed conclusive evidence supporting Meier's claims.
Examined by an eminent IBM scientist utilizing an electron scanning
microscope, an unseen world appears through the lens to reveal the amazing
properties of the tiny fragments. Observe the laboratory analysis as it
opens the many secrets of the alien metal. Hear the astonished voice of the
scientists an the mysteries unveil... discover the unusual combination of
metals... the unique purity of substance... and the strange bonding of
material which is impossible to achieve on our planet! These and other
startling findings caused scientists form four major institutions to shake
their heads in astonishment and state publicly, "This metal is NOT of Earth
origin."


>Obviously your reviews of the Alien picture and the Satellite UFO affadavits convey a big caveat emptor -- but if you could supply the name/address of the people offering these kits, we could be sure of what we're getting.

    The Satellite Photo is a Real satallite photo, if it wasn't so
    symetrical in shape I would have said it was a `freak accident' in
    the cloud cover but because of its shape it looks real.

    The picture of the Alien looks like a real bad Xerox photo copy of
    something :-). I can only go by the dimensions of the body and from
    what seems to be a dwarf with long arms a large carcas torso and
    short legs.

>I've got a lot of old Rex Research stuff here -- it's not about alien.visitors but is about Alternate Technology.  Maybe I could contribute some crits of this stuff -- which varies from interesting to laughable.

    Yea sound great, there was a Telsa Coil and Jacobs Latter thread in
    sci.electronics a while back.

>Thanks!
>  Clark

No Problem! Let the Net know if you get a catalog, maybe there will be some
new stuff available.
Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!hela.iti.org!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFO Video-Photo-Documents Part3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 20:46:18 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 44


[e-mail] (Clark Matthews) writes:
>In a message to All <24 Feb 92 12:01> Steve Urich wrote:
[My comments deleted]

>Hi Steve.  I don't know about the documents, but I have 5 GIFs on my BBS that ostensibly show an alien in a case of some kind.  The GIF files were captured some time ago from a video of the specimen.  It is the ghastliest little thing I've seen in a long, long time.

    If its the same alien specimen here is what the files that I got
    say about the the case it is enclosed in.

The containers, which resembled a cross between glass covered funeral
caskets and deep -freeze units, were tailor made to suit the ptimary-
preserve these uniqe bodies for study. These containers operated on the
principles of a cryogenic deep freeze unit, utilizing liquid covers and
vented and exhausted in such a way that it was possible to view the bodies
without opening the special display case. Other specimens were prepared for
ordinary cryogenic storage in teh wrappings and stored in cylinders for
possible future need. In this way these vary unusual and unique bodies of
unkown origin could be preserved indefinitely.


    Sounds a bit like the Hollywood UFO movie `Wavelength' doesn't it?

>But having said that -- it looks familiar, doesn't it??  Jim Schaffer & I had some conversations about it on my board ... we both think it's fake (or a terrestial life-form, anyway).  But I can't for the life of me remember what it is.  For some reason, I keep thinking it's a seahorse -- the largest species can get a couple of feet long.  But the pictures I have don't resemble the seahorse ... so there we are.
>
>Please let us know if you succeed in identifying it.

    Like I said on the other post, It is impossible to Identify
    anything that was Xerox copied a million times because of the bad
    resolution decay each time you make a copy. :-)

>Best,
>  Clark

Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!hela.iti.org!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: More Dead Bodies
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 21:20:11 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 67


    Here is another quick Xerox copy of an article about Dead E.T.
    Specimens.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=Inserted Article-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

4000-YEAR-OLD CORPSE IS REALLY A SPACE ALIEN, SAYS SCIENTIST
By: Alan Trexler

A bandage-wrapped mummy once thought to be that of an Egyptian princess is
actually the corpse of a space alien who died 4,000 years ago, a top Soviet
scientist reports.

Dr. Yury Ustinov told a gathering of researchers in Antwerp, Belguim, that
Xrays of the mummy clearly show that it is not human, even though it had
been touted as such since its discovery in the 1920s.

The creature was only four feet long, he added.

And a metal plate on its chest bears an inscription that strongly suggests
it came from another planet. "the archaeological discovery of the century
has been right under our noses for decades and we didn't even know it,"
said Dr. Ustinov.

Dr. Ustinov told scientists the mummy was obtained from an East German
research facility that had kept it in storage since purchasing it from a
collector in 1962.

It was routinely Xrayed after its arrival in Moscow, he added. And that's
when the excitement began.

"The first thing we noticed was the inscription on a small golden plate on
its chest." said the expert.

"It said:'Amenemon... beloved of pharaoh who came from the stars to command
the chariots of the host... who died in the 106th year of his
life...beloved of Amon...'

"It would appear that the alien Amenemon arrived on Earth from a distant
planet, lived an inordinately long time and was held in the highest esteem
by royalty.

"He must have looked very much out of place," continued Dr. Ustinov.

"Our study shows that he was humaniod. But he had an elongated skull with
distinct bulges over the eyes.

"The hands had six fingers with no fingernails. The brain capacity was very
large." Strangely enough, a gaping chest wound indicates that the alien was
killed by a spear or sword and the skull definitely had been clubbed.

"There's no doubt that he was murdered," said Dr. Ustinov.

"It would be most interesting to find out why."

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-End of Article-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!ames!news.dfrf.nasa.gov!ra.dfrf.nasa.gov!shafer
From: [e-mail] (Mary Shafer)
Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: Face on Mars FAQ posting
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 22:43:44 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet news)
Organization: NASA Dryden, Edwards, Cal.
Lines: 44
Xref: ns-mx sci.space:27140 alt.alien.visitors:4713 sci.skeptic:21110 alt.paranormal:4526
In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of 26 Feb 92 10:50:47 GMT

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Geoff McCaughan) writes:

   [e-mail] (Stefan Hartmann) writes:

   > Hmm,
   > I think You forgot to mention, that there are nearby the face (15 Km away) a
   > "pyramids", which are more interesting, than the "face", because such
   > rectangular and symetrical shadows can only be produced by something artifici
   > We should focus onto the "pyramids" in our discussion , because the face coul
   > also be a "well" illuminated mountain !

   So could the pyramids.

   Grab a dictionary, look up 'ventifact', this will give you a clue.
   Finding one could be trickier, try a museum in a large city, or a text
   on geology/geography. If you see one, you might understand those
   pictures better.

   The museum here has a nice one from Antartica on display.

Or a good library with a copy of "Geomorphology from Space: A Global
Overview of Regional Landforms" (NASA SP-486.

Or come look at my slides from our trip to Antarctica--there are only
about 800 of them and most only have short stories to go with them.
A lot of stuff that looks manmade.

   Be very careful with assertions like "can only be produced by something
   artificial", there may be a mundane explanation ready to jump out and
   surprise you.

Or get in an airplane near sunrise or sunset.

Then there's the time I saw a Kelvin-Helmholtz instability in the
clouds, with about 8 of the forms.  This looks about as unnatural as
you can imagine (it makes a very regular set of swirls, sort of like
very stylized ocean waves) and probably would really startle someone
who hasn't suffered through fluid mechanics.  Sure is pretty.

--
Mary Shafer  DoD #0362 KotFR NASA Dryden Flight Research Facility, Edwards, CA
[e-mail]                    Of course I don't speak for NASA
 "There's no kill like a guns kill." LCDR "Hoser" Satrapa, gunnery instructor
                       "A kill is a kill."  Anonymous
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!uvaarpa!mcnc!duke!jek
From: [e-mail] (this space for rent)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 20:41:06 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Duke University Computer Science Dept.; Durham, N.C.
Lines: 92

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>
>     This is to all those who think I am nuts or just playing a
>vicious joke on you all.

Vicious joke?  Hell no, this is prime entertainment.

>I AM the guy who jumped onto the live
>set of KNBC in 1987 and held a toy gun to the head of Consumer
>Advocate David Horowitz, and forced him to read a statement on
>live tv about how the CIA and alien forces had taken over my
>family and replaced them with clones of some kind.  I DID it
>not out of insanity, but out of desperation, having had exhausted
>all "normal" means of aquiring relief from the devious things that
>were happening to my family and friends and the people around me.

I know what you mean.  I tried to get help when I woke up one morning
and realized I was not, in fact, myself, but rather a clone of myself
who had been programmed to act like me.  Unfortunately, the real me
found out and came to get me.  So I had to defend myself, of course,
except that in the end I wasn't really defending myself, but rather
wound up destroying myself, or rather, what used to be me.  In the
end, I just had a beer and everything worked out OK.

>I have since learned that these things have been demonic in
>nature, and HAVE involved the secret government behind the U.S.
>government.  I HAVE had angels sent by God trying to save me, and
>one of these DID take the place of my mom in an effort to save my
>family.

Oh yeah, me too.  Well, I suppose I should be more specific.  I had
angel food cake.  Didn't go so hot with the beer, but hey, can't have
everything.

>YES, I KNOW how it sounds, but I swear that it is
>the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, which is
>what I SHOULD have said five years ago at a trial which didn't
>take place.

You forgot the "so help me god" part.  So you would have been in deep
trouble at that trial which didn't take place, but might have although
it very well could have gone wrong considering you weren't going to
say the right thing.

>     Now, I know this is ridiculous, impossible, and so forth, to
>believe to the "average" person, but it IS the truth!

I don't consider myself an "average" person, but I still think it is
ridiculous, if that helps you gauge your lunacy any.


>I am
>currently in the process of writing a book about the whole thing,
>titled, "The Invasion of the Human Race" which is pretty
>appropriate.

Ooh.  How much money do you want me to send you?  My VISA number
is 4838 8337 1039 0666; just bill me.

>Please believe me when I say that these things are all serious and
>quite serious as well.

I believe that these things are serious-- a serious sign of someone
who either 1) took too many hallucinogens, 2) went crazy for
non-chemical reasons, or 3) had a hairdryer fall into the tub with
them, but survived.

>God IS
>bringing the matter to a close.  I have a personal relationship
>with Him,

Hey, what is this, a smear campaign against "God" now?  And I
thought we were done with that now that the Clinton business was
pretty much worn out.

>The stuff about Jesus and other dimensions is the honest truth.

What stuff? I remember stuff about Jesus & bread & fish & the cross.
I missed the part about other dimensions.  Was that in Buckaroo Banzai
or something?

>Take care, and I will give you more details when possible.

You do that.  I need evidence of my own sanity once in a while.

>     Gary Stollman

--Dr. Jekyll
--
James Kittock -- Class of 92 -- Computer Science/Mathematics, Duke University
[e-mail] | mcnc!duke!jek | PO Box 5750, Duke Station, Durham, NC 27706
  I would gladly risk feeling bad, if only I could taste my dessert. - Data
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!agate!ucbvax!stratus.swdc.stratus.com!lpb
From: [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone])
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: OIL BARONS SUPPRESS EMERGING TECHNOLOGIES
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 00:05:35 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 188



INSIGHTS INTO THE PROPRIETARY SYNDROME

By KEN MacNEILL

Cadake Industries
Winter Haven, Florida

PART I

To give you some background on myself, I have been interested in the
energy situation since I can remember.  I have built all kinds of
devices, solar energy panels, windmills, photovoltaic arrays, flywheel
devices, and also carburetors of which I will talk on Sunday.  In my
background I am an accomplished tool and diemaker, moldmaker, been
involved in Design Engineering for the past 12 years, primarily in the
automation area.

My first real involvement with other people in this alternate energy
area was at the Toronto Symposium in 1981 where I met George Hathaway as
well as over 100 other people that believe in the impossible according
to orthodox science.  Since that time I have made myself aware of just
about everything that is happening in this field, and believe me there
are some really fantastic things going on.  The rediscovery of some of
the technology that was lost in the past is finally coming to
realization, for instance the Tesla technology, the Hubbard device, the
Moray approach to tapping into the free energy supply that we're sitting
in without even knowing it.

A friend of mine gave me a real insight possibly without even knowing
it.  He said the problem could only be solved by just considering the
problem of weighing a glass of water at 500 feet under water.  Here you
are under water with a glass of water:  how do you weigh it???

The analogy is the same for us.  Here we sit in the vastness of the
cosmos on top of one of the biggest magnets known to us and we are like
the glass of water.  We are in the vast ocean of energy.  Look around us
and watch just the weather for instance, the next thunderstorm, think of
all the electrical potential being wasted.  That energy is there;  it is
very real.

Tom Bearden, one of our upcoming speakers, may have illustrated it quite
well by the bird sitting on top of the wire with 13,000 volts going
through it.  We all know that it could kill him but it doesn't.  I am
positive that within this group will be found the ways and means for making
the energy situation of the future change.

Now to the other side of this coin.  Why has'nt this technology been
allowed to become established?  We have to look at the 'profit motive'
involved.  If we have free energy, how will they charge for it?  What
will happen to the billions of dollars that the utilities and oil
companies and the government backing these establishments do if we can
give the people independence from the chains of having to pay for
energy?

One question that has been uppermost in my mind for the last year has
been the rhetoric given by our elected representatives about the energy
situation and the amount of money given to small researchers who could
possibly give us a viable approach to becoming energy independent.  Who
gets the government money??  Let me get a little audience participation
in the question.  How many of you have all the money you need for
research in the energy area?  Everyone who has please stand!!!!!  Now
let me mention a few of the names of the companies that get the money.
See if you recognize them:  Exxon, Gulf Oil, General Electric,
Westinghouse, TRW, Exide Storage Battery, all manufacturers or producers
of fossil fuel products.  We need to get away from the fossil fuels for
the future and get into something that can indeed give us a future
because we are rapidly depleting not only our natural resources but our
air and water.  All because of burning fossil fuels.  We fund our
universities and colleges in the most directed of ways.  If you want to
explore the possibilities in some some of the more esoteric areas, for
instance the ones you will be hearing about in the next three days,
there is no money for that.  WHY???  Because of the possibility that we
might succeed.  What would our government do if all the American people
could go back and forth to work, heat their homes, run their businesses
without paying taxes on gas and oil?  Consider the fact that all of the
gas stations would go out of business or would have to find other ways
of making money.  Many complimentary businesses would also fold.  But
alas, this is America.  What are we here for???  To perpetuate Big
Business, Big Government, or to advance toward the future, not expending
all of our natural resources but to save them to make the goods of the
future.  Coal and oil both can be used for making all kinds of things
besides fuels;  the list is endless.

It is my feeling that the technology may be already here and may have
been shown to the government.  It even may have been introduced to our
patent office and turned down.  Because as you know, there is no such
thing as a perpetual motion device.  And I agree with the premise
because forever is a long time.

But there are surely some of the devices or parts thereof that have been
introduced to the government or to big business in the past which have
been shelved.  Tesla's transmission device is a classic illustration
probably best known to this group.  What happened is that they removed
the money from him to do his research and effectively stifled this
remarkable man.  How many other times has it happened to someone not so
well known?  At this moment, there are over 3,000 devices or
applications in the patent office that have been branded as security or
put under wraps by the secrecy order, Title 35, U.S. Code (1952)
Sections 181-188.  What is security?  How is it defined?  I have had
many inventors or other scientists tell me that they did not want to
discuss their invention with me or others because they might lose it to
us or we might tell someone else before they got it onto the market.
Believe me, it won't get there by going through the patent process.  It
is my feeling that if such a device were introduced at this level, then
it would be put under the Secrecy Act.  I don't know that I am correct
in this assumption.  But I cannot imagine a government like ours wanting
to commit financial suicide.  So what better way than to brand something
as a secret?

I would like to read the Secrecy Order to you so that you may better
understand my concern.  Please pay close attention.  I think it is very
important.  To you or anyone!!!  Consider your receiving this:


SECRECY ORDER
(Title 35, United States Code (1952), sections 181-188)

NOTICE:  To the applicant above named, his heirs, and any and all
of his assignees, attorneys and agents, hereinafter designated
principals:

You are hereby notified that your application as above identified
has been found to contain subject matter, the unauthorized
disclosure of which might be detrimental to the national security,
and you are ordered in nowise to publish or disclose the invention
or any material information with respect thereto, including
hitherto unpublished details of the subject matter of said
application, in any way to any person not cognizant of the
invention prior to the date of the order, including any employee
of the principals, but to keep the same secret except by written
consent first obtained of the Commissioner of Patents, under the
penalties of 35 U.S.C. (1952) 182, 186.

Any other application already filed or hereafter filed which
contains any significant part of the subject matter of the above
identified application falls within the scope of this order.  If
such other application does not stand under a security order, it
and the common subject matter should be brought to the attention
of the Security Group, Licensing and Review, Patent Office.

If, prior to the issuance of the secrecy order, any significant
part of the subject matter has been revealed to any person, the
principals shall promptly inform such person of the secrecy order
and the penalties for improper disclosure.  However, if such part
of the subject matter was disclosed to any person in a foreign
country or foreign national in the U.S., the principals shall not
inform such person of the secrecy order, but instead shall
promptly furnish to the Commissioner of Patents the following
information to the extent not already furnished:  date of
disclosure;  name and address of the disclosee;  identification of
such part;  and any authorization by a U.S. government agency to
export such part.  If the subject matter is included in any
foreign patent application, or patent, this should be identified.
The principals shall comply with any related instructions of the
Commissioner.

This order should not be construed in any way to mean that the
Government has adopted or contemplates adoption of the alleged
invention disclosed in this application;  nor is it any indication
of the value of such invention.
-------------------------------------

It is my feeling that something on the order of a so-called 'free energy
device' would receive this treatment.  My only approach would be to go
to the public domain.  That is, get the information or the device out
there to enough people that they could not stop you.  This group looks
like the best group to give this information to.  Hopefully it will
forthcoming in the next three days.

-------

Transcribed from:  PROCEEDINGS;  The Second International Symposium on
Non-Conventional Energy Technology, pp 125-126.

I have been told this was presented on September 23, 1983.

Contact Ken MacMeill at Cadake Industries, P.O. Box 1866, Clayton, GA
30525.

*******


----- End Included Message -----


----- End Included Message -----
Path: ns-mx!uunet!jwt!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Stollman)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 15:51:37 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (Waffle login)
Organization: The Matrix
Lines: 115


     Here are some of the more lively details about my situation:

     In 1981, I was attending school at my new home Tallahassee,
at Tallahassee Community College.  When I walked in to register
for classes, I knew something was wrong right away.  Almost all
the kids from the previous day had dropped ALL their classes.  It
just didn't make any sense.  Also, kids were being taken away out
different exits at random intervals, and had a look on their faces
as if they wouldn't be seen again.  The whole thing was like some
kind of a show.  It was totally different from the place I had
discovered the year before by computer hacking.

     The semester was a joke.  Some of the kids in my classes were
obviously with SOME kind of intelligence agency, or at least that
was the impression I got.  There was so much bs going on it was
unreal.  I wound up going to a counselor there, and demanded to
know why these people had been placed in my classes for the
purpose of spying on me.  You see, I had been followed around the
country for years by rich kids from California, who held SOME kind
of a grudge against me for SOMETHING.  I had made a lot of
powerful enemies in high school and I believe now that this was
part of a more general conspiracy against me and my family.

     In any case, I would up in this counselors' office, and she
asked me who to call, and I said I didn't know.  She said, "What
about the Sheriffs office?"  I said fine, and she picked up the
phone and dialed the number.  She spoke for a few moments, then
turned to me and said, "It's Sgt. Parramoore, Gary.  He says it's
what you're thinking!"  She then took down his name and told me he
wanted to meet with me at the courthouse that day to tell me all
about it.  I was greatly relieved to learn that someone of
authority was going to confide in me what was going on.  I didn't
make it to the courthouse!  I stupidly asked one of the kids in my
psychology class to go with me as a witness.  It turned out he was
with the CIA or FBI or somebody, cause when we got to the
courthouse, he went into the marriage bureau and asked for the
guy.  Then he told me he knew him, and that he was over at the
Sheriff's station across town.  So we drove over there, and when
we walked into the watch commanders office and explained the
sitution to him, he didn't know what the hell we were talking
about.  Then this "student" asked me to step out in the hall a
moment so he could talk to the cop alone for a minute.  He closed
the door and when it opened a minute later, he said, "You can come
back in now, Gary!"  The watch commander was looking at me like I
was some kind of hired assassin, and they had the counselor at the
school on the phone.  She asked me to go into a small mental
hospital for a while, and I told her to go to hell.  Then I hung
up and sat down in a chair at the cops desk and asked what the
heck was going on here.  The "student" says to me this, "Gary,
these people wouldn't be following you around the country unless
they had a good reason, or there was a PLOT TO KILL THE
PRESIDENT!!!  He screamed the bold type at me.  Now, I'll just bet
you anything that when he shut that door, he whipped some REAL
heavy duty ID out at the cop to make him think twice about telling
me anything or believing ANYTHING I might say!  In any case, I had
lost the first round, and I drove the guy back to school.  On the
way back, he took pleasure in screaming out the window at the top
of his lungs at people and waving at them furiously as if in a
frenzy.  This was a real nice guy, whoever he REALLY was!  You can
guess they got to this Parramoore guy, cause guess what!!??  When
I called the operator (the TELEPHONE OPERATOR) and asked for
information for the sheriff's office, she asked who I wanted to
speak to there, and I told her, and then she asked me who I was,
so I told her.  Then SHE says, "Well, have you ever MET Sgt.
Parramoore before?!  As she was saying that, two guys in track
suits carrying walkie-talkies came running up and took down the
number of the pay phone I was at.  I was to experience a lot of
the same during the rest of the time.

The day before I went to the sheriff's office, I went to the
Attorney Generals office at the Capitol building, and demanded to
know who was in my classes.  The secretary there, told me politely
to wait, then disappeared.  A few minutes later, another secretary
appeared, sat down at the desk, then sudddenly and violently
grabbed the phone, which hadn't rung, and screamed into it,
"HELLO, OPERATOR, OPERATOR!!!"  You can guess my reaction.  Then
she so politely told me that the Attorney General was a very busy
man, and he couldn't see me, but if I would go over to an office
downtown, their consumer complaints chief would talk to me about
it.  As I was walking out the door, she said loudly, "GOOD LUCK!"

     I walked into this two-bit office, with a paper sign taped
onto it in the basement of a building downtown.  Inside, a burly
man was discussing how much money he could get from running stolen
cars across state borders in a extremely loud voice.  When he got
off the phone, he told me that the "chief" would be there in a few
minutes and to have a seat at his desk.  I sat down.  A minute or
so later, a man who was at least 7 feet tall walked in and slumped
into the chair in front of me.  He had a short beard, and a
totally ragged look about him.  He looked like the perfect CIA
operative.  He just sat there staring me down for a few moments,
then he raised himself up on the chair and said slowly and
methodically, "WHY ARE THESE PEOPLE FOLLOWING YOU??"  I was
shocked that he even knew, because I hadn't told them anything at
the Attorney Generals office.  I freaked out and said, "I DON'T
KNOW!!!"  He said, "But for SEVEN YEARS!!  Why, if they wanted you
out of the way, they would have just WASTED you!!!"  Didn't sound
like your typical consumer advocate to me either.  Then he went
into a lot of drug-paraphenalia type talk, and asked me if I had
any concrete proof that these people were following me around.  I
told him that I had taken down license numbers over the years.  He
then became intensely interested, leaned forward on the desk and
said, "I NEED that list!"  I told him I didn't have it on me, and
he left me there, and ushered me out of the office after giving me
"his" card, on which he crossed out the regular guys number and
put another and said if I would give him license numbers, he would
check it out.

     Well, that is how this all really started, the intensely
painful stuff anyways.  It is late, so I will add more as time
permits.  Take Care, fellow humans!!


     Gary Stollman
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!cleveland.Freenet.Edu!aa440
From: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Don Ecker:  Super Star on Radio?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 01:39:37 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dale Wedge)
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA)
Lines: 10
Nntp-Posting-Host: cwns5.ins.cwru.edu


I've from the Ecker himself that he is going to be on the radio.
It would seem that it is some obscure National Ratio Network that
know one knows about.

If anyone knows if anyone is going to carry his program, or even
knows what the hell I'm talking about, let me know.

Don has a face for radio and is quite good.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!ihz.compuserve.com!dzecchini
From: [e-mail] (Dave Zecchini)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 01:35:43 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <zzzk.699178139@jacobs>
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
Lines: 41
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4718 sci.space:27143 sci.skeptic:21121 alt.paranormal:4528

As an added defense to my earlier opinions:

My ideal that there is no apparent symmetry to the face is stemming from
much more realistic scientific bounds than from emotional ones.  This
is why I lay the odds much more on the side of a non-symmetrical foundation
than on a potential artifact.

Look at it THIS way:

    1:) At least half of the entire "face" is completely shrouded
        in shadows, thus meaning that there could be a leveled
        out portion or not BUT THAT WE CANNOT KNOW FOR CERTAIN.

    2:) IF there is a symmetry to the "face", then this STILL does
        not prove it is an artifact, only that it is yet another
        in an extremely large number of bizarre-seeming, yet
        perfectly natural formations that APPEAR to be of
        something we recognize.  It's origin may have been non-
        natural, but the odds against that are much higher than
        they are for it being an interesting natural phenomenon.

    3:) Looking at the enhanced images, it becomes clear to me that
        there are very VERY many possible configurations for the
        other side that would still produce the SAME shadows as a
        symmetrical one would, but only really ONE that would fit a
        symmetrical model.

    Thus, if you're looking at it simply from an odds-for-or-against
viewpoint, the odds AGAINST it being a face increase dramatically.

    And that's what I was asked.  The odds against.

    Any more questions?

Be seeing you...

--
         David "Maelstrom" Zecchini | "It may be better to be a live jackal
       [e-mail] | than a dead lion, but it is better still
 [e-mail] | to be a live lion.  And usually easier."
           [e-mail] | -Robert A. Heinlein
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!spool.mu.edu!agate!ames!apple!netcomsv!mork!noring
From: [e-mail] (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: How about some GIFs? (was: UFO Video-Photo-Documents Part3)
Message-ID: <cknhn=[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 22:32:12 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 35

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Clark Matthews) writes:
>
>Hi Steve.  I don't know about the documents, but I have 5 GIFs on my BBS that
>ostensibly show an alien in a case of some kind.  The GIF files were captured
>some time ago from a video of the specimen.  It is the ghastliest little
>thing I've seen in a long, long time.
>
>But having said that -- it looks familiar, doesn't it??  Jim Schaffer & I had
>some conversations about it on my board ... we both think it's fake (or a
>terrestial life-form, anyway).  But I can't for the life of me remember what
>it is.  For some reason, I keep thinking it's a seahorse -- the largest
>species can get a couple of feet long.  But the pictures I have don't
>resemble the seahorse ... so there we are.
>

Clark, I tried to e-mail you, but it bounced.

Would it be possible to post these GIFs to Usenet?  Maybe some of the
bio-scientist types who read Usenet could identify it if it is terrestrial.

Where, BTW, did the original video come from, and why do some people claim that
it is of an alien specimen?

Jon Noring

--
=============================================================================
| Jon Noring          | [e-mail] | "The dogs bark, but the  |
| JKN International   | IP    : 192.100.81.100   |  caravan moves on."      |
| 1312 Carlton Place  | Phone : [phone]   | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: [phone]   |  the bushes, and watch." |
=============================================================================
"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner;  quoted in 1987.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!wupost!darwin.sura.net!mlb.semi.harris.com!rtfm.mlb.fl.us!joshua
From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 01:24:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Lines: 44
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4720 sci.space:27144 sci.skeptic:21126 alt.paranormal:4530

[e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:

|>Josh,

|>You really want me to give you odds?

yup.

|>Well, to answer your question, I HAVE seen both of the images...(and in
|>addition, the images from a book called "The Face on Mars" that I picked
|>up in the library.  If you want to see enhanced images, THAT book has
|>images that are INCREDIBLY over-enhanced.)

I have considered that possibility; I consider it real in fact.

|>And the odds that I would give you AGAINST this particular photo being
|>a pre-shaped, alien artifact are along the order of 10,000,000 to 1.

OK! in that case I will bet $1 against your $10,000,000. Now, even though you
can afford compu$erve's fees, I somehow doubt that you have ten megabucks
that you are willing to gamble with, so why don't we make it 1000 to 1 and
I'll put up $10 aganist your $10,000. I am totally serious.

|>The largest doundation for that being, simply put, that they just don't LOOK
|>like they HAVE to be an artifact.  Granted, there is a SLIM possiblity
|>that it COULD be non-natural in origin, but there is NO significant evidence
|>that I can see in either of the photos that indicates that there is symmetry
|>between the two sides, or that the effect is anything more than just
|>shadows.

I don't know that they are artifacts. I think the possibility is strong
enough (and the belief among some people that they are *not* artifacts is
strong enough) that I am willing to gamble small amounts of cash money against
large amounts.

|>Try this, try looking at the images from a completely different angle,
|>say, upside down or sideways,and THEN try to see if theere appears to be a
|>complete symmetry formed.

what convinces me that there is something interesting is all the formations
taken as a whole; especially the 'straight wall' on the crater splash
pattern, but the whole complex of formations.

josh
Path: ns-mx!uunet!spool.mu.edu!agate!ames!apple!netcomsv!mork!anson
From: [e-mail] (Anson Kennedy)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Richard Russell Sightings
Keywords: Russell
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 03:10:52 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 14

Does anyone have any info on the sightings Georgia congressman Richard
Russell reported during a visit to the USSR in the 1950s?

I'm trying to gather some info on UFO sightings by "famous" people
from the [clap-clap-clap] Great State of Georgia (apologies to the
[clap-clap-clap] Great State of Texas).

--

Anson Kennedy
Secretary of the Georgia Skeptics (but don't even THINK I speak for them!)

                  "If I had been the Virgin Mary, I would have said 'No.'"
                                      -Margaret "Stevie" Smith (1902-1971)
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!masscomp!peora!tarpit!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,talk.religion.newage,alt.conspiracy
Subject: FILE: Orvotron Newsletter for Mar-April 92 - Part 1
Summary: Still Further info on "Asteroid to Hit the Earth"...
Keywords: Earth Changes,True Meaning behind the 11: 11 "doorway", Asteroid
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 05:46:22 GMT
Followup-To: Alt.alien.visitors
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Lines: 524
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4722 talk.religion.newage:9523 alt.conspiracy:12673



----------------------------------------------------------------------
*DISCLAIMER* *DISCLAIMER* *DISCLAIMER* *DISCLAIMER* *DISCLAIMER*

This information is presented for your perusal and is a continuation
of my policy of informing the public what is currently available. The
content of this information does NOT necessarily reflect the personal
views of the poster,nor should the views,opinions,statements or claims
represented in the following be accepted by anyone reading these texts
at *face* value. If this interests you, please endeavor to research it
yourself and investigate it to *your* satisfaction, and as such I will
leave it in your hands to either prove it or de-bunk it :-)

As I do not have a great amount of time available to pursue follow-ups
exclusively, comments to me should be directed to [e-mail]
in mail.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the latest Orvotron Newsletter...thought some of you might
find it interesting..



                                    ORVOTRON
                     Bimonthly Newsletter, March\April, 1992
                 The East Coast Power Point, Kortron and Solinus
                   EMail Address: Fido Net Address 1:379/703
                            Please send us your input

             Greetings  Ascending Star People.  Perhaps you have wondered
        why I begin each writing in this manner.   I do this to emphasize
        that Homo sapiens were originally seeded on Earth by beings  from
        the stars as a physical manifestation of God.  The object of this
        was  to  evolve a species in physical form in order to  seed  the
        expanding  universes  with that image.  Variations on  the  theme
        were  created when other beings subdued and then mixed  with  the
        original  root  race, thereby tampering with the  original  seed.
        These  beings realized that their own genetic blueprint  did  not
        enable  them  to access the Living Library which  had  been  pro-
        grammed  into our ancestors' DNA/RNA in the Earth Garden  experi-
        ment.

             I realize  this  is not an original statement, but by making
        it I want to convey our support of the other sources of truth who
        are  putting  out this same message to  awakening  humanity.  The
        Pliedian  material makes this same reference to our origins.   We
        recommend reviewing Barbara Marciniak's material as she  presents
        this  information  in a clear manner which "rings  true"  to  us.
        (Her  audio  cassettes can be obtained through  Bold  Connections
        Unlimited,  P.  O. Box 6521, Raleigh, NC  27628.)  For  the  same
        reason we  recommend Virginia Essene's (Ed.) book New Cells,  New
        Bodies,  NEW  LIFE!.  (Spiritual Education  Endeavors  Publishing
        Co., 1556 Halford Ave., #288, Santa Clara, CA  95051.)

             Many  changes now occurring are affecting the planet and all
        life.  Those who fear change are growing confused and frightened.
        This  also  applies  to those in control as they  are  forced  to
        rethink many of their plans within plans; rapid changes are  also
        affecting their projected goals and outcomes.

             Our research indicates that there is a plan to separate star
        people  from the rest of humanity in an effort to keep them  from
        informing the masses of the many changes now affecting Earth  and
        her inhabitants.  As we become more aware of these plans we  must
        continue to hold our ground without fear and know we are here  to
        inform,  to help all humanity - the good, the bad and  the  ugly.
        Fear  always seems to override common sense,  rational  responses
        and  correct action of a higher order which could  produce  abun-
        dance, peace, harmony and freedom for all.  The greatest fear  of
        those in control is the loss of that control and this is the true
        reason  they do not seek peaceful solutions, or truly accept  the
        Higher  Order  - The One God.  Many of you may believe  that  the
        American government is still "One nation under God" as our  fore-
        fathers deemed it, but this is constantly overshadowed by  hidden
        agendas,  and covert secret actions that are not of God, but  are
        of greed and deceit to control the masses.

             What  the controllers don't seem to realize yet is what each
        of  us in service are.  We are ambassadors of The Light  here  to
        help  the  masses  AND the controllers out of  the  mess  they've
        created and to help ALL assimilate the many changes ahead.  Their
        plans within plans are causing problems within problems but  soon
        the  planners will understand their pursuits are dead ends of  no
        worth.   Unfortunately, if they continue on their present  course
        without seeking help from the Forces of Light they will  increase
        fear and hopelessness  that will further discredit them as  lead-
        ers in the eyes of those they control.

             The first  steps  the controllers must take in order for any
        accord to take place are honesty, compassion and a real intent to
        act for the well being of ALL life on Earth.  The re-creation  of
        lies  upon  lies must stop.  Their choice must be to  come  clean
        with  the public regarding what is really taking place  and  why.
        Continuing to hide the whole truth will only result in an already
        confused public eventually being future shocked into reality when
        the real facts finally do surface.  It is far better for them  to
        tell  the  public what is really happening  than  to  wait  until
        their secret plans fail.

             What many  of  those  who are creating the secret and covert
        plans do not yet understand is that like attracts like - the root
        of their dilemma.  The plans they are creating for the future  of
        mankind  are based upon ignorance.  This lack of  knowledge  (the
        absence  of understanding the love base) leaves a void  and  thus
        room  for  negative reality to creep in  creating  extremes  they
        cannot  even  fathom.   In order to prevent the  extreme  in  the
        shifts coming  (when positive energy reachs the level of overcom-
        ing  resistance) at some point acceptance must enter in,  balance
        then will occur. Resistance only creates hard change to all  con-
        cerned.

             If  they continue to implement plans which might destroy all
        life on Earth it will not be tolerated by the ascended beings who
        are standing by in case of such an emergency.  This is being done
        to protect the awakening masses but not necessarily those  think-
        ing  they have power over others.  Any action against  the  light
        workers will only result in a state of hopelessness being created
        for  those  thinking they can destroy what is not theirs  to  de-
        stroy.  We  are independent overseers of massive change  here  to
        assist as a private group not under anyone's control or jurisdic-
        tion.   Judgment day is real and their belief that they  will  be
        spared  is false.  What is coming will spare no one!  So, I  ask,
        why not rethink everything now and prevent future dilemmas?

             What's coming  can  be  dealt with, but only by the opposite
        polarities  merging into a balanced unity.  Individuals must  not
        only want a world based on Love, but they must also choose to act
        in  a loving manner toward that global goal.  Only then will  the
        understanding  that we are all ONE result in the peaceful  trans-
        formation  of Earth.  Each individual or group has to  make  this
        choice.

             Light workers  born in service to Earth have watched a  dete-
        riorating  situation  continually worsen.  Once awakened  to  our
        mission  of love it becomes even more imperative that  we  become
        actively  aware of the power structure of the negative  polarity.
        We  must  become more informed about our own personal  power  and
        learn  how giving it away to the negative reality only  gives  it
        more  power.   The sheer act of allowing another to  decide  your
        fate  is  not a positive step, especially when  those  who  would
        control  are  not honest about their motivations or  plans.   The
        world they have created is based on deceit and lies and is now in
        its  death throws.  Negativity begets negativity,  which  creates
        fear and hopelessness which may result in the annihilation of all
        life.   Personal power based in Love not Fear is the champion  of
        this age.  Do you understand?

             Those who merely sit on the side-lines waiting for others to
        create  positive  change are just as guilty as those  who  create
        negativity through their dishonesty.   It is necessary that  each
        individual  become involved, to take responsibility  through  ac-
        tion,   otherwise power is still being given to those  who  would
        potentially use it for their own personal gain rather than in the
        best  interests of all life on the planet.  The  continuation  of
        this  kind of action (or non-action) merely results in "what  you
        see  is  what you get".  Passive, uninvolved  behavior  regarding
        cause and effect will only lead one to be cleansed along with all
        the rest that is out of harmony.

             The choice  to become  informed and involved must be made on
        an  individual basis.  It is not necessary to wait for a  govern-
        ment  or  anyone else to create a better world first.   You,  the
        individual, must make this choice, accept full responsibility for
        the negative and then take action toward the creation of positive
        love-based changes on Earth.  The line is drawn between those who
        would  join others to create a better world and those who  either
        through  complacency, ignorance or fear give away their power  to
        help create positive changes.

             The bonding  effect  of our Father's love will protect those
        who  serve in that love.  Remember nothing on this Earth or  from
        without  can stop the positive changes now coming to  Earth.  God
        helps  those  who help themselves and your actions  and  thoughts
        will determine your worth in God's Kingdom as it is reestablished
        on Earth. The Meek will not inherit the Earth if they do not help
        themselves  and others change the problems which are  outside  of
        THE DIVINE PLAN OF GOD.

                 ( What Can You Do to Prepare for the Future? )

             God  helps those  who  help  themselves.  The  fence sitters
        must decide to get off the fence and then pour their energy  into
        helping  (in  any way possible) all those who have  struggled  to
        create foundations for positive change.  One must set an  example
        through  involvement, putting aside personal ego-based  conflicts
        and  focusing  instead  on the work at hand.  Each of  us  has  a
        contribution to make no matter how small or insignificant it  may
        seem.  One step forward will lead to the next as more people  see
        they  too can create the changes which will transform Earth  into
        the garden and living library it was designed to be.

             Reading  these words may be inspiring, but without following
        them  with actions of some sort one remains on the same fence  or
        in  the same boat as those who put their energy into  controlling
        others.   The choice is to act or to be victimized through  inac-
        tion.  "I can't change anything" is a blatant lie one accepts  as
        truth.  The history books are filled with examples of individuals
        whose  endeavors created world change.  Each of us has this  same
        power  but  it must be claimed and then used.  Excuses  for  non-
        action  are  nothing more than idle inferiority  complexes.  This
        power  loss  is  created through well placed lies  by  those  who
        control  through  mass brainwashing.  This is based on  the  fact
        that  they know that with the power of truth goes the freedom  to
        act.   This  is exactly what they don't want you to  know.   What
        they  want is complacent slaves who believe the controllers  have
        all the power and therefore allow them to make all the decisions.
        BARF!!!!

             You CAN  Wake-Up  and reclaim  your sovereignty but you must
        make the choice to do so and then stick to it!  This year will be
        a time of profound changes on Earth.  It may  also be a year  for
        your  activation to awareness or destruction as an ignorant  life
        form.  The  cards are being dealt as we speak.   The  masters  of
        deceit  are making plans to take out huge blocks of life  on  the
        planet.  Eugenics is going on now separating who lives or dies.

             You may argue,  "But I Am Not God!   I  cannot  make  change
        alone."   I say we are all gods representing God's presence  here
        on Earth.  No one is ever alone.  However, with our abilities  go
        responsibilities  and  action type decisions that must  be  made.
        Once  the decision to "hear the voice within" is made,  one  must
        take  the  time to listen.  The Bible reference to this  is:   Be
        Silent,  Be Still,  Hear the Voice of GOD.  Action then  must  be
        taken  to do what that voice tells you.  The rest is a  piece  of
        cake.  The voice of God is your real power as an individual.   It
        will  guide  and direct you to your part in  Creating  Heaven  On
        Earth.  How many times must I repeat this very simple truth?

            My  life  has been  one of constant impossibility from anoth-
        er's  point of view.  Those close to me see miracles happen on  a
        constant  basis.  But I must confess none of it would  have  been
        possible  without  the  blessing of this contact  with  my  inner
        voice, which I call God or Spirit.  Each of you have this ability
        and it is the root of your personal power. YOU MUST USE IT!

             To follow  another's  way is a waste of what little time and
        opportunity  you have left.  During the cycled events  ahead  you
        can  open to your inner voice and be guided to safety to live  to
        see the New Age.  This experience will come without loss of  your
        physical  vehicle - your bodies.  You must open and go within  to
        understand and use this guided knowledge for your survival in all
        changes coming to Earth.  Do You understand?

                      ( Following the Champion of the Day )

             We have observed that when a new champion appears many flock
        to that individual to support and follow without questioning  the
        goals beyond what appears as the obvious.  The obvious may not be
        truth and without first consulting their personal inner  guidance
        this following behavior often creates situations in which support
        actually shifts away from the group aspect which is our true goal
        as volunteers on Earth assignment.  Granted these diversions will
        eventually be seen for what they are and result in a lesson  then
        being learned, but the loss of time and focus on the real  issues
        at hand can not be replaced.  Diversions create opportunities for
        the dark  lords to further destroy Earth and her life forms.

             You  can  be  associated  with  anyone's project  you choose
        but always remember your inner guidance is your only real  direc-
        tion  and  safety net when it comes to decisions  regarding  your
        place of allegiance.  The future of Homo sapiens on Earth must be
        prepared for now and dreamy thoughts and actions based on  ficti-
        tious  ideas  will  not help when the tides rise  and  the  Earth
        trembles.  My guidance and that of others indicate this year will
        bring  many  of your worst fears about Earth  Changes  into  your
        reality.

             We have  received information that the White Brotherhood and
        other ascended beings located in obscure isolated areas known  as
        the  secret  cities,  etc. have evacuated these  places  for  the
        safety of higher ground in the mountains.  This took place world-
        wide.  Does that tell you anything about the times ahead?

             The  acquisition of communal land in places of safety should
        be  a prominent point of focus for those who wish to survive  the
        times  ahead and build foundations for the New.  To just  believe
        you  will be in the right place at the right time is not  enough.
        If  you are being told through your inner guidance to prepare  in
        this manner it is imperative that you begin in earnest now rather
        than flocking to the nearest or best sounding "leader" who  would
        take you, your money and your energy down fantasy lane.

             We are still  aware of  several  thousand  acres of pristine
        organically  farmed land that is available and could  accommodate
        hundreds.   However, without the expressed interest and focus  of
        those  who  share a vision of such a community we are  unable  to
        move  forward.   We will not manifest this by ourselves,  but  we
        will  assist a group in whatever way we can.  We have the  advan-
        tage  of over twenty-five years of combined knowledge of  working
        with this kind of land and have gathered a great deal of informa-
        tion on alternate energy, housing and farming which we are  will-
        ing to share.  We have informed many of you through our  newslet-
        ter  and in individual conversations that the land is there,  but
        so far no one has gone beyond the talking stage.  Let us know  if
        you are interested in pursuing this as "time is short".

                       ( Kay Ra's Channeling for 1992 )

             We recently  received  the following  channeling from Kay Ra
        (Starlight  Farm  Newsletter,  Rt. 1, Box 159-B,  Round  Top,  TX
        78954) and include it for your benefit because we have known  for
        some  time that an asteroid as big as a city is headed  our  way.
        This  is  not the same asteroid we've been mentioning that  is  a
        reptilian  ship in disguise (due in around 1995-6) but  one  that
        CNN  cable news alerted the public about several months ago.   We
        do  not have cablevision on the mountain but several of  you  saw
        this  announcement  and  called us about it.  We  feel  Kay  Ra's
        message  is of prime importance and if heeded perhaps  many  will
        make efforts to establish safe havens for the near future.

             The Phoenix (meteor),  the  Survival/Rescue, the New Govern-
        ment.     The Phoenix will strike the Earth in the  southern-most
        area  of  the Atlantic Ocean between the lower regions  of  South
        America and Africa - closer to Africa.  The arrival of the  Phoe-
        nix is the initial step of the change or shift of the Planet  and
        will  occur  potentially at the end of 1992 or the  beginning  of
        1993.   (We are very much aware that time has little  meaning  in
        Spirit; so we give the time-frames with this in mind.)

             The meteor will  correct  the  wobble  or tilt of the Planet
        which  is now in existence and will create major continental  and
        oceanic shifts.  In the years following the impact, well into the
        next century, the most important shiftings will occur.  Many low-
        lying  areas are swept away, especially along the  Atlantic  sea-
        boards.  The rising waters will also affect the Mediterranean Sea
        and  the Baltic Sea, though these are somewhat  protected.   High
        wind velocities will affect all the Earth.

             The  east  coast  of  the  US  will be affected.  There will
        be  a  period of 12 to 24 hours after impact  and  oceanic  floor
        changes before the flooding and tidal waves occur.  The  flooding
        will  affect most of Florida and the area between the  ocean  and
        the  mountains in the seaboard states.  Areas which are 2,000  to
        5,000 feet are considered safe.

             The Gulf  coast shoreline  will be somewhat protected at the
        initial stages because of the Caribbean islands, but the Matagor-
        da  and  New Madrid fault lines will be greatly affected  by  the
        impact.  These faults will begin their splitting, and much  ocean
        water will invade the Mississippi River.

             Houston  will be greatly affected.  Many glass buildings and
        the  tallest buildings will fall.  The central part of the  city,
        however,  that  which is called "inside the  Loop",  will  remain
        above water for some months to a year.

             The changes  will  bring  about the evacuations by the Space
        Brothers,  envisioned by many, of those who are prepared  or  are
        guided to the evacuation points.  These survivors will be  helped
        by those who have chosen to become "ground commanders", who  have
        chosen to remain behind for this mission.  The survivors will  be
        taken  by  means of interdimensional change into  the  ships  and
        deposited  in  places of safety which have been chosen  by  their
        souls.   These  places  are  already-established  communities  or
        cities  in  the central areas of a continent which  will  not  be
        affected by earthquakes.

             There will be  thousands  and  thousands  who  will heed the
        earlier warning by scientists about the in-coming meteor or their
        own  premonitions.  They will flee the low-lying areas without  a
        destination  or  point  of sanctuary  consciously  chosen.   This
        turmoil will create first a shifting of the Federal Government to
        the "centralized Washington", that is to say, which is in Kansas.
        It  will attempt to continue the government beyond  the  destruc-
        tion.  However, the suspension of human rights and of the Consti-
        tution  will be called (in much the same way as during the  Great
        Depression).

             Because the  government  will fail to help the people, there
        will  be he who will rise up as leader.  Though  the  predominate
        government  (in  Kansas) will begin as early as the turn  of  the
        century, that which is the community government, those which  are
        places of safety, will become stronger and more authoritative.

             The monetary  system,  as  you know it, will end even before
        the centralized government.  Almost immediately, there will  come
        a bartering system - "I have what you need; you have what I need.
        Let  us trade."  Where money does exist, there will be  hardship;
        there will be greed still, so that the sooner the monetary system
        as is now present ends, the more quickly communities can  congre-
        gate, harmonize, and balance with one another.

             Individual  and  Planetary  Ascension. Individual  ascension
        is already taking place and will continue throughout the  Planet.
        There are those whose bodies are shifting well into Fourth Dimen-
        sion  and also into Fifth Dimension levels.  The ones who  choose
        to  remain with the Planet after the Earth Changes will be  those
        who have chosen to individually ascend.  There will, then, be  no
        more hindrances or resistance within the Planet.

             The Planet  is  already moving into the Fourth Dimension and
        as a part of this has agreed to receive the Phoenix into  Herself
        as  a  means of Her transition.  The individual choices  to  move
        into Fourth Dimension are already underway.  You have  personally
        chosen  the  Ascension Process as have most of  the  participants
        with  you.  Everyone who is identifying himself/herself with  the
        secure and safe places of the Planet is choosing to stay with the
        Planet and serve Her into the next age.

             The  Planet is seeking the Fifth Dimensional level as a part
        of Its destiny to become a star/sun.  This will occur in total in
        about 1,000 years or about 3,000 A.D.  This is a shift completely
        out  of that which is acknowledged around you now and  into  that
        which is light - light in form, but only light or energy.


             Supplies/Commerce/Banking.  The chemicals applied to and for
        the groceries are those which many are finding abhorrent.  There-
        fore,  the  concept of herbal, vegetable, and  fruit  gardens  is
        coming into being.

             As for stock  or amounts  in grocery stores, this will cease
        when the lines of communication and transportation end, especial-
        ly  before the turn of the century.  There is potential for  food
        supplies  to come to a close in two to three years and  that  the
        garden  will  be the support of the people (as were  the  Victory
        gardens of World War II)>

             There need  be  no  fear of gardens or food sources becoming
        contaminated.   The  objective among the higher or  more  refined
        dimensions  such  as  the Devic (plant) kingdoms  and  the  Space
        Brothers is that intention to keep the so-called survivors alive,
        to  nurture  and  cherish them for they are  the  Planet's  human
        kingdom reborn!  Therefore, know that your food supplies will  be
        guarded  by the greater beings and that you will remain  nurtured
        and nourished.

             The Federal  government  will  attempt to control the people
        through  money and through credit, etc.  Even though it  is  much
        inhibited in doing so, the government's attempt will be  approxi-
        mately  into the next century.  However, the banking  and  credit
        systems, their sources, their power and so on, will be broken due
        to  the  lack of transportation and communication.  Look  to  the
        destruction of the present monetary system almost immediately and
        the  barter  system  taken up.  The objective is  to  create  the
        community  as  the new government, to create trust  and  lack  of
        greed.

             A new  system  of finance  will occur in 20 to 30 years from
        the time of the original destruction, but it will NOT be based on
        a central or organized banking system nor upon precious metals or
        banking  reserves.  It will be based upon the individual's  means
        of support, upon a more balanced idea of helping one another.

             The Present Location  of the Phoenix.   It  has entered into
        the Solar System.  It is not a part of the Asteroid Belt, but  is
        an  asteroid  or that which will function as  an  asteroid.   The
        present angle is creating a drawing toward the sun.  However, the
        projection  for  it is that of colliding with  this  Planet.   In
        other words, the timing is such that as it hurdles itself  toward
        the  sun  or is drawn by the magnetism of the sun, it  will  meet
        with this Planet in Her orbit by design as well as by accident.

             The  meteor  or asteroid  was  and IS  planned  or  designed
        because  this  Planet has requested this collision  to  occur  to
        bring  about Her desire for change.  It is being maintained  and,
        when  necessary, guided by the Space Brothers  (Pleiadians  under
        Ashtar's command) and others of the Council who are in service to
        this Planet and to this Solar System.  Know that the Phoenix  is,
        so far, in the proper alignment and timing for such a strike.

                             ***********************
             So now you have yet another new scenario to hash about.  For
        the Astronomy buffs, the asteroid's number is CS1992. My question
        is (knowing this newsletter is read by many thousands around  the
        world who never respond in any way) - What will it do to bring us
        closer  together as one family?  Will you know when the  asteroid
        is  close?  In the past the government and media  have  announced
        such  potential disasters only after they have passed, or not  at
        all.   Other  alternatives (for those who are  not  connected  to
        their  inner guidance) are the computer bulletin  board  networks
        like  ours  addressing these concerns.  What if these  no  longer
        exist  due to lack of real support?  It has been  estimated  that
        the  safety  margin  for evacuation to higher  ground  is  twelve
        hours.   Will  you  have time to reach places  of  safety?   What
        preparations  are being made to have food available to  feed  the
        ones  who  make it to high ground?  Do you  think  those  already
        there  could  feed  large groups of people?   Ask  yourself  some
        questions.   It may very well affect you.  It never hurts  to  be
        prepared, otherwise swimming lessons may be a good alternative.

             All   else  put   aside  here is yet  another  reason  in  a
        diverse world with many pit falls affecting your survival.  Know-
        ing the things that are affecting your survival that are not well
        publicized may pay off by opening you up to the experience  lead-
        ing to Eternal Life.  Read On!

             The following article  was  taken  from  the February/March,
        1991 issue of Nexus Magazine.  This is an Australian  publication
        which  we highly recommend for updated information on  many  "New
        Age"  topics.   A  one year subscription (6 issues)  is  $30  and
        should be made payable to Nexus Magazine, C/- P. O. Mapleton, Qld
        4560 Australia.

                            ( The Photon Belt Story )

             Is our solar system about to enter a cosmic 'cloud', as part
        of a 12,000 year cycle?  We present this obscure but popular 1981
        article for you to decide.

             People all over  the  world  are  grasping, reaching out for
        little pieces of knowledge, enlightenment, hope for the future of
        their  children in a world of growing degradation,  drugs,  rape,
        murder, etc.  The Prophets of doom preach of physical horror  and
        annihilation.  It is like a great vortex, a great sucking spiral,
        ever downward, blackness, despair.

             You  look  upwards,  can  see the light at the top and grasp
        and  claw  your way to get out of that ever  quickening  pull  of
        despair.  The truth sometimes is so simple that we look past  it,
        ignore  it and try to find a much more complicated  answer,  when
        all  the time, it is there, staring you right in the  face,  your
        passport out of the vortex into the future.

-----------Continued in Bimonthly Newsletter, March\April, 1992 Part TWO--------

Don

--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!masscomp!peora!tarpit!bilver!dona
From: [e-mail] (Don Allen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,talk.religion.newage,alt.conspiracy
Subject: FILE: Orvotron Newsletter for Mar-April 92 - Part 2
Summary: Still Further info on "Asteroid to Hit the Earth"...
Keywords: Earth Changes,True Meaning behind the 11: 11 "doorway", Asteroid
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 05:51:28 GMT
Followup-To: Alt.alien.visitors
Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL
Lines: 536
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4723 talk.religion.newage:9524 alt.conspiracy:12674



-------------Bimonthly Newsletter, March\April, 1992 Part TWO-------------------


             It all starts  with  a  little  atom and the group of little
        electrons  which orbit around it.  English physicist Paul  Adrain
        Maurice  Dirac,  said that for each type of  particle,  an  anti-
        particle will exist.

             In 1932, Carl  David  Anderson  discovered the anti-electron
        and  called  it a positron.  In 1956, the anti-proton  and  anti-
        neutron were discovered.

             When an  anti-particle is formed, it comes into existence in
        a  universe  of ordinary particles, and it is only  a  matter  of
        time....a  fraction  of a second...before it meets  and  collides
        with an electron.  The charges cancel, the total mass of the pair
        is converted into energy in the form of PHOTONS.  This offers   a
        new  and  unprecedented  powerful  source  of energy.  The PHOTON
        is about to become your way of life in the very near future.

             A  PHOTON  BAND was  discovered  in  outer  space in 1961 by
        means  of satellite born instruments.  We will now move onto  the
        PLEIADES....The Seven Sisters...an estimated 400 light years from
        here.   This  group of stars is the basis of  mythology  in  many
        countries....the  Greek  Gods,  Australian   Dreamtime....Chinese
        mythology.  To quote from just a few Astronomers....

             Jose  Comas  Sola made a  special study  of the Pleiades and
        discovered  that they form a system, of which our sun is part  of
        that  system,  and also several other suns, and  all  apparently,
        have their own Planetary systems.

             Freidrich Wilhelm  Bessel  showed that members of this group
        had a proper motion of 5.5 seconds of arc per century in the same
        direction.

             Isaac Asimov..."We can  assume  that  all  the stars in this
        cluster are the same chronological age."

             Edmund Halley, studying  the  position  of  the stars, noted
        that  at least three stars were not in the spots recorded by  the
        Greeks.   The difference was so great that it was  unlikely  that
        either the Greeks or Halley could have made a mistake.  It seemed
        very clear to Halley that these stars moved within a system.

             Paul Otto Hesse  also  made  a special study of this system,
        of  which  our sun is a part, and discovered, at  absolute  right
        angles  to  the movements of the suns, a PHOTON BELT  or  MANASIC
        RING,  a  phenomena which scientists have not yet  been  able  to
        reproduce with laboratory experiments.

             It takes our sun 24,000 years to complete an orbit, (of this
        system) and as seen by the diagram, it is divided into  sections.
        The 10,000 years of darkness is the period as we know it now, day
        time,  night  time,  the 2,000 year period of  all  light,  again
        10,000 years of darkness and 2,000 years of light.

             WE  ARE  NOW POSED TO ENTER THIS PHOTON BELT.   It is inevi-
        table....between  now  and the end of this century -  but  it  is
        inevitable!   We have completed the full circle and are  back  at
        the  beginning.  It is described in detail in your bible, by  all
        books on mythology, by Nostradamus, and by modern day scientists.

             To  quote our scientists....If the Earth enters  first  into
        the  PHOTON BELT, the sky will appear to be on fire, but  be  as-
        sured, this is cold light, so there will be no heat.  If the  sun
        enters  first, there will be immediate darkness, which,  computed
        our  speed through space, will last 110 hours.   The  interaction
        between the Solar Radiation and the PHOTON BELT will make the sky
        look as if it is full of falling stars.  As the Earth enters this
        radiation belt, all molecules will become excited, all atoms will
        change,  things will become luminescent, THERE WILL  BE  CONSTANT
        LIGHT.   There can be no darkness, not within the  deepest  cave,
        not  within the human body.  A quick look at  your  bible...."All
        the  stars  will  fall  from  the sky and  the  sky  will  be  no
        more....".

             It is expected that the rotation of the Earth may diminish a
        little.  Because of the reduced Solar Radiation, the  temperature
        is  expected  to become cooler and the ice caps are  expected  to
        extend  to about latitude 40 in both hemispheres....your  history
        books will tell you that at least five ICE AGES have been record-
        ed,  and  they seem to last about 2,000 years.  It may  be  noted
        that world communication centers, fixed satellites, US bases  and
        experimental  sights are within the 'safe zone'. Design or  acci-
        dent?

             What about you?  There  are  three  types  of  people in our
        cosmos...corporeal, like us, solid, human;....atmospherean,  also
        solid   to  a  point,  but  the  molecular  structure  is   quite
        different;....ethereans,  no  mass  at all.  When  we  enter  the
        Photon  Belt, a normal healthy person is expected to feel a  jolt
        similar  to putting your finger in a live light socket,  and  the
        transformation  will be complete...you have just changed  from  a
        Corporeal  person to an Atmospherean person....("and ye shall  be
        changed  to  immortality without the separation of death  in  the
        twinkling of an eye.")

             Theologians have written at great depth on Bible characters,
        and assert that they have lived in this period of light.  The sky
        and   atmosphere   was   different  and   apparently   it   never
        rained....Nostradamus, in his quatrain about the end of the world
        as  we know it, in 1999...."and it will rain no more, but  in  40
        years, all will be normal."

             In  aboriginal  mythology  it is  said...."Men were  differ-
        ent to what they are now....we had a bridge to the stars..."   In
        all their stories if they fell out with the Chief or Elder,  they
        fled  to  the  sky.  So did the Greeks.  It  appears  that  space
        travel is simple within the photon belt.

             The  year 1962  was  the year that we came within the influ-
        ence of the Photon Belt.  1962 was a year of great UFO  activity.
        Did  we  come within range of space travelers  using  the  Photon
        Belt?   As we hurtle closer and closer, will more UFO's  look  us
        over  before our rebirth into the years of LIGHT.  It would  seem
        that this is already happening.

             Erich Von Daniken, when visiting  South  America, discovered
        a  tribe with an object given to them by Sky People thousands  of
        years  ago.   They were told to keep it clean and "when  it  hums
        like  thousands of swarms of bees, we will return."   It  started
        humming  softly three years ago (ie 1978).  A cosmic alarm  clock
        alerting us to the coming of the light?

             It would seem  some  civilizations may live permanently with
        The  Light.   When  our Planet leaves this period  of  light  and
        returns  to the 10,000 years of darkness, do THEY return  to  the
        LIGHT  and  wait our eventual re-entry.  It  seems  likely.   The
        Mayans departed hurriedly with the message also of their  return,
        which  scholars  say is now imminent.  Rock carvings  around  the
        world show drawings similar to the system of Alcione.

             Ball lightning...a phenomena about which little is known, is
        it perhaps little pockets of the Photon Belt?

             To  all UFO researchers, these craft always show an interest
        in  nuclear installations.  What will happen to a reactor  within
        the  Belt?   I think our scientists are way  out  ahead.   Photon
        energy  seems to be the energy of the future.  Many  UFO  reports
        seem  to  indicate Photon rockets  on  experimental  craft..."the
        headlights were at the back."  The reports at hand indicate slow,
        cumbersome  craft..but  within the Photon Belt, I think  we  have
        craft for immediate unlimited space travel.

             Because the radiation  of  our  sun  will be modified by the
        Photon  energy,  is this why our scientists only  pay  small  lip
        service to the development of solar energy?

             Let us think  about our  planet  coming out of the light and
        into  the darkness.  Aboriginal mythology says "we were cast  out
        into darkness and were much afraid, so the Gods gave us a Sun  to
        warm us and a moon to see at night."

             If the ice caps  from  within  the  light  years,  then  the
        increased Solar radiation when leaving the belt must surely  melt
        the  ice .... Floods.  If it does not rain within this period  of
        light, it is understandable why Noah was so awed by the sight  of
        that first rainbow.  The Gilgamesh talks of a great flood, but it
        was apparently about 10,000 years before Noah's flood.

             We have  thought  about our world and the effect on a single
        person,  but what about humanity as a whole?  It  is  conceivable
        that  many people will not survive the initial jolt if  they  are
        not  prepared  for it.  If the ice extends to latitude  40,  that
        covers half the USA, and most of Europe and Asia.  That is a  lot
        of  people without a home.  Will they be accepted in other  coun-
        tries?   In a limited space of fertility, will it be possible  to
        support untold millions?

             I think not.

             And so tomorrow . . . . . . . .

        (Reprinted  in  Nexus Magazine with  permission  from  Australian
        International  UFO  Flying Saucer Research Magazine,  #12  August
        1981)   For more details:  GPO Box 2004, Adelaide. SA 5001.   Ph:
        [phone].)

                             ( The Truth of 11:11 )

             I cannot be silent on this topic - there are NO doors  being
        swung  open.   There IS a merging of dimensions as we  go  deeper
        into  the photon belt.  The pyramid on Stone Mountain was one  of
        the  devices built to help this process take place. It created  a
        New  Grid  that was less resistant to this energy coming  in  and
        through Earth.  Doors are a lot of bunk.  The only DOORS  opening
        are those in your consciousness to bring you to a new understand-
        ing.  These are natural cycled events that happen  everywhere  in
        creation  over  and over again.   They are not portals  for  your
        ascension, but rather paths to opening up to what you really are.

             Many will completely  open  if  they  survive  to the Photon
        Belt's arrival by taking the time to listen to their inner  guid-
        ance.   This  is a connection to a higher frequency  where  truth
        exists and where one will fully understand that THOUGHT  creates.
        When  this knowledge is revealed to each individual then each  of
        you will no longer need prodding such as mine to create Heaven on
        Earth.   This will occur because those who make it to this  stage
        will be on a new Earth minus the Sheep, Shepherds, Fools and Jack
        Asses  who  were destroying it.  They will know  that  what  they
        think, they can instantly manifest and they will understand  that
        God  is Love and will manifest in that love knowing the  opposite
        experience at that point is behind  them, not wanting to re-expe-
        rience it again.  At this point you will have understood Earth as
        having been a school to teach you right and wrong as Co-Creators.

             All this is  based  on  hooking  you  up to the unused five-
        sixths  of your brain - the double helix, the twelve  strands  of
        consciousness now awakening as we go deeper into the Photon Light
        Belt.  It is important that we become fully awake and survive  in
        order  to  take  the opportunity to become  our  graduated  parts
        contributing to the expanding universes.  Following another is  a
        useless  waste  of  time, energy  and  money.   Follow  Spirit!!!
        That's my say on the 11:11.

                   ( How Do We Spend the Money You Send Us? )

             Perhaps you've  wondered  how the  donation and subscription
        money  you  send is spent.  Last year the vast  majority  of  the
        donation money went into the building of the pyramid with a small
        portion  going  to feed those who came through to help  with  the
        project.   We  also  spend donation money on  the  computer  when
        professional help is necessary or equipment needs replacing.

              The subscription  money  pays  for the printing and mailing
        of  the newsletter and the business part of the phone bill  which
        ranges  from $150 - $200 a month to gather and exchange  informa-
        tion  via the computer and the phone.  Our personal expenses  are
        paid by our personal income and these expenditures often  include
        such  items as replacing the hot water heater and water  pump  or
        cleaning the septic tank which receive considerable use from  the
        many people who come here.

                  ( Will This Bimonthly Newsletter Continue? )

             With the printing and  mailing of this newsletter the finan-
        cial base we operate on (subscription money) will be used up.  At
        this  point  our  publication will continue only  if  we  receive
        enough new subscriptions, resubscriptions or donations to put out
        the next one.  Up until this point we have not found it necessary
        to  use donation money to support the newsletter, but the  rising
        cost  of  researching  information  and  communicating  with  our
        "extended  family" (i.e. the phone bill) have placed this  little
        proprietorship  near bankruptcy.   We prefer not to use  donation
        money to keep the newsletter going, but it is a moot point anyway
        since we have no donation money in the till.

             This has  been  the  pattern for over four issues but we are
        at a live or die point now due to the fact that about one-half of
        our subscribers will soon need to resubscribe.  If you would like
        to  resubscribe  early in order to alleviate  the  situation,  it
        would truly be helpful.  If you can't pay the subscription  price
        all at one time but want to subscribe for the first time we  will
        work with you on making partial payments.

             We  have done our best on a shoestring for months but now we
        can  only  continue if your support continues.  Those  souls  who
        have  been  taking  a free ride by not  subscribing  but  somehow
        obtaining  a  copy of each issue are some of the  ones  who  have
        created  this situation.  We know of many groups who  receive  it
        and then make copies for all the individuals involved.  There  is
        also  the issue of being able to obtain each newsletter  free  of
        charge  via  the  computer bulletin board system.   There  is  no
        remedy  for  either situation except for these  souls  to  become
        involved by paying for what they receive.

             We could reduce the cost of getting each issue out by elimi-
        nating even more folks from our complimentary list.  We have done
        several  purges  over the past six months and  have  reduced  the
        number now sent free to only 35.   This includes exchange  copies
        for another's publication (networking for information), or copies
        to those who have stated they want to receive it but simply can't
        afford to pay anything.  In addition, we send free  "Love Copies"
        to  people our subscribers recommend or to those who inquire  for
        the first time.  Perhaps we should charge to receive the  initial
        copy.   Perhaps we should say "No Money, No Honey" to  those  who
        say  they  can't  afford to pay $2.50 every  month.   But,  these
        solutions seem both inhumane and poor business policies to us.

             The entire  point for  so many light workers volunteering to
        incarnate  together,  this time around, was for  support  of  the
        organizations working to create correct and positive change.   We
        are all in this together and networking and supporting each other
        is a MUST!  We hope to hear from you SOON!!

                            ( The Information System)

             We have  watched  many other dedicated souls in the evolving
        information network literally go under due to a lack of financial
        support  for  their  efforts in searching out  and  then  sharing
        truth.   This often requires many hours on the phone,  using  the
        computer/modem,   printing costs and postage not to  mention  the
        many  other expenses incurred to get the news out on a  worldwide
        basis.   We  would love to be in a position to forward  funds  to
        those  we  know who are helping the cause of truth at  their  own
        expense but so far we are just "cutting it" ourselves.

             The word is that freedom  of speech is at risk due to legis-
        lation  that  would not only curb it but possibly put a  stop  to
        even the dissemination of information in newsletters and bulletin
        boards such as ours.

             Experience  has  shown  us that those who are really working
        to  spread  truth  are not piling up big bucks  or  taking  trips
        around  the world; they are staying put and remain accessible  to
        those who want to know and need help.  These souls get out infor-
        mation  about things few would ever learn about and go,  for  the
        most  part, completely ignored, underfinanced and receive  criti-
        cism  where thanks are due.  In our opinion these people are  the
        real  heroes  helping humanity.   We have high  hopes  that  this
        situation  will  eventually be alleviated by  their  getting  the
        necessary funding to continue the important work they do.  It  is
        far  better  that they be a shining portal of truth  than  to  go
        under  due to lack of support which might prevent you and  others
        from getting the necessary information that could directly effect
        YOUR well being.

             Our question is, when will the free riders (those that never
        subscribe  or donate but look forward to each newsletter  or  new
        information on the nets and bulletin boards) show their apprecia-
        tion by free will support?   There is so much more that could  be
        accomplished,  but lack of financial support keeps much on  hold.
        For instance, we would love to create packets of information that
        would  provide  background and updated material on  many  of  the
        issues (political, ecological, health, etc.) we have been gather-
        ing news about.  We have also given a great deal of consideration
        to  putting  the newsletter out on a monthly basis  in  order  to
        provide the readers with more current information.  We were  even
        considering  merging  with others to put out  a  joint  worldwide
        magazine.

             We freely  admit that we cannot do it by ourselves.  Neither
        can  it  be done by expanding the team then asking them  to  work
        here  full  time and earn a living elsewhere.  We  have  room  to
        house additional folks, but their personal expenses must be  met.
        All those who are in full time service cannot expect to be funded
        by  windfalls from a few nor should they be expected  to  provide
        for  everything  from  their personal funds while  in  full  time
        service.  One solution might be for individuals to pledge  finan-
        cial support on a regular basis.

                       ( World Commander Where Are You? )

             No takers for World Commander, eh!  Perhaps that means world
        organizers are now "in" and we would like to support that idea by
        offering to be a main organizational point for this.  In addition
        it might be nice to drop all titles, so from now on you can  just
        call me Kortron.  Our work here has been slowly evolving from  an
        East Coast Headquarters to one of a more global focus.  As infor-
        mation spreads worldwide we look optimistically to the time  when
        the many small groups will merge into one planetary team.  We are
        heartened  that so many are now coming out of their  closets  and
        are  less afraid to speak out and hopefully, as this group  grows
        larger, their combined voice will grow more audible and more will
        then come forward to create a better Earth for all.

             Who out there  sees  the  logic  of  World Unification which
        promotes the idea of a worldwide network working to create  free-
        dom,  truth,  harmony and Love on Earth?   Let us hear  from  you
        because if you are working toward that end you are already  known
        by  the  controllers (the Dark Lords) and  associating  with  our
        network will give you additional support of like-minded people.
        Whatever happens we are all in it up to our necks whether  you're
        still  "in  hiding" or involved out in the open.   We  need  your
        help,  input  and your support and we may be able  to  help  you.
        This is definitely one case of "the more, the merrier".

                                 ( The Pyramid )

             The pyramid  is  almost insulated and as soon as the weather
        breaks  in March we plan to start working on it again.  The  out-
        side needs to be sealed against water, the chimney and  fireplace
        construction  must be completed before we panel and put  flooring
        inside and there is some landscaping to be done.  Needless to say
        we need your continued support in order to finish this project so
        we can get on to others.

             We have  been  pleased with the many requests we have filled
        for crystals charged with the love energy in the pyramid.  Thanks
        to  all of you who have shown your support and desire to link  up
        with the grid from the vortex by purchasing these special stones.
        The  crystal gridwork is now connected to many places around  the
        country  but  there are still many exquisite  crystals  left  for
        those  of you who wish to connect up in this manner.  They  range
        in price from $20 - $75 and will be individually selected through
        our inner guidance.
                             Peace and Love, Kortron

                                  ( Sanctuary )

             We have  stated  that  Orvotron is a center for information.
        We  gather it and exchange it, so our visitors are encouraged  to
        ask  for  it.  However, it would be impossible to  copy  all  the
        videos, newsletters or files on and not on Spirit Bulletin  Board
        in a few short days.  We are simultaneously amused and  irritated
        by  those who spend countless hours at the stereo trying to  make
        copies  of the very many cassette tapes to take home  with  them.
        Amused because it would take months to tape everything; irritated
        because  this behavior does not support those who are  trying  to
        market  the  information in order to continue producing  it.   We
        would  prefer  that folks ask Spirit what they need to  learn  or
        gain  access to while here, not to be "information  junkies"  and
        require  everything  in sight.  We feel that would be  much  less
        stressful  on us and easier for all concerned in the sharing  and
        the giving, plus cut our equipment maintenance costs.

             Nineteen Ninety-Two began  in  an  interesting  fashion here
        when  two souls appeared unannounced at our door.  They  told  us
        Spirit had sent them to help us and had spent their last dime  to
        get  here.  They had no means to support themselves and no  means
        to  leave.   We were not consulted prior to their arrival  if  we
        could  provide for them, or if we had any work for them to do  in
        exchange for room and board.  Knowing that Spirit works in myste-
        rious  ways  and since you never know who will be "an  angel"  we
        accepted  them even though there was little productive  work  for
        them beyond insulating the pyramid in freezing weather.
             A month  later we were no longer "gracious hosts", the  cup-
        board  was  nearly  bare and the pyramid was  still  not  totally
        insulated.   They left in a huff as though there had not  been  a
        fair  exchange  and we were left scratching our  heads  wondering
        what kind of angels they were.  As a result of this encounter  we
        learned  some things and must now insist upon several  courtesies
        from  any future guests.  The first is PLEASE contact us  in  ad-
        vance.   We prefer to know when we are entertaining visitors  and
        are most happy when we have a referral from our "extended family"
        if the guest to be is otherwise unknown to us.  We simply  cannot
        continue to just open our doors to anyone who is passing  through
        looking  for a place of sanctuary.  On one hand we would love  to
        have the place and means to provide this, but on the other we put
        a  lot in jeopardy by taking folks totally on face value  or  be-
        cause they say Spirit guided them here.

             We are doing  our best to be good hosts but some people have
        expectations  of  what they will find here and  as  we've  stated
        previously,  expectations almost always lead to  disappointments.
        For the must part this is an outside work camp except during  the
        winter when our time is spent inside trying to catch up on things
        gone undone during the rest of the year.  We work hard, play hard
        and  sometimes play at work and work while we  play.   Hopefully,
        those  who want to stay longer than a day will jump right in  and
        help with whatever the priority might be - whether it is work  or
        play.

             We do take  time  to relax  on  occasion and that might very
        well  happen when we have visitors.  So let it be known  we  have
        some human vices that are socially unacceptable in some  circles.
        We eat meat  once or twice a day but usually have plenty of  home
        grown  organic vegetables to go with it and Kortron drinks a  few
        beers  now and then.   One particularly offensive person  enjoyed
        referring to our meat consumption as "eating dead animals"  while
        he  gorged himself on vegetables we provided and cooked  for  him
        straight  from  our garden.  We have noticed that  many  who  are
        obviously put out by these indulgences because they believe it is
        bad  for our health are in poor physical condition  themselves  -
        they are overweight, out of shape and have a hard time walking up
        the  hill to the pyramid.  Others seemingly find everything  here
        to their liking until we say it's time to go to work then sudden-
        ly  that  trip to town is of utmost importance.  Our way  to  en-
        lightenment at Orvotron is to chop wood and haul water. So PLEASE
        don't  arrive with only high heels and white outfits to  wear  if
        you want to spend time with us.  We are not running a "resort".

             Speaking about  what some  entities  put into their bodies I
        have to say we are amazed at the variety of "health foods"  which
        come  with our guests.  We wonder what people will do when  their
        seaweed  and bottles of supplements from the health  food  stores
        are  no longer available.  These same entities rarely  know  any-
        thing  about  the nutritious editable foods to be  found  in  the
        woods  or  others with medicinal qualities.  They  know  next  to
        nothing  about growing and storing vegetables from the  looks  of
        their long, manicured fingernails and some seem to get upset when
        I prefer to be in the garden than to talk enlightenment.   One of
        the  neatest seminars we have had was an "herb walk"  around  the
        property and we would love to host another.

             By no  means  am  I trying to indicate that everyone who has
        visited us over the course of the past two years is an ungrateful
        laggard.   I  just needed to do a little  complaining,  a  little
        clearing,  before Spring and the rush of visitors  begins  again.
        We enjoy having guests and understand the importance of  network-
        ing.  However, our time must be divided between interaction  with
        guests, obtaining and sharing information and accomplishing  work
        in  the rhythm of the seasons here.  When it's time to  plant  we
        must  take  the opportunity to do so even if we would  rather  be
        sitting on the porch talking with our guests.  For the most  part
        folks  are  willing to get involved while they  are  here.   What
        continues to surprise us is that many leave here loaded down with
        information  and  voicing support of our efforts  but  apparently
        don't  share  what they have learned and often never  contact  us
        again.  Our hope is that the "doers" will come more often in  the
        future and the fence sitters will rapidly awaken to their part in
        creating Heaven on Earth.
                         With Love in the Light, SolinUs

                     ( Subscription and Log-On Information )

             We are pleased  to  send  a "Love  Copy" of the most current
        newsletter  to  anyone you think will be interested.   Just  pass
        your friend's name and address on to us and we will mail out  the
        issue  compliments of you.  Back issues contain much  information
        which is still relevant and may provide some clarity on  subjects
        discussed  in  subsequent  newsletters.   Love  donations  (which
        should be made payable to Judith A. Wells) are greatly appreciat-
        ed and go to Spirit's work to create Heaven on Earth.

             A subscription also entitles you to log-on the Spirit Bulle-
        tin  Board Service, a computer/modem system with files on  alter-
        nate  energy, UFO/extraterrestrial happenings, political,  scien-
        tific  and  medical  information and much more.   The  files  are
        updated frequently and we encourage you to use and contribute  to
        this "library at your fingertips".  You may access this  informa-
        tion 24 hours a day by calling 1-704-297-5973.

             For a  year's  subscription (six  bimonthly issues) and user
        status  on  Spirit BBS please send $30.00 (USA)  or  $40.00  (all
        other  countries) in check or money order (no cash  please)  made
        payable to:

                                 Judith A. Wells
                                Route 2, Box 309B
                                Vilas, NC  28692
                                  704/297-2343


-------------------------------End of Newsletter-------------------------------

Don

--
-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!yale.edu!think.com!wupost!darwin.sura.net!uvaarpa!murdoch!kelvin.seas.Virginia.EDU!crb7q
From: [e-mail] (Cameron Randale Bass)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: OIL BARONS SUPPRESS EMERGING TECHNOLOGIES
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 08:48:57 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: University of Virginia
Lines: 24

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Len Bucuvalas [phone]) writes:
>
>Tom Bearden, one of our upcoming speakers, may have illustrated it quite
>well by the bird sitting on top of the wire with 13,000 volts going
>through it.  We all know that it could kill him but it doesn't.  I am
>positive that within this group will be found the ways and means for making
>the energy situation of the future change.
>

       Marge, its those new birds I've been tellin' you about.  Yep, those
       insulated ones.   Sure saves the inconvenience of the loud pop
       and whiff of ozone of the regular ones.

                                dale bass

       P.S. try this experiment with the with bird IN the circuit and report
            back.  Sure beats a microwave.


--
C. R. Bass                                           [e-mail]
Department of Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering
University of Virginia
Charlottesville, Virginia                            [phone]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!infonode!macklowj
From: [e-mail] (Jim J. Macklow)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Star Systems With Habitable Planets
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 15:16:42 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Intergraph Corporation, Huntsville, AL.
Lines: 33

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (barry.o.olson) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Donald Yett) writes:
>>
>> Isn't it amazing that UFO sightings really started [in the UFO sense] in the mid to late '40's?  Roughly 20 to 30
>> years after most of the ground-breaking research into higher frequencies in radio.  And has increased stedily since
>
>I used to be an avid UFO buff for at least 10 years straight('68-78')
>approximately. I remember reading about sightings of dirigibles in the
>mid to late 1800's before they were manufactured and used.
>If this is accurate, they first appeared in modern times in the form
>of airships or zeppelins. It wasn't until mid 1940'(?) they were sighted
>as flying discs near Mt. Ranier in Washington state.
>Any support?
>
>barry olson

This probably isn't what you're looking for, but in Japan there's a very
popular "legend" called Kagume-hime which is about a girl from the stars
who fell to earth.  A woodsman found her, and years later, when she had
grown, her parents flew to earth in a ship from the far side of the moon
and took her home.

The strangest thing about the story (to me) is that the woodsman found
the girl _inside_ a bamboo stalk.  He cut it open and there she was.

This story is thousands of years old, so I guess it doesn't count as an
eyewitness account.  Probably doesn't count as a UFO account, since the
woodsman's family _knew_ the ship was a starship.  Can't remember if a
shape is given in the story; I can check at home later.

Just some food for thought from the Far East's far past.

-Jim
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!ux.acs.umn.edu!csd1227
From: [e-mail] (Greg Larson)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 11:51:58 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Minnesota
Lines: 13

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (R. S. Statsinger) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:
>>
>> [inanities ommitted]
>>
>
>Stollman, you are a LUNATIC. PLEASE commit yourself to an institution
>before you hurt yourself or anyone else.
>
>RS

And those who get their jollies by tormenting those they perceive to be
mentally ill could use some professional help themselves.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!aero.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (R. S. Statsinger)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 18:34:55 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: Ssaymssik Inc.
Lines: 6

Gary, Gary, Gary........

You're the only one left. And we WILL get you; it's just a matter of
time.....

RS
Path: ns-mx!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!ut-emx!astro.as.utexas.edu!defonso
From: [e-mail] (Eric Defonso)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 17:22:50 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: McDonald Observatory, University of Texas @ Austin
Lines: 21
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4728 alt.conspiracy:12685 talk.religion.newage:9528

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes:
>

[unbelievable amount of crack-induced blather
 about military/alien/tooth-fairy takeover of the world deleted...]

>--
>-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
>Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
>UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
>Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?

Does this guy actually make a living writing this stuff? Maybe he's
smarter than I thought =-)


--
Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In Search Of...a good .sig **** "When in doubt, tell the truth." - Twain
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!wupost!darwin.sura.net!Sirius.dfn.de!fauern!unido!mcsun!news.funet.fi!network.jyu.fi!tola
From: [e-mail] (Teemu Olavi Lahteenmaki)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: HUMANOID.GIF (Picture from the Roswell incident ?)
Keywords: Roswell, UFO, GIF, humanoids
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 00:19:48 GMT
Distribution: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: University of Jyvaskyla, Finland
Lines: 916

This is a gif picture scanned from a book about the Roswell-incident.
Picture has real bad quality - but it's good enough to reconize what it is
about. It is said, that there are two military police here guarding
suvirved humanoid from the UFO-crash (at Roswell, New Mexico, USA, 1947).
It is not known is this picture really related to this Roswell-UFO, nor
is it known where and when the picture was taken (anyway the picture
was given to FBI agent in 1950 at New Orleans).

To view it, save it and UUDECODE it and there it is !

NOTE: I am not taking any opinion of the 'reality' of the picture,
figure it out your self !

--- before UUDECODE, delete everything before this line -------------

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M1TE&.#=AL )' _       /___RP     L )' P "_HR/J<OM#Z.<M-J+L]Z\
M^P, AB@V8;B4W\JV[@O'\DS7]HWG^*EF?)_X"5&I(3!@#)XL0A-O11P9I[K9
M]!HM9A5-;?4+!G>YO[#SB$2GL4_&<4F&(ZCSWK#>=FQ!>27;?1=7AJ>FUR>X
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56%V3QTUQ[=33/?4C) I4SPN@   [

end
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!malgudi.oar.net!news.ans.net!nynexst.com!mirage!pjc
From: [e-mail] (Peter Colonel)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Greys,Reptillians,Underground Bases and Planetary Control
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 20:35:23 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (For News purposes)
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Peter Colonel)
Organization: Nynex Science & Technology
Lines: 26

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric Defonso) writes:
|> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Don Allen) writes:
|> >
|>
|> [unbelievable amount of crack-induced blather
|>  about military/alien/tooth-fairy takeover of the world deleted...]
|>
|> >--
|> >-* Don Allen *-               // Only   | Are you ready for SETI?
|> >Internet: [e-mail]  \X/ Amiga   | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
|> >UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona  | The *real* "October Surprise"
|> >Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
|>
|> Does this guy actually make a living writing this stuff? Maybe he's
|> smarter than I thought =-)
|>
|>
|> --
|> Eric DeFonso (astro.as.utexas.edu)
|> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
|> In Search Of...a good .sig **** "When in doubt, tell the truth." - Twain
|> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Since you failed to read the article completely, you missed the disclaimer
at the top of the article. Try to do your homework before slamming Don.
What have you offered to the net?
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!ukma!widener!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Forwarded Belgian UFO Info
Keywords: sci.space post
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 23:14:10 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 246


    The following is a repost of a sci.space post. I thought maybe
    you would like to read this since I know some people don't get
    sci.space (Hi Jim! :-).

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-FWD sci.space post-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: sci.space
Subject: Belgian mysteries
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 16:01:40 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: The Internet
Lines: 215

The following is a report written by the secretarial staff of the
Belgian Air Force staff. Any comments?                J. Pharabod
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
REPORT ON THE OBSERVATION OF UFOs DURING THE NIGHT OF MARCH 30-31, 1990

1.Introduction
a. This report gives an overall view of the reports from the concerned
   Air Force units and of the reports from ocular witnesses of the
   gendarmerie patrols, about the unknown phenomena watched in the
   air space (hereafter called UFOs), south of the axis Brussels-
   Tirlemont, during the night of March 30-31,1990.
b. The observations, visual and radar, were of such a nature that the
   take off of two F-16 of the 1 J Wing has been decided, in order to
   identify these UFOs.
c. This report has been established by Major Lambrechts, VS/3 Ctl-Met 1.

2. Context.
  Since the beginning of December 1989, strange phenomena have been
regularly noticed in the Belgian air space. The Air Force has at its
disposal several ocular witnesses, most of them having been informed
by the gendarmerie. The Air Force radar stations could not confirm, in
any case, up to March 30-31, these sightings, and the presence of the
UFOs could never be established by the fighters sent in that order. The
Air Force staff has been able to produce several hypotheses about the
origin of these UFOs. The presence or the testing of B-2 or F-117 A
(stealth), RPV (Remotely Piloted Vehicles), ULM (Ultra Light Motorised)
and AWACS in the Belgian air space during the facts can be excluded.
The cabinet of the MLV (Ministery of National Defense) has been informed
about these discoveries. In the meantime, the SOBEPS (Societe Belge
d'Etude des Phenomenes Spatiaux) got in touch with the MLV, in order
that the MLV backed the SOBEPS in its inquiries about this phenomenon.
This request has been accepted, and after that the Air Force has
regularly cooperated with this society.

3. Chronological summary of the events during the night of March 30-31,
1990.
Note: local time.
March 30:
23 h 00: The supervisor responsible (MC) for the Glons CRC (Control
Reporting Center) receives a phone call from Mr. A. Renkin, gendarmerie
MDL, who certifies to see, from his home at Ramillies, three unusual
lights towards Thorembais-Gembloux. These lights are distinctly more
intense than stars and planets, they don't move and are located at the
apexes of an equilateral triangle. Their color is changing: red, green
and yellow.
23 h 05: The Glons CRC asks the Wavre gendarmerie to send a patrol at
this place in order to confirm this sighting.
23 h 10: A new call from Mr. Renkin points out a new phenomenon: three
other lights move towards the first triangle. One of these lights is
far brighter than the others. The Glons CRC observes in the meantime
an unidentified radar contact, about 5 km north of the Beauvechain
airport. The contacts moves at about 25 knots towards west.
23 h 28: A gendarmerie patrol including, among others, Captain Pinson,
is on the premises and confirms Mr. Renkin's sightings. Captain Pinson
describes the observed phenomenon as follows: the bright points have
the dimension of a big star(*); their color changes continually. The
prevailing color is red; then it changes itself in blue, green, yellow
and white, but not always in the same order. The lights are very clear,
as if they were signals: this enables to distinguish them from stars.
23 h 30 - 23 h 45: The three new lights, in the meantime, have drawn
closer to the first observed triangle. In their turn, after a series
of erratic moves, they arrange themselves also in triangular formation.
In the mean time, the Glons CRC observes the phenomenon on radar.
23 h 49 - 23 h 59: The Semmerkaze TCC/RP (Traffic Center Control/
Reporting Post) confirms in its turn to have a clear radar contact at
the same position pointed out by the Glons CRC.
23 h 56: After prerequisite coordination with the SOC II, and since
all conditions are fulfilled to make the QRA take off, the Glons CRC
gives the scramble order to the 1 J Wing.
23 h 45 - 00 h 15: The bright points are still clearly observed from
ground. Their respective position does not change. The whole formation
seems to move slowly in comparison with the stars. The ocular witnesses
on ground notice that the UFOs send from time to time brief and more
intense luminous signals. In the mean time, two weaker luminous points
are observed towards Eghezee. Those, as the others, have also brief and
erratic moves.
March 31:
00 h 05: Two F-16, QRA of J Wing, AL 17 and AL 23, take off. Between
00 h 07 and 00 h 54, under control of the CRC, on the whole nine
interception attempts have been undertaken by the fighters. The planes
have had, several times, brief radar contacts on the targets designated
by the CRC. In three cases, the pilots managed to lock on the target
during a few seconds, which, each time, induced a drastic change in
the comportment of the UFOs. In no case, the pilots have had a visual
contact with the UFOs.
00 h 13: First lock on the target designated by the CRC. Position:
"on the nose" 6 NM (Nautical Miles), 9000 feet, direction: 250. The
target speed changes within minimum time from 150 to 970 knots,
altitude coming down from 9000 to 5000 feet, then up to 11000 feet,
and, shortly after, down to ground level. From this results a "break
lock" after some seconds, the pilot losing the radar contact. The
Glons radar informs, at the moment of the break lock, that the
fighters are above the target position.
+/- 00 h 19 - 00 h 30: The Semmerkaze TCC as well as the Glons CRC
have lost contact with the target. From time to time a contact appears
in the region, but they are too few to have a clear track. In the
meantime, the pilots contact on VHF the radio of the civilian air
traffic, in order to coordinate their moves with the Brussels TMA.
The radio contact on UHF is maintained with the Glons CRC.
00 h 30: AL 17 has a radar contact at 5000 feet, 20 NM away Beauvechain
(Nivelles), position 255. The target moves at very high speed (740
knots). The lock on lasts during 6 seconds, and, at the break lock, the
signal of a jamming appears on the scope.
+/- 00 h 30: The ground witnesses see three times the F-16 pass along.
During the third pass, they see the planes turning in circles at the
center of the great formation initially seen. At the same time, they
notice the disappearance of the little triangle, while the brightest,
western point of the big triangle moves very fast, probably up. This
point emits intense red signals, in a repetitive way, during the
manoeuvre. The two other points of the great triangle disappear shortly
after. The clear points above Eghezee are no longer visible, and only
the western brightest point of the triangle can be observed.
00 h 32: The Glons and Semmerkaze radars have a contact at 110 / 6 NM
away Beauvechain, which heads for Bierset at 7000 feet and high speed.
The registered speeds go from 478 to 690 knots. The contact is lost
above Bierset. The Maastricht radar control center has had no contact
with this UFO.
00 h 39 - 00 h 41: The Glons CRC mentions a possible contact at 10 NM
from the planes, altitude 10000 feet. The pilots have a radar contact
at 7 NM. Again is noticed an acceleration of the target from 100 to
600 knots. The lock on lasts only a few seconds, and the planes as
well as the CRC lose the contact.
00 h 47: The Beauvechain RAPCON mentions a contact on its radar, at
6500 feet altitude, position away Beauvechain: 160 / 5 NM. The Glons
CRC has also a contact on the same position. This one is observed up
to 00 h 56.
00 h 45 - 01 h 00: Some attempts are undertaken in order to intercept
the UFOs. The planes register only a few very short radar contacts.
The ground observers see the last UFO disappear towards Louvain-la-
Neuve (NNW). Around 01 h 00, the UFO has completely disappeared.
01 h 02: AL 17 and AL 23 quit the frequency of the Glons CRC and go
back to their base.
01 h 06: The Jodoigne gendarmerie mentions to the Glons CRC that has
just been observed a phenomenon like the one observed by Mr. Renkin
at 23 h 15.
01 h 10: Landing of AL 17.
01 h 16: Landing of AL 23.
01 h 18: Captain Pinson, who in the meantime has gone to the Jodoigne
gendarmerie, describes his observation as follows: four luminous white
points at the apexes of a square, the center of which is Jodoigne. The
UFO seen towards Orp-Jauche (SW of Jodoigne) is the brightest and has
a yellow-red color. The luminous points move with jerky and short moves.
+/- 01 h 30: The UFOs lose their luminosity and seem to disappear in
four distinct directions.

4. General information.
a. Meteo. The data mentioned by the Air Force Wing Meteo regarding the
   concerned area and during the night of March 30-31, 1990, are the
   following:
   Visibility: 8 to 15 km with clear sky. Wind at 10000 feet: 50/60
   knots. A slight temperature inversion at ground, and another, as
   slight, at 3000 feet. These data are confirmed in Captain Pinson's
   report. He mentions also that the stars were clearly visible.
b. Because of lack of appropriate material, the ground observers could
   not make any photo or film of the phenomenon.
c. The UFO observed with a telescope is described as follows: a kind
   of sphere, a part of which is very luminous; a triangular shape
   could also be distinguished (For a more detailed observation, see
   Captain Pinson's report, in appendix H1).

5. Constatations.
a. In contradiction with other pointed out UFO sightings, for the first
   time a radar contact has been positively observed, in corrrelation
   with different sensors of the Air Force (CRC, TCC, RAPCON, EBBE and
   F-16 radar), and this in the same area as visual observations. This
   has to be explained by the fact that the March 30-31 UFOs have been
   noticed at +/- 10000 feet altitude, whereas in the former cases
   there was always talk of visual contacts at very low altitude.
b. The visual evidences, on which this report is partially based, come
   from gendarmes in duty, whose objectivity cannot be questioned.
c. The UFOs, as soon as seen by the F-16 radar in the "Target Track"
   mode (after interception), have drastically changed their parameters.
   The speeds measured at that time and the altitude shifts exclude the
   hypothesis according to which planes could be mistaken for the
   oberved UFOs. The slow moves during the other phases differ also
   from the moves of planes.
d. The fighter pilots never have had visual contact with the UFOs. This
   can be explained by the changes of luminous intensity, and even the
   disappearance of the UFOs, when the F-16 arrived in the neighborhood
   of the place where they were observed from the ground.
e. The hypothesis according to which it was an optical illusion, a
   mistake for planets, or any other meteorological phenomenon, is
   in contradiction with the radar observations, especially the
   10000 feet altitude and the geometrical position of the UFOs
   between themselves. The geometrical formation tends to prove a
   program.
f. The first observation of the slow motion of the UFOs has been made
   roughly in the same direction and with the same speed as the wind.
   The direction differs by 30 degrees from the direction of the
   wind (260 degrees instead of 230 degrees). The hypothesis of
   sounding balloons is very improbable. The UFOs altitude during all
   this phase remained 10000 feet, whereas the sounding balloons go on
   higher and higher, up to burst at around 100000 feet. It is difficult
   to explain the bright lights and changes of color with such balloons.
   It is very improbable that balloons stay at the same altitude during
   more than one hour, while keeping the same position between
   themselves. In Belgium, during the radar observation, there was no
   meteorological inversion in progress. The hypothesis according to
   which it could be other balloons must be absolutely dismissed.
g. Though speeds greater than the sound barrier have been measured
   several times, not any bang has been noticed. Here also, no
   explanation can be given.
h. Though the different ground witnesses have effectively pointed out
   eight points in the sky, the radars have registered only one contact
   at the same time. The points have been seen at a distance one from
   another sufficient for them to be distinguished by the radars also.
   No plausible explanation can be put forward.
i. The hypothesis of air phenomena resulting from projection of
   holograms(*) must be excluded too: the laser projectors should have
   been normally observed by the pilots on flight. Moreover, the
   hologram cannot be detected by radar, and a laser projection can be
   seen only if there is a screen, like clouds for example. Here, the
   sky was clear, and there was no significant temperature inversion.
(end of report)
(*)sic

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-End of FWD'ed post-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Steve


--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!psuvax1!psuvm!dam137
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Habitable Planet's Table
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 29 Feb 92 00:21:13 GMT
Organization: Penn State University
Lines: 135

At the continuing request of reader's of this forum, I am posting this
table that shows probablity of habitable planets around other stars, plus
some other facts about habitable worlds...

Share and Enjoy...
Dave

***************************************************************************

        The following posting is a summary written by my friend and
    co-worker, Drew LePage, of an article in the January 1992 issue of
    the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS), Volume 45,
    Number 1.  Titled "An Estimate of the Prevalence of Biocompatible
    and Habitable Planets", it is authored by M. J. Fogg.

   ########################################################################

        There is a very interesting article in the January 1992 edition
    of the JOURNAL OF THE BRITISH INTERPLANETARY SOCIETY (JBIS) on the
    likelihood of various types of stars having habitable or biocompatible
    planets.  A biocompatible planet is one where the long term presence
    of surface liquid water provides environmental conditions suitable for
    for the origin and evolution of life.  There are three subsets of
    biocompatible planets:

  * Juvenile Martian - As the name implies, it is a planet with condition
    similar to those found on Mars early in its life.  The planet would
    receive between 27% and 75% of the light we presently receive from the
    Sun and possess plate tectonics or some other geochemical carbon cycle.
    Mars was this type for its first one billion years.

  * Juvenile Terran - Again as the name implies, this is a planet with
    conditions similar to those found on the early Earth.  The planet
    would receive between 75% and 95% of the light we presently receive
    from the Sun and be geologically active.  Earth was this type of planet
    for its first four billion years (i.e. during the Precambrian period).

  * Habitable - This is a planet with Earthlike conditions.  The planet
    would receive between 95% and 110% of the light we receive and be
    geologically active.

        The author of the study collected the results of various studies
    to determine what conditions produce biocompatible and habitable
    planets, the evolution of stars and the effects on planetary environ-
    ments, the likely distribution of planets in other systems, as well
    as others.  The results of the author's simulations indicate the
    following:

  * Habitable planets can exist around stars with 0.8 to 1.8 times the
    mass of the Sun.

  * Biocompatible planets can exist around stars with 0.5 to 1.8 times the
    mass of the Sun.

  * Habitable planets may occur around >3% of the stars between 0.85 and
    1.45 times the mass of the Sun.

  * Biocompatible planets may occur around >30% of the stars between 0.8
    and 1.25 time the mass of the Sun.

        If only single stars possess planets:

  * There would be one habitable planet for every 413 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with habitable planets would be
    31 light years.

  * There would be one biocompatible planet for every 39 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with biocompatible planets would be
    14 light years.

  * There would be about 362 biocompatible (of which 34 would be habitable)
    planets within 100 light years of us.

        If planets could form in multiple star systems:

  * There would be one habitable planet for every 196 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with habitable planets would be 24
    light years.

  * There would be one biocompatible planet for every 18 stars.

  * The mean distance between systems with biocompatible planets would be
    11 light years.

  * There would be about 763 biocompatible (of which 71 would be habitable)
    planets within 100 light years of us.

        The author goes further and calculates the probability of the
    nearer stars having biocompatible or habitable planets.  Assuming that
    planets can form in multiple star systems the following probabilities
    were calculated:

  Name                  Distance (LY)   Type    Habitable       Biocompatible

  Alpha Centauri A         4.38         G2V        7.8%             44%
  Alpha Centauri B         4.38         K6V        4.4%             38%
  Epsilon Eridani         10.69         K2V        0.6%             34%
  61 Cygni A              11.17         K5V        0.0%              5.8%
  61 Cygni B              11.17         K7V        0.0%              0.3%
  Epsilon Indi            11.21         K5V        0.0%             18%
  Lacille 9352            11.69         M2         0.0%             <0.3%
  Tau Ceti                11.95         G8V        1.5%             35%
  Lacille 8760            12.54         M1V        0.0%              1.5%
  Groombridge 1618        15.03         K7         0.0%              2.5%
  70 Ophiuchi A           16.73         K1         4.4%             38%
  70 Ophiuchi B           16.73         K6         0.0%             16%
  36 Ophiuchi A           17.73         K0V        0.0%             28%
  36 Ophiuchi B           17.73         K1V        0.0%             27%
  36 Ophiuchi C           17.73         K5V        0.0%              9.0%
  HR 7703 A               18.43         K3V        0.0%             27%
  Sigma Draconis          18.53         K0V        1.5%             35%
  Delta Pavonis           18.64         G5         5.1%             39%
  Eta Cassiopeiae A       19.19         G0V        3.9%             38%
  Eta Cassiopeiae B       19.19         M0         0.0%              0.7%
  HD 36395                19.19         M1V        0.0%              0.5%
  Wolf 294                19.41         M4         0.0%             <0.3%
  +5301320 A              19.65         M0         0.0%              0.6%
  +5301320 B              19.65         M0         0.0%              0.5%
  -45013677               20.6          M0         0.0%             <0.3%
  82 Eridani              20.9          G5         4.4%             38%
  Beta Hydri              21.3          G1         7.5%             35%
  HR 8832                 21.4          K3         0.0%             23%

        Assuming that the author's simulations and calculations are
    correct, there could be as many as 5.6 BILLION biocompatible planets
    in our galaxy of which about 500 MILLION are habitable.  And, as the
    above table shows, the nearest biocompatible planet could only be
    4.38 light years away.

        Drew LePage

=========================================================================
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!cbfsb!cbnewsc!chapin
From: [e-mail] ( Tom Chapin )
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Dispassionate Scientific Discussion
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 29 Feb 92 05:58:14 GMT
Organization: Hickory Ridge - Lisle, IL
Lines: 7
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4535 alt.alien.visitors:4733 sci.skeptic:21171

>You've got your head shoved so far up your as, you can't see daylight.

This must be some of that scientific objectivity in discussion I've
been hearing so much about...the mark of true science...

--
         tom chapin                [e-mail]
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!darwin.sura.net!mlb.semi.harris.com!rtfm.mlb.fl.us!joshua
From: [e-mail] (Joshua Geller)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space,sci.skeptic,alt.paranormal
Subject: Re: mars Pyramids - what do You think about it?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 29 Feb 92 18:23:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <zzzk.699178139@jacobs> <[e-mail]>
Organization: We don't need no stinkin' batches!
Lines: 12
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4734 sci.space:27201 sci.skeptic:21189 alt.paranormal:4543

[e-mail] (Dave Zecchini) writes:

|>    Thus, if you're looking at it simply from an odds-for-or-against
|>viewpoint, the odds AGAINST it being a face increase dramatically.

|>    And that's what I was asked.  The odds against.

nonono....I am talking odds in the sense of gambling; do you want to bet
$10,000 against my $10?


josh
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From: [e-mail] (Walter D. Pullen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Summary: Daily Meditations for Peace at noon.
Keywords: Peace Clock
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 1 Mar 92 08:20:51 GMT
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Organization: University of Washington Computer Science
Lines: 104
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4735 alt.pagan:13226 alt.paranormal:4544 talk.religion.newage:9554


Since today is February 29, the Leap Day, a once in a four year
experience, I figured that now would be an synchronistically
appropriate time to post this. :) This is another excerpt from the
book "Bashar: Blueprint for Change - A Message from Our Future",
written by Darryl Anka and Luana Ewing.

The Peace Clock as described below was started in December 1987, and
the efforts of the people participating in it, as well as of other
groups and individuals who have been working and praying for peace and
understanding on our Earth, have really been working, as can be seen
from the recent dramatic changes of the world scene since 1987 for the
better. Let us not stop here - there are more transformations awaiting
us! Let us step into the conscious creating of our own realities:


----------------------------------------------------------------------


                 -----  PEACE IN OUR LIFETIME -----
       <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<  PEACE CLOCK  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
                 ------   A WORLDWIDE EVENT  ------

STARTING NOW: Wherever you are, perform a silent meditation for world
              peace EVERY DAY AT NOON FOR ONE FULL MINUTE.
THE GOAL:     To have EVERY PERSON ON EARTH performing this event by the
              year 2000.

- SYNCHRONIZED INTENTION IS THE KEY -

o  With an alarm, a bell, a note or any other method that works for you,
   remind yourself with it is noon in your time zone.
o  Acquire the active participation of your company, your school,
   community, city, state and nation.
o  Involve radio and television. Have them broadcast the PEACE CLOCK
   name, slogan and logo, accompanied by one minute of silence every day.
o  Above all: approach all interactions with others in peaceful,
   constructive and creative ways.
o  Copy and share this information with as many people as you can.
o  Report your participation, or write for further information to:
   PEACE CLOCK, P.O. Box 8307, Calabasas, CA 91302

NOTE: Peace Clock flyers and cardboard master copies are available in
12 languages (8 1/2 x 11), as are 5x7 post cards. Write to: Dorothy
Compinsky, 2717 Arizona Ave., #5, Santa Monica, CA 90404, U.S.A.


----------------------------------------------------------------------


     At this time ([which was initially started in] December, 1987) we
would like to suggest to you a project we have called the Peace Clock.
A very simple idea, but very impactful. It goes as follows:

     Step one: every single day of your time, at noon in your time
zone - for one full minute at noon time - meditate on world peace in
any way that is comfortable for you. See your world enjoying the idea
of peace and harmony, in any way you wish to imagine, or visualize.
What you will be creating is a motion, a momentum, an electromagnetic
thrust around your planet - for we recognize you have many different
time zones on your world.

     If at midday in your time zone that entire slice,
one-twenty-fourth of your planet, is focused for one minute in
meditation on world peace - and then the next slice, and the next
slice, all the way around your planet, around and around and around,
day after day - you will actually generate an electromagnetic momentum
that will almost literally spin you, before you know it, into fourth
density, into synchronicity all around you.

     Allow yourselves to truly feel the strength of your power, for
you *are* empowered. If you know that *every single individual has a
profound impact upon your entire planet*, you will change your world
in ways you have not yet imagined - very rapidly. You will be
accelerating your world at such a pace that if this is accomplished by
your year 2000, then beginning from that year many things will happen
you will perhaps hardly even believe.

     Now, step two: take that information - that idea of the
one-minute meditation at noon - and share it with as many as you
possibly can. Involve individuals, cities and whole communities,
states and nations; all levels of society. Involve your radio and your
television media, so that at 12 noon every day they will also allow
the one minute of silent meditation. Remind everyone with a tone, if
you wish, or with a comment. All participating.

     The basic goal is to have every individual - yes, every *single*
individual - on your planet doing that one-minute meditation by
January 1, 2000. You will find such a high degree of accelerated
energy focused on world peace around your world that you will be able
to have the foundations laid down for one world between 1990 and the
year 2000. No later than 2013, 2011....

     AND THERE WILL INDEED BE PEACE IN OUR TIME.

--

-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|     Walter D. "Cruiser1" Pullen     |     [e-mail]     |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
|   "Who am I, What am I?  As I am, I am not.  But as we are, I AM.  And to   |
-   you my creation, My Perfect Love is your Perfect Freedom. And I will be   -
|   with you forever and ever, until the End, and then forever more." - GOD   |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
Path: ns-mx!uunet!rosevax!aquarius!grante
From: [e-mail] (Grant Edwards)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dispassionate Scientific Discussion
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 29 Feb 92 20:17:47 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (USENET News administrator)
Organization: Rosemount, Inc.
Lines: 14
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4547 alt.alien.visitors:4736 sci.skeptic:21200
Nntp-Posting-Host: aquarius

[e-mail] ( Tom Chapin) writes:
: >You've got your head shoved so far up your as, you can't see daylight.
:
: This must be some of that scientific objectivity in discussion I've
: been hearing so much about...the mark of true science...

Could be, I've heard that the situation can be aided by the surgical
installation of a plexiglass navel :-)

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  My life is a patio of
Rosemount Inc.                                |fun!
                                              |
[e-mail]                 |
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From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: (STORY) Brazilian UFO Magazine Reports
Keywords: UFO article
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 13:16:37 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 145


    Found this Article in my vast UFO collection (Yea Right :-). I
    thought it my be interesting to read since there some threads
    out there about terrestrial space missions like Phobos, Viking
    Lander etc etc.

---------------------------------Inserted Article----------------------
The following article, translated from its original Portuguese, is
reprinted with permission from the Sept/Oct, 1985 issue of Brazil's
UFOLOGIA, possibly the largest-circulated UFO magazine in the world with
30,000 circulation. Translator Catherine Solange is now working on
another UFOLOGIA story, also by Luis Gonzaga, which attempts to explain
a theory of extraterrestrial classification based on spiritual
hierarchies.

SOVIETS RELEASE INFORMATION ABOUT E.T.-ASTRONAUT CONTACT ON SALYUT
MISSION. By: Luis Gonzaga Sortecci de Paula

    UFO crew members appeared in space and interacted extensively
with the three Solviet cosmonauts who linked up with Salyut 6 in early
1981. Surprisingly, the U.S.S.R. has elected to release some ot the
information on the history-making encounter.

    During their Salyut 6 msiiion that began in March and ended in
late May, 1981, Soviet cosmonauts Vladimir Kivalyonok and Viktor
Savinikh maintained extraordinary contact with three human
interplanetary aliens. For an extended period of time, the cosmonauts
watched as these aliens operated an extremely advanced, circular
spaceship ringed with portholes.

    Public awareness of this event was held back until 1984, when
the September 24 issue of `Manchete' was published. Displayed on that
issue's cover was the face of international model Jushiu Manegal, In a
relatively minor position on the inside left-hand corner of the cover we
read the sensational words: "Russians Encounter UFO's".

    For approximately four days, with periodic interruptions, the
Salyut 6 and the round UFO orbited 400 kilometers above Earth. The crews
interfaced to approximately 30 meters of distance between their two
craft.

    Shaped like a ball, the alien ship measured an estimated 9 to 10
meters in diameter. The circumference of the UFO was ringed with eight
symmetrical portholes, or windows. Sixteen additional transparent areas,
eight above and eight below the UFO's center area, were lit up in a way
that sugeested some automatedform of lighting.

    By this interior light, the cosmonauts were able to observe a
relatively conventional-looking cabin space within the craft, exhibiting
control panels, chairs, retaining walls and other equipment and
structures. The surface sheen of the craft looked metallic. No obivous
points of entry and exit were seen, and the Soviets also noted a
remarkable absence of assumed necesities on the ship's
exterior-identifying marks, antennae, optical systems terminals, solar
panels and the like.

    The encounter was initiated on May 14, when through his
porthole, cosmonaut Kovalyonok spotted the round object in front of the
Salyut 6 from about 1,000 meters distance. He had made out the ship's
portholes with long-distance binoculars.

    The following day, the cosmonauts were surprised to see that the
UFO had moved in much closer, within 100 meters of the Salyut. Since
their unterstanding of propulsion systems was limited to the disposable
resources of Earth's rocket technology, the cosmonauts were perplexed
that the UFO could produce such a vast alteration of its orbit: If
rockets were used for propulsion, escape hatches for attendant fuel
emissions were noticably lacking on the aliens' stark craft!

    Positioned by the portholes were three beings of human aspect
clearly making various gestures. They were of a solemn and serene
countenance, reminiscent of devout Hindus, with straight noses and thick
eyebrows visible above their enormous, slanted blue eyes. They looked
out at the cosmonauts with a deep and penetrating gaze, yet displayed no
emotional qualities in terms of our understanding of emotions.

    At one point, the cosmonauts asked their Soviet base of command
for permission to make contact with these unknown voyagers. The
immediate response that got back was a decisive and definite, "no," that
the only manner of contact they could utilize must be instrumental.

    Little by little, the alien ship was getting closer to the
Salyut, and at an unimaginable velocity. Ti would appear and disappear
at various angles. For frations of a second, it would disappear behind
the Earth and then reappear in a new relative position, stopping
abruptly with no apparent effect on the crew members. In one of its
reappearances, the alien ship stopped within 30 meters of the Salyut.

    On impulse, cosmonaut Kovalyonok opened a celestial map and took
it to the window. To his amazement, he noticed that two of the aliens
did exactly the same thing, opening a map so that Kovalyonok could
clearly perceive out solar system in the upper right-hand corner, along
with many other celestial bodies not identified during the brief time
the map was glimped.

    Without knowing exactly how to proceed , the Soviet cosmonauts
waved and offered a "thumbs up" gesture of fraternity-and they returned
it. Tentative communication was achieved by instruments, but did't
evolve to the level desired.

    Using a high-potency light source, the Soviet cosmonauts used
Morse Code to welcome the visitors in Russian. There was no reaction
from the aliens. The Soviets tried English: "Are you reading us?" again,
no reaction. On the third try, still in Morse Code, the cosmonauts
tranmitted a binary number: 101101, which expressed a certain geometric
figure. The aliens responded with another sequence of numbers, not the
same as theirs. Later the cosmonauts verified that the aliens had
transmitted the value of the letter "E," based on a logarithmic
configuration applied frequently by the computers on Salyut 6, when
programmed to graphically linearize the relative curves of a complex
mathematical function.

    Dressed in the same spacesuits they were wearing on board, which
looked like diving suits with visors, the aliens left their ship and
floated in space. They made strange movements, as if they were sitting
in chairs. They wore no knapsacks of any other kind of apparatus that
normally would be used to maintain life as it's known on Earth.

    At the end of the fourth day, the aliens went away and didn't
reappear. It left the cosmonauts with a strange feeling of homesickness,
in the words of one ot the Russian crew.

    Members of Russia's military and scientific communities met with
the cosmonauts on June 18, 1981, to view photographs and film footage
taken on the mission. Cosmonaut Kovalyonok was bombarded with questions
and responded to them all. Later he was silenced under the restrictive
label, "top secret," until, for reasons still not clearly explicated, he
was offically allowed to go public by determination of the Kremlin.

Footnote: Author Gonzaga lives in Brazil's capital, Brasilia, where he's
spearheading a community project to facilitate contact and
communication between Earthlings and extraterrestrials.

--------------------------------EOF------------------------------------




--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!rutgers!cbmvax!snark!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: A field trip on an extraterrestrial spacecraft.
Keywords: 11:11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 26 Feb 92 18:19:27 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 24

[e-mail] (Walter D. Pullen) writes:

>The passage is another excerpt from the book "Bashar: Blueprint for
>Change. A Message from Our Future", by Darryl Anka and Luana Ewing,
>which is "channeled" from an extraterrestrial named Bashar (although
>don't let that label add to or take away from the feeling.) For those
>who have been expressing interest in this book, it is 302 pages
>($13.95 or so) available from New Solutions Publishing; Seattle, WA;
>ISBN# 1-56284-113-0. The back cover of it reads as follows:

    Ahmmmm thanks but no thanks. You just convicted me not to buy the
    book. Keep up the good work, the first thing that made me suspect
    is you following-up on your own post. If it wasn't for you Walter
    I might have bought this loser :-).

Steve

--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uwm.edu!rutgers!cbmvax!snark!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re:  California CE-3's
Summary: Speaking of Light Beams
Keywords: UFO Light Beams
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 27 Feb 92 16:24:50 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 62

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Phred T. Platypus) writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Shaffer) writes:
>>>Yesterday I saw an ABC news report on an anonymous family in California who
>>>claim that they're visited by aliens every night.  The aliens probe them
>>>with beams of light, sometimes right through the ceiling of the house while
>>>the family is awake.  They made drawings of the ships and they look fairly
>>
>>   Couldn't be beams of light - ceilings tend to stop those.
>
>You're right of course, but remember that a lot of UFO reports tend to have
>paranormal elements.

    Here's another press clipping that I have a copy of about beams of
    light you might be interested in. Something that also seems paranormal
    to me.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=Included Article-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

    Soviets: UFO beamed light, green cloud

    UNITED PRESS INTERNATIONAL

    MOSCOW- The crew and passangers of a Soviet airliner flying at
night over Minsk spotted an unidentified flying object that sent beams of
light to the ground below, the newspaper `Trud' said Wednesday.

The UFO lef a green cloud in its wake that flew alongside the airliner at
an altitude of 30,000 feet until it landed in Latvia, said the newspaper.

"The pilots saw what appeared to be a large, blinking star suddenly shed a
thin ray of light which fell plumb down on the ground," `Trud' said. It was
followed by two light beams which formed a cone.

All four crew members in the cockpit reported that they "could see
distinctly everything down in the sector of the ground illuminated be the
cone-shaped shaft of light, the houses and the roads."

The light suddenly shot back into the UFO, which they said was hovering at
25 to 30 miles in the air. "It then flared up, leaving a greeen cloud in
its stead," the report said, without giving a date.

"The green cloud then dropped straight down below the altitude at which the
airliner was cruising, then climbed up again in a similiar fashion,
positioning itself right opposite the plane at a height of 10,000 meters
[30,000 feet] and accompanying it in this way till the end of the flight
like an honorary escort," the pilot reported.

Nikolai Zheltukhin, a member of the Academy of Sciences, said there was
only one conclusion: "The airliner's crew encountered what we call an
unidentified flying object."

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=End of Story-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!rpi!uwm.edu!psuvax1!rutgers!cbmvax!snark!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Tesla Info via Packet
Keywords: Tesla HamRadio Packet
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 11:12:47 GMT
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 56


    I know this isn't directly related to this newsgroup but there are
    a few people that have mentioned Tesla here already so I'll do the
    same. I just grabbed this off of `Amatuer Packet Radio'. It looks
    like someone wants to setup a Tesla Packet database in Newark, NJ.

    Clark: Maybe they frequent your BBS and snagged your Rex Research
    Stuff :-). I'm going to send them a message to see what its all
    about.


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-MSG via Amatuer Packet Radio-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

MSG # TR  SIZE TO     FROM   @BBS   DATE    TITLE
  544 B#  1697 TESLA  KA2RIT ALLUSA 920227 TESLA DATABASE EXCHANGE
Forwarding path: WB3EUF N3FOA N3DFD KF2AW KB1BD KB2EAR KA2CHO KA2RIT

                        Tesla Coil Data Exchange
                             KA2RIT/WB2FGX
                               Newark,NJ.
*************************************************************************
This is address to all those Amatuer Radio Operators who have an interest
in, building and experimenting with Tesla coils. The purpose of this
bulletin is to determine whether or not there will be a need to open
up a PBBS database,here at KA2RIT BBS. If there's should be a big
respond's to this bulletin, then there will be a database setup here.
With the purpose to be able to share information and idea's with others
on this topic.As replys come in there will be list made up and posted
at all USA's BBs.With names,callsigns and address of all those with
an interest. When replying back please leave a brief message as to what
you are doing or have don with Tesla coils,Along with your
NAME,QTH, CALLSIGN AND HOME BBS.

Name: John
QTH: (Elizabeth, NJ)
Callsign: (WB2FGX) HOME BBS (KA2RIT.NJ.USA.NA)


Send all replys to John (WB2FGX @ KA2RIT.NJ.USA.NA)





*** END OF MSG # 544 from KA2RIT @ KA2RIT.NJ.USA.NA

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=End of MSG-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uwm.edu!psuvax1!rutgers!cbmvax!snark!beyonet!beyo
From: [e-mail] (Steve Urich)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFO Video-Photo-Document Part1
Summary: Lighten Up Mr. (Bill) Serious (Oh No :-)
Keywords: Review Footage
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 28 Feb 92 14:56:25 GMT
References: <[e-mail]> <1992Feb24.172432.4575@anasaz>
Organization: Beyonet Network
Lines: 79

In article <1992Feb24.172432.4575@anasaz> billy@anasaz (Bill Moore) writes:

    I never said it was `THE TRUTH' only that is was the best UFO
    footage that I have seen so far.

>Watch the tree branches, not the UFO, during this sequence.  The splice
>can be seen very easily with the naked eye.  The "light shift" and sudden
>jump of the branches shows the change in lighting and wind conditions
>between the two sequences. Also, in other sequences, watch the cloud patterns
>in the background to see where splices occur.

    HAHAHAHA! Bill your parents must be Lawyers! HAHAHAHA
    So serious, lighten Up. You almost make it sound like Gary
    has some competition :-)

########THIS WAS NOT PART OF THE SCRUTINY TEST OF THE JAPANESE###

    You have to remember this stuff is dated back in 1975 the
    part you mean is at the end where Meier is talking about the
    materialization wave mumbo jumbo. In that part while he is talking
    the editing wasn't too cool and yes the jump of the branches
    was VERY noticable. Did you ever think maybe it was edited there
    because the film ran out? That part you discribe was not the part
    that they scrutinzed maybe because it was the end of the film.

#######REMEMBER THIS WHEN YOU REPLY#####

    I think the originals were checked for spices and editing before
    the Japs did there investigation don't you?

#######SCEPTIC ALERT###########

The parts of the footage the Japanese scrutinized `Did Not' noticably have
changes in "swaying" branches or other surroundings like clouds etc etc.
It did have the "green glow" light conditions. Remember they did the slow
motion and still effects. I didn't touch my VCR buttons.

Again, what did he film?!?!?! How did he do it?!?!?!

###############################
>Horn swoggle.  This particular sequence was a large part of why Mr. Meiers
>was discredited.  As decribed above, changes in "swaying" branches and
>lighting conditions from one frame to the next are indicitive of splicing,
>not magic.  What's "true" is that the film was altered.

    I notice you never say anything about the actual UFOs why?????
    I wasn't worried about the film, I was trying to figure out how
    he did it. Maybe this `Alter armer Schweizer Bauer mit bloss einen
    guten arm' was really a Hollywood Film Technowizard with a phony
    half an arm while his real left arm was tied to his back :-).

    Come on, so he wasn't the greatest movie producer. I don't think
    he was using `Blue Screens' back then do you? What did he film?

    The model that was found in his Shack was just that....A MODEL!
    Yea thats it... He had a bunch of operator Engineers with Hydraulic
    Cranes behind, operating the models on fishing string. Better yet
    a fleet of Swiss Army Helicopters tangling the models with
    clear plexiglass poles.

>... more horn swoggle deleted ...

    Horn swoggle huh :-) Reminds me of the 2 old Geezers on the
    `Muppet Show' that used to cut up all the other muppets, hahahaha.

    Thank you Bill for your excellent Opinion, very good to see someone
    else out there think about these classic UFO debunker materials.
    I only wish it was in better condition to really give it the
    microscope but alas all we can do now is wait for some new UFO
    material to come out so we can scrutinize! :-)

Steve
--
 ############### Stephen Urich WB3FTP |"Starlightbeams project ###############
 ##|_|########## Bensalem, PA  USA    |me in Red Blue and Green##|_|##########
 ###############----------------------|Velvetdreams protect me ###############
 ####       #### snark!beyonet!beyo   |when I hit the Screen"  ####       ####
 ##    |_|    ## widener!beyonet!beyo |--Alan Parsons Project  ##    |_|    ##
 ##           ##-----------------------------------------------##           ##
 ####       ####  Packet Radio: WB3FTP@WA3NWL.#EPA.PA.USA.NA   ####       ####
_###############_______________________________________________###############_
Path: ns-mx!uunet!microsoft!marcmil
From: [e-mail] (Marc MILANINI)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 29 Feb 92 23:58:24 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
Lines: 28
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4553 alt.alien.visitors:4742 sci.skeptic:21213

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Richard A. Schumacher) writes:
>Yes, Newton was a genius, but he was not infallible. Some of his
>views were completely wrong (such as those that led him to write
>tens of thousands of words on alchemy as a science), or even lunatic
>(his deathbed statement that his proudest achievement was to die a
>virgin).
>
>So stop with these ridiculous appeals to authority, already.
>

<Flame on>
Seems to me that you missed an -another?- opportunity to shut up. First,
I don't think that Newton was really a genius. Hard-working, certainly,
but his intelligence was quite common, I believe. Second, and more important,
is the fact that alchemy is simply the ancestor of modern chemistry. Only
the work of first-rank scientists like Newton transformed it into science.
<Flame off>

I am waiting for the same thing to happen to ufology. During decades,
people kept on saying that stones were falling from the sky, and scientists
responded that it was impossible because there were no stones in the sky.
One day, one of them used the witnesses of a falling stone to calculate its
trajectory, retrieve it, and present it to other scientists.
Evidence was found that this stone was very likely not to be from the Earth.
It was the beginning of the study of meteorites.

--
=---K8>>@@@@@@@@ Marc Milanini @@@@ [e-mail] @@@@%%
Path: ns-mx!umaxc.weeg.uiowa.edu
From: [e-mail] (Raven Tengu of Kyoto)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy
Subject: PLANETCOM
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 1 Mar 92 19:52:44 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: U of Iowa, Iowa City, IA
Lines: 431
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4743 alt.conspiracy:12739


(Posted with permission by author.)

                  Concerning "Revelations"
                   author-Jacques Vallee

                      January 15, 1992
Dear Jacques,
     Far from a "revelation", as answer to either
Harbinson's "Genesis", or the Bible's, (the [aliens] sons of
God took the daughters of men for wives, Gen 6:6), your book
is expertly written but shows your tremendous bias by
omission. You have lightly tapped some of the "intelligence
operatives" in the UFO field smartly on the wrist with your
iron ruler, or was it an iron cross? Gave Bill Cooper's four
year old viewpoints instead of his current rethought
position. Wrote three pages separated by many pages about
the mechanical side of the flying object scenario possibly
having been produced here on earth by earthlings. Lip
service to assuage the uninformed. Sure, there are
extraterrestrials with bodies, and they must have craft in
which to travel. There are also other-dimensional bodiless
beings who need no craft to travel in. You are probably like
most folks and say that unless you saw a bodiless being you
wouldn't think it possible. In order to "see" a bodiless
being, one must go within and withdraw one's attention from
the exterior world of the senses.
     Come on, Jacques, double think, triple think and get to
the bottom of things. Otherwise you are no better at this
gig than any other decent writer who needs money, and
applies themselves to definitely "one-sided" revelations.
     1947 brought the passage of the National Security Act,
the start of the Nazi germinated CIA and NSA. The influx of
at least a hundred Nazi scientists, engineers, etc., into
the United States and Canada. A Nazi aeronautical engineer,
a certain Herr Miethe, who had designed four different types
of saucer shaped craft by 1943 using either rocket power or
donut configuration jet turbine engines (rather than
cylindrical), with the cabin stabilized by gyro, the
compressors rotating in one direction and the expansion
chambers and vectored exhausts rotating in the opposite
direction, was traced to Canada in 1947 and began work for
the A. V. Roe company (Avroe disk). The phony AVROE "aircar"
was definitely to disinform the press as to the real
projects underway underground in Canada.
     The eight mile long train that went out of Austria in
1945 (672 train cars!), to the coast of Brittany, the
contents loaded on board ships, eventually ending up
underground in Southwestern Canada. At the same time over
100 prefab factory buildings were shipped from England to
British Columbia. Get your "remote viewing" friend to scope
the spot for you. Anybody could find it, even at this late
date. A complete underground construction and flight testing
facility in British Columbia. The 1947 first "sighting" of a
flight of "saucers", Kenneth Arnold, etc., etc., right over
the border from the underground base in British Columbia.
The base was decommisioned in about 1952 when we (the
Americans) traded the H-bomb technology for all the improved
German hardware, and the scientists and technicians to go
with it.
     The first flights of these "captured disks" by remote
or on board pilots unfamiliar with their controls led to the
early crashes in Roswell and elsewhere. The disks were
captured from "aliens" (Nazis), and there were definitely
"alien bodies" at the crash sites, (Canadian).
     A special group was formed to keep this technology and
in effect all the most advanced forms of technologies
separate from the general course of science. This group has
powers above the executive branch. Who knows what it's
called? By the way, the Nazis had everything before any
other country, they had radar in 1933 they had infra-red
sensors, heavy water, etc., etc. We have been told lie after
lie in terms of who invented these things. If anyone in the
world had access to "alien" technology it was the master
race "Aryans" (Nazis). Their metallurgy and casting were
flawed or they would have conquered the world. As you
probably know, many expatriot Nazis were given carte
blanche, new I.D's., and were included in startup of more
than several departments of the CIA in 1947. Departments
including "genetics and cloning" (with some of the same
"doctors" who had given death camp residents gangrene,
etc.), "designer drugs and mind control" using the same
scientists who had designed Methadone and Methedrine for
Hitler's maniacal efforts. In 1952, a public stir caused the
CIA to shuffle these fab fellows out of town. My guess is to
the various underground centers that were being built.
     There's two reasons why you don't reveal things about
the characters in your book, either you don't know, or you
are protecting certain agendas.
     Linda Howe is a nice person, most certainly in on the
deception or so naive as to be pathetic. The technology for
hand held lasers driven by power supplies that only weigh
200 pounds has existed for twenty years or more. DARPA
builds them and they have all the necessary capabilities she
is overawed with.
     The reason for all the testing of animal systems from
stem to stern, reproductive systems and other organs by us,
is that 85% of the current underground nuclear testing and
100% of the above ground testing in the past at the Nevada
Test Site, has vented radioactivity into the atmosphere. The
radiation travels downwind offsite, and for the last 47
years has affected and continues to affect the terrain and
the animals with measureable radioactivity in the various
systems. It's only natural for those who think they are in
control to try to measure the quantitative damage they have
inflicted and keep inflicting on the earth and its
inhabitants and to KEEP THE RESULTS SECRET. These days the
largest rug that you can sweep secrets under is the "alien"
flying carpet! It interested me to see your specious formula
equating the number of landings, number of sightings, and
number of close encounters, into a formula for the amount of
landings that would have occurred unseen by humans if your
theory would have held mud. The problem, according to my
information, is that "sightings" and "close encounters" of
"aliens" by humans have always been staged, and for a most
important reason. It's estimated that 1% of the population
believes the crap about little-big-heads making a deal with
our government in the 50's, if they can get 5% of the
population to "believe", they can run the scam and everybody
will fall into line.
     Lazar probably works for NSA and was running a game
typical of the Russian G.R.U. on the scientists from Los
Alamos where the "Honeysuckle Parlor" was, compromising them
via videotape, then trying to decompartmentalize them. He
did the same for the personnel he came into contact with at
the test site in Nevada, he would recommend them to his
bugged whore house in Vegas to be taped and compromised.
Then there was the Lazar show on KLAS and George Knapp and
Gene Huff (Lazar's "clean-up man" like Nancy Davis Reagan
was the "clean-up person for Ronnie), John Grace (the
infamous Valdomar Valerian of "The Matrix" papers and head
of Nevada Aerial Research Group), John Lear and all the
other interested parties now have a list of "test site
employees" and others who called and wrote in, telling about
seeing "things" at the test site. The operation was mainly
to expose leaks in security at the test site.
     The reason Lazar was at either location was to pick up
exposed film taken of particle collisions (at Los Alamos) or
particle beam interactions (taken at the test site Nevada)
and develop it and return it poste haste to its point of
origin. He had a top secret clearance for this. With such a
clearance, he was a valuable asset to the small super secret
group spoken about previously. He was keeping track of which
scientists were working on what. Lazar doesn't violate the
tenets of his security oath. None of these shuck artists do.
If he were to talk about the particles and paths he saw on
the film he used to develop, they would put him away in
solitude. He is not a physicist and never was.
     I have talked to Paul Bennewitz at length, several
times. On his behalf, you only tell people how they drove
him nuts, not why. I ask myself why would you leave out the
reason that they sent him reeling? To fill you in, because
you obviously took Linda Howe's and Tracy's opinion rather
than questioning Paul directly; he's a pilot, he flew over
the Dulce area numerous times on his way between Albuquerque
and Denver. He took many pictures of the construction going
on, and according to Paul, he also took pictures of circular
craft on the ground at this site which, as late as 1973,
according to him, had large hangar doors much the same as
Lazar's second hand explanation about the doors at S-4. (All
the stuff from area 51 and "S-4" having to do with inertial
mass cancellation has been moved to an area near St. George,
Utah). The most revealing photos and their negatives
disappeared in about 1975 when various "fringe UFO experts"
visited Paul. Also, his house was burglarized and ransacked
more than once. In later years Moore, Shandera, and Torme
made a meaningless tour of Dulce and then went on to
Albuquerque (the real reason for their travels) to see if
there was any more evidence of serious consequence still in
Paul's possession that they could grab, and sure enough, he
was missing some more photos when they left his house. If
you had even talked to Bennewitz, you would have gotten a
lot closer to having a "revelation". But by listening to
what Linda Howe has to say about Bennewitz, you might as
well call your book, "Hearsay". By the way, you could have
your "remote viewer" look at the Dulce area and easily show
you some entrance points. The "waste" from the underground
bio-genetic lab (no aliens involved, although that is where
we humans produce the short lived, big-eyed, big headed
imitation "aliens") comes out in the river canyon about ten
miles below Navajo Dam. Although these days they "treat" it
a lot more before letting their "grey" water back into the
environment. This base and others are of course connected by
tunnels to Los Alamos. The Archuleta Mesa installation
rivals Pine Gap at Alice Springs, Australia for security,
etc. Every U.S. Air Force base has a so-called "bolt-hole"
and is connected to the bolt-hole by tunnel.
     Another source was in the area of the Archuleta Mesa in
1972. At that time a narrow gauge railway spur still existed
that went down from Durango, CO, through Dulce, N.M. through
Chama, N.M., and ended several miles later where it used to
connect to a straight line narrow gauge track that had gone
all the way from Albuquerque to Denver (part of the original
Durango-Silverton Line). This person noted a tremendous
amount of materiel being unloaded at a crossing of this
narrow gauge railway and the dirt road he was travelling on.
A bunch of workers were unloading flat cars full of cement,
pipe, etc, onto flatbed trucks that then disappeared down
the dirt road toward the Jicarillo Indian Reservation, he
took pictures because he was interested in the antique
railcars, etc. There were no accomodations in the area at
that time so he made his way up to Durango to stay the night
before going on with his travels. He was "tailed" all the
way to Durango to the motel parking lot by a "military type"
wearing civilian clothes, in an open civilian type jeep.
That evening he went to the bar to have a few drinks, was
picked up by a good looking woman who went with him to his
room, in the morning, she was gone and so was all his film,
not just the film in the camera! I have had several
occasions in my research to note that women are often used
to garner someone's trust. I call these women "military
millies", in honor of the one I personally came into contact
with who called herself "Milly". Pretty Army and Air Force
brats are mind-controlled at an early age and taught to gain
information from their subjects with the use of sex.
     A group of 21 people led by an individual we will call
Rick, went to area 51 in 1989 in a small bus to watch
"saucers". They were stopped on "mail-box road" by two
individuals carrying automatic weapons and wearing
camouflage togs. One individual popped a can of "gas" in the
aisle of the bus, and that's all they all remembered for
three hours. When they came to their senses, they cut their
trip short, returned to L.A. and five persons got separately
regressed using hypnotic regressers that did not know one
another, and found that during the lost time their memories
had repressed similar events. They had been marched off the
bus, taken in jeeps to a building nearby, and had their
lives threatened by military personnel. No "aliens"
whatsoever.
     In the U.S., the group that runs the "alien abduction
scam" can only use some of the hardiest of these short lived
bio-genetic bad luck stories. Short lived because they have
no digestive tract and can survive only about two weeks
maximum after they are removed from the growing matrix, then
they deteriorate and die. They have no "soul" and are not
considered "sentient beings" by Tibetan Buddhists.
     The French are obviously not as skilled as the U.S. in
fabricating biological entities, and so weren't able to
expose poor unfortunate Franck Fontaine to any phony aliens.
Instead, only keeping him in and out of the "twilight zone"
in their "clean room" wherever that was. They used a
haloperidol-like substance in the fog that surrounded his
car.
     Edith Fiore is a new arrival in the huckster
professional wrestling world of UFO experts. She claims to
be a clinical psychologist. ALL of her female patients who
"remember" with help, their "abduction" experience, remember
a long steel surgical needle being used to take eggs from
their ovaries. The same kind of long steel surgical needle
that WE USE to take eggs from female ovaries. If these
little greys are thousands of years in advance of us as the
liars would have us believe, why are they limited to using
model "T" technology to get our women's eggs? Gimme a break!
The reason the needle is remembered is because it is
painful, temporarily breaking the hold of the drug induced
mind control. Some of these women also remember a human in
the room at that time.
     Bud Hopkins is definitely an intelligence agent from
hell, slavering over the females he has attracted to his
franchised "abduction workshops", where all the females are
"supported" by other females who have had "the same
experience". One of the "details" that Bud harps on that he
hasn't published and that he retains "secret" as a test for
authenticity when he interviews new applicant "abductees" is
the "long steel surgical needle". If you remember the needle
you are authentic in Bud's cosmology. Thanks to Bud Hopkins'
franchise, female "abductees" can look in any phone book
yellow pages and find an "abduction support group".
     Whitley Streiber wrote "B" quality horror novels before
he got seriously mind-controlled at the Monroe Institute.
Then he started talking about little "somethings" messing
around with him in between sleep and wakefulness.
     Monroe has 5 permanent resident CIA astral travelers
who do nothing but "help" people to "understand" their
"travels" in group sessions after the fact. Bob Monroe says
that his "people", go into the astral world and everything
becomes foggy, so one wouldn't know if one was astralling in
San Francisco or London. I am a remote viewer and conscious
dreamer, and I know that information to be spurious. The
place that he and his people are going is "limbo land". The
places which I set myself to view or travel to, I actually
see or visit. No fog involved. Proof is in the pudding.
     Haldol is used to "treat" multiple personality
disorder. The inverse is also true, multiple personalities
can be "created" and screened from one another with the use
of Haldol. To become even more complex for the sake of
current discussion, one "personality" would remember an
abduction experience, and would be given dominance over any
other "personality" by the individual's "handler".
     The drug haloperidol-generic (Haldol-trade name), when
given in slight overdose causes a three hour lost time/lost
memory experience. Six American psychiatrists so far are
under indictment for taking advantage of their female
patients using this drug in overdose. Their mistake? They
didn't "mask" the "lost time" with a "memory" of some sort,
and so the women, after a short while, became suspicious and
went to different psychiatrists, got hypnotized to find
themselves remembering the exact events. To the indicted
psychiatrists' liking, one can have a person slightly
overdosed on haloperidol do anything physically possible and
not remember a thing for awhile! Whereas if you mask the
lost time with a "unique memory" the person will tend to
cling to that "memory", or repress that "memory" (to the
detriment of remembering the truth) for a longer time. If
the person joins a support group that periodically refreshes
the "memory", it will maintain long into the person's
future.
     The army's mind control unit must take well deserved
credit for the veterans who seemingly go suddenly crazy,
killing many people and then themselves. The most recent
event in Killeen, Texas was planned for the day BEFORE a
Congressional vote on gun control, hoping to influence
Congress with yet another mass automatic killing. Handlers
(psychiatrists) at each perpetrator's local Veterans
Hospital are involved in each and every case of these mass
killings/suicides. Prozac is also involved with each case
having been prescribed by the aforementioned "handlers" in
each and every case. The fellow in Canada who killed 12
women at a women's college, the fellow in the Stockton,
California schoolyard, etc., etc.
     Try reading the "Global 2000 Report", and the 1959
study by the Club of Rome, I could send you a copy of
"Stopping the Coming Ice Age" videotape, this in order to
gain an overview of what is really going on. "They" know
that the weather is changing permanently for the next
100,000 years, going back to an ice age. It has done this 17
times in the last 1.8 million years. Global warming is a lie
like so many other lies that we have been told in order for
them to insinuate that we have 50 years in which to change
our habits. These jerks tell us these lies in order to
maintain power, mine the last of the ore, suck the last of
the oil, sell us the last drop of gasoline and then tell us
that they were mistaken; when it's far too late for most of
us to grow food. They say that they do these heinous crimes
in the name of human survival. The only survival they work
for is their own. They work out of fear. Less than half of
the world's arable land will still be able to support the
growth of food crops shortly, so the concensus is that half
of the world population must die by starving to death, AIDS
(germ warfare-Strecker Memorandum), or killing one another.
     In order to maintain a semblance of control during
infrastructure breakdown when people are killing each other
for food, they will fly the saucers and tell us we are
undergoing an alien invasion, please stop rioting, go to
your local post office and register, FEMA will take over and
it will be a "new world order". Fascist one world
government, Communism already lost according to plan and
despotic Fascism always wins because people are
complacent and refuse to get involved.
     Bush will feign serious illness in October, to throw
the election. He doesn't want to be in power when this place
falls apart, which will be by 1996.
     Six years worth of grain is missing from the nation's
grain silos. Secreted underground no doubt.
     There are about five major end time scenarios that you
should consider in order for you to come up to speed on the
totality and magnitude of the subterfuge.
     You could call my service and leave a neutral number
and time when you can be reached. 818-569-3072

cc. M. William Cooper, Vladimir Terziyski, Martin Cannon,
Paul Bennewitz, and a multitude of other "friends".
*********************************************************

                          Apology

                     February 22, 1992

Dear Jacques,
     This letter is being sent and given to all who received
or were given copies of the first letter that I wrote to you
entitled "Concerning Revelations, author Jacques Vallee".
     I hope you will accept my sincere apology for what I
spewed forth in a state of picque while thinking of it as
"creative license". I hope all the other individuals and
groups mentioned will also accept my heartfelt apology. I am
pretty sure that all of the people and groups I mentioned
believe in what they are doing, and believe they are doing
what is "right". I did not mean to stir up pain or suffering
in anyone's personal life, hurt people's feelings or
commerce by weaving these real people into imaginary and/or
outright false fabric.
     The first letter was written with specific tone,
certain style, using a few facts and a lot of embellishment.
The myriad results could not have been imagined and were
mostly obtained because the letter was written in that
manner and sent unsigned to all who received it.
     To those who still don't know who I am, my name appears
in Bill Cooper's book "Behold a Pale Horse", which I suggest
that everyone should purchase and read.
     It's all right for the major players to go underground
during a crisis, either "natural" or contrived. We need to
lose half the population of this place in order to save it
from total devastation. We need to preserve certain whole
aspects of our ordered civilization. It's all right that
unconventional means are used to get laws passed to take
armaments out of the hands of all the idiots. As we approach
certain debacle, the ends justify the means.
     After the occurrence of the last days scenario, there
will be two main types of surviving groups on the surface.
     1. Total imbeciles with plenty of paranoia, plenty of
guns, ammo, food, bigotry, racism, etc.
     2. Loving families of "light" hidden away in out of the
way places, living in harmony with this Earth and the
Cosmos.
     I have heard that you read the entire first letter. I
have gained valuable input from people that called my
answering service and left their numbers or various
messages. I think you must have sensed that the first letter
did not need your response, however, I would certainly
appreciate talking to you sometime.
     Needless to say, Planet Com is working on an
"apocryphal book" which contains information about this
epoch that has never been common knowledge. It will be
available in 3 months. Projected cost will be $15.00
     Anyone interested in subscribing to a newsletter which
Planet Com has available, please send $2.00 and request to
Planet Com [phone]  Box 33, Mountain Center, CA 92561
cc. Those of you who copied and distributed the first
letter, please make copies of this letter and do the same.
**********************************************************

If you have intentions of replying to this post, PLEASE do not send me
([e-mail]) email.  All replies (unless they are general
comments) should be sent DIRECTLY to PLANETCOM (phone and address included.)
I am not the one to answer questions, PLANETCOM _is_.

**********************************
Please distribute this!!!!!!!!!!!!
**********************************

Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!news.bbn.com!ulowell!swlvx2!rayssd!anomaly!plankton.sbs.com!mpd
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: INVASION!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 1 Mar 92 14:37:01 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Small Business Systems, Incorporated, Esmond, RI  02917
Lines: 13
Nntp-Posting-Host: plankton.sbs.com

[e-mail] (Gary Stollman) writes:

>She asked me to go into a small mental
>hospital for a while

Sounds like the best advise you'll ever get.

MD
--
--  Michael P. Deignan                      /
--  Domain: [e-mail]            /   I'm not a bigot,
--    UUCP: ...!uunet!rayssd!anomaly!mpd  /    I hate everyone.
-- Telebit: [phone]              /